The rich man and the beggar at his gate?

[Renniks]

Jonah 2:2 KJV
And said, I cried by reason of mine affliction unto the Lord, and he heard me; out of the belly of hell cried I, and thou heardest my voice.

How do you reconcile this?

He wasn't literally in hell.

 

[Waiting on him]

He wasn't literally in hell.

Did Jesus literally descend into hell?

 

[VictoryinJesus]

. (he had two bodies)

Not so odd “two bodies”: James 4:8-10 Draw nigh to God, and he will draw nigh to you. Cleanse your hands, ye sinners; and purify your hearts, ye double minded. [9] Be afflicted, and mourn, and weep: let your laughter be turned to mourning, and your joy to heaviness. [10] Humble yourselves in the sight of the Lord, and he shall lift you up.

James 1:8-11 A double minded man is unstable in all his ways.(someone earlier mentioned well “a slippery slope” [9] Let the brother of low degree rejoice in that he is exalted: [10] But the rich, in that he is made low: because as the flower of the grass he shall pass away. [11] For the sun is no sooner risen with a burning heat, but it withereth the grass, and the flower thereof falleth, and the grace of the fashion of it perisheth: so also shall the rich man fade away in his ways.

The brother of low degree...that he is lifted up. But the rich man ...rejoice? In that he is made low. Brought down. What? Rejoice in being “spoiled”? Paul said plainly he knew how to be “abased” and “to abound”... “For the sun is no sooner risen with “burning heat” and those trusting in “uncertain” riches perish and fades away in his own ways. BUT that is never the end of it but “be rich towards God” as said “make friends with the unrighteousness Of uncertain riches so WHEN they fail ...who will receive you?”

Not so odd “two bodies” In Colossians 2:11 In whom also ye are circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, in putting off the body of the sins of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ:

Where does that body of sins go to be destroyed...done away with? Put off the body of sins and put on the New Man. The “old man” and “new man”: you have borne the earthly images, also you shall bear the heavenly.

 

[bbyrd009]

Jesus descended into hell.

Well, figuratively speaking anyway huh

 

[Renniks]

Not so odd “two bodies”: James 4:8-10 Draw nigh to God, and he will draw nigh to you. Cleanse your hands, ye sinners; and purify your hearts, ye double minded. [9] Be afflicted, and mourn, and weep: let your laughter be turned to mourning, and your joy to heaviness. [10] Humble yourselves in the sight of the Lord, and he shall lift you up.

James 1:8-11 A double minded man is unstable in all his ways.(someone earlier mentioned well “a slippery slope” [9] Let the brother of low degree rejoice in that he is exalted: [10] But the rich, in that he is made low: because as the flower of the grass he shall pass away. [11] For the sun is no sooner risen with a burning heat, but it withereth the grass, and the flower thereof falleth, and the grace of the fashion of it perisheth: so also shall the rich man fade away in his ways.

The brother of low degree...that he is lifted up. But the rich man ...rejoice? In that he is made low. Brought down. What? Rejoice in being “spoiled”? Paul said plainly he knew how to be “abased” and “to abound”... “For the sun is no sooner risen with “burning heat” and those trusting in “uncertain” riches perish and fades away in his own ways. BUT that is never the end of it but “be rich towards God” as said “make friends with the unrighteousness Of uncertain riches so WHEN they fail ...who will receive you?”

Not so odd “two bodies” In Colossians 2:11 In whom also ye are circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, in putting off the body of the sins of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ:

Where does that body of sins go to be destroyed...done away with?

Lol, wow, some people sure do tamper with what scripture actually says. This isn't figurative. It's about two separate people. There's no logical way to read it as the same man in two places at once. Good grief.

 

[Waiting on him]

Lol, wow, some people sure do tamper with what scripture actually says. This isn't figurative. It's about two separate people. There's no logical way to read it as the same man in two places at once. Good grief.

John 3:13 KJV
And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.

 

[101G]

Makes me think of: Zechariah 8:23 Thus saith the Lord of hosts; In those days it shall come to pass, that ten men shall take hold out of all languages of the nations, even shall take hold of the skirt of him that is a Jew, saying, We will go with you: for we have heard that God is with you.

GINOLJC, to all.
yes, also while you're in Zechariah look at Zechariah 4:6 "Then he answered and spake unto me, saying, This is the word of the LORD unto Zerubbabel, saying, Not by might, nor by power, but by my spirit, saith the LORD of hosts." and the spirit who helps us is the "COMFORTER", or the "HELPER". if one really takes their time all of the Lod's saying are connected. this is just a couple of them.

PICJAG.

 

[bbyrd009]

Did Jesus literally descend into hell?

Well, we can’t Quote that right

 

[Waiting on him]

GINOLJC, to all.
yes, also while you're in Zechariah look at Zechariah 4:6 "Then he answered and spake unto me, saying, This is the word of the LORD unto Zerubbabel, saying, Not by might, nor by power, but by my spirit, saith the LORD of hosts." and the spirit who helps us is the "COMFORTER", or the "HELPER". if one really takes their time all of the Lod's saying are connected. this is just a couple of them.

PICJAG.

Why do you believe that father Abraham addressed the rich man in torment as Son?

 

[icxn]

...A question. Why did Jesus not go visit John the Baptist in prison? Instead sent word those captive are set free? The dead raised, the sick healed...

Someone of the spiritual stature of Saint John had no need of the physical visit of the Lord, he was always in His presence in spirit, even more so in the quietude of his prison cell. Also, the question he posed through his disciples was made on behalf of them, he had no doubts about Christ’s identity as some say. He wanted his disciples to stop following him and join Christ instead, he had to decrease as the scripture says, so he sent them to the Lord to be convinced. Also, the captivity that Christ set us free from is that of sin and death, so not freeing Saint John from prison – if that is what you were suggesting – was not contrary to Christ’s message. Many good things resulted from his death: it ‘forced’ his disciples to join Christ and he became a forerunner to those in Hades (1 Peter 3:19), not to mention the glory that dying for the word of God earned him. As a symbol of the Mosaic Law, he also ‘had*’ to die at the hands of the will of the flesh (Herod interpreted means ‘made of skin’), so that the new covenant of Grace could be introduced.

Why did she recognize his table and the one who sat at it and asked for the crumbs which fell from the masters table?

Because she had the key to the treasures of wisdom and knowledge (Psalms 25:9) and thus was able to recognize the Divinity of Christ. Something, which the Jews and especially the Pharisees despite their extensive book-learning lacked. Every time Jesus challenged their pride, they became enraged (the opposite of meekness) and wanted to kill Him (Luke 4:28). She on the other hand accepted His reproach with humility and acknowledge Him to be God by calling the heeling of her demon-possessed daughter a crumb, i.e. a trivial thing for God to do.

______
* To reflect the reality that none of us could keep it (Acts 15:10)

 

[101G]

Why do you believe that father Abraham addressed the rich man in torment as Son?

now I'm going to make a connection to Job which I see you are very interested in. listen, Job 1:1 "There was a man in the land of Uz, whose name was Job; and that man was perfect and upright, and one that feared God, and eschewed evil."
Job 1:2 "And there were born unto him seven sons and three daughters."
Job 1:3 "His substance also was seven thousand sheep, and three thousand camels, and five hundred yoke of oxen, and five hundred she asses, and a very great household; so that this man was the greatest of all the men of the east."

now look up the word men there and see what it means?......

and then a keyword, "hier".

PICJAG.

 

[VictoryinJesus]

Lol, wow, some people sure do tamper with what scripture actually says. This isn't figurative. It's about two separate people. There's no logical way to read it as the same man in two places at once. Good grief.

Not saying it is. Only asking first why do we add to? 1) the man asked for water for his thirst. 2) he thought of the well being of his brothers to not end up in the same torment also; unlike many who really could careless about where there brothers go, as long as they don’t end up there. This is wide spread in the churches when you ask a loving Christian about Hell even concerning their family and quickly love expressions and warm tingles of feeling good, turns to “Yea, they are going to burn in Hell. But I am not.” Again, that is okay? At least the plea was go warn my brothers so they don’t end up in torment like me.
Then, We add to all kinds of motives to make it fit our desires.
3) and the big one. He asked and received. The Spirit was sent. Ask anything in my name and The Father will do it. Asking for water for thirst and for your brothers is...unless I’ve totally misunderstood the message ...Is in His Name.

 

[Waiting on him]

Someone of the spiritual stature of Saint John had no need of the physical visit of the Lord, he was always in His presence in spirit, even more so in the quietude of his prison cell. Also, the question he posed through his disciples was made on behalf of them, he had no doubts about Christ’s identity as some say. He wanted his disciples to stop following him and join Christ instead, he had to decrease as the scripture says, so he sent them to the Lord to be convinced. Also, the captivity that Christ set us free from is that of sin and death, so not freeing Saint John from prison – if that is what you were suggesting – was not contrary to Christ’s message. Many good things resulted from his death: it ‘forced’ his disciples to join Christ and he became a forerunner to those in Hades (1 Peter 3:19), not to mention the glory that dying for the word of God earned him. As a symbol of the Mosaic Law, he also ‘had*’ to die at the hands of the will of the flesh (Herod interpreted means ‘made of skin’), so that the new covenant of Grace could be introduced.

Because she had the key to the treasures of wisdom and knowledge (Psalms 25:9) and thus was able to recognize the Divinity of Christ. Something, which the Jews and especially the Pharisees despite their extensive book-learning lacked. Every time Jesus challenged their pride, they became enraged (the opposite of meekness) and wanted to kill Him (Luke 4:28). She on the other hand accepted His reproach with humility and acknowledge Him to be God by calling the heeling of her demon-possessed daughter a crumb, i.e. a trivial thing for God to do.

______
* To reflect the reality that none of us could keep it (Acts 15:10)

Later on in scripture these two are asking why Jesus and His disciples don't fast as they and the Pharisee s do?

 

[icxn]

A very interesting and thoughtful perspective. Thank you for that.

Give God the Glory, as Amadeus would say!

 

[VictoryinJesus]

he was always in His presence in spirit,

Agree that God did not fail to visit John the Baptist in prison, for the door was opened.

Because she had the key to the treasures of wisdom and knowledge

Thank you. Good encouragement in Psalm 25:8-9 Good and upright is the Lord : therefore will he teach sinners in the way. [9] The meek will he guide in judgment: and the meek will he teach his way.

 

[Waiting on him]

now I'm going to make a connection to Job which I see you are very interested in. listen, Job 1:1 "There was a man in the land of Uz, whose name was Job; and that man was perfect and upright, and one that feared God, and eschewed evil."
Job 1:2 "And there were born unto him seven sons and three daughters."
Job 1:3 "His substance also was seven thousand sheep, and three thousand camels, and five hundred yoke of oxen, and five hundred she asses, and a very great household; so that this man was the greatest of all the men of the east."

now look up the word men there and see what it means?......

and then a keyword, "hier".

PICJAG.

Strong's Concordance
ben: son
Original Word: בֵּן
Part of Speech: Noun Masculine
Transliteration: ben
Phonetic Spelling: (bane)
Definition: son

 

[Renniks]

John 3:13 KJV
And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.

How is that supposed to apply?

" As they were walking along and talking together, suddenly a chariot of fire and horses of fire appeared and separated the two of them, and Elijah went up to heaven in a whirlwind."
2 Kings 2:11
Oops.

 

[Renniks]

and the big one. He asked and received. The Spirit was sent. Ask anything in my name and The Father will do it. Asking for water for thirst and for your brothers is...unless I’ve totally misunderstood the message ...Is in His Name

Only he didn't receive. So there goes that. He was beyond redemption at this point.

 

[Waiting on him]

How is that supposed to apply?

" As they were walking along and talking together, suddenly a chariot of fire and horses of fire appeared and separated the two of them, and Elijah went up to heaven in a whirlwind."
2 Kings 2:11
Oops.

Matthew 11:14 KJV
And if ye will receive it, this is Elias, which was for to come.

 

[VictoryinJesus]

Well, we can’t Quote that right

I’m Confused there. What do you mean? Isaiah 53:4 Surely he hath borne our griefs, and carried our sorrows: yet we did esteem him stricken, smitten of God, and afflicted.

Isaiah 53:5 But he was wounded for our transgressions, he was bruised for our iniquities: the chastisement of our peace was upon him; and with his stripes we are healed.

Romans 8:3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:

John 8:23 And he said unto them, Ye are from beneath; I am from above: ye are of this world; I am not of this world.