No Escape : From Hell

[Aunty Jane]

Yes Ma'am....
the devil sure does know how to deceive.
You're living proof.

But that could possibly apply to you...? What are you living proof of?

BUT YOU are the enslaved one...
not other Christians - including Catholics....

Says the enslaved ones.....LOL.
Just as in the first century, the heretics are calling the truth, heresy!
The mainstream are not the keepers of truth and never were...satan makes sure of that.
If Jesus said “few” are on the road to life, where does that leave the majority? There is only one other road....(Matt 7:13-14)

But at the end of the day, we have the confidence that two things are not negotiable......
1) That satan can only blind “unbelievers” (2 Cor 4:4) and we know that the Jews were classified as such even though they were believers in the same God as Jesus.....so just calling yourself a Christian because you “believe” in God and Jesus is not really proof that you are. You have to have the actions to back up your words.

2) no one can come to the son without an invitation from his Father. (John 6:65)

So if we are “unbelievers”, God knows already, and will not invite us into his family.....end of story.

 

[Aunty Jane]

Are you saying that the first Christians had a bible to read?
HOW would the early Christians have known they were being taught the word of God?
Did they travel with a bible under their arm?

LOL...can you read? Where did the first Christians hear the word of God? They were all Jewish and heard Scripture read every Sabbath Saturday.....(not pagan Sunday dedicated to sun worship by the Romans)

The apostles carried God’s word as Jesus taught it, to their Jewish audience first. All who regularly attended the Synagogue were familiar with the Scriptures....which for the Biblically educated, are written on hearts rather than parchment. Mary herself quoted from God’s Word because she was a faithful Jew.
They were not illiterate even if they were poor at reading and writing. Jews educated their children.
By the time gentiles were added, letters from the apostles were already circulating, adding to their knowledge of God’s Kingdom and how to qualify to become its citizens.

 

[GodsGrace]

Yes...it has all been recorded so that anyone can read what is an appalling story of “church” history.
What church history are you referring to?

Church history is not APPALLING.
It is HISTORY.

And you ask WHAT church history?
You know Auntie Jane
THE history of THE church that was present here on earth after Jesus ascended.

It was NOT the JWs.

As you said....”History is history and speaking against it is rather silly IMHO.”
So why do you deny it, or pretend that an apostasy wasn’t foretold by Jesus himself, as well as by the apostles? It was beginning at the end of the first century, but held back until the last of the apostles (John) passed away. His was the last contribution to Christian Scripture.

I really never know what you're talking about.
Jesus went back home to heaven and church history continued.

The APOSTACY....apostacy is breaking away.
YOU are the one that has broken away...
not the chruch that was present from the beginning.

The “weeds” that Jesus warned about, pretty much choked out what the apostles tried to keep alive....the truth, about God YAHWEH, about his son, and about God’s Kingdom....which has been perverted ever since then by a church system so divided and disunited that it is a shame to call it “Christianity”.

If Jesus came back today...who would he recognize as his own?

Certainly not the JWs.
And it'ìs really difficult to reply to all your silly comments.

Which is why I will not be responding to the other THREE OR FOUR replies from you to just ONE of my posts.

The Catholic church WAS the heresy....but pretended to be “wheat” rather than the “weeds” that they proved to be, by their appalling deviation from Scripture....and their murder of any who sought to reveal the truth and expose them.

Was George Washington the first president of the United States?
I don't think so.

Only in today’s world can people obtain the truth without the church gagging those who want to expose error and free people from ancient rusted shackles that still keep their members in bondage to beliefs and practices that find no origin in Scripture....nothing close to the teachings of Jesus and the apostles.

And these were the groundswell of an awakening that had to happen.....the devil knew that the jig was up as the “last days” were looming, so he did what he has always done....he created counterfeits, so that today the world is flooded with them. Christendom is a confused and bickering mess, but all still claiming to be “Christians”...the “body of Christ”.....Can Christ exist in a dismembered body?

Did I? You misrepresent what I said.....I drew your attention to the fact that nothing happens in this world that God does not permit. You act as if he needs corrupt humans to do his job for him.....I assure you, he is quite capable of taking care of his own business....everything is taking place just as he has foretold.

This is what I stated, and which we all know to be true.
You can disagree of course.

THE CHURCH IS PURE.
MEN ARE NOT.

If you believe an elder of yours that has is promiscuous,
and this means that the entire organization (notice it's called an organization - so man-like)
should be shut down....
it is your right to believe this.

So I guess every JW is perfect in every way or this ORGANIZATION would have folded long ago.

LOL...now that’s funny....I understand that an apostasy was foretold by Jesus himself, and that Christendom pretends that it never happened.....or that it only happened recently when people started to question the role of an impotent church system in the real lives of people struggling to find God in that maze of confusion. Any wonder that science took over and eliminated God altogether for a great many people....

Was God thankful for those who ignored his Christ to shed unsanctioned blood? (Matt 5:43-44)
Since Christendom has often had soldiers fighting each other in various wars, can we ask whose side God took in those wars where both sides are claiming to be “Christians”?

We believe what the Bible says, not what “the church” (of whatever label it wears) teaches....

Actually, the church DID and DOES teach what is in the bible.

It's the JWs, invented in the 1800's, that does not believe the bible.

We have examined all doctrines carefully, and sifted out what was introduced in later centuries and passed off as “Christian” teachings. You are still bound by things that God and his son never taught.

It's just great that it took 1800 plus years for SOMEONE to sift out doctrine so
the church could FINALLY get them straight!

You're always saying silly things.

What is “communion”? It morphed into something way different to what Jesus instituted on the night before his death. The church turned it into a meaningless ritual....as if a wafer in the shape of the sun, given to someone in a line, regardless of their lifestyle, means anything to God.

YOU don't even do what Jesus commanded.
He said DO THIS IN MEMORY OF ME.
So when do YOU have communion?
Of course a far better one than any other denomination.

Oh. That's right, you don't do communion.
You don't do birthdays.
You don't do Christmas or Easter.

What a legalistic system/organization you belong to.
You're not even allowed to celebrate THE DAY OF THE LORD.

SUNDAY.

Rituals are an empty way to worship, as are repetitive prayers. As if confessing sins to another sinner and repeating words mindlessly is penance that leads to God’s forgiveness. This makes God into a moron, who requires nothing more than empty performance from his worshippers. Sorry, not good enough.

John says we are to ask forgiveness.
You do miss a lot of scripture.

1 John 1:9
9 If we confess our sins, He is faithful and righteous to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

HOW we confess that sin can be debated.
Maybe you also missed:

John 20:22-23
22 And when He had said this, He breathed on them and said to them, "Receive the Holy Spirit.
23 "If you forgive the sins of any, their sins have been forgiven them; if you retain the sins of any, they have been retained."

You have been informed many times about the use of pronouns.
The “Paraclete” (Holy spirit) is male gender in Greek, and requires male pronouns...that argument is weak.

You didn't like John 14: 16?

How about

Luke 12:10
10 "And everyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man, it will be forgiven him; but he who blasphemes against the Holy Spirit, it will not be forgiven him.

Can we blaspheme against an it?


Acts 5:3-4
3 But Peter said, "Ananias, why * has Satan filled your heart to lie to the Holy Spirit and to keep back some of the price of the land?
4 "While it remained unsold, did it not remain your own? And after it was sold, was it not under your control? Why is it that you have conceived this deed in your heart? You have not lied to men but to God."

Ananias lied to the Holy Spirit. Verse 3
Ananias lied to God. Verse 4

Referring to the same Person of the Trinity.....
The Holy Spirit is God.
BOTH Persons of the Trinity.

 

[GodsGrace]

LOL...can you read? Where did the first Christians hear the word of God? They were all Jewish and heard Scripture read every Sabbath Saturday.....(not pagan Sunday dedicated to sun worship by the Romans)

This is what you stated in post in no. 472:

"Heresies and falsehoods are the very foundation of Catholicism, but only the brave had the courage to question their teachings and conduct......"


Please explain to us HOW a person could have known they were being fed heresies and falsehoods if they did not even have a bible to confirm what was being taught to them.

As I said,,,I will not read nor comment on your other replies.

I've already done my reading for the day.

The apostles carried God’s word as Jesus taught it, to their Jewish audience first. All who regularly attended the Synagogue were familiar with the Scriptures....which for the Biblically educated, are written on hearts rather than parchment. Mary herself quoted from God’s Word because she was a faithful Jew.
They were not illiterate even if they were poor at reading and writing. Jews educated their children.
By the time gentiles were added, letters from the apostles were already circulating, adding to their knowledge of God’s Kingdom and how to qualify to become its citizens.

 

[GodsGrace]

But that could possibly apply to you...? What are you living proof of?

Says the enslaved ones.....LOL.
Just as in the first century, the heretics are calling the truth, heresy!
The mainstream are not the keepers of truth and never were...satan makes sure of that.
If Jesus said “few” are on the road to life, where does that leaven the majority? There is only one other road....(Matt 7:13-14)

But at the end of the day, we have the confidence that two things are not negotiable......
1) That satan can only blind “unbelievers” (2 Cor 4:4) and we know that the Jews were classified as such even though they were believers in the same God as Jesus.....so just calling yourself a Christian because you “believe” in God and Jesus is not really proof that you are. You have to have the actions to back up your words.

2) no one can come to the son without an invitation from his Father. (John 6:65)

Fell on this when closing down.
John 6:65

Interesting.

Please give your comment on this conflict:

John 6:65
65 And He was saying, "For this reason I have said to you, that no one can come to Me unless * it has been granted him from the Father."


John 12:32
32 "And I, if I am lifted up from the earth, will draw all men to Myself."


So, does the Father grant to go to Jesus?
Or does Jesus draw all men to Himself?

 

[BreadOfLife]

You are correct about that at least.
The fact that you cannot defend your own doctrines speaks volumes to those not indoctrinated by a church that is clearly far removed from anything Jesus taught.

Huh??
I’ve defended the Church’s position against every bit of mud you’re thrown at it.

The fact that YOU don’t like the answers is irrelevant . . .

Heresies and falsehoods are the very foundation of Catholicism, but only the brave had the courage to question their teachings and conduct......after torture forced a confession, certain death awaited them. What kind of ”Christianity” is that? Can you argue with recorded history?

And as GodsGrace has already educated you – it was the Church that kept heresy OUT of Christianity.

As for those who “questioned” and protested the teaching of the Early Church – THEY were the heretics. Gnostics, Arians, Montanists, Nestorians, and others were the heretics who – like YOUR sect’s founder – rejected the Word of God and invented their OWN system of belief.

Virtually, EVERY heresy begins with the misunderstanding of the very nature of God. ALL of the heresies I just mentioned were NO different, including YOURS . . .

You speak of lies and confusion.....but fail to recognize the lies and confusion that Catholicism teaches.
They are a mirror image of first century Judaism. Any attempt to expose the wickedness of the church and its teachings, meets with blind faith, backed up by itself and it’s own adopted ideas.....

No – the Church is the fulfillment of Judaism – NOT the “undoing” of it (Matt. 5:17).

If the Catholic Church looks like Judaism to you – then that’s a sign the it is the genuine Church because the OT is fulfilled in the NT. Those who claim to “follow Christ”, yet seek to wipe out all residue of Judaism, are counterfeiters.

...because none of it can be backed up by Scripture, which the church ignores unless it can twist the word to fit its own lies. The real heretics are calling those who disagree with their lies...heretics!

Now, you’re REALLY reaching. So, EVERY bit of Christian teaching cannot be supported by Scripture?? This would include creation, the atoning sacrifice of Jesus, the Resurrection and Ascension of Jesus, etc.

You stuck for foot in your mouth again . . .

No one performs meaningless ritual in Christendom, like Catholic people have been taught to do from childhood. Add in my own experience, no one responds more angrily to the way they have been ‘programmed’ to worship, than Catholic people who actually want to study the Bible. Once the church is exposed for what it truly is, there is no going back.

Sticking your foot in your mouth again . . .

NO ONE performs rituals in Christendom??
Call me crazy – but what are Baptisms. Infant Dedications., Weddings, Funerals, etc.

As for Bible study – that was introduced to the world by the Catholic Church. At EVERY mass, there is a reading from the OT, the NT and another exclusively from one of the Gospels. They are discussed afterward.

The entire Mass is patterned after the Scriptures.
We see references to the Eucharist in, Acts 2:46-47, 1 Cor. 10:16, Matt. 26:26-29, Mark 14:22-25, Luke 22:19-20, John 6:29-71, 1 Cor. 11:27-30.

The prayers, vestments, sacramentals, etc., used in the Mass are also outlined in Scripture:
(Rev. 1:10 Rev. 1:12, 2:5 Rev. 1:13, 4:4, 6:11, 7:9, 15:6, 19:13-14 Rev. 2:5, 16, 21; 3:3; 16:11 Rev. 15:3-4 Rev. 4:4, 5:14; 11:16, 14:3, 19:4 Rev. 5:8, 6:9-11, 8:3-4 Rev. 4:8 Rev. 2:17, Rev. 5:8, 8:3-4 Rev. 6:9 Rev. 5 Rev. 8:3, 11:1, 14:18, 16:7 Rev. 14:4 Rev. 15:7, 16:1-4, 8, 10, 12, 17; 21:9 Rev. 17, 19:9 Rev. 19:1, 3, 4, 6, Rev. 5:14; 7:12; 19:4,)

You might want to do your homework before you continue to ignorantly and blindly attack things you have NO understanding of . . .

The deceiver knows how to deceive on a mass scale....we show the devil that we are “no part of his world” (John 17:16; John 18:36) by our conduct and refusal to participate in its bloodshed and immorality. We also refuse to accept any teaching that comes from outside of God’s word, just as the first Christians did.

People deserve the truth, no matter how confronting it is....and all have the choice to believe it...or not.
The truth sets us free...it does not enslave us to traditions and teachings that Christ never preached.

THIS, coming from a person who has been sucked in by a MAN-MADE sect from the 19th

 

[Aunty Jane]

As for those who “questioned” and protested the teaching of the Early Church – THEY were the heretics. Gnostics, Arians, Montanists, Nestorians, and others were the heretics who – like YOUR sect’s founder – rejected the Word of God and invented their OWN system of belief.

Interestingly, early Christians taught no purgatory, worshiped no images, honored no “saints,” and venerated no relics. They did not engage in politics and did not resort to carnal warfare. But by the 15th century, none of this was any longer true of many who professed to be their imitators. The deviation was absolute!

Jesus and his apostles foretold an that an apostasy would take over the church like “weeds”....and it was beginning to take place at the end of the first century.....those ”weeds” Jesus said we’re planted “by the devil” would engulf “the world”.....and remain until “the harvest” which we see rapidly approaching as this world system under satan’s rulership, caves in on itself.

Anyone with a knowledge of church history knows what the “weeds” did to those who dared to question the authority of ”the church”...and the consequence were dire. That is established history.

Virtually, EVERY heresy begins with the misunderstanding of the very nature of God. ALL of the heresies I just mentioned were NO different, including YOURS . . .

This “misunderstanding” as you call it, was calculated. Because the “weeds” were a product of the devil, his stamp would be seen on all of it. “The very nature of God” was corrupted in order to have “the church” worshipping a god that in Scripture does not exist. Everyone who subscribes to this false doctrine is breaking the first Commandment.....they have put a false god in place of the Father.
This is not the God of Jesus Christ. (Rev 3:12)

No – the Church is the fulfillment of Judaism – NOT the “undoing” of it (Matt. 5:17).

Oh dear....Jesus roundly condemned Judaism as the work of the devil. Those who taught it were “from their father the devil” according to Jesus (John 8:44).....so emulating Judaism is imitating the devil’s religion. Any wonder it doesn’t resemble Christianity....which had no priests, no rituals, no distinctive clothing or titles, and no grand, ornate buildings.

Matt 5:17 is Jesus saying he came to “fulfill the Law”....not the teachings of Judaism.
What did Jesus say about them...?
“...To uphold your tradition you have made God’s word null and void. You hypocrites! How rightly did Isaiah prophesy about you when he said: ‘This people honors me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me; in vain do they worship me, teaching as doctrines the commandments of men.’ ” (Matt 15:7-9 NCB)

So, EVERY bit of Christian teaching cannot be supported by Scripture?? This would include creation, the atoning sacrifice of Jesus, the Resurrection and Ascension of Jesus, etc.

Well, it’s the interpretation of Scripture where the church fails....
Who created all things? (Col 1:15-17) God did, but “through” the agency of his son. (John 1:2-3)

What is “the sin atoning sacrifice of Jesus”? If he is God, then the sacrifice he made was way above what was required to fulfill God’s Law...”an eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth, a life for a life”. God’s law demanded equivalency, so Jesus had to be the exact equivalent of Adam in order to pay the debt that Adam left for his children. This is why he was called “the last Adam”. (1 Cor 15:45)
Can mere humans kill God?

What was the manner of Jesus’ resurrection? In what form was he raised in order to return to heaven?
And in what “manner” was his ascension, so that we would know how he was to return? (Acts 1:9-11)

NO ONE performs rituals in Christendom??
Call me crazy – but what are Baptisms. Infant Dedications., Weddings, Funerals, etc.

There are rituals of the church, and there are the traditions that the church invented around things like baptisms, weddings, funerals etc.....
Baptisms in the Bible were only performed on adults, not minor children. For one to be baptized as a disciple of Christ, one had to make a decision to do so on the basis of imparted knowledge. An infant cannot make such a commitment...and there was no proxy arrangement....minor children were judged on the conduct of their believing parent. (1 Cor 7:13-14)

Weddings and funerals were cultural things, not really religious rituals.
Marriage in Israel involved no ceremony, and funerals were attended by those who accompanied the deceased to their burial site.
Humans invented the rituals.

The entire Mass is patterned after the Scriptures.
We see references to the Eucharist in, Acts 2:46-47, 1 Cor. 10:16, Matt. 26:26-29, Mark 14:22-25, Luke 22:19-20, John 6:29-71, 1 Cor. 11:27-30.

The RCC invented the ritual of the Eucharist, turning the bread and wine into the literal flesh and blood of Christ....something that most people would find completely repulsive.
No Jew would ever assume that the emblems were literal, but representations. It would be breaking God’s Law if they were literal.

The prayers, vestments, sacramentals, etc., used in the Mass are also outlined in Scripture:
(Rev. 1:10 Rev. 1:12, 2:5 Rev. 1:13, 4:4, 6:11, 7:9, 15:6, 19:13-14 Rev. 2:5, 16, 21; 3:3; 16:11 Rev. 15:3-4 Rev. 4:4, 5:14; 11:16, 14:3, 19:4 Rev. 5:8, 6:9-11, 8:3-4 Rev. 4:8 Rev. 2:17, Rev. 5:8, 8:3-4 Rev. 6:9 Rev. 5 Rev. 8:3, 11:1, 14:18, 16:7 Rev. 14:4 Rev. 15:7, 16:1-4, 8, 10, 12, 17; 21:9 Rev. 17, 19:9 Rev. 19:1, 3, 4, 6, Rev. 5:14; 7:12; 19:4,)

Oh please...all these things in Revelation refer to the heavenly arrangement not the earthly one.
What did Jesus say in Rev 20:6 regarding the priesthood that was to be served in heaven?

“Blessed and holy are those who share in the first resurrection. The second death has no power over them. They will be priests of God and of Christ, and they will reign with him for a thousand years.” (NCB)

Since this was yet future....when were these “chosen ones” (saints) to rule with Christ in his Kingdom?
Has the thousands years already passed? Or has it even begun?

You might want to do your homework before you continue to ignorantly and blindly attack things you have NO understanding of . . .

LOL...I know one of us needs to do their homework.....because one of us is showing absolute ignorance of anything Scriptural....you have one view that has been indoctrinated to the point where the truth cannot penetrate even when it is presented from God’s own word.....(2 Cor 4:3-4) Sad, but not unexpected.

THIS, coming from a person who has been sucked in by a MAN-MADE sect from the 19th

If you knew what the Bible teaches, you would also know that at “the time of the end” prophesied by Daniel, only at that time was the truth going to be fully revealed. (Daniel 12:4, 9-10)

The “weeds” were permitted to do what weeds do best.... to choke out what the sower (Jesus) planted.

We are living in “the time of the end” right now, when Jesus is about to manifest as the judge of all of us....
He has already warned us that the majority who claim him as their “Lord” will come to realise what he tells them...”I NEVER KNEW YOU”....and calls them “WORKERS OF LAWLESSNESS”.....Which means that he has never set foot in their houses of worship. (Matt 7:21-13)

Only then will we know if we have obeyed Christ in all things. He will “separate the sheep from the goats” and his judgment is final.....we will all know then which category we chose for ourselves.

 

[walter]

Do you believe that you should adhere to the decisions of the church?

My Church or Leader is ultimately the Bible.. I can explain why I believe something with the Bible alone.

For example I believe in these fundamental beliefs and I let the Bible do all the talking and explaining, I don't have to add any commentary.

- Salvation is a free gift. read these scriptures...
- I observe all Jesus words. read these scriptures...
- I observe all the Bible words. read these scriptures...
- Many inherit the Earth living forever upon it and a little flock inherits heaven and they become priests and judges.. scriptures...
- God gave specific instructions to Moses to engage in war with enemy nations, Jesus gave new instructions on how we are to treat our neighbors, our brothers and sisters and even our enemies. [ We have brothers and sisters in every nation totaling 1,108 languages. ]
- All our fundamental beliefs can be explained with scriptures alone.
- When the Bible does not directly address a topic, Jehovah's Witnesses rely on Bible principles and an informed conscience to make decisions. They research relevant scriptures, and pray for wisdom.

 

[TazzJazz]

....those that stayed within orthodoxy.

What good are orthodox beliefs, if a religion professing Christ, doesn't obey Christ & His 12 Apostles?

Beliefs wouldnt matter a hill of beans, according to Jesus.

 

[GodsGrace]

Interestingly, early Christians taught no purgatory, worshiped no images, honored no “saints,” and venerated no relics. They did not engage in politics and did not resort to carnal warfare. But by the 15th century, none of this was any longer true of many who professed to be their imitators. The deviation was absolute!

Jesus and his apostles foretold an that an apostasy would take over the church like “weeds”....and it was beginning to take place at the end of the first century.....those ”weeds” Jesus said we’re planted “by the devil” would engulf “the world”.....and remain until “the harvest” which we see rapidly approaching as this world system under satan’s rulership, caves in in itself.

Anyone with a knowledge of church history knows what the “weeds” did to those who dared to question the authority of ”the church”...and the consequence were dire. That is established history.

This “misunderstanding” as you call it, was calculated. Because the “weeds” were a product of the devil, his stamp would be seen on all of it. “The very nature of God” was corrupted in order to have “the church” worshipping a god that in Scripture does not exist. Everyone who subscribes to this false doctrine is breaking the first Commandment.....they have put a false god in place of the Father.
This is not the God of Jesus Christ. (Rev 3:12)



Oh dear....Jesus roundly condemned Judaism as the work of the devil. Those who taught it were “from their father the devil” according to Jesus (John 8:44).....so emulating Judaism is imitating the devil’s religion. Any wonder it doesn’t resemble Christianity....which had no priests, no rituals, no distinctive clothing or titles, and no grand, ornate buildings.

Matt 5:17 is Jesus saying he came to “fulfill the Law”....not the teachings of Judaism.
What did Jesus say about them...?
“...To uphold your tradition you have made God’s word null and void. You hypocrites! How rightly did Isaiah prophesy about you when he said: ‘This people honors me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me; in vain do they worship me, teaching as doctrines the commandments of men.’ ” (Matt 15:7-9 NCB)


Well, it’s the interpretation of Scripture where the church fails....
Who created all things? (Col 1:15-17) God did, but “through” the agency of his son. (John 1:2-3)

What is “the sin atoning sacrifice of Jesus”? If he is God, then the sacrifice he made was way above what was required to fulfill God’s Law...”an eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth, a life for a life”. God’s law demanded equivalency, so Jesus had to be the exact equivalent of Adam in order to pay the debt that Adam left for his children. This is why he was called “the last Adam”. (1 Cor 15:45)
Can mere humans kill God?

What was the manner of Jesus’ resurrection? In what form was he raised in order to return to heaven?
And in what “manner” was his ascension, so that we would know how he was to return? (Acts 1:9-11)

There are rituals of the church, and there are the traditions that the church invented around things like baptisms, weddings, funerals etc.....
Baptisms in the Bible were only performed on adults, not minor children. For one to be baptized as a disciple of Christ, one had to make a decision to do so on the basis of imparted knowledge. An infant cannot make such a commitment...and there was no proxy arrangement....minor children were judged on the conduct of their believing parent. (1 Cor 7:13-14)

Weddings and funerals were cultural things, not really religious rituals.
Marriage in Israel involved no ceremony, and funerals were attended by those who accompanied the deceased to their burial site.
Humans invented the rituals.


The RCC invented the ritual of the Eucharist, turning the bread and wine into the literal flesh and blood of Christ....something that most people would find completely repulsive.
No Jew would ever assume that the emblems were literal, but representations. It would be breaking God’s Law if they were literal.

Oh please...all these things in Revelation refer to the heavenly arrangement not the earthly one.
What did Jesus say in Rev 20:6 regarding the priesthood that was to be served in heaven?

“Blessed and holy are those who share in the first resurrection. The second death has no power over them. They will be priests of God and of Christ, and they will reign with him for a thousand years.” (NCB)

Since this was yet future....when were these “chosen ones” (saints) to rule with Christ in his Kingdom?
Has the thousands years already passed? Or has it even begun?



LOL...I know one of us needs to do their homework.....because one of us is showing absolute ignorance of anything Scriptural....you have one view that has been indoctrinated to the point where the truth cannot penetrate even when it is presented from God’s own word.....(2 Cor 4:3-4) Sad, but not unexpected.

If you knew what the Bible teaches, you would also know that at “the time of the end” prophesied by Daniel, only at that time was the truth going to be fully revealed. (Daniel 12:4, 9-10)

The “weeds” were permitted to do what weeds do best.... to choke out what the sower (Jesus) planted.

We are living in “the time of the end” right now, when Jesus is about to manifest as the judge of all of us....
He has already warned us that the majority who claim him as their “Lord” will come to realise what he tells them...”I NEVER KNEW YOU”....and calls them “WORKERS OF LAWLESSNESS”.....Which means that he has never set foot in their houses of worship. (Matt 7:21-13)

Only then will we know if we have obeyed Christ in all things. He will “separate the sheep from the goats” and his judgment is final.....we will all know then which category we chose for ourselves.

Your going to allow a MAN to judge you??

2 Timothy 4:1
1I charge you in the presence of God and of Christ Jesus, who is to judge the living and the dead, and by his appearing and his kingdom...

John 5:22
22For the Father judges no one, but has given all judgment to the Son,

 

[GodsGrace]

What good are orthodox beliefs, if a religion professing Christ, doesn't obey Christ & His 12 Apostles?

Beliefs wouldnt matter a hill of beans, according to Jesus.

Which religion are you speaking of Tazz?
When/where did Jesus say beliefs don't matter?

I can't think of any scripture regarding this.

And WHICH orthodox religion teaches not to obey Christ?

 

[Aunty Jane]

Your going to allow a MAN to judge you??

Yes....because God is the one who said that the leaders in the congregation are given that authority.

“In my letter, I wrote to you not to associate with people who are leading immoral lives. Obviously, I was not referring to contact with people in the world who are immoral or with those who are greedy or thieves or worshipers of false gods, since to do this you would have to leave the world. What I really meant to get across was that you should not associate with any brother or sister who is sexually immoral, greedy, an idolater, a slanderer, a drunkard or a robber. You should not even eat with such a person. It is no concern of mine to judge those who are outside the fold. It is your responsibility to judge those who are inside. God will pass judgment on the outsiders. Banish the evil person from your midst.” (1 Cor 5:9-13 NCB)

Those who take the lead have the responsibility to enforce God’s standards inside the congregation, on those who claim Jesus as their Lord, but who fail to obey him. God will judge those outside.

He also wrote.....
“Obey your leaders and submit to them, for they watch over your souls and will have to render an account in that regard. Make this a joy for them to do rather than a grief, for that would be of no advantage to you.” (Heb 13:17 NCB)

Those appointed to judge will themselves be judged....they will “render an account” to God for the judgments they make. The offence must be proven, just as was the case in ancient Israel. There has to be substantiated evidence and witnesses to the offence...not just empty gossip.

God’s standards do not change. If the leaders tolerate unrepentant wrongdoing, they will account to God for their lack of action to correct those ones. The Scriptures tell us exactly what to do, and why God’s discipline is necessary.....

”You have forgotten the exhortation that addresses you as children:“My son, do not scorn the discipline of the Lord or lose heart when you are punished by him. For the Lord disciplines those whom he loves, and he chastises every son whom he acknowledges.” (Heb 12:5 NCB)

God’s discipline is an evidence of his love.

2 Timothy 4:1
1I charge you in the presence of God and of Christ Jesus, who is to judge the living and the dead, and by his appearing and his kingdom...

John 5:22
22For the Father judges no one, but has given all judgment to the Son,

Can you see the selective way that makes it appear as if the Scriptures contradict each other...?
What is the old saying......”a little knowledge is a dangerous thing”....proven true by those who use weak arguments and then use Scripture, out of context, to support it....

Jesus is God’s appointed judge and acts in his behalf on a global scale.....the leaders in the congregation act on the authority that is given them by Christ, locally. There is no contradiction....just poorly interpreted Scripture.

The Scriptures you quoted are about God’s final judgment on this world....Jesus is the one who, with his powerful angels, dispatches the “goats”. All authority that the Son has, is “given” to him by his God and Father. (Matt 28:18)

 

[Aunty Jane]

Which religion are you speaking of Tazz?
When/where did Jesus say beliefs don't matter?

I can't think of any scripture regarding this.

And WHICH orthodox religion teaches not to obey Christ?

And here is an example of selective “believing”.....it’s not the act of ‘believing’, but what we have been taught to believe that becomes the issue.

What therefore is “orthodox” Christianity?

“Orthodox” is defined as....
“Following or conforming to the traditional or generally accepted rules or beliefs of a religion, philosophy or practice.”

So don’t we have to first ascertain if what we believe and accept as “orthodox” is actually truth?

What is accepted by the majority can be manipulated very easily by the devil who rules this world. (1 John 5:19) Take for example the standards of morality in the world.....those nations who see themselves as “Christian” used to have standards whereby even in the movies, efforts were made to keep them moral by a strict code of censorship.....

Fast forward only a few decades and see now where there is no effort made to censor anything immoral because it has become so accepted in today’s world that even those who identify as Christians are no longer offended by them......the graphically depicted sex scenes and immoral behavior and foul language are now the “norm”, not to mention the violence and bloodshed that are depicted in movies and graphic video games played by children, and desensitizing them......but how does a God who does not change his standards, view them?

If you study the Bible instead of corrupted church theology, you soon realise that what is viewed as “orthodox” today, was simply carried over in centuries of indoctrination, teaching things that were introduced after Jesus and the apostles left......the “weeds” foretold by Jesus, took over “the church” and if you stand back and look at what passes for “Christianity” today.....what is God seeing?.....people sticking to what was programmed in them by a divided and corrupted “church” system, who can’t really agree on much of anything except those “orthodox” beliefs, which are accepted and practiced, but were never the truth in the first place.

Unless people wake up to what the devil has done, they will perish when God brings this world to an accounting.....this is the time for “no excuses”.....in today’s world, ignorance is a choice, because knowledge is at our finger tips. We can research whatever we want to, but we need to carefully weigh up what we read, as the devil is ever present on the Internet, as well.
Historical sources are more reliable if they have no religious bias to uphold....same with Bible translations...use a good concordance and Interlinear for better understanding of the original languages.

People can continue on in their “orthodoxy”....or they can wake up and see how manipulated they have been through centuries of corruption and division.....and they can seek the true God...the one Jesus served and ask for his direction.

There can only be one truth...and only God can lead a willing heart to accept it, (John 6:65) because it is in absolute contradiction to what is accepted as “orthodox”....and people have been taught to reject it, and to hate those who teach it, just as the Pharisees taught people to reject the Son of God. (John 16:18-21)

“There is nothing new under the sun”...Solomon said....

 

[walter]

Yes....because God is the one who said that the leaders in the congregation are given that authority.

“In my letter, I wrote to you not to associate with people who are leading immoral lives. Obviously, I was not referring to contact with people in the world who are immoral or with those who are greedy or thieves or worshipers of false gods, since to do this you would have to leave the world. What I really meant to get across was that you should not associate with any brother or sister who is sexually immoral, greedy, an idolater, a slanderer, a drunkard or a robber. You should not even eat with such a person. It is no concern of mine to judge those who are outside the fold. It is your responsibility to judge those who are inside. God will pass judgment on the outsiders. Banish the evil person from your midst.” (1 Cor 5:9-13 NCB)

Those who take the lead have the responsibility to enforce God’s standards inside the congregation, on those who claim Jesus as their Lord, but who fail to obey him. God will judge those outside.

He also wrote.....
“Obey your leaders and submit to them, for they watch over your souls and will have to render an account in that regard. Make this a joy for them to do rather than a grief, for that would be of no advantage to you.” (Heb 13:17 NCB)

Those appointed to judge will themselves be judged....they will “render an account” to God for the judgments they make. The offence must be proven, just as was the case in ancient Israel. There has to be substantiated evidence and witnesses to the offence...not just empty gossip.

God’s standards do not change. If the leaders tolerate unrepentant wrongdoing, they will account to God for their lack of action to correct those ones. The Scriptures tell us exactly what to do, and why God’s discipline is necessary.....

”You have forgotten the exhortation that addresses you as children:“My son, do not scorn the discipline of the Lord or lose heart when you are punished by him. For the Lord disciplines those whom he loves, and he chastises every son whom he acknowledges.” (Heb 12:5 NCB)

God’s discipline is an evidence of his love.

Can you see the selective way that makes it appear as if the Scriptures contradict each other...?
What is the old saying......”a little knowledge is a dangerous thing”....proven true by those who use weak arguments and then use Scripture, out of context, to support it....

Jesus is God’s appointed judge and acts in his behalf on a global scale.....the leaders in the congregation act on the authority that is given them by Christ, locally. There is no contradiction....just poorly interpreted Scripture.

The Scriptures you quoted are about God’s final judgment on this world....Jesus is the one who, with his powerful angels, dispatches the “goats”. All authority that the Son has, is “given” to him by his God and Father. (Matt 28:18)

I feel that as a fine thing to let the Bible do the explaining.. Very nice Sister.

 

[TazzJazz]

Hello...

When/where did Jesus say beliefs don't matter?

Well, I didn't say beliefs 'don't' matter.

I said they "wouldn't" matter, If believers weren't being obedient to God and His Son.

 

[BreadOfLife]

Interestingly, early Christians taught no purgatory,

The Bible absolutely teaches that many WILL go through a final purification: 2 Macc. 12:42-46, Matt. 5:25-26, Matt. 12:32, Matt. 18:32-35, Luke 12:58-59, 1 Cor. 3:10‐15

worshiped no images, honored no “saints,” and venerated no relics.

Neither does the Catholic church worship images. We worship God – and God ALONE.

As for NOT having honored saints from the past or their relics – again, you DON’T know what you’re talking about . . .
Heb. 11 is often referred to as the “Hall of Saints” chapter. We read about them faith and trust in God - from Abel and Noah ,all the way down to Abraham, Jacob, Moses and even Rahab.

2 Kings 13:21
And as a man was being buried, lo, a marauding band was seen and the man was cast into the grave of Eli′sha; and as soon as the man touched the bones of Eli′sha, he revived, and stood on his feet.

- Moses took the bones of Joseph with him (Exod. 13:19)

- People laid out the sick into the streets, so that Peter’s shadow might fall on some of them so that they might be healed (Acts 5:14-15).

- God did extraordinary miracles by the hands of Paul’s handkerchiefs or aprons were taken from his body to the sick and demo- possessed and they were healed.

- In the document, The Martyrdom of St. Polycarp (155 AD), who was a disciple of the Apostle John, we read that the bones of Polycarp were considered, "…more precious than costly gems and finer than gold", were carefully gathered up after his execution, and put "in a suitable place" (Jurgens, Vol. 1, pg 31).

They did not engage in politics and did not resort to carnal warfare. But by the 15th century, none of this was any longer true of many who professed to be their imitators. The deviation was absolute!

If YOU that Jesus was a pacifist – the you DON’T know your Bible . . .
Luke 22:36

He said to them, “But now if you have a purse, take it, and also a bag; and if you don’t have a sword, sell your cloak and buy one.

God doesn’t lie – NOR is He a hypocrite. The NT doesn’t mean that He “changed” His mind about the OT. It shows that He fulfilled it. Peace and love do NOT automatically result in “pacifism”. Our God is a God of justice as well.

In Eccl. 3, He states that there is a time for EVERYTHING under the heavens.
There is a time to be born and a time to die, a time to plant and a time to uproot…
a time TO KILL and a time to heal…

As for NOT being involved in politics – the entire Book of Deuteronomy is about setting up a government. Moses, Jacob, Joseph, Daniel, Esther, Mordecai, Nehemiah, Jeremiah, were ALL involved in the politics of their time.

This is NOT condemned in Scripture – but encouraged . . .

Jer. 29:7
Also, seek the peace and prosperity of the city to which I have carried you into exile. Pray to the Lord for it, because if it prospers, you too will prosper.”

Jesus and his apostles foretold an that an apostasy would take over the church like “weeds”....and it was beginning to take place at the end of the first century.....those ”weeds” Jesus said we’re planted “by the devil” would engulf “the world”.....and remain until “the harvest” which we see rapidly approaching as this world system under satan’s rulership, caves in in itself.

Anyone with a knowledge of church history knows what the “weeds” did to those who dared to question the authority of ”the church”...and the consequence were dire. That is established history.

Apostasy began in the Church as early as the FIRST century with the Gnostics and others.

Apostasy isn’t just a “veering-off” from the truth. It’s a repudiation oof the truth – and that’s precisely what your founder Charles Taze Russell did when He rejected the very nature of God.

YOUR problem – besides Scripture and Early Fathers like Ignatius of Antioch and Clement of Rome - is that you actually believe that the apostates won out over Christ’s Church for 1900 years - until your founder, Chrles Russell set things “straight”.

Talk about a con-job . . .

This “misunderstanding” as you call it, was calculated. Because the “weeds” were a product of the devil, his stamp would be seen on all of it. “The very nature of God” was corrupted in order to have “the church” worshipping a god that in Scripture does not exist. Everyone who subscribes to this false doctrine is breaking the first Commandment.....they have put a false god in place of the Father.
This is not the God of Jesus Christ. (Rev 3:12)

No - the misunderstanding came from a rebellious ignorance of Scripture.

Men like Luther and Calvin opened the door to open rebellion and private interpretation of Scripture so that verses like Matt. 16:18-19, 18:15-18, Luke 10:16, John 16:12-15 and John 20:21 became individual mandates (micro) – instead of the Authoritative statements (macro) that they are. They and those that followed them were free to accept or reject whatever they chose, based on their OWN interpretations..

THIS is why YOUR sect exists – and why there are literally tens of thousands of Protestant denominations that ALL teach different doctrines based on the whims and personal interpretations of their individual founders - ALL claiming to have the "truth" . . .

Oh dear....Jesus roundly condemned Judaism as the work of the devil. Those who taught it were “from their father the devil” according to Jesus (John 8:44).....so emulating Judaism is imitating the devil’s religion. Any wonder it doesn’t resemble Christianity....which had no priests, no rituals, no distinctive clothing or titles, and no grand, ornate buildings.

Matt 5:17 is Jesus saying he came to “fulfill the Law”....not the teachings of Judaism.
What did Jesus say about them...?
“...To uphold your tradition you have made God’s word null and void. You hypocrites! How rightly did Isaiah prophesy about you when he said: ‘This people honors me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me; in vain do they worship me, teaching as doctrines the commandments of men.’ ” (Matt 15:7-9 NCB)

WOW. Your ignorance is astounding – as, is your rebellion against God . . .

Jesus NEVER condemned Judaism as evil. Jesus was a Jew who was an adherent to Jewish Tradition. He was circumcised, observed the Sabbath, observed all of the Jewish Festivals. He quoted from Tradition (Matt 23:2).

Why would you EVER accuse God of creating something evil for people to practice? You pretty much just condemned EVERYONE in the Old Testament.

He condemned the traditions of the Pharisees that THEY invented to exalt themselves and to make money. He wasn’t condemning ALL tradition.

Do your homework . . .

 

[BreadOfLife]

continued . . .

Well, it’s the interpretation of Scripture where the church fails....
Who created all things? (Col 1:15-17) God did, but “through” the agency of his son. (John 1:2-3)

WRONG.

Col. 1:16-17
FOR BY HIM ALL THINGS WERE CREATED, in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things were created through him and for him.

Gen. 1:26
“Let US create man in OUR image"

- In Rev 1:8 and Rev. 21:5, GOD specifically calls Himself, the “Alpha and the Omega.”
- In Rev. 22:12-16, we see JESUS proclaim:
“I am the Alpha and the Omega, the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End.”

Indeed, GOD created all things – the Father, Son and Holy Spirit.
You can't have TWO different Beings called the "Alpha and the Omega" . . .What is “the sin atoning sacrifice of Jesus”? If he is God, then the sacrifice he made was way above what was required to fulfill God’s Law...”an eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth, a life for a life”. God’s law demanded equivalency, so Jesus had to be the exact equivalent of Adam in order to pay the debt that Adam left for his children. This is why he was called “the last Adam”. (1 Cor 15:45)

Can mere humans kill God?

What was the manner of Jesus’ resurrection? In what form was he raised in order to return to heaven?

So then, what’s your problem?
Jesus IS fully man.

YOUR problem with Him is that He is also FULLY God. This isn’t a man-made tradition – this is Scriptural FACT . . .
Isaiah 7:14, Isaiah 9:6, Matt. 4:7, John 1:1, John 1:3, John 8:58, John 10:30, John 14:9, John 20:28, 2 Corinthians 4:4, Phil. 2:6, Col. 2:9, 1 Tim. 3:16, Heb. 1:8, Titus 2:13, Rev. 22:13

GOD says . . .
Rev. 1:8
“I am the Alpha and the Omega.”

Rev. 21:6
“I am the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End.”

JESUS says . . .
Rev. 22:13
I am the Alpha and the Omega, the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End".

Ergo, Jesus is GOD . . .

And in what “manner” was his ascension, so that we would know how he was to return? (Acts 1:9-11)

He's going to return in the SAME way that He ascended (Acts 1:11).

There are rituals of the church, and there are the traditions that the church invented around things like baptisms, weddings, funerals etc.....
Baptisms in the Bible were only performed on adults, not minor children. For one to be baptized as a disciple of Christ, one had to make a decision to do so on the basis of imparted knowledge. An infant cannot make such a commitment...and there was no proxy arrangement....minor children were judged on the conduct of their believing parent. (1 Cor 7:13-14)

WRONG.

Both Peter and Paul Baptized entire households (Acts 10:1-49, 11:13-14, Acts 16:23-33, 1 Cor. 1:16).
A first century household typically included parents, grandparents, children (including infants) – and servants.

THIS is why it was unanimously written about by the Early Church Fathers.

Weddings and funerals were cultural things, not really religious rituals.
Marriage in Israel involved no ceremony, and funerals were attended by those who accompanied the deceased to their burial site.

WRONG on ALL counts . . .

First of all - I’ve NEVER been to a wedding OR a funeral where God and and/or Scripture were NOT invoked.

Secondly – 1st century Jewish weddings indeed included ritual.
There were the ritual blessings. There were also prayers offered by family and guests. There were blessings over the wine. The couple also recited blessings of commitment and sanctification.

It may not have resembled a typical 20th century American wedding – but it absolutely included religious ritual.

The RCC invented the ritual of the Eucharist, turning the bread and wine into the literal flesh and blood of Christ....

Another Scripturally-bankrupt claim . . .

The Bread of Life discourse in John 6 is about as explicit as it gets when it comes to the Eucharist:

John 6:53-56
“Amen, amen, I say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you do not have life within you.

Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise him on the last day. For my flesh is true food, and my blood is true drink. Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood remains in me and I in him.”

It might interest you that the usual Greek word used for human eating is “phagon”. However, this is NOT the word used in these passages. John uses the word, “trogon”, which means, to munch or to gnaw - like an animal. Jesus was again using hyperbole as he often did to drive his point across so that the crowd would understand that he was NOT speaking metaphorically. He meant what he said.

Just as the Paschal Lamb was to be eaten, it is also true for the Lamb of God.

...something that most people would find completely repulsive.
No Jew would ever assume that the emblems were literal, but representations. It would be breaking God’s Law if they were literal.

Which is exactly why many of His followers left Him in John 6:66 and returned to their former way of life. They couldn’t handle what He was telling them. YOU remind me of them . . .

And it wouldn’t “break” God’s law ANY more than eating shellfish or pork - which was now approved in the New Covenant (Acts 10:9-16).

If you knew what the Bible teaches, you would also know that at “the time of the end” prophesied by Daniel, only at that time was the truth going to be fully revealed. (Daniel 12:4, 9-10)

The “weeds” were permitted to do what weeds do best.... to choke out what the sower (Jesus) planted.

The EASIEST way to pick out a counterfeit, quasi-Christian is to simply point to the one that claims, “EVERYNODY else has been ‘wrong’ for 1800 years - until WE got here” . . .

 

[GodsGrace]

Hello...


Well, I didn't say beliefs 'don't' matter.

I said they "wouldn't" matter, If believers weren't being obedient to God and His Son.

Here's what you said in no. 491:

"What good are orthodox beliefs, if a religion professing Christ, doesn't obey Christ & His 12 Apostles?

Beliefs wouldnt matter a hill of beans, according to Jesus."


So you're saying that beliefs DO matter to Jesus?
If that's what you're saying,,,then we agree.

 

[GodsGrace]

Yes....because God is the one who said that the leaders in the congregation are given that authority.

What are you talking about??

You let men in a congregation JUDGE you?

Can't get your mind out of the JW track.

I'm talking about JUDGING AFTER YOUR DEATH...
or if YOU prefer since you believe in soul sleep...

AT THE LAST JUDGMENT.

“In my letter, I wrote to you not to associate with people who are leading immoral lives. Obviously, I was not referring to contact with people in the world who are immoral or with those who are greedy or thieves or worshipers of false gods, since to do this you would have to leave the world. What I really meant to get across was that you should not associate with any brother or sister who is sexually immoral, greedy, an idolater, a slanderer, a drunkard or a robber. You should not even eat with such a person. It is no concern of mine to judge those who are outside the fold. It is your responsibility to judge those who are inside. God will pass judgment on the outsiders. Banish the evil person from your midst.” (1 Cor 5:9-13 NCB)

Those who take the lead have the responsibility to enforce God’s standards inside the congregation, on those who claim Jesus as their Lord, but who fail to obey him. God will judge those outside.

He also wrote.....
“Obey your leaders and submit to them, for they watch over your souls and will have to render an account in that regard. Make this a joy for them to do rather than a grief, for that would be of no advantage to you.” (Heb 13:17 NCB)

Those appointed to judge will themselves be judged....they will “render an account” to God for the judgments they make. The offence must be proven, just as was the case in ancient Israel. There has to be substantiated evidence and witnesses to the offence...not just empty gossip.

God’s standards do not change. If the leaders tolerate unrepentant wrongdoing, they will account to God for their lack of action to correct those ones. The Scriptures tell us exactly what to do, and why God’s discipline is necessary.....

”You have forgotten the exhortation that addresses you as children:“My son, do not scorn the discipline of the Lord or lose heart when you are punished by him. For the Lord disciplines those whom he loves, and he chastises every son whom he acknowledges.” (Heb 12:5 NCB)

God’s discipline is an evidence of his love.

Can you see the selective way that makes it appear as if the Scriptures contradict each other...?
What is the old saying......”a little knowledge is a dangerous thing”....proven true by those who use weak arguments and then use Scripture, out of context, to support it....

Jesus is God’s appointed judge and acts in his behalf on a global scale.....the leaders in the congregation act on the authority that is given them by Christ, locally. There is no contradiction....just poorly interpreted Scripture.

The Scriptures you quoted are about God’s final judgment on this world....Jesus is the one who, with his powerful angels, dispatches the “goats”. All authority that the Son has, is “given” to him by his God and Father. (Matt 28:18)

Not replying to the rest because, as ususal, you're off on different rabbit holes.

 

[GodsGrace]

And here is an example of selective “believing”.....it’s not the act of ‘believing’, but what we have been taught to believe that becomes the issue.

What therefore is “orthodox” Christianity?

“Orthodox” is defined as....
“Following or conforming to the traditional or generally accepted rules or beliefs of a religion, philosophy or practice.”

Very good!

YOU are NOT following orthodox Christianity and it's been shown to you why ad nauseum.

Any NEW RELIGION will not be following orthodoxy.

So don’t we have to first ascertain if what we believe and accept as “orthodox” is actually truth?

What is accepted by the majority can be manipulated very easily by the devil who rules this world. (1 John 5:19) Take for example the standards of morality in the world.....those nations who see themselves as “Christian” used to have standards whereby even in the movies, efforts were made to keep them moral by a strict code of censorship.....

Fast forward only a few decades and see now where there is no effort made to censor anything immoral because it has become so accepted in today’s world that even those who identify as Christians are no longer offended by them......the graphically depicted sex scenes and immoral behavior and foul language are now the “norm”, not to mention the violence and bloodshed that are depicted in movies and graphic video games played by children, and desensitizing them......but how does a God who does not change his standards, view them?

If you study the Bible instead of corrupted church theology, you soon realise that what is viewed as “orthodox” today, was simply carried over in centuries of indoctrination, teaching things that were introduced after Jesus and the apostles left......the “weeds” foretold by Jesus, took over “the church” and if you stand back and look at what passes for “Christianity” today.....what is God seeing?.....people sticking to what was programmed in them by a divided and corrupted “church” system, who can’t really agree on much of anything except those “orthodox” beliefs, which are accepted and practiced, but were never the truth in the first place.

Unless people wake up to what the devil has done, they will perish when God brings this world to an accounting.....this is the time for “no excuses”.....in today’s world, ignorance is a choice, because knowledge is at our finger tips. We can research whatever we want to, but we need to carefully weigh up what we read, as the devil is ever present on the Internet, as well.
Historical sources are more reliable if they have no religious bias to uphold....same with Bible translations...use a good concordance and Interlinear for better understanding of the original languages.

People can continue on in their “orthodoxy”....or they can wake up and see how manipulated they have been through centuries of corruption and division.....and they can seek the true God...the one Jesus served and ask for his direction.

There can only be one truth...and only God can lead a willing heart to accept it, (John 6:65) because it is in absolute contradiction to what is accepted as “orthodox”....and people have been taught to reject it, and to hate those who teach it, just as the Pharisees taught people to reject the Son of God. (John 16:18-21)

“There is nothing new under the sun”...Solomon said....

You should write a book.