Have you ever been challenged to, say, call for a healing?

[bbyrd009]

Sure, but, Jesus' power was enough to change atoms

i guess your gaze is all it takes, and the atoms don't care if you're saved or not either lol. We're still tryna figure out just why

 

[VictoryinJesus]

Let me be the first one to call foul, that was uncalled for and presumptuous.
You have no idea of any such thing of anyone here. Wouldn't you agree?

In a post above Alley said: "If the healing does not come, No faith."

Whether it is Alley or Sword, or some pastor on television... "If the healing does not come, No faith." can only mean one thing...something is wrong with the sick persons faith and that is why they are not healed. It is their fault. They must work for it.

You said before on another thread that God has healed every one you have asked Him to but one friend with als that her husband interrupted her faith. It was her fault for letting him. Did you say it, or am I delusional?

So which is it: if a person doesn't receive healing; is it their faith that prevented the healing?? So how then is it wrong for me to presume this makes the sick person feel ashamed in what they lack?

Have you ever considered all the times Jesus made reference to: where's your faith...when Peter sank, when Peter denied Jesus three times; what was being shown is before the baptism of the Holy Spirit at Pentecost: man could do nothing apart from the Spirit? Did they lack faith after? What changed? Their faith or what was inside of them?

Faith (power) comes from God.
So how do you say we produce it?
And if we can't produce it, then how is it someone's fault?

Right or wrong: Just a few honest questions?

 

[Miss Hepburn]

So yes scripture tells us if the mountain doesnt move no faith. Really sorry.

Oh for Pete's sake, you just did what I told Victory not to; presume ! Which I still stand behind. Never presume anything.

I would never say it was lack of faith...sure, they could have come into the healing with tons of faith...while their minds are saying during it, "This will never work, this will never work." Displaying silently to God their doubt.
It wavered, possibly, that's all.

There is so much more involved..like teaching how to pray correctly...not a blanket: Your faith was not strong enough.
Geese Louise.
Jesus could get away with that to his disciples, they signed up for that..we can not..and it is not exactly true, while it was with the disciples....there is more involved.


Victory I see you wrote...back to you later...☺

 

[Ally.s.j]

Oh for Pete's sake, you just did what I told Victory not to; presume ! Which I still stand behind. Never presume anything.

I would never say it was lack of faith...sure, they could have come into the healing with tons of faith...while their minds are saying during it, "This will never work, this will never work." Displaying silently to God their doubt.
It wavered, possibly, that's all.

There is so much more involved..like teaching how to pray correctly...not a blanket: Your faith was not strong enough.
Geese Louise.
Jesus could get away with that to his disciples, they signed up for that..we can not..and it is not exactly true, while it was with the disciples....there is more involved.


Victory I see you wrote...back to you later...☺

Eh It was Jesus who said it not me. Its there for our benifit. No so we can ignore it. stand by what ever you like. But show me scripture for another reason it doesnt work when we want it and so does God?

We signed the same deal as the deciples.

 

[Ally.s.j]

can you clear this up with the one about the dead guy not needing any faith to get resurrected? ty
"no faith healers in hospitals, bc psychics/lotteries" though, hmm

I was the one who said the guy who was dead had no faith as he was dead. There for it was Christ faith that got him up.
It is the person laying hands on that is responcible for the person getting healed. They dont need faith. But if they believe it can add to it.

 

[Ally.s.j]

be hard to have kids that way i guess

hmm

Ok why did adam and the first fathers live far longer than us. They had no trouble having lots of kids.

 

[Ally.s.j]

wish, pray, same thing. i go "wish" there to get people's minds right, try to snap them out of it so to speak

No its not. Wish upon a star and see what you get. Pray and nothing is imposible for you

 

[Miss Hepburn]

In a post above Alley said: "If the healing does not come, No faith."
Whether it is Alley or Sword, or some pastor on television... "If the healing does not come, No faith." can only mean one thing...something is wrong with the sick persons faith and that is why they are not healed. It is their fault. They must work for it.
You said before on another thread that God has healed every one you have asked Him to but one friend with als that her husband interrupted her faith. It was her fault for letting him. Did you say it, or am I delusional?

I have time for one thing at a time...I never say ''fault''.
It is not in my belief system...their are reasons and circumstances...I never blame them.
Later, about my friend with ALS.
Jesus was talking directly to his disciples, so apparently they did not have the faith needed, see?

While we who now have the Holy Spirit, could be doing something else incorrectly....
with great faith.
Sure, the issue could be faith...but how would anyone know?
Jesus knew that's what it was for the disciples.

It may be how people are praying, I dunno.
Jesus was clear, If.. you will say to this mountain move here...it will move..
What is the most imp word in that verse, would you say...take a minute,
(besides faith as a mustard seed, I skipped over..).

Did Jesus tell anyone, "Ask me to move the mountain...or...Ask my Father in my name to move the mountain..."?
No...did he say," Ask for a miracle" ?
No.
So now what is the most imp word?
'Say'....'say to'.

So, why are the healings and decrees I am involved in 99% successful?
Sure, I have no doubt what-so-ever the Holy Spirit will heal the person...or what I decree will happen...
But, I also say to the tumor, the knee ligament, the bleeding bladder, Go, Leave, Be Gone
and any spirit causing these things. NOW.

While many people are begging, sincerely over and over and over for a miracle...
they might not be saying to the illness itself...Be Gone, now!! With power.
When someone asks/prays over and over it is for 'themselves' to get centered and focused...
But, it is silly when God hears the first whisper.
What people display to God is their belief that He didn't hear them the first time, you see?
Thus, their doubt is written all over each and every repeated prayer.
Is that giving you a diff insight into what this healing thing is about? ANY, hint of doubt and
you get zip. Even when it is innocent and unconscious.

My friend with ALS...briefly...as I would leave the house her wonderful, atheist husband walked in with a wheelchair when she was walking fine. Oy vey, I walked to the car
with my mouth dropped, oh my, the forces working on her, wow!
'Help was walking out the door, as doubt walked in.'
He was placing the belief in her of her inevitable decline...it worked on her subconscious mind...
to where her belief was now his and the MDs...not in her faith in God's healing for her.
Her focus shifted, wavered. Her 'fault'? Never would I say that.
There were forces laying right next to her every night working on her will, her focus, her beliefs.
She always had faith in God....but, 'Maybe this is my time, my lesson? Maybe I am supposed
to die now?'
See? Double-mindedness blocks the whole deal.

However...why did I just touch 2 people, an agnostic and a mean atheist and they were healed...
no prayer....
and a drunk confessing to me all his health problems...I took 5 seconds talking to the Holy Spirit,
silently, to heal him...I saw him the next month at my local pub...washed, shaved, short hair, new clothes, not drinking, hugging me saying that night I healed him. "Oh, how nice...cool, praise God."
i said it once and it was done....he had no idea I was doing that.
His faith? I by passed it, ha, so there could be no doubt to enter in him.
(It was not 'me'...lest someone do the attack thing on me!)
We all have this gift...I am not something special, I'm like a hose with water going thru it.

Will read ur post again later and get back to you.
In the meantime get every book you can on Healing and the Holy Spirit learn all you can.

 

[Miss Hepburn]

We signed the same deal as the deciples.

Actually, many have not and are effected by blame from others...they are not warriors.
You and I might be a bit tougher!!
I addressed your other part in another post answering Victory on something...I don't know how much time I have today to write....cuz you and I both love talking abut this stuff!! *wink*

 

[Ally.s.j]

Actually, many have not and are effected by blame from others...they are not warriors.
You and I might be a bit tougher!!
I addressed your other part in another post answering Victory on something...I don't know how much time I have today to write....cuz you and I both love talking abut this stuff!! *wink*

Amen sister I love Jesus. He forgave me. So I dont have the right to be offended at anyone. People think I am kidding. I aint. I want to live for people who hate me

 

[amadeus]

I dont have a question I pointed out a few this you said that were worng. And theres no need for you to go back to anwser then I already did.
You clearly said Gods not to concernd with heaing the body. That is 100% wrong . You more or less said we are born to die . So that also is wrong.

You said we were born dead. No Adam was not born dead. As I said we are born by the creator of life and not death. God is God of the living not dead. Death come from satan. So as I said. we were born to live and live life to that full as Vhrist said He came to restore that which was lost. Life was lost because death came. Jesus resorted out rightfull place at the table with life more abundant.

Read more carefully my friend.
May God richly bless you as you walk with Him.

 

[bbyrd009]

No its not.

ok fine
bad place for this post anyway, but

pray is in Strong's, it ain't a secret, it's only hidden that's all.
Shepherd's Chapel still has some uncorrupted Strong's, i just checked, fyi

fwiw prayers are for you, as you say, don't wanna wreck anyone's prayer life here,
but prayers are just wishes, and God is not moved by your prayers, not one inch does He budge.
you got the word "pray" by a certain path, see, and "pray" meant something different to them than it does to you now. see.
this is the only reason pray does not mean wish to you, right now

the prayer of a righteous man avails much

 

[amadeus]

But you said we were born dead. I am not fighting just pointing out little things that you been saying that are not quite right, so causes confusion. flush them out so to speak. Peace bro.

Peace always my friend. When I said, "we", I really meant everyone born of woman after Adam and Eve sinned. I am sorry that I was not more specific.

 

[amadeus]

I was the one who said the guy who was dead had no faith as he was dead. There for it was Christ faith that got him up.
It is the person laying hands on that is responcible for the person getting healed. They dont need faith. But if they believe it can add to it.

But... unbelief does hinder healing!

"And they were offended in him. But Jesus said unto them, A prophet is not without honour, save in his own country, and in his own house.
And he did not many mighty works there because of their unbelief." Matt 13:57-58

 

[bbyrd009]

In a post above Alley said: "If the healing does not come, No faith."

Whether it is Alley or Sword, or some pastor on television... "If the healing does not come, No faith." can only mean one thing...something is wrong with the sick persons faith and that is why they are not healed. It is their fault. They must work for it.

You said before on another thread that God has healed every one you have asked Him to but one friend with als that her husband interrupted her faith. It was her fault for letting him. Did you say it, or am I delusional?

So which is it: if a person doesn't receive healing; is it their faith that prevented the healing?? So how then is it wrong for me to presume this makes the sick person feel ashamed in what they lack?

Have you ever considered all the times Jesus made reference to: where's your faith...when Peter sank, when Peter denied Jesus three times; what was being shown is before the baptism of the Holy Spirit at Pentecost: man could do nothing apart from the Spirit? Did they lack faith after? What changed? Their faith or what was inside of them?

Faith (power) comes from God.
So how do you say we produce it?
And if we can't produce it, then how is it someone's fault?

Right or wrong: Just a few honest questions?

zing

 

[bbyrd009]

Jesus was clear, If.. you will say to this mountain move here...it will move..
What is the most imp word in that verse, would you say...

ha, a little play on saying there i guess

 

[amadeus]

In a post above Alley said: "If the healing does not come, No faith."

Whether it is Alley or Sword, or some pastor on television... "If the healing does not come, No faith." can only mean one thing...something is wrong with the sick persons faith and that is why they are not healed. It is their fault. They must work for it.

You said before on another thread that God has healed every one you have asked Him to but one friend with als that her husband interrupted her faith. It was her fault for letting him. Did you say it, or am I delusional?

So which is it: if a person doesn't receive healing; is it their faith that prevented the healing?? So how then is it wrong for me to presume this makes the sick person feel ashamed in what they lack?

Have you ever considered all the times Jesus made reference to: where's your faith...when Peter sank, when Peter denied Jesus three times; what was being shown is before the baptism of the Holy Spirit at Pentecost: man could do nothing apart from the Spirit? Did they lack faith after? What changed? Their faith or what was inside of them?

Faith (power) comes from God.
So how do you say we produce it?
And if we can't produce it, then how is it someone's fault?

Right or wrong: Just a few honest questions?

Faith may come from God but it works in and through people.

Consider also these verses:

"Then came the disciples to Jesus apart, and said, Why could not we cast him out?
And Jesus said unto them, Because of your unbelief: for verily I say unto you, If ye have faith as a grain of mustard seed, ye shall say unto this mountain, Remove hence to yonder place; and it shall remove; and nothing shall be impossible unto you.
Howbeit this kind goeth not out but by prayer and fasting." Matt 17:19-21

 

[bbyrd009]

Ok why did adam and the first fathers live far longer than us. They had no trouble having lots of kids.

well, but see neither one of those really addresses the point that if we lived forever, we could not have children, right

 

[bbyrd009]

I was the one who said the guy who was dead had no faith as he was dead. There for it was Christ faith that got him up.
It is the person laying hands on that is responcible for the person getting healed. They dont need faith. But if they believe it can add to it.

then why all the "your faith has made you well?" do you think

 

[VictoryinJesus]

I have time for one thing at a time...I never say ''fault''.
It is not in my belief system...their are reasons and circumstances...I never blame them.
Later, about my friend with ALS.
Jesus was talking directly to his disciples, so apparently they did not have the faith needed, see?

While we who now have the Holy Spirit, could be doing something else incorrectly....
with great faith.
Sure, the issue could be faith...but how would anyone know?
Jesus knew that's what it was for the disciples.

It may be how people are praying, I dunno.
Jesus was clear, If.. you will say to this mountain move here...it will move..
What is the most imp word in that verse, would you say...take a minute,
(besides faith as a mustard seed, I skipped over..).

Did Jesus tell anyone, "Ask me to move the mountain...or...Ask my Father in my name to move the mountain..."?
No...did he say," Ask for a miracle" ?
No.
So now what is the most imp word?
'Say'....'say to'.

So, why are the healings and decrees I am involved in 99% successful?
Sure, I have no doubt what-so-ever the Holy Spirit will heal the person...or what I decree will happen...
But, I also say to the tumor, the knee ligament, the bleeding bladder, Go, Leave, Be Gone
and any spirit causing these things. NOW.

While many people are begging, sincerely over and over and over for a miracle...
they might not be saying to the illness itself...Be Gone, now!! With power.
When someone asks/prays over and over it is for 'themselves' to get centered and focused...
But, it is silly when God hears the first whisper.
What people display to God is their belief that He didn't hear them the first time, you see?
Thus, their doubt is written all over each and every repeated prayer.
Is that giving you a diff insight into what this healing thing is about? ANY, hint of doubt and
you get zip. Even when it is innocent and unconscious.

My friend with ALS...briefly...as I would leave the house her wonderful, atheist husband walked in with a wheelchair when she was walking fine. Oy vey, I walked to the car
with my mouth dropped, oh my, the forces working on her, wow!
'Help was walking out the door, as doubt walked in.'
He was placing the belief in her of her inevitable decline...it worked on her subconscious mind...
to where her belief was now his and the MDs...not in her faith in God's healing for her.
Her focus shifted, wavered. Her 'fault'? Never would I say that.
There were forces laying right next to her every night working on her will, her focus, her beliefs.
She always had faith in God....but, 'Maybe this is my time, my lesson? Maybe I am supposed
to die now?'
See? Double-mindedness blocks the whole deal.

However...why did I just touch 2 people, an agnostic and a mean atheist and they were healed...
no prayer....
and a drunk confessing to me all his health problems...I took 5 seconds talking to the Holy Spirit,
silently, to heal him...I saw him the next month at my local pub...washed, shaved, short hair, new clothes, not drinking, hugging me saying that night I healed him. "Oh, how nice...cool, praise God."
i said it once and it was done....he had no idea I was doing that.
His faith? I by passed it, ha, so there could be no doubt to enter in him.
(It was not 'me'...lest someone do the attack thing on me!)
We all have this gift...I am not something special, I'm like a hose with water going thru it.

Will read ur post again later and get back to you.
In the meantime get every book you can on Healing and the Holy Spirit learn all you can.

Praise God for the sick healed! I am not some horrible person that wants to fight or stop healings. I am only saying I don't agree with blaming a person's faith. Maybe the persons faith is growing through the illness. I used to pass people on the street and was so pumped that I wanted to run up and ask to heal them. God has changed my view on this. I don't just go running up to random people. If someone asks for prayer, then of course I would pray with them. I have a friend whose daughter has cerebral palsy; people come up to her and ask if they can cast the demon out of her daughter. For me, seeing it from her side now; this asking to cast out a demon is invasive and constant cruelty. I spent a year praying in secret, asking God if He wanted me to snatch this little girl up out of her wheelchair and command she walk. This was before I really got to know her. At the end of that year, the answer was NO. This behavior and boldness and arrogance I had in the beginning that I could command the world, was not of God. It was immaturity and error on my part.

This is what I believe about double minded. You don't have to agree; I don't expect you to. To be double minded is to attempt to walk in Spirit and in flesh. Our affection is either toward God, or toward the world. Our affection is either toward heaven (our home) or toward earth. When it is both...we are tossed like a wave of the sea; driven by the wind. If we walk after the Spirit our affections and desires are His. Then anything we ask, it is given because we want what He wants. Our will aligns with His.

James 4:8-10 KJV
[8] Draw nigh to God, and he will draw nigh to you. Cleanse your hands, ye sinners; and purify your hearts, ye double minded. [9] Be afflicted, and mourn, and weep: let your laughter be turned to mourning, and your joy to heaviness. [10] Humble yourselves in the sight of the Lord, and he shall lift you up.

James 1: 8 "a double minded man is unstable in all his ways." Are you serving Spirit or serving flesh? this says to me. If you are serving flesh then don't expect to receive anything from the Lord.

For you to understand where I am coming from. I used to have panic attacks. God has healed them so I know God heals. I once thought my most terrifying moment would be the moment I take my last breath. I was paralyzed with fear of germs and of dying, convinced that last breath would be in a state of total panic to grasp and fight to hang on to control. One day it was as if God spoke and He told me: when you take your last breath it will not be in a state of panic. You will have peace with it and be ready.

People call you insane for saying God speaks to you, but I know it was Him. Because little by little He has indeed released me from the torture of the constant fear of dying. It is no longer terrifying. I know He will be with me when it happens, and I will be ready. So, I am not attacking you or your belief. If it seems that way; I am sorry. I am only suggesting: desperately trying to hold onto this world may keep us from the peace of trusting God.