Mary, Mother of the Lord Jesus Christ

[Josho]

Guys and girls please remember this is also a Bible study into the life of Mary. And try to be respectful to one another

 

[BreadOfLife]

But you're following the CATHOLIC Church, or BAPTIST Church, or METHODIST Church, etc., etc., etc. And they ALL teach FALSE DOCTRINES. -- Scripture is the ONLY source for TRUE Doctrines, and MOST are not following it.

Bobby Jo

Then YOU don't know your Bible - because Scripture itself says that you're wrong.
Time for another Bible lesson . . .

The FIRST rule of any Bible class is:
Christ didn't leave us with a Bible. He left us with a Church - and He gave that Church Supreme earthly Authority.
He guaranteed the leaders of that Church that the Holy Spirit would guide it to ALL truth.
He told them that WHATEVER they bound or loosed on earth would ALSO be bound and loosed in Heaven (Matt. 16:18-19, Matt. 18:15-18, John 20:21-23).

With this in mind, Paul, under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit, wrote to the Thessalonians:
2 Thess 2:15
"Stand firm and hold fast to the Traditions you were taught, whether by an ORAL STATEMENT or by a letter from us."

Here - the very Scriptures that YOU claim to be our "SOLE authority" put Sacred Tradition ON PAR with Scripture.

YOUR turn . . .

 

[BreadOfLife]

Guys and girls please remember this is also a Bible study into the life of Mary. And try to be respectful to one another

Point taken.
I would LOVE to discuss Mary - but the usual anti-Catholic cast of characters has cone out of the woodwork to hijack the thread again.

Soooooo - what do you say guys - how about keeping this about MARY??

 

[Philip James]

Guys and girls please remember this is also a Bible study into the life of Mary. And try to be respectful to one another

Ok. I have more for you. :)

Mary is 'the woman' of Gen 3:15 .
The same 'woman' of Rev 12..

Perhaps Jesus' recorded address to her of 'woman' means more than just a formal address...?

Peace!

 

[Bobby Jo]

...
Christ ... gave that Church Supreme earthly Authority. ...

Perfect. Then believe ALL the various denominations including your own. I hope they don't disappoint you as a thinking individual should anticipate.

We're done.
Bobby Jo

 

[BreadOfLife]

The Catholic doctrine claims that you can pray to the saints and Mary and they act as intercessors to God, my question is there any scriptures that support this?

Yes - glad you asked.

Revelation 5:8 shows the Elders in heaven bringing our prayers before God and Rev. 8:3-4 speaks of the Angels in heaven doing the same thing.
Under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit - James tells his readers to pray for each other and that the prayers of a RIGHTEOUS person are very powerful (James 5:16). Only those in Heaven are truly righteous because they have been made perfect in Christ (Rev. 21:27).

EVERY Protestant I've ever debated has told me that Mary cannot be sinless because of Romans 3:10, which says there is "NONE righteous."
Okay - so doesn't this lend credence to the fact that James is talking about those members of the Body of Christ Heaven praying for us?

 

[BreadOfLife]

Perfect. Then believe ALL the various denominations including your own. I hope they don't disappoint you as a thinking individual should anticipate.

We're done.
Bobby Jo

That's fine - but you're only "done" with me because you can't refute what I said.

EVERYTHING I told you was Scriptural truth - just like you asked.
Can you prove to me that Jesus didn't give His Church Supreme earthly Authority in those verses??

 

[Taken]

TRANSLATION:
"I won't give you any documented evidence because it doesn't exist."

Like I said before - that's what I thought.

Ummmmm, it's called :"deductive reasoning."
He made a claim and couldn't back it up. I naturally deduced that since he he couldn't - he had no proof.

Judging by his impotent response above - I see that I was right . . .

Dude you obviously are oblivious no one is impressed with you preaching your own self-righteousness.

 

[Taken]

Yes - glad you asked.

Revelation 5:8 shows the Elders in heaven bringing our prayers before God and Rev. 8:3-4 speaks of the Angels in heaven doing the same thing.
Under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit - James tells his readers to pray for each other and that the prayers of a RIGHTEOUS person are very powerful (James 5:16). Only those in Heaven are truly righteous because they have been made perfect in Christ (Rev. 21:27).

EVERY Protestant I've ever debated has told me that Mary cannot be sinless because of Romans 3:10, which says there is "NONE righteous."
Okay - so doesn't this lend credence to the fact that James is talking about those members of the Body of Christ Heaven praying for us?

Why not actually quote one scripture that says pray TO Saints?

 

[BreadOfLife]

You need to see it biblically rather than "the way you see it."
There is only one mediator, and it isn't Mary.
All believers are saints.
You should drop reading what father so and so says and read your Bible and stick with sound doctrine instead.

This argument is irrelevant.


Jesus is our only mediator because only HIS blood is the perfect sacrifice before the Father for our sins. HOWEVER - our intercession for one another is commanded in the Scriptures (1 Cor. 3:9, 1 Tim. 2:1-3, Eph 6:18, James 5:16, 1 John 5:16).

 

[BreadOfLife]

Dude you obviously are oblivious no one is impressed with you preaching your own self-righteousness.

Then people shouldn't make statements about Mary - or anybody else without documented evidence.

 

[Bobby Jo]

That's fine - but you're only "done" with me because you can't refute what I said. ...

Well let me give one final thought:

Proverbs 21:9 It is better to live in a corner of the housetop
than in a house shared with a contentious woman.​

... and YOU are a contentious man.
Bobby Jo

 

[BreadOfLife]

Why not actually quote one scripture that says pray TO Saints?

As soon as YOU can show me a verse that says Scripture is our "SOLE Authority."

I eagerly await your response . . .

 

[BreadOfLife]

Well let me give one final thought:

Proverbs 21:9 It is better to live in a corner of the housetop
than in a house shared with a contentious woman.​

... and YOU are a contentious man.
Bobby Jo

I see
So YOU see Scriptural truth as "contentiousness"??

Interesting . . .

 

[farouk]

Why not actually quote one scripture that says pray TO Saints?

...because there isn't one....

 

[Bobby Jo]

Guys and girls please remember this is also a Bible study into the life of Mary. And try to be respectful to one another

Pppppppppppppppppp.

"Bible Study" my foot. This is an exercise in futility for those who blindly defend their religious organization in spite of FALSE Doctrines.

NO ONE, repeat -- NO ONE, will change their mind upon "further study". And YOU are admonished for creating contention:

Titus 3:10 Reject a divisive man after the first and second admonition, 11 knowing that such a person is warped and sinning, being self-condemned.​

Bobby Jo

 

[Josho]

Ok. I have more for you. :)

Mary is 'the woman' of Gen 3:15 .
The same 'woman' of Rev 12..

Perhaps Jesus' recorded address to her of 'woman' means more than just a formal address...?

Peace!

Yep I mentioned Revelation 12 yesterday, I would like to discuss more about that one.

 

[Josho]

Yep I mentioned Revelation 12 yesterday, I would like to discuss more about that one.

@Philip James

I don't have too much time to talk about it now, but I believe the woman Revelation 12 is Mary. Here is the chapter.

Revelation 12
Now a great sign appeared in heaven: a woman clothed with the sun, with the moon under her feet, and on her head a garland of twelve stars. Then being with child, she cried out in labor and in pain to give birth. And another sign appeared in heaven: behold, a great, fiery red dragon having seven heads and ten horns, and seven diadems on his heads. His tail drew a third of the stars of heaven and threw them to the earth. And the dragon stood before the woman who was ready to give birth, to devour her Child as soon as it was born. She bore a male Child who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron. And her Child was caught up to God and His throne. Then the woman fled into the wilderness, where she has a place prepared by God, that they should feed her there one thousand two hundred and sixty days. And war broke out in heaven: Michael and his angels fought with the dragon; and the dragon and his angels fought, but they did not prevail, nor was a place found for them in heaven any longer. So the great dragon was cast out, that serpent of old, called the Devil and Satan, who deceives the whole world; he was cast to the earth, and his angels were cast out with him. Then I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, “Now salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of His Christ have come, for the accuser of our brethren, who accused them before our God day and night, has been cast down. And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb and by the word of their testimony, and they did not love their lives to the death. Therefore rejoice, O heavens, and you who dwell in them! Woe to the inhabitants of the earth and the sea! For the devil has come down to you, having great wrath, because he knows that he has a short time.” Now when the dragon saw that he had been cast to the earth, he persecuted the woman who gave birth to the male Child. But the woman was given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness to her place, where she is nourished for a time and times and half a time, from the presence of the serpent. So the serpent spewed water out of his mouth like a flood after the woman, that he might cause her to be carried away by the flood. But the earth helped the woman, and the earth opened its mouth and swallowed up the flood which the dragon had spewed out of his mouth. And the dragon was enraged with the woman, and he went to make war with the rest of her offspring, who keep the commandments of God and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

 

[BreadOfLife]

Pppppppppppppppppp.

"Bible Study" my foot. This is an exercise in futility for those who blindly defend their religious organization in spite of FALSE Doctrines.

NO ONE, repeat -- NO ONE, will change their mind upon "further study". And YOU are admonished for creating contention:

Titus 3:10 Reject a divisive man after the first and second admonition, 11 knowing that such a person is warped and sinning, being self-condemned.​

Bobby Jo

He simply brought up a subject to discuss.
The "contention" is ALL yours.

 

[BreadOfLife]

...because there isn't one....

Maybe YOU could help your friend find the verse that says Scripture is our "SOLE Authority".

You guys built an entire doctrine around it, so surely it must be there . . .