Soul and Spirit

[Mayflower]

I learned something different then what I was taught tonight, so want to look up some scriptures and study about it. The soul and spirit are separate? I always thought they were the same. He said many versions interpret them the same, but they are different. Soul is the mind. But then there is this verse:

and you shall love the Lord your G od with all your heart , and with all your soul , and with all your mind , and with all your strength .’
MARK 12:30 NASB

Just was looking up a few verses... Thoughts?


What is the Soul?

Behold, all souls are Mine; the soul of the father as well as the soul of the son is Mine. The soul who sins will die.
EZEKIEL 18:4 NASB

For He has satisfied the thirsty soul, And the hungry soul He has filled with what is good.
PSALMS 107:9 NASB

And I will say to my soul, “Soul, you have many goods laid up for many years to come; take your ease, eat, drink and be merry.” ’ But God said to him, ‘You fool! This very night your soul is required of you; and now who will own what you have prepared?’ So is the man who stores up treasure for himself, and is not rich toward God.”
LUKE 12:19‭-‬21 NASB




What is the Spirit?

God is spirit, and those who worship Him must worship in spirit and truth.”
JOHN 4:24 NASB

The Spirit Himself testifies with our spirit that we are children of God,
ROMANS 8:16 NASB

If we live by the Spirit, let us also walk by the Spirit.
GALATIANS 5:25 NASB

That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
JOHN 3:6 NASB

 

[OzSpen]

I learned something different then what I was taught tonight, so want to look up some scriptures and study about it. The soul and spirit are separate? I always thought they were the same. He said many versions interpret them the same, but they are different. Soul is the mind. But then there is this verse:

and you shall love the Lord your G od with all your heart , and with all your soul , and with all your mind , and with all your strength .’
MARK 12:30 NASB

Just was looking up a few verses... Thoughts?


What is the Soul?

Behold, all souls are Mine; the soul of the father as well as the soul of the son is Mine. The soul who sins will die.
EZEKIEL 18:4 NASB

For He has satisfied the thirsty soul, And the hungry soul He has filled with what is good.
PSALMS 107:9 NASB

And I will say to my soul, “Soul, you have many goods laid up for many years to come; take your ease, eat, drink and be merry.” ’ But God said to him, ‘You fool! This very night your soul is required of you; and now who will own what you have prepared?’ So is the man who stores up treasure for himself, and is not rich toward God.”
LUKE 12:19‭-‬21 NASB




What is the Spirit?

God is spirit, and those who worship Him must worship in spirit and truth.”
JOHN 4:24 NASB

The Spirit Himself testifies with our spirit that we are children of God,
ROMANS 8:16 NASB

If we live by the Spirit, let us also walk by the Spirit.
GALATIANS 5:25 NASB

That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
JOHN 3:6 NASB

Mayflower,

I could discuss these points with you but they are in my article, What’s the difference between soul and spirit?

My conclusion is that they are used interchangeably in Scripture as referring to a person's unseen dimension.

Oz

 

[Mayflower]

Mayflower,

I could discuss these points with you but they are in my article, What’s the difference between soul and spirit?

My conclusion is that they are used interchangeably in Scripture as referring to a person's unseen dimension.

Oz

I'll check it out. I might need to sleep on this one. I am just surprised if this is right. I'm just learning to study for myself and not just take what others tell me. But the thing is I can't have my answer tonight. My spirit is patient, I need to utilize that power!

 

[Mayflower]

@OzSpen thanks so much for your article. I was reading quite a bit and I believe this is what he was talking about. I want to read this again tomorrow and focus on the scriptures. It is still a bit confusing, especially since they are used interchangeably and I do not know Greek/Hebrew.

 

[Enoch111]

The soul and spirit are separate? I always thought they were the same.

Yes, they are different according to the Bible, but very closely connected. Here is one verse that makes it clear: And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole [1] spirit and [2] soul and [3] body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ. (1 Thess 5:23)

Man is a tripartite being. Upon death the Christian's soul and spirit go to be with Christ in Heaven while the body is buried in a grave. The unsaved go to Sheol/Hades.

 

[OzSpen]

@OzSpen thanks so much for your article. I was reading quite a bit and I believe this is what he was talking about. I want to read this again tomorrow and focus on the scriptures. It is still a bit confusing, especially since they are used interchangeably and I do not know Greek/Hebrew.

Mayflower,

See also: Trichotomy vs. dichotomy of man—which view is correct?

In my view, this is not a teaching to break fellowship over. There are many orthodox, evangelical believers who support both sides. For me, I consider the weight of evidence comes down on dichotomy.

I'm not a heretic because of that view.

Oz

 

[OzSpen]

Yes, they are different according to the Bible, but very closely connected. Here is one verse that makes it clear: And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole [1] spirit and [2] soul and [3] body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ. (1 Thess 5:23)

Man is a tripartite being. Upon death the Christian's soul and spirit go to be with Christ in Heaven while the body is buried in a grave. The unsaved go to Sheol/Hades.

Enoch,

Taking one verse to try to demonstrate human beings are tripartite is not an adequate view, in my understanding. Here's why:

1. The Scripture refers to the soul (nephesh in Hebrew; psuche in Greek) as distinct from the body in passages such as Gen. 35:18, “And as her [Rachel’s] soul was departing (for she was dying), she called his name Ben-oni; but his father called him Benjamin” (ESV). So, the soul leaves the body at death.
2. I Thess 5:23, “Now may the God of peace himself sanctify you completely, and may your whole spirit and soul and body be kept blameless at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.”
3. Revelation 6:9, “When he opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of those who had been slain for the word of God and for the witness they had borne.” So here the souls are separated from the bodies in heaven.

The word “soul” means “life” and refers to the principle of life in a human being. It gives life to the body and is sometimes used to refer to a dead body as in Lev. 19:28; 21:1; 23:4 as I might refer to my departed loved one as “the poor soul.”

Theologian Norman Geisler rightly states that “the primary meaning of soul can most often be captured best by translating it as person, which usually is embodied but is sometimes disembodied” (Systematic Theology, vol. 3, BethanyHouse Publishers, Minneapolis, Minnesota, 2004, p. 47).

The word spirit (Greek, pneuma; Hebrew, ruach) almost always refers to the immaterial part of a human being and is sometimes used interchangeably with soul in many verses (cf. Luke 1:46). The body without the soul is dead (James 2:26) but at death, Jesus “bowed his head and gave up his spirit” (John 19:30).

So your statement that 'man is a tripartite being' needs to be challenged.

The word “soul” can mean “life” and refers to the principle of life in a human being. It gives life to the body and is sometimes used to refer to a dead body as in Lev. 19:28; 21:1; 23:4 as I might refer to my departed loved one as “the poor soul.”

So a statement that human beings are tripartite beings, as the above exposition demonstrates, needs to be questioned.

Oz

 

[101G]

Addressing the OP, the soul and the Spirit are different, and Separate. the best example we can give is in a computer system. the Spirit is Like the computer ROM, (Read Only Memory), which comes from God. and the Soul is like the computer RAM, (Ramdon Acess Memory), which comes from or is the collection of our earthly lives. once the computer is turned off, (we die), the RAM is lost. but the ROM is static, unchainging, not loosing any imformation. and our RECORDED RECORD, the written books of our lives, from the cradel to the grave is stored on the computer Hard Drive, (the books that will be open), holding all of our volatile, and immutable information of the course of our entire life here on earth. once turned on, or resurrected, just as with the computer, all information is RE-Stored.

PICJAG.

 

[Davy]

I learned something different then what I was taught tonight, so want to look up some scriptures and study about it. The soul and spirit are separate? I always thought they were the same. He said many versions interpret them the same, but they are different. Soul is the mind. But then there is this verse:

and you shall love the Lord your G od with all your heart , and with all your soul , and with all your mind , and with all your strength .’
MARK 12:30 NASB

Just was looking up a few verses... Thoughts?
....

Matt 10:28
28 And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul (psuche): but rather fear Him Which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.
KJV


NT:5590
psuche (psoo-khay'); from NT:5594; breath, i.e. (by implication) spirit, abstractly or concretely (the animal sentient principle only; thus distinguished on the one hand from NT:4151, which is the rational and immortal soul; and on the other from NT:2222, which is mere vitality, even of plants: these terms thus exactly correspond respectively to the Hebrew OT:5315, OT:7307 and OT:2416):

KJV - heart (+-ily), life, mind, soul, + us, + you.
(Biblesoft's New Exhaustive Strong's Numbers and Concordance with Expanded Greek-Hebrew Dictionary. Copyright (c) 1994, Biblesoft and International Bible Translators, Inc.)

Notice how even the above definition tends to adhere to the OT Jewish tradition, instead of admitting a conscious soul existence after flesh death.

Those on Jewish traditions adhere to the 'dead in the ground' theory, because they wrongly interpret the soul being an offshoot of flesh.

But even Solomon in Eccl.12:5-7 showed that our spirit and flesh are two separate things.

But the Jewish traditionalists then re-interpret that Eccl.12 "spirit" to mean simply a force that animates all things that breath.


Yet what our Lord Jesus said there in Matt.10:28 reveals the soul is a different part of our makeup that continues existence after flesh death. This means the story He gave about Lazarus and the rich man in Luke 16 most likely is not just a parable.

The Biblical reality is that we are given several Bible examples about the soul (spirit) being something different than flesh, just mostly in the New Testament (2 Cor.5; 1 Cor.15; Matt.10:28; 2 Cor.12; John 3:6).

 

[Enoch111]

Taking one verse to try to demonstrate human beings are tripartite is not an adequate view, in my understanding.

That was only for illustration. Try Hebrews 4:12,13.

1. The human spirit is distinct from the soul, yet very closely connected.

2. Human beings are born with souls which are very much alive (the person himself) but the spirit is dead (according to Scripture). That is proof positive that they are distinct from each other.

3. That is why the New Birth is absolutely essential to "quicken" or bring to life the spirit. The Holy Spirit indwells the "new" spirit after the New Birth, and enables the spirit to communicate with God, and comprehend spiritual things. (all supported by Scripture).

 

[Davy]

We really are made up of 3 parts.

In 1 Cor.15, Apostle Paul remarked how as we have borne the "image of the earthy", we shall also bear the "image of the heavenly".

That "image of the heavenly" should be the focus when wanting to understand how our flesh is a separate thing from our spirit.

An 'image' means outward likeness or appearance. It means a body, just not a flesh body. In 1 Cor.15, Paul explained that image as being the "spiritual body". That means it's an outward likeness body, just not one that is made up of flesh and blood. Paul even said there that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God. So we cannot bring in fleshy interpretations into defining that image of the heavenly.

Some might be thinking, "But a flesh body is the only kind of body I know how to relate to, so how is that image of the heavenly not a flesh body?"

To not understand that means to not understand God's Word about the two different dimensions of existence, i.e., flesh and spirit.

John 3:6
6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
KJV

Today - we have:
1. flesh body
2. a soul with spirit inside

At Flesh Death:
1. spirit body image with a soul, the two cannot be separated. Goes back to God in the heavenly dimension, to Paradise.

After Christ's Coming:
1. spirit body image with a soul, the two cannot be separated.

 

[Hidden In Him]

Enoch,

Taking one verse to try to demonstrate human beings are tripartite is not an adequate view, in my understanding. Here's why:

1. The Scripture refers to the soul (nephesh in Hebrew; psuche in Greek) as distinct from the body in passages such as Gen. 35:18, “And as her [Rachel’s] soul was departing (for she was dying), she called his name Ben-oni; but his father called him Benjamin” (ESV). So, the soul leaves the body at death.
2. I Thess 5:23, “Now may the God of peace himself sanctify you completely, and may your whole spirit and soul and body be kept blameless at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.”
3. Revelation 6:9, “When he opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of those who had been slain for the word of God and for the witness they had borne.” So here the souls are separated from the bodies in heaven.

The word “soul” means “life” and refers to the principle of life in a human being. It gives life to the body and is sometimes used to refer to a dead body as in Lev. 19:28; 21:1; 23:4 as I might refer to my departed loved one as “the poor soul.”

Theologian Norman Geisler rightly states that “the primary meaning of soul can most often be captured best by translating it as person, which usually is embodied but is sometimes disembodied” (Systematic Theology, vol. 3, BethanyHouse Publishers, Minneapolis, Minnesota, 2004, p. 47).

The word spirit (Greek, pneuma; Hebrew, ruach) almost always refers to the immaterial part of a human being and is sometimes used interchangeably with soul in many verses (cf. Luke 1:46). The body without the soul is dead (James 2:26) but at death, Jesus “bowed his head and gave up his spirit” (John 19:30).

So your statement that 'man is a tripartite being' needs to be challenged.

The word “soul” can mean “life” and refers to the principle of life in a human being. It gives life to the body and is sometimes used to refer to a dead body as in Lev. 19:28; 21:1; 23:4 as I might refer to my departed loved one as “the poor soul.”

So a statement that human beings are tripartite beings, as the above exposition demonstrates, needs to be questioned.

Oz

Interesting discussion.

Forgive me for not having had time yet to read your articles, Oz, but my first question would be how then do you translate and interpret all three words in 1 Thessalonians 5:23? It would seem that using either "life" or "person" as a translation of ψυχὴ would be a bit redundant if the word weren't defining a specific part of their being that was distinct from the other two.

 

[Mayflower]

That was only for illustration. Try Hebrews 4:12,13.

1. The human spirit is distinct from the soul, yet very closely connected.

2. Human beings are born with souls which are very much alive (the person himself) but the spirit is dead (according to Scripture). That is proof positive that they are distinct from each other.

3. That is why the New Birth is absolutely essential to "quicken" or bring to life the spirit. The Holy Spirit indwells the "new" spirit after the New Birth, and enables the spirit to communicate with God, and comprehend spiritual things. (all supported by Scripture).

Okay between point two and the computer analogy, I think I am understanding the difference. I read Hebrews 4:12 multiple times and it wasn't until Bible study last night did I notice this.

Edit: point 3 is great. I also need to look at when the Holy Spirit comes. I have always believed the Holy Spirit came upon salvation. But the Baptism of the Holy Spirit "filled with the spirit", I want to understand this term better. Like renewing the mind brings out our spirit's gifts, renewing the mind and asking to be filled with the spirit also brings about the manifestations of the Holy Spirit?

 

[Mayflower]

One amazing thing they said is the spirit living inside of us cannot sin. And in Christ bears all the fruits in Galations.

Keep watching and praying that you may not enter into temptation; the spirit is willing, but the flesh is weak.”
MATTHEW 26:41 NASB

I am still studying to see if the Bible says this, about the spirit unable to sin part that is not the Holy Spirit, but my own, but basically he said renewing the mind is what brings out the fruits of the spirit. Otherwise, they are not being used.

But it is sort of a revolutionary concept that all we need, we have already, like in Galations:

But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control; against such things there is no law.
GALATIANS 5:22‭-‬23 NASB

So we were discusising it and he said we don't need to pray for more goodness or more patience, for example, but thank God that He has given us these spiritual fruits upon salvation and help to renew our mind and live by the spirit.

If we live by the Spirit, let us also walk by the Spirit.
GALATIANS 5:25 NASB

Anyway, I am trying to not just swallow things I learn anymore, but actually study about it. But that just blows my mind. It even makes my spirit leap for joy right now that all these things I pray about, God has already given me. I can handle it, because the same spirit that lives in me also was in Christ.

Ozpen, I really liked that article and it is really nice to see both sides of the picture. Thank y'all for the input in understanding this!!!! The Trinity is one of those subjects that has always been difficult to understand. And now I just learn we are three part beings too.

If God is a three part being and we are made in His image, it would make sense.

Body
Soul gives life to body/intellectual part
Spirit- what was condemned in the garden of Eden and brought back to life by Christ Jesus.

 

[aspen]

Plato was the first to use the word ‘soul’ to describe spirit. Sometimes the terms are used interchangeably in the Bible. The early church taught that the word ‘soul’ meant Spirit+Body and when it came to describing Christian souls it would comprise of Christ+spirit+body

 

[Mayflower]

Plato was the first to use the word ‘soul’ to describe spirit. Sometimes the terms are used interchangeably in the Bible. The early church taught that the word ‘soul’ meant Spirit+Body and when it came to describing Christian souls it would comprise of Christ+spirit+body

I am coming to think both. The terms are used interchangeably because they are so closely connected, but different at the same time. Just like the Trinity and praying to God the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit...

 

[OzSpen]

Addressing the OP, the soul and the Spirit are different, and Separate. the best example we can give is in a computer system. the Spirit is Like the computer ROM, (Read Only Memory), which comes from God. and the Soul is like the computer RAM, (Ramdon Acess Memory), which comes from or is the collection of our earthly lives. once the computer is turned off, (we die), the RAM is lost. but the ROM is static, unchainging, not loosing any imformation. and our RECORDED RECORD, the written books of our lives, from the cradel to the grave is stored on the computer Hard Drive, (the books that will be open), holding all of our volatile, and immutable information of the course of our entire life here on earth. once turned on, or resurrected, just as with the computer, all information is RE-Stored.

PICJAG.

You gave no Scripture to support your view. Analogies do not replace Scripture.

 

[Mayflower]

You gave no Scripture to support your view. Analogies do not replace Scripture.

I think he was trying to just give an analogy to help understand his view better. I believe this is what others have been posting about. Mind, soul, and spirit. Makes sense to a computer geek like me.

 

[Mayflower]

Mayflower,

See also: Trichotomy vs. dichotomy of man—which view is correct?

In my view, this is not a teaching to break fellowship over. There are many orthodox, evangelical believers who support both sides. For me, I consider the weight of evidence comes down on dichotomy.

I'm not a heretic because of that view.

Oz

This helped me understand the difference even better. Thanks a lot! Just took some time to get to it.

 

[Enoch111]

Edit: point 3 is great. I also need to look at when the Holy Spirit comes. I have always believed the Holy Spirit came upon salvation. But the Baptism of the Holy Spirit "filled with the spirit", I want to understand this term better. Like renewing the mind brings out our spirit's gifts, renewing the mind and asking to be filled with the spirit also brings about the manifestations of the Holy Spirit?

Good questions since there is a lot of misunderstanding.

1. John the Baptist was the one who said that he baptized with water, but the One coming after him (and far greater than him) would *baptize* with the Holy Ghost (Mt 3:11). [For the present we will leave the matter of "and with fire"].

BAPTISM WITH THE HOLY SPIRIT
2. The word baptism means immersion, but it is also connected with the outpouring of the Spirit (as on the day of Pentecost). This meant in reality that those who repented and believed on the Lord Jesus Christ would receive THE GIFT of the Holy Ghost. Christ and God would be the givers of that gift, therefore Christ would be "baptizing with" the Holy Ghost: Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost. (Acts 2:38)

INDWELLING OF THE HOLY SPIRIT
3. When the Holy Spirit is given, many supernatural things happen at the same time, including the New Birth (see Titus 3:4-7). But as we know from other Scriptures, the Holy Spirit comes to indwell the believer permanently, and to seal the believer as God's purchased possession.

BEING FILLED WITH THE SPIRIT
4. This is would be the same as walking in the Spirit, or being totally surrendered to God and totally under the control of the Spirit. Which means that the old Adamic nature (or "flesh") would not be in control. So you could say that perfect obedience to God and Christ is the same as being filled with the Spirit, and our example is Christ Himself. Jesus was always and continuously "filled with the Spirit" (and it had nothing to do with speaking in tongues, since He only spoke Aramaic, and perhaps Greek when needed). So this is not so much a matter of *asking* to be filled as it is to doing God's will (Romans 12:1,2).

THE GIFTS OF THE SPIRIT
5. There are for the edification of others and each and every Christian has at least one of about 20 spiritual gifts (several passages list them).