Mary the Queen of Heaven?

[Grailhunter]

Tell us, what is the "false belief" of Genesis chapter 1 ???

בְּרֵאשִׁ֖ית (bə·rê·šîṯ)
Preposition-b | Noun - feminine singular
Strong's Hebrew 7225: 1) first, beginning, best, chief 1a) beginning 1b) first 1c) chief 1d) choice part

God
אֱלֹהִ֑ים (’ĕ·lō·hîm)
Noun - masculine plural
Strong's Hebrew 430: 1) (plural) 1a) rulers, judges 1b) divine ones 1c) angels 1d) gods 2) (plural intensive-singular meaning) 2a) god, goddess 2b) godlike one 2c) works or special possessions of God 2d) the (true) God 2e) God

It is not a false belief, it is the way the Hebrew language works.
Do you think Yahweh is a woman?

 

[Grailhunter]

i enjoy reading your responses, they can be quite entertaining.

Like this statement = "just because you find a three aspect in God's name does not prove the three in one formula for the Trinity."


Actually, they do!

John 7:38 - On the last day, that great day of the feast, Jesus stood and cried out, saying, “If anyone thirsts, let him come to Me and drink.
He who believes in Me, as the Scripture has said, out of his heart will flow rivers of living water.”


"The Only True Elohim" = Plurality of Echad


Genesis to Revelation Speak of THREE, Who are Echad Elohim

Pray for the LORD to open the scriptures to you = Luke 24:45

Again Yahweh said several times He is the only God and there is no one like Him. Do you think Yahweh is a liar? If the Israelites or Jews would have caught someone worshipping Yeshua they would have killed them as directed by the Mosaic Law.

 

[David1701]

Yes – ONLY if you include the likes of the late anti-Catholic cartoonist Jack Chick and fugitive conman Alberto Riveera.

BOTH of these yahoos have been DEBUNKED so many times that it is comical you would consider their false accusations as anything other than the manure that they are. There are entire websites committed to exposing Chick’s nonsense.

For crying out loud – these idiots were adherents of Alexander Hislop and his ridiculous book, The Two Babylons., which has been debunked by virtually EVERY theologian and historian - Protestant, Cathoolic and secular . . .

Yes, let’s TALK about that court case . . .

First of all – Lincoln was one of a team of lawyers on that case. And the reason there was a court case in the first place is because Chiniquy was being SUED by Peter Spink for $40,000 because of false and slanderous claims against him.

In the END, having NO other alternative – Chiniquy’s layers (including Lincoln) finally convinced him to settle the matter OUT of court or be faced with having to pay the ENTIRE fine.

Chiniquy was a LIAR, and an embezzler – as his Protestant congregations eventually discovered . . .

WRONG.

The Bible mentions PAGANS who worshipped and offered sacrifices to a female deity whom THEY referred to as “Queen of Heaven”.

Let’s explore this . . .

So, you’re a Biblical Literalist, who believes that ONLY those things that are explicitly-mentioned in Scripture are those things we are to adhere to? NO room for Symbolism, Allegory or Implied Truth - of which there is PLENTY on Scripture?

Please EXPLAIN, then how you come to Protestant doctrines and practices like:
- Sola Scriptura
- The Rapture
- Accepting Christ as personal Lord and Savior
- Limited Atonement
- Altar Calls
- Infant Dedications
- Eternal Security - “Once saved, always saved”
And MANY others . . .

The title, “Queen of Heaven” can be attributed ti Mary because if the implicitly-taught truth in Revelation:
Rev 12:1
A great sign appeared in the sky, a WOMAN clothed with the sun, with the moon under her feet, and on her head A CROWN OF TWELVE STARS.
She was with child and wailed aloud in pain as she labored to give birth.

This is what is known to theologians as “polyvalent symbolism” (sorry for the big words).

We know that this child is Jesus because in verse 4, we read:
“She gave birth to a son, a male child, destined to rule all the nations with an iron rod.”

This can ALSO represent Israel because of the Twelve Stars on her crown – and the fact that Jesus came from the Jews.

“Polyvalent” means that there are multiple meanings to a symbol.
There is simply NO getting around the fact that the Woman here in Revelation 12 is Mary.

Pro. 16:18 (MKJV) Pride goes before destruction, and a haughty spirit before a fall.

 

[David in NJ]

Again Yahweh said several times He is the only God and there is no one like Him. Do you think Yahweh is a liar? If the Israelites or Jews would have caught someone worshipping Yeshua they would have killed them as directed by the Mosaic Law.

Yahweh is Echad with His FATHER = as is the Ruach HaKodesh = THREE

There is no distinction from the fact that all THREE are the Elohim of Genesis chapter 1

The Hebrew apostle John knew this and thus he opened his gospel with Genesis 1:1

As a Hebrew, John knew that there is Only One True Elohim
1.) "I and My FATHER are ONE"
2.) "This is Eternal Life: to Know You, the only true God and Jesus Christ whom You sent"
3.) "If you love Me keep My commandments and I will pray to the FATHER that you may receive the SPIRIT of TRUTH"

 

[Grailhunter]

Yahweh is Echad with His FATHER = as is the Ruach HaKodesh = THREE

There is no distinction from the fact that all THREE are the Elohim of Genesis chapter 1

The Hebrew apostle John knew this and thus he opened his gospel with Genesis 1:1

As a Hebrew, John knew that there is Only One True Elohim
1.) "I and My FATHER are ONE"
2.) "This is Eternal Life: to Know You, the only true God and Jesus Christ whom You sent"
3.) "If you love Me keep My commandments and I will pray to the FATHER that you may receive the SPIRIT of TRUTH"

Exodus 20:3 You shall have no other gods before Me.
Isaiah 45:5 – “I am the LORD, and there is no other; there is no God but Me.
Isaiah 42:8 – “I am the LORD; that is my name; my glory I give to no other, nor my praise to carved idols.”
Yahweh was replaced by the word LORD in your Bible.
Deuteronomy 6:4 Hear, O Israel! The LORD is our God, the LORD is one!

In the New Testament Yeshua gives us a clearer explanation of the oneness concept. Speaking to God the Father (He was not talking to Himself) Yeshua says this about the concept of one...John 17:22 “And the glory which to them; that they may be one just as We are one.” Because Yeshua says “just as” this is an exactness, a duplication of a condition that we can achieve, and He states that this condition of “oneness” can apply to us, but it has nothing to do with absorption or singularity, but rather a condition of spiritual union and solidarity between God and us.
The next verse further defines this by describing a unity with Christ that would cause the same condition with us as it did with them, a condition of perfection. Again, not talking to Himself, in John 17:23 “I in them, and You in Me, that they may be perfected in unity, that the world may know that You did send Me, and do love them, even as you do love Me.” In this context millions of people could be made one...one being a abstract concept of one, but a more literal meaning of unity, solidarity, and perfection and even a “body” that is considered one....the body of Christ or the body of the Church.
And then, the next verse is probably one of the best verses to put this oneness concept into perspective. The leading verses are speaking of the works of the Holy Spirit and then ends with this explanation. 1st Corinthians 12:11-13 “But one and the same Spirit works all these things, distributing to each one individually just as He wills. For even as the body is one and yet has many members, and all the members of the body, though they are many, are one body, so also is Christ. For by one Spirit we were all baptized into one body, whether Jews or Greeks, whether slaves or free, and were all made to drink of one Spirit. For the body is not one member, but many.”.....So the "Oneness" is something that applies or will apply to all of us and we are not gods nor will we ever be gods.

Beyond that the scriptures give literally hundreds of proofs that the One God formula for the Trinity is false. The begotten God….Christ refers to Yahweh as His Father and His God.

All of the My Father scriptures....like 59 of them and some of referring to His Father in Heaven. God designated Himself as God the Father so we would understand His position and His relationship with His Son in our terms.
John 3:16 God so love the world that He gave His only begotten Son.....
Matthew 3:77 and behold, a voice out of the heavens said, “This is My beloved Son, in whom I am well-pleased.”

John 20:17“Do not cling to me, for I have not yet ascended to the Father; but go to my brothers and say to them, ‘I am ascending to my Father and your Father, to my God and your God.’”

The Request
Matthew 20:20–21 records that she knelt before Jesus and said, “Grant that one of these two sons of mine may sit at your right and the other at your left in your kingdom” This was a request for positions of supreme honor in Jesus’ reign, reflecting a common expectation among some disciples that the kingdom would be an earthly, political rule with visible prestige

Jesus’ Response
Jesus replies, “You don’t know what you are asking. Can you drink the cup I am going to drink?” The “cup” symbolized the suffering and death He was about to endure. James and John answered, “We can.” Jesus then explained that those seats were not for Him to grant, but were prepared by the Father for others.
https://www.bing.com/copilotsearch?...nd+of+time+would+occur+scripture&form=CSBRAND

Jesus stated that no one knows the day or hour of His return, not even the angels in heaven or the Son, but only the Father (Matthew 24:36; Mark 13:32).​

In the New Testament the Apostles refer to Yahweh as God and Yeshua as Lord.
Example....
2nd Corinthians The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the fellowship of the Holy Spirit…

And there is Yahweh and Yeshua and the Holy Spirit.

 

[David in NJ]

Exodus 20:3 You shall have no other gods before Me.
Isaiah 45:5 – “I am the LORD, and there is no other; there is no God but Me.
Isaiah 42:8 – “I am the LORD; that is my name; my glory I give to no other, nor my praise to carved idols.”
Yahweh was replaced by the word LORD in your Bible.
Deuteronomy 6:4 Hear, O Israel! The LORD is our God, the LORD is one!

In the New Testament Yeshua gives us a clearer explanation of the oneness concept. Speaking to God the Father (He was not talking to Himself) Yeshua says this about the concept of one...John 17:22 “And the glory which to them; that they may be one just as We are one.” Because Yeshua says “just as” this is an exactness, a duplication of a condition that we can achieve, and He states that this condition of “oneness” can apply to us, but it has nothing to do with absorption or singularity, but rather a condition of spiritual union and solidarity between God and us.
The next verse further defines this by describing a unity with Christ that would cause the same condition with us as it did with them, a condition of perfection. Again, not talking to Himself, in John 17:23 “I in them, and You in Me, that they may be perfected in unity, that the world may know that You did send Me, and do love them, even as you do love Me.” In this context millions of people could be made one...one being a abstract concept of one, but a more literal meaning of unity, solidarity, and perfection and even a “body” that is considered one....the body of Christ or the body of the Church.
And then, the next verse is probably one of the best verses to put this oneness concept into perspective. The leading verses are speaking of the works of the Holy Spirit and then ends with this explanation. 1st Corinthians 12:11-13 “But one and the same Spirit works all these things, distributing to each one individually just as He wills. For even as the body is one and yet has many members, and all the members of the body, though they are many, are one body, so also is Christ. For by one Spirit we were all baptized into one body, whether Jews or Greeks, whether slaves or free, and were all made to drink of one Spirit. For the body is not one member, but many.”.....So the "Oneness" is something that applies or will apply to all of us and we are not gods nor will we ever be gods.

Beyond that the scriptures give literally hundreds of proofs that the One God formula for the Trinity is false. The begotten God….Christ refers to Yahweh as His Father and His God.

All of the My Father scriptures....like 59 of them and some of referring to His Father in Heaven. God designated Himself as God the Father so we would understand His position and His relationship with His Son in our terms.
John 3:16 God so love the world that He gave His only begotten Son.....
Matthew 3:77 and behold, a voice out of the heavens said, “This is My beloved Son, in whom I am well-pleased.”

John 20:17“Do not cling to me, for I have not yet ascended to the Father; but go to my brothers and say to them, ‘I am ascending to my Father and your Father, to my God and your God.’”

The Request
Matthew 20:20–21 records that she knelt before Jesus and said, “Grant that one of these two sons of mine may sit at your right and the other at your left in your kingdom” This was a request for positions of supreme honor in Jesus’ reign, reflecting a common expectation among some disciples that the kingdom would be an earthly, political rule with visible prestige

Jesus’ Response
Jesus replies, “You don’t know what you are asking. Can you drink the cup I am going to drink?” The “cup” symbolized the suffering and death He was about to endure. James and John answered, “We can.” Jesus then explained that those seats were not for Him to grant, but were prepared by the Father for others.
Copilot Search

Jesus stated that no one knows the day or hour of His return, not even the angels in heaven or the Son, but only the Father (Matthew 24:36; Mark 13:32).​

In the New Testament the Apostles refer to Yahweh as God and Yeshua as Lord.
Example....
2nd Corinthians The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the fellowship of the Holy Spirit…

And there is Yahweh and Yeshua and the Holy Spirit.

You need the Annointing in order to SEE the THREE

 

[Grailhunter]

You need the Annointing in order to SEE the THREE

False beliefs have fooled millions.

 

[sondring7]

We know Jesus raised him from the dead, but we don't know if he died again or was taken alive to heaven perhaps after Jesus' resurrection. "It is appointed unto men once to die..." Heb9:27

++ "It is appointed unto men once to die..." Heb9:27

Yet in 1 Thess 4:16-17 the ALIVE in Christ are raptured without dying ?

Your thoughts ?

 

[David in NJ]

False beliefs have fooled millions.

Well, by your own admission we now know you have been fooled by false beliefs when you reject the clear words of God thru unbelief.

The GOOD NEWS is that it is not too late to seek the LORD.

Gospel of John is the BEST place for you to begin seeking/praying/believing.

Don't miss out!!!

 

[Grailhunter]

Well, by your own admission we now know you have been fooled by false beliefs when you reject the clear words of God thru unbelief.

The GOOD NEWS is that it is not too late to seek the LORD.

Gospel of John is the BEST place for you to begin seeking/praying/believing.

Don't miss out!!!

I am not the one that it fooled, I believe the scriptures not the doctrine of men.
The scriptures speak for themselves......I only gave you a few.

 

[David in NJ]

I am not the one that it fooled, I believe the scriptures not the doctrine of men.
The scriptures speak for themselves......I only gave you a few.

And you have been shown the Holy Scriptures - yet- you reject and run to doctrines of unbelief = the Jews did this to JESUS

Jesus answered, “If I honor Myself, My honor is nothing. It is My Father who honors Me, of whom you say that He is your God.
Yet you have not known Him, but I know Him. And if I say, ‘I do not know Him,’ I shall be a liar like you; but I do know Him and keep His word.
Your father Abraham rejoiced to see My day, and he saw it and was glad.”

Then the Jews said to Him, “You are not yet fifty years old, and have You seen Abraham?”

Jesus said to them, “Most assuredly, I say to you, before Abraham was, I AM.”

Then they took up stones to throw at Him; but Jesus hid Himself and went out of the temple, going through the midst of them, and so passed by.

 

[Grailhunter]

And you have been shown the Holy Scriptures - yet- you reject and run to doctrines of unbelief = the Jews did this to JESUS

Jesus answered, “If I honor Myself, My honor is nothing. It is My Father who honors Me, of whom you say that He is your God.
Yet you have not known Him, but I know Him. And if I say, ‘I do not know Him,’ I shall be a liar like you; but I do know Him and keep His word.
Your father Abraham rejoiced to see My day, and he saw it and was glad.”

Then the Jews said to Him, “You are not yet fifty years old, and have You seen Abraham?”

Jesus said to them, “Most assuredly, I say to you, before Abraham was, I AM.”

Then they took up stones to throw at Him; but Jesus hid Himself and went out of the temple, going through the midst of them, and so passed by.

It is My Father who honors Me, of whom you say that He is your God.
So what do you think your post proves.

 

[Fathom]

Quite the contrary

RCC is the "other gospel" which the LORD Jesus Christ, the Holy Spirit and the Holy Apostles Peter, Paul, John warned us of.

Did your abomination told you Jesus failed to build his church?

Jesus said in Matthew 16:18, And I tell you that you are Peter, and on this rock I will build my church, and the gates of Hades will not overcome it.

 

[Fathom]

You are twisting Scripture to support doctrines that God never taught! First Corinthians 14:34-38 says absolutely nothing about Jesus judging only men, Mary judging women, or Jesus possessing male and female aspects. You invented those interpretations. They are not in the text!

Paul references “the law says” at the very end of 1 Corinthians 14:34. You ignore that and assume Paul was fixing a specific woman disorder that was happening.

Jesus said, “For the Father judgeth no man, but hath committed all judgment unto the Son” (John 5:22). That leaves no room for your invented role for Mary.

The father is the creator; he can bring things into being or tear them down, but he can’t pass judgment on his own work, because that would be judging himself. So the father appoints a judge—Jesus.

Jesus built the church, He didn’t write a book. The book was put together by the church to keep false teachers from misleading people.

Your reference to Martin Luther is irrelevant. I follow Jesus Christ, not Luther, Catholicism, Protestantism, or any other religious tradition. If anyone's teaching contradicts Scripture, reject it!

In Matthew 16:18 Jesus said, "And I tell you that you are Peter, and on this rock I will build my church, and the gates of Hades will not overcome it."

you condemned the Catholic Church and positioned yourself as a great teacher.

And now you refuse to provide Scripture unless I repent and pray a Hail Mary? That is not a biblical argument. That is an attempt to replace the authority of God's Word with your religious demands!

The Sacrament of Penance.

 

[Grailhunter]

Did your abomination told you Jesus failed to build his church?

Jesus said in Matthew 16:18, And I tell you that you are Peter, and on this rock I will build my church, and the gates of Hades will not overcome it.

Amen.
Interesting fact. The concept of Hell.....as in an eternal fiery place of eternal punishment..... was so new during the 1st century---New Testament period---that Christians did not have a word for it. Sometimes Yeshua would use descriptive places like Gehenna, where the fire never died and here He borrowed the Greek word Hades......Hades was a Greek god that reign over the underworld of the same name. But the Greek Hades was not a place of punishment as so much as the realm of the dead. Christians added the definition of a place of eternal fiery punishment.

Christian Greek is a real thing that even Yeshua used. The Greek languages did not have Christian terms ....because.....it was Pagan. Christian Greek refers to the practice of Christians taking Greek words and changing or adding a definition to describe Christian theology. For example; ἁμαρτία (hamartía) the Greek word for sin which means to miss the target was given the definition of an offense against God..... wrong doing.

On the other hand, Hell is a non-biblical word that first appeared in the Anglo-Saxon language in the 8th century AD. So it could not have appeared in the Old or New Testament. Likewise, the word Hades could not have appeared in the Old Testament because it is Greek and that language did not exist in the Old Testament period.
So if you have a Bible where Hell appears in it or the word Hades appear in the Old Testament.....Time to get another Bible.
But make no mistake that a fiery place of eternal punishment is real.

Hades - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[David1701]

Did your abomination told you Jesus failed to build his church?

Jesus said in Matthew 16:18, And I tell you that you are Peter, and on this rock I will build my church, and the gates of Hades will not overcome it.

Peter is Greek "Petros" (a stone or boulder); rock, in this verse, is Greek "Petra" (massive bedrock or a cliff). The Rock is the Lord Jesus Christ and it is upon HIMSELF that he builds his assembly.

The assembly universal is comprised of all those who have genuine faith in the Lord Jesus Christ. It has no headquarters; and its head is the Lord Jesus Christ, not a blasphemously titled "pope"!

 

[David in NJ]

Did your abomination told you Jesus failed to build his church?

Jesus said in Matthew 16:18, And I tell you that you are Peter, and on this rock I will build my church, and the gates of Hades will not overcome it.

JESUS Says: “Assuredly, I say to you, all sins will be forgiven the sons of men, and whatever blasphemies they may utter; but he who blasphemes against the Holy Spirit never has forgiveness, but is subject to eternal condemnation”— because they said, “He has an unclean spirit.”

 

[Grailhunter]

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Watch videos instantly on Bing—enjoy direct playback, discover related clips, and dive into trending content all in one place.

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[bdavidc]

Paul references “the law says” at the very end of 1 Corinthians 14:34. You ignore that and assume Paul was fixing a specific woman disorder that was happening.

The father is the creator; he can bring things into being or tear them down, but he can’t pass judgment on his own work, because that would be judging himself. So the father appoints a judge—Jesus.

Jesus built the church, He didn’t write a book. The book was put together by the church to keep false teachers from misleading people.

In Matthew 16:18 Jesus said, "And I tell you that you are Peter, and on this rock I will build my church, and the gates of Hades will not overcome it."

you condemned the Catholic Church and positioned yourself as a great teacher.

The Sacrament of Penance.

You are once more making assertions that cannot be supported by Scripture. You say that because Paul wrote "as also saith the law" in 1 Corinthians 14:34, this somehow supports your teaching about Jesus judging men and Mary judging women.

But in which place does Paul say that?

Look at the passage. When Paul is speaking about the behaviour of members of the churches, he makes no reference to Mary judging women, or to Jesus judging only men, nor does he speak of Jesus having both male and female aspects.

It is not possible to convert a section dealing with order in the church into a doctrine concerning who judges mankind.

You are now saying that the Father cannot judge His own creation since that would amount to judging Himself.

Well, WHERE DOES THE SCRIPTURES SAY THAT?

Romans 2:16 says, "In the day when God shall judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ according to my gospel."

The Father is spoken of in 1 Peter 1:17 as judging each person according to their own work without showing any partiality.

It is certainly within the Father's authority to pass judgment. As Scripture states in John 5:22, all judgment has been entrusted to the Son. That is exactly what the Bible says. Your argument that God cannot judge His own creation is one that you have invented.

You also state that Jesus founded a church, not a book; of course He did build His church! Nobody is denying what Matthew 16:18 says.

He also said, "Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.”" (John 17:17).

As Paul states, "All scripture was given by the inspiration of God and is of benefit for teaching, for reproof, for correction and for instruction in righteousness" (2 Timothy 3:16).

Are you then saying that since Christ founded His church we should accept everything that religious leaders teach, even though their doctrines are not to be found in God's Word?

Jesus points out that very situation in Mark 7:7 by saying, "They worship me in vain, for they teach human commandments as if they were divine doctrines."

You are accusing me of condemning the Catholic Church and of positioning myself as a great teacher; yet I have never said that I was a great teacher, and all I am asking is that you prove your doctrines on the basis of Scripture.

I do not mind where a teaching comes from—whether it is from Catholics, Protestants, or anyone else—if it goes against the Word of God then it is wrong.

You mention the Sacrament of Penance now, but that still doesn't explain why you required me to say a Hail Mary before you would give me Scripture.

The Bible in First Timothy 2:5 states that "There is one God and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus."

What does the Scripture say that Christians should pray to Mary? And where does it grant Mary the authority to judge women?

Those are the questions I've been asking, and you have still not answered them.

Mary was considered to be blessed compared with other women, and the Scriptures certainly regard her as the mother of Jesus; but the fact that she has been blessed by God does not make her a judge of men or a mediator between God and mankind.

I have no intention of defending one denomination or launching an attack against another; what I am interested in is exactly what God has actually said.

If the teachings referred to are based on the Bible, then prove from the Bible where they are taught. It does not suffice simply to quote passages that have nothing to do with the matter and to appeal to the authority of the Church.

 

[BreadOfLife]

Pro. 16:18 (MKJV) Pride goes before destruction, and a haughty spirit before a fall.

Great verse – but completely irrelevant to the evidence presented . . .