Without unconditional Election,no one would be saved.

[justbyfaith]

Can a cat cease to act like a cat? It is the new nature that causes us to respond naturally.

So a person will respond if redeemed. And therefore, if they don't respond, they are not redeemed.

 

[Dave L]

So a person will respond if redeemed. And therefore, if they don't respond, they are not redeemed.

This is exactly true.

 

[justbyfaith]

But only those whom he chose want to be saved.

I agree; and would also say that those who want to be saved will call upon the name of the Lord. Of course, if they think they are already saved but are not, they will not do this if they believe your doctrine; because if the motive is wanting to be saved, the motivation is not there because they think they are already saved.

 

[justbyfaith]

This is exactly true.

This would make our response, in a sense, essential.

 

[Dave L]

This would make our response, in a sense, essential.

Not really, God provides a new nature and we naturally act according to that. It's like changing a dog into a cat, the cat then acts like a cat.

 

[Dave L]

I agree; and would also say that those who want to be saved will call upon the name of the Lord. Of course, if they think they are already saved but are not, they will not do this if they believe your doctrine; because if the motive is wanting to be saved, the motivation is not there because they think they are already saved.

If they are saved, they will have the fruit of the Holy Spirit and they will let nothing stand in their way to have more of it.

 

[justbyfaith]

Not really, God provides a new nature and we naturally act according to that. It's like changing a dog into a cat, the cat then acts like a cat.

In that case, there is nothing that I need to do to be saved; and therefore the response is unnecessary.

 

[Dave L]

In that case, there is nothing that I need to do to be saved; and therefore the response is unnecessary.

Response is natural if you are saved. It is an effect of salvation, not the cause of it. Christians act like Christians because of their new Christian nature. But many think if you force the flesh to act like a Christian you will become one. This is false of course.

 

[justbyfaith]

In that case, there is nothing that I need to do to be saved; and therefore the response is unnecessary.

And this is what I take issue with as an evangelist. People who believe in Calvinism often think of themselves as saved by arbitrary election and therefore do not see the need to make a commitment to Christ.

 

[justbyfaith]

Because we have access by faith into this grace wherein we stand.

And therefore a man cannot stand in grace apart from faith.

And therefore faith is the catalyst for standing in grace.

Therefore grace does not come first.

 

[Dave L]

And this is what I take issue with as an evangelist. People who believe in Calvinism often think of themselves as saved by arbitrary election and therefore do not see the need to make a commitment to Christ.

You are ignoring the saved nature that loves holiness.

 

[justbyfaith]

It remains that our entrance into salvation, from the perspective of time, is through surrender to the Lordship of Jesus Christ.

 

[Dave L]

It remains that our entrance into salvation, from the perspective of time, is through surrender to the Lordship of Jesus Christ.

It's our nature to do this.

 

[justbyfaith]

It's our nature to do this.

Not before surrender occurs; for you were born dead in trespasses and sins.

 

[Dave L]

Not before surrender occurs; for you were born dead in trespasses and sins.

The new birth wants holiness. The flesh only surrenders to law and is not saved.

 

[justbyfaith]

because it is for those who are certain of their call and election, and are exhorted to prove this until themselves.

If they are certain of it, why do they need to prove it to themselves? To them it would already be proven in their thinking.

 

[justbyfaith]

The new birth wants holiness. The flesh only surrenders to law and is not saved.

The law is a schoolmaster to lead us to Christ. There is no law that will condemn a man who is bearing the fruit of the Spirit. It is also written on the hearts and in the minds of all those who are under the New Covenant.

 

[Dave L]

The law is a schoolmaster to lead us to Christ. There is no law that will condemn a man who is bearing the fruit of the Spirit. It is also written on the hearts and in the minds of all those who are under the New Covenant.

Paul says we are a new creation. And the new creation hates sin and loves holiness. No law needed.

 

[justbyfaith]

Paul says we are a new creation. And the new creation hates sin and loves holiness. No law needed.

The righteousness which is apart from the law is attested to as being righteousness by the law and the prophets.

The righteousness of the law is fulfilled in us who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit.

 

[justbyfaith]

The question is, will you surrender to the Lordship of Jesus Christ today? (I posit this to all).