Understanding : Under Grace

[Ritajanice]

Why you think they are believing ? Its because God so loved them and gave Christ for them and then gives them the Gift of Believing on Him.

I agree with this....God certainty brings us to believe in Jesus, he also gives us the Faith to believe and understand the word of God...we need to be Born Of The Spirit...to understand the word of God....it’s the witness of the Holy Spirit in us that brings us to understanding the word of God....which can and does take years to understand imo.

Overall, a person must be radically born again by the wind of the Holy Spirit and raised up from the dead in their inner person, like the dry bones in Ezekiel's vision. Without this radical transformation lived out until death, no one can enter the eternal Kingdom of God.

 

[Ritajanice]

Who are the elect of God?​

ANSWER

Simply put, the “elect of God” are those whom God has predestined to salvation. They are called the “elect” because that word denotes “determining beforehand,” “ordaining,” “deciding ahead of time.” Every four years in the U.S., we “elect” a President—i.e., we choose who will serve in that office. The same goes for God and those who will be saved; God chooses those who will be saved. These are the elect of God.

As it stands, the concept of God electing those who will be saved (predestination) isn’t controversial. It is a biblical truth (John 6:44, Romans 8:28-30, Ephesians 1:4-5). What is controversial is how and in what manner God chooses those who will be saved. Throughout church history, there have been two main views on the doctrine of election. One view, which we will call the prescient or foreknowledge view, teaches that God, through His omniscience, knows those who will in the course of time choose of their own free will to place their faith and trust in Jesus Christ for their salvation. On the basis of this divine foreknowledge, God elects these individuals “before the foundation of the world” (Ephesians 1:4).


I posted this commentary just to be viewed from different viewpoints...

I don’t believe that you can choose God by your own freewill....for a start you can’t know that God exists without the witness of the Holy Spirit....
testifying with our spirit that we are Gods children, that’s the spiritual rebirth, in other words he speaks to our spirit as he’s indwelling us, that’s how we know we have been Born Of The Spirit...
As his word says, the carnal mind has no understanding of the word of God , it’s foolishness to those who haven’t been spiritually reborn....

Therefore I believe God chooses whom he saves and makes Born Again.....God is the initiator...man is not...imo...

 

[JunChosen]

Your wrong

He died for everyone

Whoever believes is not condemned

Whoever does not believe is condemned already, because they have not believed

Hell is filled with non believers..Because they did not believe, not because they sinned

And hence we have the error of calvanism (fatalism)

Jesus said he died for THE WORLD (everyone) so that WHOEVER (in that world) Believes will not perish, but live forever.


He also used moses and the serpent as the example. Moses lifted the serpent so that EVERYONE could be saved. But only those who BELIEVED (looked) were saved.

The ones who did not believe were condemned to death by the poison in their bodies as being bitten by snakes..

That serpent on the pole COULD have saved them also. But they did not believe.

John 3 is easy to understand, Sadly people can;t get away from their doctrines to let the word speak to them.

Sorry my friend, your post is full of contradictions!! One minute you say all be saved and the next, you say only those that believe!!! Your beliefs are wishy-washy.....Ephesians 4:14 reads:
"That we [henceforth] be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, [and] cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive;"

To God BE The Glory

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Sorry my friend, your post is full of contradictions!! One minute you say all be saved and the next, you say only those that believe!!! Your beliefs are wishy-washy....

Now your just bearing false witness

i said he died for everyone, I never said they will all be saved. i said only those who will believe will be saved,

.Ephesians 4:14 reads:
"That we [henceforth] be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, [and] cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive;"

To God BE The Glory

Then why are you still tossed to and fro and fail to comprehend the gospel?

 

[JunChosen]

Who are the elect of God?​

ANSWER​

Simply put, the “elect of God” are those whom God has predestined to salvation. They are called the “elect” because that word denotes “determining beforehand,” “ordaining,” “deciding ahead of time.” Every four years in the U.S., we “elect” a President—i.e., we choose who will serve in that office. The same goes for God and those who will be saved; God chooses those who will be saved. These are the elect of God.

As it stands, the concept of God electing those who will be saved (predestination) isn’t controversial. It is a biblical truth (John 6:44, Romans 8:28-30, Ephesians 1:4-5). What is controversial is how and in what manner God chooses those who will be saved. Throughout church history, there have been two main views on the doctrine of election. One view, which we will call the prescient or foreknowledge view, teaches that God, through His omniscience, knows those who will in the course of time choose of their own free will to place their faith and trust in Jesus Christ for their salvation. On the basis of this divine foreknowledge, God elects these individuals “before the foundation of the world” (Ephesians 1:4).


I posted this commentary just to be viewed from different viewpoints...

I don’t believe that you can choose God by your own freewill....for a start you can’t know that God exists without the witness of the Holy Spirit....
testifying with our spirit that we are Gods children, that’s the spiritual rebirth, in other words he speaks to our spirit as he’s indwelling us, that’s how we know we have been Born Of The Spirit...
As his word says, the carnal mind has no understanding of the word of God , it’s foolishness to those who haven’t been spiritually reborn....

Therefore I believe God chooses whom he saves and makes Born Again.....God is the initiator...man is not...imo...

Very well said! Thank you

 

[JunChosen]

Now your just bearing false witness

i said he died for everyone, I never said they will all be saved. i said only those who will believe will be saved

If Jesus died for everyone, it means "each and every person" whether they believed or not.

Then why are you still tossed to and fro and fail to comprehend the gospel?

I'm secure in my belief. Don't blame me for you not knowing and understanding Bible doctrines and it's interpretations.

There's still time though, for today is still the day.....

To God Be The Glory

 

[JBO]

Why you think they are believing ? Its because God so loved them and gave Christ for them and then gives them the Gift of Believing on Him.

Therefore, since according to you, God didn't give Christ for the rest and then give them the Gift of Believing, it is God's fault that the rest are not saved.

I feel so sorry for you for having such a sick, vicious, and malignant view of God.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

If Jesus died for everyone, it means "each and every person" whether they believed or not.

No it does not

He died for their sin. No one will go to hell because they commited a personal sin, Jesus paid that debt,

they will go to hell because they did nto recieve Gods grace gift, Because they refused to be born again Like jesus told them to (john 3)

I'm secure in my belief. Don't blame me for you not knowing and understanding Bible doctrines and it's interpretations.

There's still time though, for today is still the day.....

To God Be The Glory

Thats good

But you still reject the gospel. And you have a God that does not love

 

[brightfame52]

Thats not what the word says

John 3: but he who does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God. 19 And this is the condemnation, that the light has come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil. 20 For everyone practicing evil hates the light and does not come to the light, lest his deeds should be exposed. 21 But he who does the truth comes to the light, that his deeds may be clearly seen, that they have been done in God.”

2 Thessalonians 2:12
that they all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

Why do you want to make Jesus a liar?

It says it to me. If Christ didnt die for you, you condemned, if He did die for you, you will believe in Him.

 

[brightfame52]

Sorry bud

they are justified by faith..

without faith in Jesus no one is justified

but as many as have received him, to THEM he gave the right to become children of God.

fail to receive him, You condemn yourself.

If Christ didn't die for you, you will never be given Faith, Faith is only for them whom Christ died for

 

[brightfame52]

Therefore, since according to you, God didn't give Christ for the rest and then give them the Gift of Believing, it is God's fault that the rest are not saved.

I feel so sorry for you for having such a sick, vicious, and malignant view of God.

Only the , Sheep for whom Christ died believe. Only those for whom He did not die shall be damned.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

It says it to me.

That does not matter, what matter is what Christ actually said

If Christ didnt die for you, you condemned, if He did die for you, you will believe in Him.

Thats not what it says

 

[Eternally Grateful]

If Christ didn't die for you, you will never be given Faith, Faith is only for them whom Christ died for

That's not what it says, it says if you do not believe you are already condemned

those who recieve him freely are saved.

 

[brightfame52]

That does not matter, what matter is what Christ actually said

Thats not what it says

It says it to me.

 

[brightfame52]

That's not what it says, it says if you do not believe you are already condemned

those who recieve him freely are saved.

Thats what it says to me. The reason why some dont believe [unbelief] is because they were not Sheep Christ died for Jn 10:26-27

26 But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you.

27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:

Christ declares that the Sheep He died for shall believe in Him, follow Him

 

[JBO]

It says it to me.

That is because you are just making up what it says rather than seriously trying to learn what it actually says and means. That is the whole MO of Calvinism soteriology. It all actually began with Augustine when he inserted his manichaeistic doctrine of Total Depravity into his Christian teaching. Calvin, later, picked it up and ran with it. Augustine was wrong and so was Calvin.

 

[Hobie]

Reader,

The Born again exist IN the Kingdom OF God.

What is that?

Its this.. ,"God is A Spirit".

A.) "Spiritual Kingdom" = Kingdom of God.

So, what part of you, is THERE ???
What part of you is "seated in Heavenly Places, in Christ'.........right now???

Its not your body, as you can see it, so that is not : SPIRITUAL.

Its your BORN AGAIN...."new creation"... that is Spiritual, and is "'ONE with God""...
This is Spiritual UNION with God, that was lost by 1st Adam and restored to you, by The Cross of Christ who is the 2nd Adam.
When you believe in Jesus and are born again, you have become "ONE with God'.... = Spiritual Union established "in Christ" = Forever.

Welcome to : ETERNAL LIFE

Reader...
"God is A Spirit" and your born again SPIRIT is now become a part of God.
(That is not water baptism),
So, to become born again SPIRITUALLY = This is how the born again exist in the Kingdom of God, as a "new Creation".... Son/Daughter of God.
See that?
That is not your body or your mind or your feelings.

Now, think about that which i just taught you..... so that when you SEE it... then what i'll write below, is going to help you end your striving to be good and failing.... issue.

Reader,
Notice this partial verse.. Romans 6:6

1.) ""knowing THIS.... our OLD MAN is crucified with Christ"..

Now, do you know that your old man is your carnal mind and your "flesh".
You have to understand this.. or KNOW THIS>.. as Paul teaches.... or you will not be able to come to the renewed mind that is the first part of the Thread that explains your born again spirit, being in the KOG.
So, where is your "old man of sin"

Notice this verse...2 Corinthians 5:17

2.) Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: OLD things are passed away....; behold, all things are become new.

Now what is "passed away"?
Its mean DEAD....
Look at #1... "Our OLD MAN is CRUCIFIED with Christ".
Reader, if you are crucified you are "passed away"..

So, what is now the "ALL things have become NEW"? A.) = That is you as the born again "NEW Creation, in Christ"..child of God.

See it?

Now here is the CONTEXT.. of this Teaching..

Romans 6:2

"""""How shall we, that are DEAD TO SIN, live any longer therein?”

Now, if you are dead to sin, then why are you breathing?
Its because Paul is talkig about your sin consciousness and your "old man of sin".. not your body or your mind or your feelings.

So, Where is your old carnal mind "flesh"... "old man of sin"?
Its Dead.
You just read that in a couple of verses.
Now Believe it.
Why is it dead?
Because its "Crucified with Christ", Reader.

And Where is Christ?
Is He dead?
No......He is RISEN, and if you are born again, you are also risen with Him in "newness of LIFE"... (Eternal life) Born again.. as a "New Creation".
= "Seated in Heavenly Places" in the KOG.

Now you can't see any of that, Reader.
However, that is ALL THAT GOD SEES of you, if you are born again., as that is You as the "Son/Daughter" of God.
Do you.....See that MIND of God, regarding you ??
Now you have to learn to only SEE yourself, as HE SEES YOU... at all times..
You have to get that renewed mind.
And when you get it, and you have it, then you have= "worked out your Salvation". You've seen the LIGHT. You have the Revelation. regarding who the born again have become "IN Christ".

Now how do you get the old man who is crucified, behind you, and out of your thinking?

Its not by striving.
Its not by resisting carnality.
Its not by trying to be good.
NO...

Here is how you do it.

Romans 6:11

Paul teaches us...

"""" RECKON yourselves to be DEAD indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord.”

That means to see it that way, .. period.

And how do you do that?

All you have to do is see yourself as God sees you.
Get HIS MIND... as your perception of yourself.
Reader, if you are born again... then GOD sees your sin as eternally forgiven, and your old man of carnality as DEAD and Crucified, and you as ALIVE UNTO GOD, as a born again,= "A New Creation in Christ".

If you will get that understanding, as your MIND< then God's Grace that has removed the curse of the Law from you, will empower your Holy Living, every day.

Now once you SEE this revelation and you get that mind, you have for the very first time.. "put on the Helmet of SALVATiON".

Yes, but if you continue in sin, then what? Many say they are 'born again' and yet are under the addiction and bondage of iniquity, we have to truly turn to Christ, not just say we have.

 

[Ritajanice]

A Born Again doesn’t continue to sin because they have been Born Again of imperishable seed.....that needs to be understood in the Spirit, by the witness of the Holy Spirit, he witnesses Gods truth to our spirit as we have been “ Born Of The Spirit “ our spirit has been Born Again.

“ Flesh gives birth to flesh “

Only the Spirit of God can can birth our spirit into his...” Spirit gives birth to spirit “.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

It says it to me.

Thats called selective reading and twisting the word of God

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Thats what it says to me. The reason why some dont believe [unbelief] is because they were not Sheep Christ died for Jn 10:26-27

26 But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you.

27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:

Christ declares that the Sheep He died for shall believe in Him, follow Him

Again

It does not say that.

Not sure what your reading. But I would take jesus word for it.