Once Saved....always Saved - Results of Questionnaire.

[Taken]

And if YOU think that these ideas came out of YOUR head - you are tragically mistaken.
Your Protestant Fathers implanted these ideas in your head and the heads of Protestants for 500 years.

Funny. I don't have a protestant Father.
I am not a STUDENT of earthly People you appoint as Fathers.

Jesus says that our FAITH saves us (Luke 7:50, 18:42).

Scripture says;
FAITH is a gift from God...
Only a LITTLE (mustard amount of Faith) is required to BELIEVE.
REMAIN IN FAITH, the FAITH INCREASES.
DEPART FROM FAITH, the FAITH IS LOST.

Receive INCREASED FAITH, and the Lord has PREPARED the man to RECEIVE ...
MORE GIFTS.

The GIft of Forgiveness.
The GIft of Salvation
The GIft of His Seed
And the Gift of Baptism of the Holy Spirit to DWELL WITHIN the man "FOREVER".

You DO not acknowledge the Gift is a LITTLE FAITH, from the Gift of INCREASED FAITH.

You do not acknowledge the INCREASE prepares a man to RECEIVE Christ.

You do not acknowledge a man is not FORCED into becoming increased in Faith, and CAN WALK AWAY, and LOSE OUT on receiving the Gift of Salvation and His Seed.

A man must make his own choice and election of God.

IF the man so does Choose God; he receives the gifts of Salvation and Gods Seed, that was prepared for him to receive and SHALL FOREVER BE in the Hand of God.

IF the man rejects God; he forfeits the Gift of Salvation and Gods Seed.

A man DOES NOT receive Gods Gift of Salvation and His Seed, and then thereafter LOSE it.

FAITH = belief + Obedience (works)

No. Faith IS a GIFT from God, FOR a mans belief.

SAVING

faith requires endurance . . .

SavING requires Gods Gift of FAITH.

Ummm, tell that to the Apostles and ALL of the first Christians - who were ALL Jews.
Born again and indwelt with the Holy spirit . . .

Ummm, I don't talk to dead people.
And not ALL Jews or ALL Gentiles "were" OR "are" saved or born again.

SOME

of them have been addressed, however incorrectly - but NONE of them have been proven to mean something else.
They are ALL warnings about LOSING salvation . . .

No one can UNDERSTAND FOR YOU.

Salvation IS LOST to a man who REJECTS receiving Salvation that was PAID FOR BY the Lord.

You continuing to preach a Saved and born again man CAN be plucked out of Gods Hand.....IS FALSE.

 

[Taken]

Really??
God WILLS that ALL men be saved and come to a knowledge of the truth (1 Tim. 2:4).
Tell me - will ALL be saved??

That's what I thought . . .

Game playing is a bore BOL. Try to refrain. Do not ask me questions then presume your thoughts prevail as my answer.

WRONG

again.

Thanks for sharing, you disagree that men are taught about God. Weird, but hey, your opinion that applies to you.

This entire rant is due to your rejection of the linguistic implications of the word "EPIGNOSIS" that is used in the verses I presented.

Epignosis is not just a simple intellectual assent or "knowledge" (oida).
It is a FULL and EXPERIENTIAL knowledge that come from having a relationship.

Thanks for sharing your irrelevant rant.

God keeps trying to tell you where you're wrong -

Uh...you are the one who keeps declaring WRONG.

NEWSFLASH....you are NOT God!!

and you keep rejecting him . . .

I have been very clear, it is your teaching I reject, and again, YOU ARE NOT God!!

 

[Taken]

And, in every one of your angry rants,

Revealing more and more out of the playbook of tricks of liberalism, is only accounted to YOUR BEHAVIOR, not mine.

If I should become angry toward you, I'll tell you plainly.

you keep missing the point that NOBODY is forced to remain faithful.

No, It is you, who is missing the understanding.

Faith is a gift from God.
A beginner......is NOT gifted with the FULLNESS of Faith.

I have already told you, show you, explained to you umpteen times....

Faith is given A beginner who believes.
Its a small MEASURE.....NOT FULLNESS.

Absolutely, they CAN WALK AWAY, and again NOT BELIEVE....Like Judas did, and MANY other Jews.

As a man continues hearing and believing, his FAITH IS INCREASED!

INCREASED....get it? MORE FAITH, received from God.

The LITTLE beginning Faith, IS NOT FULLNESS.. and no one said he is FORCED to remain in Faith.

A man with FULLNESS of FAITH, is FAITHFUL!!

He is not FORCED to Reamin IN FAITHFULLNESS....

Hello? What don't you get? MEN CHOOSE TO REMAIN IN FAITHFULLNESS "TO" the Lord, BY Giving their LIFE in crucifixion WITH Him.

The is not FORCE....that is a mans CHOICE!!

You keep trying to show that a true, born again person will
STAY faithful, no matter what - but the Word of God warns that this is NOT the case.

A true born again man IS FOREVEN in Gods HANDS....you teaching they can be PLUCKED OUT of Gods Hand IS FALSE.

I'm NOT going to change your mind here because you have chosen to reject God's Word where it differs from YOUR understanding.
All I can do is to point you in the right direction and pray the Holy Spirit intervenes . . .

Of course you are not going to change my MIND. Once a man is IN Gods Hand, NO MAN can pluck him OUT of Gods Hand. NO MAN!

And IF you desire Gods Understanding on the matter at hand, try asking the TRUE FATHER, whom it is he that gives men understanding...and stop relying on your Carnal Mind.....that is but foolishness and AGAINST God....read the Scriptures and discover that is TRUE.

 

[bbyrd009]

or at least debatable anyway

 

[Heb 13:8]

putting God in a box, mmore like a forum

 

[BreadOfLife]

There is more than ONE BOOK.
Rev 20:12

All authority is UNDER Christ the Lord, TO open, TO read, TO judge out of the Testimony and Evidence within the BOOK(S).

And Rev. 3:5 is referring to the LAMB'S Book of Life.
ONLY the names of those who are saved are written in that Book - and Rev. 3:5 says that they can be "blotted out" . . .

 

[BreadOfLife]

Nobody.

Then, WHY post Heb. 6:1??
The fact is that you erroneously used this verse ion a feeble attempt to point to works as "Dead" works - but you got caught with your Scriptural pants down . . .

Ok, now check out the promises of the New Covenant

1. as the covenant of which he is mediator is superior to the old one
2. since the new covenant is established on better promises.
3. that those who are called may receive the promised eternal inheritance
4. now that he has died as a ransom to set them free from the sins committed under the first covenant.
5. and to the sprinkled blood that speaks a better word than the blood of Abel.

Heb 8:6 But in fact the ministry Jesus has received is as superior to theirs as the covenant of which he is mediator is superior to the old one, since the new covenant is established on better promises.

Heb 9:15 For this reason Christ is the mediator of a new covenant, that those who are called may receive the promised eternal inheritance—now that he has died as a ransom to set them free from the sins committed under the first covenant.

Heb 12:24 to Jesus the mediator of a new covenant, and to the sprinkled blood that speaks a better word than the blood of Abel.

These passages are drenched in OSAS. OSAS is not based on our works, it's based on whether Jesus Christ has risen BOL. God bless.

The passages teach anything BUT OSAS.
NOWHERE do they even imply that our salvation is a "done" deal no matter WHAT we do.

Christ IS our only mediator - in that, only HIS sacrifice can bring peace between us and the Father,.
HOWEVER - we are ALL called on to mediate or intercede for one another (1 Cor. 3:9, 1 Tim. 2:1-3, Eph 6:18, James 5:16, 1 John 5:16).

In the Old Testament, there were three levels of Priests: Aaron, the High Priest, the Levitical/Ministerial Priesthood, and the rest of the people were a general priesthood of believers.

In the New Testament, there are also three levels of Priests: Jesus, our High Priest (1 Tim. 2:5, Heb. 7:22-25), the Ministerial (James 5:14-15) and the general priesthood of all Christians (1 Peter 2:5-9).

Just as with all New Testament fulfillments, the fulfillment is always more glorious than the Old Testament type.

Finally, in the Epistle of Jude, we read the warning about those who would usurp Church Authority by assuming the ministerial priesthood without the Church’s consent (Jude 1:11). In this passage he compares them to the rebellion of Korah and their subsequent punishment (Numbers 16:1-35; 31:16).

 

[BreadOfLife]

Funny. I don't have a protestant Father.
I am not a STUDENT of earthly People you appoint as Fathers.
Scripture says;
FAITH is a gift from God...
Only a LITTLE (mustard amount of Faith) is required to BELIEVE.
REMAIN IN FAITH, the FAITH INCREASES.
DEPART FROM FAITH, the FAITH IS LOST.
Receive INCREASED FAITH, and the Lord has PREPARED the man to RECEIVE ...
MORE GIFTS.
The GIft of Forgiveness.
The GIft of Salvation
The GIft of His Seed
And the Gift of Baptism of the Holy Spirit to DWELL WITHIN the man "FOREVER".

You DO not acknowledge the Gift is a LITTLE FAITH, from the Gift of INCREASED FAITH.
You do not acknowledge the INCREASE prepares a man to RECEIVE Christ.
You do not acknowledge a man is not FORCED into becoming increased in Faith, and CAN WALK AWAY, and LOSE OUT on receiving the Gift of Salvation and His Seed.
A man must make his own choice and election of God.
IF the man so does Choose God; he receives the gifts of Salvation and Gods Seed, that was prepared for him to receive and SHALL FOREVER BE in the Hand of God.
IF the man rejects God; he forfeits the Gift of Salvation and Gods Seed.
A man DOES NOT receive Gods Gift of Salvation and His Seed, and then thereafter LOSE it.
No. Faith IS a GIFT from God, FOR a mans belief.
SavING requires Gods Gift of FAITH.
Ummm, I don't talk to dead people.
And not ALL Jews or ALL Gentiles "were" OR "are" saved or born again.
No one can UNDERSTAND FOR YOU.
Salvation IS LOST to a man who REJECTS receiving Salvation that was PAID FOR BY the Lord.
You continuing to preach a Saved and born again man CAN be plucked out of Gods Hand.....IS FALSE.

And in EVERY one of your long-winded and verbose rants, you ignore the Biblical truth that salvation can be LOST as easily as it can be accepted (Matt. 5:13, Matt. 7:21, Rom. 11:22, Heb. 10:26-27, 2 Peter 2:20-22, 2 Peter 3:17, Rev. 3:5, Rev. 22:19).

NOBODY can pluck us out of God's hand - but the Bible is crystal-clear that WE ca jump out any time we want . . .

 

[Heb 13:8]

Then, WHY post Heb. 6:1??

Because non-osas use Heb 6:4-6 for loss of salvation, but many don't realize that paragraph actually starts at Heb 5:11 and is referring to maturity in Christ. Heb 6 and Heb 10 are using the same figurative language.

Christ IS our only mediator - in that, only HIS sacrifice can bring peace between us and the Father,.
HOWEVER - we are ALL called on to mediate or intercede for one another (1 Cor. 3:9, 1 Tim. 2:1-3, Eph 6:18, James 5:16, 1 John 5:16).

Ah yes, there's that word however or but, which ever you choose.

In the Old Testament, there were three levels of Priests: Aaron, the High Priest, the Levitical/Ministerial Priesthood, and the rest of the people were a general priesthood of believers.

In the New Testament, there are also three levels of Priests: Jesus, our High Priest (1 Tim. 2:5, Heb. 7:22-25), the Ministerial (James 5:14-15) and the general priesthood of all Christians (1 Peter 2:5-9).

Just as with all New Testament fulfillments, the fulfillment is always more glorious than the Old Testament type.

Finally, in the Epistle of Jude, we read the warning about those who would usurp Church Authority by assuming the ministerial priesthood without the Church’s consent (Jude 1:11). In this passage he compares them to the rebellion of Korah and their subsequent punishment (Numbers 16:1-35; 31:16).

Or it could be that you're afraid to accept love?

https://www.amazon.com/Joshua-Tony-...ie=UTF8&qid=1526962765&sr=1-2&keywords=Joshua

God bles

 

[Taken]

And Rev. 3:5 is referring to the LAMB'S Book of Life.
ONLY the names of those who are saved are written in that Book - and Rev. 3:5 says that they can be "blotted out" . . .

No it does not.
It says those who have overcome CAN NOT BE BLOTTED OUT.

Not a mystery, it is NATURAL MEN who overcome, WHEN they BECOME "IN" Christ.

Remain a "NATURAL MAN"....and the man has NOT "overcome", and blot, blot....!

 

[Taken]

And in EVERY one of your long-winded and verbose rants, you ignore the Biblical truth that salvation can be LOST as easily as it can be accepted (Matt. 5:13, Matt. 7:21, Rom. 11:22, Heb. 10:26-27, 2 Peter 2:20-22, 2 Peter 3:17, Rev. 3:5, Rev. 22:19).

And what you call a long-winded verbose rant, is revealing to a thick skull....

Salvation CAN BE LOST, (and have stated that umpteen times) to one WHO has never ACCEPTED and RECEIVED Salvation.

Apparently you can NOT comprehend, Salvation is PROVIDED, NOT FORCED, and once a man accepts and receives Salvation...
IT IS NOT KEPT by a man trying really hard to comply......BUT IS KEPT by the POWER of the INDWELLING SPIRIT OF GOD.

NOBODY

can pluck us out of God's hand - but the Bible is crystal-clear that WE ca jump out any time we want . . .

Funny. "WE" CAN, PLUCK ourselves out of Gods Hand anytime "WE" want"...??

Guess you are something other than a MAN, since NO MAN has control over that.... When the Lord says FOREVER, He doesn't lie, regardless of how hard you attempt to change HIS TRUTH.

Heb 13:5
...for he hath said,
"I WILL NEVER LEAVE THEE".

 

[LC627]

God hates sin so much that if one could lose their salvation it would only take one sin to do it. If you are doing anything to maintain salvation then you have an reason to boast. It would not be grace if any work involved on our part to maintain something that we couldn't even get apart from Jesus. Grace means we do not deserve it in the first place. I don't think God would appreciate it if when I stand before Him I said I had a part in maintaining my salvation when 1) it was impossible for me to even save my self and 2) It was my sins and I am the one who killed His Son. You can't do a single work to maintain an impossible condition. Apart from Christ, it is impossible to be saved and its only His WORK on the cross that made Heaven a possibility for any of us.

 

[BreadOfLife]

No it does not.
It says those who have overcome CAN NOT BE BLOTTED OUT.

Not a mystery, it is NATURAL MEN who overcome, WHEN they BECOME "IN" Christ.

Remain a "NATURAL MAN"....and the man has NOT "overcome", and blot, blot....!

Which indicates that there ARE some that WILL BE blotted out.
Not that difficult to understand here, sparky . . .

 

[BreadOfLife]

And what you call a long-winded verbose rant, is revealing to a thick skull....
Salvation CAN BE LOST, (and have stated that umpteen times) to one WHO has never ACCEPTED and RECEIVED Salvation.
Apparently you can NOT comprehend, Salvation is PROVIDED, NOT FORCED, and once a man accepts and receives Salvation...
IT IS NOT KEPT by a man trying really hard to comply......BUT IS KEPT by the POWER of the INDWELLING SPIRIT OF GOD..

One who has NEVER accepted or received salvation does not "Lose" it.
they never HAD it.

The verses I keep posting show that there are MANY people who are BORN AGAIN and have a full, experiential knowledge of Christ (Epignosis) - and will LOSE that salvation that came from being born again.

Funny. "WE" CAN, PLUCK ourselves out of Gods Hand anytime "WE" want"...??

Guess you are something other than a MAN, since NO MAN has control over that.... When the Lord says FOREVER, He doesn't lie, regardless of how hard you attempt to change HIS TRUTH.

Heb 13:5
...for he hath said,
"I WILL NEVER LEAVE THEE".

It's not GOD who leaves - it is the fallen man who leaves.
BIG difference . . .

 

[Taken]

Which indicates that there ARE some that WILL BE blotted out.
Not that difficult to understand here, sparky . . .

Speaking of sparks....it would be refreshing, for you to stop pretending you are repeating news.

No one has said Men can not lose their salvation. As a matter of fact, that point has been repeated to ad nausum, yet still you pretend it hasn't.

Sheesh!!

 

[Helen]

Because non-osas use Heb 6:4-6 for loss of salvation, but many don't realize that paragraph actually starts at Heb 5:11 and is referring to maturity in Christ. Heb 6 and Heb 10 are using the same figurative language.

Amen @Heb 13:8

Very good post.

 

[Taken]

One who has NEVER accepted or received salvation does not "Lose" it.
they never HAD it.

THEY DID HAVE THE OPPORTINITY TO RECEIVE SALVATION.

THEY LOSE IT, BY NOT RECEIVING IT!

The verses I keep posting show that there are MANY people who are BORN AGAIN and have a full, experiential knowledge of Christ (Epignosis) - and will LOSE that salvation that came from being born again.

No. The verses you keep posting ARE out of Chapters of the Apostles PREACHING to men...some of whom ARE Saved, and some of WHOM are NOT SAVED, but believing, BUT HAVE NOT YET surrendered their LIFE TO Christ.....THEY ARE STUDENTS LEARNING.

You have not yet figured out, it is the STUDENT, who believes, but is NOT YET COMMITTED who is in Danger of LOSING his opportunity to RECEIVE SALVATION.

The Crowds were MIXED. With some saved and some not. You can not tell who is who, which is a fail to divide the Word of truth.

It's not GOD who leaves - it is the fallen man who leaves.

NO DUH!

BIG

difference . . .

A man who has become SAVED, IS NOT FALLEN, and Remains with God, BY Gods POWER....

BIG DIFFERENCE!

You simply can NOT comprehend the difference between believing and submitting ones life TO Christ BECAUSE of their belief.

Nor can you comprehend WHO in Scripture is believing and learning FROM WHO is submitted their life Because they believed.

And you repeat your lack of understanding over and over and over and over and over.

 

[LC627]

2 Timothy 1:9 - He has saved us and called us to a holy life-not because of anything we have done but because of His own purpose and grace. This grace was given us in Christ Jesus before the beginning of time,

 

[Taken]

SANCTIFIED;
...set apart
...declared holy
...freed from sin

ONCE....a man has BECOME SANCTIFIED....
....he IS set apart
....he IS declared holy
....he IS freed from sin

BOL....ONCE a man has BECOME SANCTIFIED;

It is accomplished BY the Authority and Power of God....AND NOT UNDONE.

It does not have to MEET "your" standard or "your" acceptance.

It hinges on MEETING what IS acceptable to God, and WHY God accomplished SANCTIFICATION "IN" a man.

Sanctification IN A MAN, occurs WHILE the man IS naturally alive in his own flesh and blood.

It is part of the process God performs IN A MAN, during the time the man IS receiving his Gift of Salvation and his Gift of Gods Seed.

You Teaching a man CAN receive such gifts and then throw those gifts back in Gods face is a very disturbing and dangerous teaching.

You are in essence teaching that man has the Power over Gods Gifts, which is false.

There is an OLD MAN.....
....natural in sin.
There is a NEW MAN......
.....spiritual freed from sin.

ONCE a man has become CONVERTED from the OLD MAN "to" the NEW MAN....

IT IS FOREVER!

That in a nutshell is the big picture of the saying....ONCE saved always saved.

IT IS CONDITIONAL, on having been Convert-ED

And Conversion IS CONDITIONAL, on a man having received the Gifts of God, from the Lord.

What you DO NOT comprehend IS the Lord is QUICK, but man is a SLOW POKE. Man does not KNOW ALL THINGS. Man must hear, see, read, learn.......and decide to believe or not.

And man's poking into the knowledge of spiritual things is merely a BEGINNING for the man......If the man continues......the man is set on a path that HE CAN RECEIVE FOREVER the GIFT(S) the Lord has PREPARED for THAT MAN TO RECEIVE....

A man receiving faith is a beginning.
A man receiving knowledge is a beginning.
A man receiving instruction is a beginning.

These things are clearly shown in Scripture of men receiving THESE THINGS.

The receiving of THESE THINGS, "LEADS" to a mans CONVERSION.....and the receiving of the CONVERSION.....IS CONDITIONAL BY the mans CHOICE TO CONTINUE receiving faith, knowledge, instruction in Spiritual things.

ONCE the man HAS CHOSEN TO COMMIT TO the Lord.....THE CONVERSION effected BY the Lord Himself commences.....and REMAINS IN effect, BY the Power of the Lord Himself.

IOW, what "WAS" Hop-ED FOR,
IS Accomplish-ED

The man Forgiv-EN
The Crucif-ED old flesh of the man ...
The Wash-ED old flesh of the man ...
The Sanctifi-ED old man...
The Sav-ED soul of the man...
The spirit of man Quicken-ED...
The man IS Fre-ED from Sin...
The man IS Justifi-ED...
The HOLY SPIRIT of God is FOREVER "WITHIN" that man.

Your teaching that these thing having been Accomplish-ED, can become UN-accomplish-ED, is false.

BOL, every student you read about in Scripture who is in the process of learning knowledge and instruction......DOES NOT MAKE THEM "accomplish-ED"....as you purport.

Teaching these things are Accomplish-ED by and through "WORKS", is false.

 

[Taken]

NOWHERE do they even imply that our salvation is a "done" deal no matter WHAT we do.

Slavation IS a "DONE DEAL", "ONCE" a man "IS" "IN" Christ.

All the "GIFTS" necessary "FOR" Salvation to "BE A DONE DEAL" has been "GIVEN" "BY" the Lord and "RECEIVED" "UNTO" the man.

"WHAT" a man DOES going FORWARD, "DOES NOT AFFECT", WHAT THE Lord HAS "SPIRITUALLY" ACCOMPLISH-ED IN THE MAN.

THAT MAN, WILL FOREVER, BY the Lords POWER IN THE MAN, "BE" IN FAITH-FULLNESS of BELIEF "IN" the Lord.

"WHAT" a man DOES going FORWARD...."IS"
ACCOUNTED TO THAT INDIVIDUAL MAN...

That man MAY be a GREAT servant on behalf of the Lord; speaking His Word; telling others ABOUT the Lord; that others MAY DESIRE to ALSO become CONVERTED......
AND the Lord SHALL reward such man.

OR THAT man MAY be a LUMP, observed BY other men, AS DOING NOTHING in service to the Lord. So WHAT? It is that man himself, who suffers at the losing of rewards from the Lord. It is that man himself who suffers the finger pointing and accusations of other men.
It is that man himself who shall be called the LEAST in the Kingdom of Heaven.

THAT is that man's own Choices being effected and he himself suffering the Consequences........

IT DOES NOT AFFECT HIS SALVATION HE HAS ALREADY .......RECEIV-ED!

While the "LUMP" or the "LEAST" may not BE acceptable to you....

A LITTLE, the LEAST....is acceptable TO God.

Rom 11:16
1 Cor 5:6 -7
Gal 5:9