I note that Brother Copeland and Jesse Duplantis is on the minds of some here.

[GISMYS_7]

What does GOD say about those who bring a false gospel??!! THINK!!

False witness with NO =ZERO proof =daring and asking for early judgment!

 

[Giuliano]

KC would fly his plane with his staff, across the country to hold a crusade sponsored by a church there. If that ministry sponsoring the event didn't have a plane and needed one for their own ministry, KC would give them theirs, leaving themselves stranded. The would all have to find their way back home by other means.

Why would the church sponsoring the event need a plane? Who flew it? Did Copeland also pay for a pilot?

And if the other church really needed a plane, did Copeland ever give them a plane outright as a gift?

 

[Giuliano]

False witness with NO =ZERO proof =daring and asking for early judgment!

 

[marksman]

I thought they both already has their own private planes. Do they want new ones?

I could be wrong but I thought Copeland had two planes.

 

[CharismaticLady]

Why would the church sponsoring the event need a plane? Who flew it? Did Copeland also pay for a pilot?

And if the other church really needed a plane, did Copeland ever give them a plane outright as a gift?

Yes, as a gift outright. Your other questions are ridiculous. You think it is too good to be true, maybe because you never, yourself, could be that generous. So you strain at a gnats.

 

[Josho]

Did any of those people ever tell someone, "Give me money, and God will make sure you get more money back yourself?"

How did those people use their wealth? It is a very good thing to be rich if you aren't in love with money. You can do a lot of good with a lot of money.

As for Job? I subscribe to a Jewish teaching that he did not use his wealth correctly at first. I base that on:

Job 1:10 Hast not thou made an hedge about him, and about his house, and about all that he hath on every side? thou hast blessed the work of his hands, and his substance is increased in the land.

"Increased" in that sentence is ambiguous. It can be read to mean Job had so much livestock, they were "breaking out". Nor was all happiness and lightness with Job. He was miserable. He was so concerned about his children -- and not enough about people who were not related to him. He could easily have shared his wealth with some of his poorer neighbors but chose to keep so many that he couldn't control them.

So there he was, all bothered about his children. Worried that they might have sinned, and sacrificing for them, just in case. Did it work? Did Job's prayers and sacrifices for his children work? No. They were all killed.

There is more to be said about Job's children too. Did you ever notice they didn't visit him?

job 1:3 His substance also was seven thousand sheep, and three thousand camels, and five hundred yoke of oxen, and five hundred she asses, and a very great household; so that this man was the greatest of all the men of the east.
4 And his sons went and feasted in their houses, every one his day; and sent and called for their three sisters to eat and to drink with them.
5 And it was so, when the days of their feasting were gone about, that Job sent and sanctified them, and rose up early in the morning, and offered burnt offerings according to the number of them all: for Job said, It may be that my sons have sinned, and cursed God in their hearts. Thus did Job continually.

Why did they feast at each other's houses and not visit Job?

Job acquired love and wisdom. In the end, we see him being told to sacrifice for his three Gentile friends , and his prayers and sacrifices were acceptable. I think Job learned to stop being partial. He learned the value of loving everyone.

Copeland, like some other ministers, seems to show favoritism to his children. Is someone really the best person for a job just because you're related by blood? Then too there's the matter of his three marriages.
Running costs aren't the question. The question is how much wealth does a person need to amass as his personal fortune? How many planes you do need? How many homes?


Context? What should we ask for?

Luke 11:9 And I say unto you, Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you.
10 For every one that asketh receiveth; and he that seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened.
11 If a son shall ask bread of any of you that is a father, will he give him a stone? or if he ask a fish, will he for a fish give him a serpent?
12 Or if he shall ask an egg, will he offer him a scorpion?
13 If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children: how much more shall your heavenly Father give the Holy Spirit to them that ask him?

What should we treasure? Money and earthly things?

Matthew 6:19 Lay not up for yourselves treasures upon earth, where moth and rust doth corrupt, and where thieves break through and steal:
20 But lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust doth corrupt, and where thieves do not break through nor steal:
21 For where your treasure is, there will your heart be also.

In all honesty, I cannot discuss much about Job much at the moment, as I would need to take time to read the whole book of Job again, maybe one day I will get back to you on that one. I admit, I am not one to get through the Bible 5 times a year, I am a slow reader, and have read the first few books and New Testament way more than the other books. But we do have to remember Job was under the Mosaic Law and could have been used as example of why we need Jesus, and why we needed that new covenant of grace, in today's world, not many of us would have been able to keep up with the sacrifices in the Old Testament, and it could be easily questioned if human beings on this earth would still be alive, if we were still living under Mosaic law, that is for another topic though. But the positive out of the book of Job is Job made it through even though he faced some awful stuff.

Yes we should store up our treasures in heaven.

Even though that does not make the faith Gospel a false gospel, because throughout the new testament Jesus teaches faith, I mean even in real life, dad has driven cars by faith on empty petrol tanks, one time it was something like 160 kilometres he drove on faith with no petrol until he arrived to the next petrol, he has even gone to the airport without any money, one time he was called by God to go to USA, it might have been for prison ministry or he might have been called to go to a conference, cannot remember which one it was or perhaps even both, but dad kept on believing for an air ticket, and God provided, and that was the 11th hour he kept believing til, and parents have also been through financial struggles too, but got through by faith that God would help us through, during the times we were called to move to Victoria, they even found a house for rent for $90 a week, which was way cheaper than anything else in the market, and it stayed $90 a week even after the landlord died and a new one bought a property, and at point houses were $300 per week, yet the rent remained at $90 for the last year or 2 we lived there and we eventually had to move out, we kept getting more blessed and blessed that we had to clear out some clutter and we aren't renting anymore praise God! So the faith Gospel is very real and alive. We also know a healing Evangelist known as Howard Willard, that also preaches faith, he is quite accurate in the word of Knowledge too, he has given a testimony of where a cancer hospital got emptied in some third world country, and it was of course done by the Lord Jesus Christ because of faith! He even had a situation when he had a hole in his foot, he told the doctor Jesus would heal it, of course the doctor was in doubt, but that doctor got proven wrong, and Jesus supernaturally healed Howard's foot through faith. So just from experiences, I have seen and heard how the faith Gospel works, my dog even got healed from a heart murmur when the vet gave him 6 months to live, he was 9 years old at the time, and the Good Friday after a few months had passed by the dog was feeling very weak and one point would not get up, through prayer, faith and believing, the dog regained strength on the 3rd day, it was a Resurrection Sunday! And He went on to live to an old age of 15 years old! PRAISE GOD!!

So just from experiences the faith gospel is not fake but has been proven to be very REAL!!!!

I did make a comment on Kenneth's response to Covid-19 on another thread but I chose to remove it, I will say this though God can remove Covid-19 in an instant if it was His will, but God's got to get the glory though, not Kenneth nor any other man, and Kenneth should have done his research on Covid-19 and hot weather, before praying about it like publicly the other day, I will stop right there though, because the wind of God can knock out Covid-19, but in a different way, it's not the hot winds he was praying about, God can supernaturally and has supernaturally, there are testimonies about this, we even know of someone who has witnessed it, on God removing the covid-19 from someone and filling their lungs with air supernaturally allowing them to breathe easily and normally again, filling their lungs with the wind of God, the wind of life. God can also help man discover a vaccine.

Also I want to mention, a prophetic dentist we see every 6 months received a revelation from God on James 1:17 about "every good and perfect gift being from above", the good gift being medical cures, hospitals, doctors, pharmacists, the perfect gift being a supernatural healing.


Now back to Kenneth Copeland and Jesse Duplantis, there is no doubt they both serve a purpose for God on this earth and both are born again Spirit-filled Believers, they both have a lot of opposition, so they must be doing something right. And my next posts in this thread, will be positives on them and maybe even some testimonies. Some people focus way too much on negatives.

You know Kenneth hasn't avoided teaching about the "love of money being the root of all evil", he has even taught on it before. I would have to listen to the sermon though.

 

[Giuliano]

Yes, as a gift outright. Your other questions are ridiculous. You think it is too good to be true, maybe because you never, yourself, be that generous. So you strain at a gnats.

I'm straining at jet planes, not gnats. Can you document your statements, or would that be asking too much? I read once that his son said Copeland had given away 26 planes -- but no names were mentioned. Again I could not document the claim.

I can be even more ridiculous in your eyes. Why would Copeland need to give planes to other ministries? Why are they too poor to afford their own? Don't they know how to practice Prosperity Gospel? Or maybe he was tired of the ones he had and wanted new ones, bigger and more expensive?

Go ahead, keep insulting me by inference. If you think I know little about Copeland, I assure you know less about me. I am basing my comments on known facts. You are impugning my character because I don't like Copeland. That you're making it personal tells me you're short on facts so are resorting to making a sly comment about me -- based on absolutely nothing except suspicion. You remind me of Michal who drew a curse down on herself with her suspicious mind.

I thought the Catholic hierarchy was misguided when so many Bishops tried to defend the indefensible; and the reputation of their entire church was besmirched because good people were willing to do nothing about the bad eggs. Did non-Catholics learn from that? If you are being defensive about Copeland over theological reasons, I suggest you look beyond those. He is bringing the reputation of charismatic Christians into disrepute as other wilder charismatics have in the past. I would think if you cared about the reputation of charismatics, you would want things to be cleaned up. I care about it since I think if Catholics or charismatics look bad, it makes all Christians look bad in the eyes of some people.

Too many churches do not take Paul's advice in 1 Timothy 3 seriously. I think it's sound theological and sound practically. Leaders should not be given to too much alcohol, greed, or marrying multiple times.

I remind you too that some bad people regularly make sizable donations to charity. They do it to polish their reputation.

 

[Joseph77]

In their own words, in their own broadcasts, in their own teaching.
That is what they preach the false gospel in, OPENLY< ANTENNA TV > and internet, etc

TO SEE THAT, THEN WITH GREAT CAUTION, (TO NOT BE MORE FULLY BROUGHT INTO THE PIT) , WATCH THEM , since it appears you have not.

False witness with NO =ZERO proof =daring and asking for early judgment!

 

[GISMYS_7]

Bottom line= Those that do not believe and reject God's Word on healing and prosperity will have none=you have what you say and believe.
Psalms 35:27 God's Word says
"Let the LORD be magnified, which hath pleasure in the prosperity of his servant.”

 

[Joseph77]

ooops. Healing and (ick) prosperity, no matter if truth, or false, is not the false gospel copeland preaches.

You have to see what God says to realize the false gospel that comes from that accursed one.

i.e. your 'bottom' is not even close to what God Says.

Bottom line= Those that do not believe and reject God's Word on healing and prosperity will have none=you have what you say and believe.
Psalms 35:27 God's Word says
"Let the LORD be magnified, which hath pleasure in the prosperity of his servant.”

 

[Giuliano]

Bottom line= Those that do not believe and reject God's Word on healing and prosperity will have none=you have what you say and believe.
Psalms 35:27 God's Word says
"Let the LORD be magnified, which hath pleasure in the prosperity of his servant.”

That Psalm is about the enemies of David who sought his destruction. So far as I know, no one is plotting the death of Copeland. You don't even bother to quote the whole verse.

Psalm 35:24 Judge me, O LORD my God, according to thy righteousness; and let them not rejoice over me.
25 Let them not say in their hearts, Ah, so would we have it: let them not say, We have swallowed him up.
26 Let them be ashamed and brought to confusion together that rejoice at mine hurt: let them be clothed with shame and dishonour that magnify themselves against me.
27 Let them shout for joy, and be glad, that favour my righteous cause: yea, let them say continually, Let the LORD be magnified, which hath pleasure in the prosperity of his servant.

Is obtaining three jet planes a righteous cause? Is building mansions a righteous cause? You know it isn't, so why quote out of context from this Psalm?

Matthew 19:23 Then said Jesus unto his disciples, Verily I say unto you, That a rich man shall hardly enter into the kingdom of heaven.
24 And again I say unto you, It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God.

James 1:11 For the sun is no sooner risen with a burning heat, but it withereth the grass, and the flower thereof falleth, and the grace of the fashion of it perisheth: so also shall the rich man fade away in his ways.

 

[Joseph77]

Is obtaining three jet planes a righteous cause? Is building mansions a righteous cause? You know it isn't, so why quote out of context from this Psalm?

As noted world wide for centuries, anything goes for those who are defending something/ anything/ false.

 

[GISMYS_7]

Really!! Who finds this scripture hard to understand??==Psalms 35:27 God's Word says
"Let the LORD be magnified, which hath pleasure in the prosperity of his servant.”

 

[Joseph77]

Apparently you do.
You mis-understand it.
Mis-apply it.
Mis-construe it, all going with the enemy of Christ in the false gospel perpetrators daily, in many of your posts.

Really!! Who finds this scripture hard to understand??==Psalms 35:27 God's Word says
"Let the LORD be magnified, which hath pleasure in the prosperity of his servant.”

 

[GISMYS_7]

Why would a born again believer=a son of God and joint heir with Jesus think it is good to be sick, poor and cursed?? Psalms 35:27 God's Word says
"Let the LORD be magnified, which hath pleasure in the prosperity of his servant.”

 

[Giuliano]

Really!! Who finds this scripture hard to understand??==Psalms 35:27 God's Word says
"Let the LORD be magnified, which hath pleasure in the prosperity of his servant.”

You find it hard since you want to use it to justify greed. Do you understand what context is?

And are you ignoring the passages I gave you? It seems so.

 

[Joseph77]

Why would a born again believer=a son of God and joint heir with Jesus think it is good to be sick, poor and cursed?? Psalms 35:27 God's Word says
"Let the LORD be magnified, which hath pleasure in the prosperity of his servant.”

So what !? That part of the message, while it can be and usually is a false teaching,

it is not why (or is it?) you are promoting a false gospel preacher. We do not know why you continue believing a bringer of a false gospel, accursed by Jesus.

 

[GISMYS_7]

I choose to believe God's Word!! and you??
Psalm 25:13

His soul will abide in prosperity,
And his descendants will inherit the land.

Proverbs 28:25

An arrogant man stirs up strife,
But he who trusts in the Lord will prosper.

Proverbs 13:21

Adversity pursues sinners,
But the righteous will be rewarded with prosperity.

 

[Joseph77]

No you did not.
You choose to ignore God's Word.

The one you follow, a bringing and teacher of the false gospel, is accursed, and so are you if you continue without repentance, if you continue bringing a support of a false gospel.

I choose to believe God's Word!! and you??

 

[Giuliano]

In all honesty, I cannot discuss much about Job much at the moment, as I would need to take time to read the whole book of Job again, maybe one day I will get back to you on that one. I admit, I am not one to get through the Bible 5 times a year, I am a slow reader, and have read the first few books and New Testament way more than the other books. But we do have to remember Job was under the Mosaic Law and could have been used as example of why we need Jesus, and why we needed that new covenant of grace, in today's world, not many of us would have been able to keep up with the sacrifices in the Old Testament, and it could be easily questioned if human beings on this earth would still be alive, if we were still living under Mosaic law, that is for another topic though. But the positive out of the book of Job is Job made it through even though he faced some awful stuff.

I do not know that Job was living under Mosaic law.

Yes we should store up our treasures in heaven.

Indeed.

Even though that does not make the faith Gospel a false gospel, because throughout the new testament Jesus teaches faith, I mean even in real life, dad has driven cars by faith on empty petrol tanks, one time it was something like 160 kilometres he drove on faith with no petrol until he arrived to the next petrol, he has even gone to the airport without any money, one time he was called by God to go to USA, it might have been for prison ministry or he might have been called to go to a conference, cannot remember which one it was or perhaps even both, but dad kept on believing for an air ticket, and God provided, and that was the 11th hour he kept believing til, and parents have also been through financial struggles too, but got through by faith that God would help us through, during the times we were called to move to Victoria, they even found a house for rent for $90 a week, which was way cheaper than anything else in the market, and it stayed $90 a week even after the landlord died and a new one bought a property, and at point houses were $300 per week, yet the rent remained at $90 for the last year or 2 we lived there and we eventually had to move out, we kept getting more blessed and blessed that we had to clear out some clutter and we aren't renting anymore praise God! So the faith Gospel is very real and alive. We also know a healing Evangelist known as Howard Willard, that also preaches faith, he is quite accurate in the word of Knowledge too, he has given a testimony of where a cancer hospital got emptied in some third world country, and it was of course done by the Lord Jesus Christ because of faith! He even had a situation when he had a hole in his foot, he told the doctor Jesus would heal it, of course the doctor was in doubt, but that doctor got proven wrong, and Jesus supernaturally healed Howard's foot through faith. So just from experiences, I have seen and heard how the faith Gospel works, my dog even got healed from a heart murmur when the vet gave him 6 months to live, he was 9 years old at the time, and the Good Friday after a few months had passed by the dog was feeling very weak and one point would not get up, through prayer, faith and believing, the dog regained strength on the 3rd day, it was a Resurrection Sunday! And He went on to live to an old age of 15 years old! PRAISE GOD!!

So just from experiences the faith gospel is not fake but has been proven to be very REAL!!!!

Two points here. The first point is that your dad is nothing like Copeland. He was't rich, and he wasn't trying to get rich.

My second point is I've seen several miracles in my time. I was never that impressed. Miracles don't seem that unusual to me. I also do not attribute all miracles to God; and I think there is a danger is some circles to seek signs and wonder. Then often people attribute them to God without thinking, without testing the spirits, without looking for charity and other clearer signs that something is from God. I also know that the Dark Side can be tricky, sometimes doing good deeds in order to entice innocent people.

I did make a comment on Kenneth's response to Covid-19 on another thread but I chose to remove it, I will say this though God can remove Covid-19 in an instant if it was His will, but God's got to get the glory though, not Kenneth nor any other man, and Kenneth should have done his research on Covid-19 and hot weather, before praying about it like publicly the other day, I will stop right there though, because the wind of God can knock out Covid-19, but in a different way, it's not the hot winds he was praying about, God can supernaturally and has supernaturally, there are testimonies about this, we even know of someone who has witnessed it, on God removing the covid-19 from someone and filling their lungs with air supernaturally allowing them to breathe easily and normally again, filling their lungs with the wind of God, the wind of life. God can also help man discover a vaccine.

I wonder ask why Copeland allowed Texas to be hit by tornadoes. For the record, Louisiana was also hit -- where Duplantis lives.

Also I want to mention, a prophetic dentist we see every 6 months received a revelation from God on James 1:17 about "every good and perfect gift being from above", the good gift being medical cures, hospitals, doctors, pharmacists, the perfect gift being a supernatural healing.

Now back to Kenneth Copeland and Jesse Duplantis, there is no doubt they both serve a purpose for God on this earth and both are born again Spirit-filled Believers, they both have a lot of opposition, so they must be doing something right. And my next posts in this thread, will be positives on them and maybe even some testimonies. Some people focus way too much on negatives.

You know Kenneth hasn't avoided teaching about the "love of money being the root of all evil", he has even taught on it before. I would have to listen to the sermon though.

Judas was a disciple. He preached the gospel and even cast out evil spirits.

My opposition to this type is based on Paul's writing about church leaders should not be motivated by greed. They should be sober. They should not have more than one wife. Your logic could be used to defend the Temple priesthood of Jesus' day. They were doing good too; but they thought it okay to mingle evil with good, bitter with sweet.