Are Doctrines affected by Modern Versions

[Jane_Doe22]

So then how do you know that what the Holy Spirit is telling one person is correct if another person said the Spirit told them something different?

Ask God yourself.

 

[brakelite]

Does theology, even correct theology, lead us to the correct Christ... or are we drawn by the Father to Jesus because of what the Father sees in our heart?

In the initial stages of my own conversion experience, it was as you have described it. I had never picked up a Bible in life, and as you know yourself, Catholic education and religious practice in the 50s and 60s did not encourage Bible reading among the laity.
But when I told my Christian friend that I had given myself to Christ, she said, let me buy you a Bible. That also was God's leading of her heart. God places his Word above every other consideration. If we do not believe what He has said, how can we claim to love him? And our own hearts? I only trust my own thoughts as long as they agree with scripture.

I would suggest it's folly for man A to judge man B's relationship based on how man B's ability to "correctly" pass a theology test posed by man A.

Who said anything about judging? I'm not even questioning, yet, your beliefs. I am merely asking if you agree that a correct theology ought to lead us to the true Christ yes? I mean, after all, Jesus Himself said there would be many false Christs. How do know we have the real deal leading us and sanctifying us if our theology disagrees with our practice which we to that point thought was Christ's leading?

 

[brakelite]

Ask God yourself.

And will His answer contradict the scriptures?

 

[Jane_Doe22]

And will His answer contradict the scriptures?

As I just said: God's Truth never contradicts itself. But He can contradict man's limited understanding of His Truth.

 

[brakelite]

As I just said: God's Truth never contradicts itself. But He can contradict man's limited understanding of His Truth.

Indeed. And how does He do that?

 

[brakelite]

As I just said: God's Truth never contradicts itself. But He can contradict man's limited understanding of His Truth.

And how can we test it for ourselves that we have truth and not error?

 

[reformed1689]

Ask God yourself.

Great non-answer.

 

[Jane_Doe22]

Great non-answer.

It is the ultimate answer, as He is the ultimate source of Truth and everything. All other things are lesser.

 

[Jane_Doe22]

And how can we test it for ourselves that we have truth and not error?

Ask Him. Test His words. Listen.

That relationship is foundational to being a Christian: His disciple.

 

[ReChoired]

Does theology, even correct theology, lead us to the correct Christ... or are we drawn by the Father to Jesus because of what the Father sees in our heart?

Correct theology simply tells us who the real Christ Jesus is, among the myriad claiming to be Christ. I wouldn't say it (theology), of itself, leads any person to Christ and salvation, per se, as that requires the Holy Spirit, as sent by the Father and the Son, Jesus, God drawing all through the character displayed at Calvary, the gospel in Christ Jesus, and even sister White herself stated that a person may know all there is to know about prophecy, etc and still not know Christ Jesus and be lost, which simply mirrors what Paul states in 1 Cor. 13 and elsewhere. It would sort of be like the distinction between "right" and "righteousness".

1Co 13:2 And though I have the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries, and all knowledge; and though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, and have not charity, I am nothing.

"... Not all who profess to keep the Sabbath will be sealed. There are many even among those who teach the truth to others who will not receive the seal of God in their foreheads. They had the light of truth, they knew their Master's will, they understood every point of our faith, but they had not corresponding works. These who were so familiar with prophecy and the treasures of divine wisdom should have acted their faith. They should have commanded their households after them, that by a well-ordered family they might present to the world the influence of the truth upon the human heart. {CCh 333.5} ..." - Counsels for the Church (1991, compilation); page 333.5
​

God is "charity", or "love" (1 John 4:8,16). If I have not God, I am nothing, even if I knew all there was to know about God.

Some good advice:

"... When asked to hear the reasons of a doctrine that you do not understand, do not condemn the message [32] until you have given it a thorough investigation, and know from the word of God that it is not tenable. If I had an opportunity, I would speak to the students of every Sabbath school in the land, lifting up my voice in earnest appeal that they go to the word of God, seeking for truth and light. God has precious light to come to His people at this very time, and you should strive earnestly in your investigations to aim at nothing less than a thorough knowledge of every point of truth, that you may not be found in the day of God among those who have not lived by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God. {CSW 31.2} ..." - Counsels on Sabbath School Work (1938, compilation), page 32.1

"... Brethren should not feel that it is a virtue to stand apart because they do not see all minor points in exactly the same light. If they agree on fundamental truths, they should not differ and dispute about matters of little real importance. To dwell on perplexing questions, that after all are of no vital consequence, tends to call the mind away from truths vital to the saving of the soul. Brethren should be very modest in urging these side-issues, which often they do not themselves understand, points that they do not know to be truth, and that are not essential to salvation. When there is difference of opinion on such points, the less prominence you give to them the better it will be for your own spirituality and for the peace and unity of the church. {3MR 28.2}

Unbelievers are critical, and they seek to frame some excuse for not receiving the truth as it is in Jesus. Where these differences exist among us, those who stand outside will say, "It will be time enough for us to believe as you do when you can agree among yourselves as to what constitutes [29] truth." Thus the ungodly take advantage of the divisions and controversies among Christians. {3MR 28.3}

We are to pray for divine enlightenment, and at the same time we should be careful about receiving everything termed new light. We must beware, lest, under cover of searching for new truth, we allow Satan to divert our minds from Christ and the special truths for this time. I have been shown that it is the device of the enemy to divert men's minds to some obscure or unimportant point, something that is not fully revealed or is not essential to salvation. This is made the absorbing theme, the "present truth," when all the investigations and suppositions only serve to make matters more obscure, and to confuse the minds of some who ought to be seeking for oneness through sanctification of the truth. {3MR 29.1}

All must be careful what they present to the people as truth. Do not present your own imaginations. The enemy tries to warp and twist human minds. To the one who will listen to him, he will present ideas which are odd and peculiar, which will create a sensation. These he leads him to present to others, with a test which he has imagined. Thus Satan sets minds running in wrong channels, diverting them from the genuine tests which God has presented in His Word. {3MR 29.2} ..." - Manuscripts Releases, Volume 3 (1990), pages 28.2 - 29.2

"... If we have received the gift of God, and have a knowledge of Jesus Christ, we have a work to do for others. We must imitate the long-suffering of God toward us. The Lord requires of us the same treatment toward his followers that we receive of him. We are to exercise patience, to be kind, even though they do not meet our expectations in every particular. The Lord expects us to be pitiful and loving, to have sympathetic hearts. The fruits of the grace of God will be shown in our deportment to one another. We should keep always before us that, while claiming to be commandment-keepers, we must not be found to be commandment-breakers. The last six commandments specify man's duty to man. Christ did not say, You may tolerate your neighbor, but, "Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself." This means a great deal more than professing Christians carry out in their daily life. While they claim to be doers of God's word, they fail to make sure work by earnest practice. {RH, November 16, 1886 par. 3} ..." - The Advent Review And Sabbath Herald, November 16, 1886, par. 3

"... Every association of life calls for the exercise of self-control, forbearance, and sympathy. We differ so widely in disposition, habits, education, that our ways of looking at things vary. We judge differently. Our understanding of truth, our ideas in regard to the conduct of life, are not in all respects the same. There are no two whose experience is alike in every particular. The trials of one are not the trials of another. The duties that one finds light, are to another most difficult and perplexing. {CSW 102.1} ..." - Counsels on Sabbath School Work (1938, compilation); page 102.1

"... I saw that God's people were coming into the unity of the faith, and those that believe that the seventh day is the Sabbath, are united in their views and understanding of the Bible truths in all important points and that they believe and speak the same things. But those who oppose the seventh day Sabbath are cut up and divided; there are hardly two agreed. One comes forward in opposition to the Sabbath commandment and declares it to be thus and so, and at the conclusion calls it settled. Then a second comes up and tears the first down, and declares it to be some other way. But they will not have it, any of them, that the seventh day is the Sabbath. They do not agree among themselves, but are blind and dishonest and are standing out against the Sabbath commandment. {6MR 169.1} ..." - Manuscripts Releases, Volume 6 (1990), page 169.1

"... There are many mysteries which I do not seek to understand or to explain; they are too high for me, and too high for you. On some of these points, silence is golden. Piety, devotion, sanctification of soul, body, and spirit--this is essential for us all. "This is life eternal, that they might know Thee, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom Thou hast sent" [180] [John 17:3]. "This is the will of Him that sent Me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on Him, may have everlasting life" [John 6:40]. {14MR 179.3}

I hope that you will seek to be in harmony with the body. ... {14MR 180.1} ..." - Manuscripts Releases, Volume 14 (1990), pages 179.3 - 180.1

"... Many of our people are backsliding from God. We need to arouse. Let every soul that has named the name of Christ depart from iniquity. We want a pure Christianity. Great dangers are lurking for us on every side. When they most need the presence of God, many have it least. They are in danger of becoming like the Jewish nation, who knew not the Scriptures nor the power of God. Like the teachers of Israel, you may explain Bible truth to others, and yet not practice it in your daily life. If the Jews had possessed an experimental knowledge of the Scriptures, they would not have been ignorant of the power of God. Like them, we have great light and privileges; but many do not respond to these, and herein lies their peril. When Jesus wept over Jerusalem, his tears were for all who abuse present privileges. He wept that so many who profess his name fail to become what God designed them to be; that they continue in sin and weakness, while he is willing and able to save them if they will but come to him. ..." - The Advent Review And Sabbath Herald, November 2, 1886, par. 2​

 

[marksman]

Where in the world do people find churches like these? I hear about them, but have never seen one.

Maybe a case of you in your small corner and I in mine. I have lived on three continents so I have been around.

 

[mjrhealth]

But He can contradict a man's interpretation of scripture.

More like mens interpretation of Scripture can contradict the truth thats why there are so many arguments.

 

[marksman]

For those exalting the Alexandrian line of MSS allow me to quote B G Wilkinson, from his book, The Authorised Bible Vindicated (available freely online in pdf format)...
The year in which the apostle John died, 100 A.D., is given as the date in which Justin Martyr was born. Justin, originally a pagan and of pagan parentage, afterward embraced Christianity and although he is said to have died at heathen hands for his religion, nevertheless, his teachings were of a heretical nature. Even as a Christian teacher, he continued to wear the robes of a pagan philosopher. In the teachings of Justin Martyr, we begin to see how muddy the stream of pure Christian doctrine was running among the heretical sects fifty years after the death of the apostle John. It was in Tatian, Justin Martyr’s pupil, that these regrettable doctrines were carried to alarming lengths, and by his hand committed to writing. After the death of Justin Martyr in Rome, Tatian returned to Palestine and embraced the Gnostic heresy. This same Tatian wrote a Harmony of the Gospels which was called the Diatessaron, meaning four in one. The Gospels were so notoriously corrupted by his hand that in later years a bishop of Syria, because of the errors, was obliged to throw out of his churches no less than two hundred copies of this Diatessaron, since church members were mistaking it for the true Gospel.fa19 We come now to Tatian’s pupil known as Clement of Alexandria, 200 A. D.fa20 He went much farther than Tatian in that he founded a school at Alexandria which instituted propaganda along these heretical lines. Clement expressly tells us that he would not hand down Christian teachings, pure and unmixed, but rather clothed with precepts of pagan philosophy. All the writings of the outstanding heretical teachers were possessed by Clement, and he freely quoted from their corrupted MSS. As if they were the pure words of Scripture.fa21 His influence in the depravation of Christianity was tremendous. But his greatest contribution, undoubtedly, was the direction given to the studies and activities of Origen, his famous pupil. When we come to Origen, we speak the name of him who did the most of all to create and give direction to the forces of apostasy down through the centuries. It was he who mightily influenced Jerome, the editor of the Latin Bible known as the Vulgate. Eusebius worshiped at the altar of Origen’s teachings. He claims to have collected eight hundred of Origen’s letters, to have used Origen’s six-column Bible, the Hexapla, in his Biblical labors. Assisted by Pamphilus, he restored and preserved Origen’s library. Origen’s corrupted MSS. of the Scriptures were well arranged and balanced with subtlety. The last one hundred years have seen much of the so-called scholarship of European and English Christianity dominated by the subtle and powerful influence of Origen. Origen had so surrendered himself to the furore of turning all Bible events into allegories that he, himself, says, “The Scriptures are of little use to those who understand them as they are written.”fa22 In order to estimate Origen rightly, we must remember that as a pupil of Clement, he learned the teachings of the Gnostic heresy and like his master, lightly esteemed the historical basis of the Bible. As Schaff says, “His predilection for Plato (the pagan philosopher) led him into many grand and fascinating errors.”
He made himself acquainted with the various heresies and studied under the heathen Ammonius Saccas, founder of Neo-Platonism. He taught that the soul existed from eternity before it inhabited the body, and that after death, it migrated to a higher or a lower form of life according to the deeds done in the body; and finally all would return to the state of pure intelligence, only to begin again the same cycle as before. He believed that the devils would be saved, and that the stars and planets had souls, and were, like men, on trial to learn perfection. In fact, he turned the whole law and Gospel into an allegory. Such was the man who from his day to this has dominated the endeavors of destructive textual critics. One of the greatest results of his life, was that his teachings became the foundation of that system of education called Scholasticism, which guided the colleges of Latin Europe for nearly one thousand years during the Dark Ages.

Brakelite, paragraphs please.

 

[brakelite]

Brakelite, paragraphs please.

Sorry.

 

[ReChoired]

Sorry.

Here these may help you out.

Its "Pair of Graphs":

 

[marksman]

More like mens interpretation of Scripture can contradict the truth thats why there are so many arguments.

And can I add, denominations?

 

[ReChoired]

And can I add, denominations?

The 'de-nomin-ation' is simply the outward working of the held doctrines.

 

[mjrhealth]

And can I add, denominations?

well religion and mankind in general. Thats why these forums exist. People wont go to Jesus, find every excuse under the sun to stay away from Him than hope to be saved.

 

[marksman]

The 'de-nomin-ation' is simply the outward working of the held doctrines.

And who is holding those doctrines?

 

[ReChoired]

And who is holding those doctrines?

Individual persons, collectively believing in a core set of doctrines together.