Hebrews 10:26-31

[Ferris Bueller]

Perhaps, what I said there was not clear to you. The result spoken of in verse 26, that “there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins” is not the result of the willful sinning, but the result of the sacrifice of Jesus Christ for sins, which had rendered the sacrifices for sins afforded under the Law or the old covenant to had been done away with and no longer of avail.

If we deliberately keep on sinning after we have received the knowledge of the truth, no sacrifice for sins is left, but only a fearful expectation of judgment and of raging fire that will consume the enemies of God.

How can you not see that the passage is saying in the absence of the sacrifice of Christ there is nothing left but the fearful expectation of God's judgment?

 

[HisLife]

See, the problem with Christians is they are so closed minded and dogmatic it makes them incapable of appreciating alternate views to scripture that they never thought of and, therefore, can not see, but which may very well be true.

Your last sentence sums you up very well I always see you mocking Christians and looking for alternate views to scripture, In looking for alternate views to scripture you are blinded to what scripture is actually saying, The Gospel is foolishness to them that perish, The Gospel says Jesus Died For your Sins, You say Not all Sins, So you have trampled The Blood Of Jesus As Not Effective to pay for all the sins of the world

What exactly is this perverted gospel that I preach?

You say That Jesus Didn't Die For All The Sins Of those that believe on Him, It's another Gospel Its Galatians 1:8

 

[Ferris Bueller]

The Gospel says Jesus Died For your Sins, You say Not all Sins, So you have trampled The Blood Of Jesus As Not Effective to pay for all the sins of the world

Matthew 12:31And so I tell you, every kind of sin and slander can be forgiven, but blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven.

 

[HisLife]

Matthew 12:31And so I tell you, every kind of sin and slander can be forgiven, but blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven.

Jesus Isn't Walking around in the Flesh performing miracles by the Holy Spirit, There is one Sin you Need to worry about in the New Testament

John16:7 Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you.

8 And when he is come, he will reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment:

9 Of sin, because they believe not on me

That's The Sin You will not be forgiven of, Because you didn't Believe in The only Sacrifice for your sins

 

[FHII]

It seems to me that up to now you carry on with the “willful sin” when there is none spoken nor conveyed in the topic verse Hebrews 10:26. What is there is not about a willful sin but about sinning willfully. If you will keep ignoring this point, hopes are low at arriving at the correct understanding of v.26


I already pointed out and shown you. I am afraid I don’t know how else I could help you see it. But I’ll give it one more try here.

The result spoken of in verse 26, that “there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins” is not of the willful sinning, much less of some willful sin, but of the once and for all sacrifice by Jesus Christs for sins. Willful sinning has nothing to do with the matter of sacrifices for sins. More so, some “willful sin” has nothing to do with the matter of sacrifices for sins.

Tong
R1416

I was hoping you would explain to me what is so "messy" about what I said. In fact, I was confident that would. You were very eager for me ro answer specific questions (though I believe I did), and thus, I figured you would get right to the point.

But you didn't. You never explained why failing to hold fast to our faith (which according to verse 25 includes not forsaking the assembling of ourselves) and the resultant penalty was so "messy".

Nonetheless, I will continue.

I will attend to new business first: The verse says, "For if we sin wilfully..." There is very little difference in "sin wilfully" and "wilfull sin", if any difference at all. To differentiate between the terms is knit picking.

Next, there is still that phrase, "For if" in the verse, which I have brought up in the majority of my posts, if not all of them. It absolutely joins the thoughts of verses 22-25 to that of 26 and beyond. While you were so steadfast for me to answer your questions, you have failed to address this point.

Next, I was tduly interested in hearing why you thought my theory was "messy" or at least was hoping you would define "messy". Pedhaps I could've tidied it up for you! However, with a lack of an explanation, I am forced to go with my intuition.

People don't like these verses (23-25) bwcause it tells them it comes down to holding fast to the faith, fellowshipping those of the faith and to assemble together. That scares them. But frankly, I don't know why.

Well the shocking part of this is the idea that of assembling... Yes, it includes going to Church but it doesn't say that. Frankly, I don't think people want to hear that they must go to Church... And for most Churches, I don't blame them!

However, it simply says not to forsake the assembling of yourselves. It doesn't say attend a Church service (though I do believe it is important, but that isn't my focus right now). I believe doing so is important today, but in the era it was written, it was vital. This was an infant era of Christianity where there was no KJV, NIV, DARBY or any lther formal Bible. It was a time where a big city may only have 12 other Christians. So you had to meet to get news from circular letters or direct letters from the Apostles and to get/give encouragement from others.

Things are different today, but that need is still present.

The bottom line is if you abandon faith (which does include fellowship and assembling, as I can show throughout the NT) then, yes... There is no more sacrifice for sins. Without faith there IS a fearful looking for of firery indignation and yes... When you abandon faith you have trampled under fokt the son of God and did all the other stuff.

Is that really in despute? I don't think it is! It just so happens that one of the things that faith requires is not forsaking the assembling of yourselves.

I want to bring up a similar verse. One that describes that if something is done, its final, condemning and impossible to reverse:

Hebrews 6:4-6 KJV
For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost, [5] And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come, [6] If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.

The wording is different between this passage and that of Hebrews 10:23-29, but the concept is the same. We must not fall away and forsake faith. We can slip, we can even doubt but we must not fall away. If we do so, there is no more sacrifice for sin and its impossible to be renewed.

I could give a bunch of other scriptures to back that up, but I will move on.

Tong has provided a rival theory to what he believes is better to than the messy situation of what I have said. His theory is that we can sin, but we just can't do it wilfully. I don't know, but I suppose be believes this is somehow less messy.

It's actually more messy.

Its no secret that people sin every day. But what isn't admitted is that they know they are sinning. Sinning isn't the problem, but knowing better and doing it anyway means nothing more can be done for you. That describes every person on earth! That's much more "messy"!

What I am saying is that if you come to faith, understand it and what is required of it and you walk away from it ir decide not to do it, then yea... Thats it! Hhat Tong is suggesting is that if you sin and know it is a sin and do it anyway, that's it.

Basically, I am saying be faithful and he is saying don't sin if you know it is sin. now you tell me which is more messy and hope I don't rattle off a bunch of Old Testament sins that will mean you can no longer do them!

 

[Tong2020]

If we deliberately keep on sinning after we have received the knowledge of the truth, no sacrifice for sins is left, but only a fearful expectation of judgment and of raging fire that will consume the enemies of God.

How can you not see that the passage is saying in the absence of the sacrifice of Christ there is nothing left but the fearful expectation of God's judgment?

Haven't you read the whole of my post?

"the point and message that the writer of Hebrews wanted for them to understand and realize at this point in Heb. 10:26, that there is no forgiveness of sin, except in Jesus Christ, the law even having been rendered of no avail."

I don't know about you if that does not tell you the same thing. If not, then yes, I agree that the passage says as you put it there.

But please explain, since you don't agree with take on this. What does the "deliberately keep on sinning" have to do with having no more sacrifice for sins left? How will the "deliberately keep on sinning" result to having no more sacrifice for sins left?

Tong
R1420

 

[Tong2020]

I was hoping you would explain to me what is so "messy" about what I said. In fact, I was confident that would. You were very eager for me ro answer specific questions (though I believe I did), and thus, I figured you would get right to the point.

But you didn't. You never explained why failing to hold fast to our faith (which according to verse 25 includes not forsaking the assembling of ourselves) and the resultant penalty was so "messy".

As I said, I already did. But you just can't see it now, because perhaps you don't find anything messy in the making of a verse (in this case Hebrews 10:26) to convey something that it does not. For me, when that happens, it makes of a mess. The verse speaks about willfully sinning and not about a willful sin. Mixing that up makes a mess of what verse 26 actually is meant to convey.

Nonetheless, I will continue.

I will attend to new business first: The verse says, "For if we sin wilfully..." There is very little difference in "sin wilfully" and "wilfull sin", if any difference at all. To differentiate between the terms is knit picking.

And there is where the problem lies in our conversation. If you don't see the difference as big, but as very little to none, and I see it as big, I don't think we will come to a common understanding. So we both are just wasting our time. Perhaps it is wise to just leave it at that.

Next, there is still that phrase, "For if" in the verse, which I have brought up in the majority of my posts, if not all of them. It absolutely joins the thoughts of verses 22-25 to that of 26 and beyond. While you were so steadfast for me to answer your questions, you have failed to address this point.

Perhaps you are not reading sir or you forgot? Go to post #124 where I said:

"There is no question that those you quoted are in scriptures and they are easy to understand even. The problem does not lie there but how you take those scriptures in relation to verse 26. Some had done the same as you do here and relates not only v.23-25 but also 22. It is not that you are not to relate them to v26, but that, in so doing you entirely missed the point of verse 26 and I would say made a mess of it, if not, add to it what it does not convey, which I have shown In my post."

"As I pointed out in my response above, it is not that they have nothing to do with v 23-25. They sure have, even the whole chapter or even the entirety of Hebrews."

Now it's just that, I could not relate them to verse 26 in the sense that you do in that, I don't see verse 26 as talking about sin but about sinning willfully. It's the willful sinning, not the sin that is in view. Besides, what is there to argue about with the "For if"?

Next, I was tduly interested in hearing why you thought my theory was "messy" or at least was hoping you would define "messy". Pedhaps I could've tidied it up for you! However, with a lack of an explanation, I am forced to go with my intuition.

People don't like these verses (23-25) bwcause it tells them it comes down to holding fast to the faith, fellowshipping those of the faith and to assemble together. That scares them. But frankly, I don't know why.

Well the shocking part of this is the idea that of assembling... Yes, it includes going to Church but it doesn't say that. Frankly, I don't think people want to hear that they must go to Church... And for most Churches, I don't blame them!

However, it simply says not to forsake the assembling of yourselves. It doesn't say attend a Church service (though I do believe it is important, but that isn't my focus right now). I believe doing so is important today, but in the era it was written, it was vital. This was an infant era of Christianity where there was no KJV, NIV, DARBY or any lther formal Bible. It was a time where a big city may only have 12 other Christians. So you had to meet to get news from circular letters or direct letters from the Apostles and to get/give encouragement from others.

Things are different today, but that need is still present.

The bottom line is if you abandon faith (which does include fellowship and assembling, as I can show throughout the NT) then, yes... There is no more sacrifice for sins. Without faith there IS a fearful looking for of firery indignation and yes... When you abandon faith you have trampled under fokt the son of God and did all the other stuff.

Is that really in despute? I don't think it is! It just so happens that one of the things that faith requires is not forsaking the assembling of yourselves.

I want to bring up a similar verse. One that describes that if something is done, its final, condemning and impossible to reverse:

Hebrews 6:4-6 KJV
For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost, [5] And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come, [6] If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.

The wording is different between this passage and that of Hebrews 10:23-29, but the concept is the same. We must not fall away and forsake faith. We can slip, we can even doubt but we must not fall away. If we do so, there is no more sacrifice for sin and its impossible to be renewed.

I could give a bunch of other scriptures to back that up, but I will move on.

Tong has provided a rival theory to what he believes is better to than the messy situation of what I have said. His theory is that we can sin, but we just can't do it wilfully. I don't know, but I suppose be believes this is somehow less messy.

It's actually more messy.

Its no secret that people sin every day. But what isn't admitted is that they know they are sinning. Sinning isn't the problem, but knowing better and doing it anyway means nothing more can be done for you. That describes every person on earth! That's much more "messy"!

What I am saying is that if you come to faith, understand it and what is required of it and you walk away from it ir decide not to do it, then yea... Thats it! Hhat Tong is suggesting is that if you sin and know it is a sin and do it anyway, that's it.

Basically, I am saying be faithful and he is saying don't sin if you know it is sin. now you tell me which is more messy and hope I don't rattle off a bunch of Old Testament sins that will mean you can no longer do them!

<<<Tong has provided a rival theory to what he believes is better to than the messy situation of what I have said. His theory is that we can sin, but we just can't do it wilfully. I don't know, but I suppose be believes this is somehow less messy.>>>

<<<Basically, I am saying be faithful and he is saying don't sin if you know it is sin.>>>

What are you now doing sir?

Those words comes from your mouth, not mine. Please show where you got all that. Where did I ever said or even hinted that we can sin, but we just can't do it wilfully? And that I am saying don't sin if you know it is sin? Appears to be a strawman there that you made up sir. It is a shame that you stoop down to that level. I'm sad about that. And I agree, that's messy.

Tong
R1421

 

[mjrhealth]

He didn't twist anything. He made his point right from plain scriptures. The verse that seems to really trip you up is the 1 John 3:9 verse. You avoid it like the plague.

Do you even understand what it means???

 

[Cooper]

Out of courtesy and respect to those who think you can lose your salvation, let's examine their argument and ask ourselves why John 5:24 has to mean you can not lose eternal life as you contend. Put your thinking cap on and honestly ask yourself if there is a way to understand eternal life in a way that allows it to be lost and yet it still be eternal life. There is. Can you think of that way? Probably not. But let me know.

I'm sure you think there is only one way to see John 5:24......your way.....the once saved always saved way. I will show you there is another way. A rational, legitimate way. But first take the time to think how it can still mean what it says but mean you can lose eternal life. I'm not going to take a doctrinal stance on it either way (like I say, it's a meaningless argument). Whether what you believe is right or wrong is not the point. I just want to demonstrate to you the narrow, closed off, limited thinking of your teaching.

Those who believe in the Lord Jesus Christ have everlasting life, but what happens to the lady the other week who told me she no longer believes?

 

[Tong2020]

@justbyfaith, @Blood Bought 1953, @brightfame52, @Ferris Bueller and those who are discussing the OSAS, losing salvation, etc.

I think everybody are in agreement that the believer in Christ and God, is saved by grace through faith.

Questions for all:

1) is it possible for a genuine born again Christian to genuinely reject the gospel?

2) is it possible for a genuine born again Christian to genuinely reject the gospel and then genuinely repent towards Christ again?

Tong
R1425

 

[CadyandZoe]

Can God give birth to something and not bring it to term?

 

[BloodBought 1953]

I sent this accidentally..... Maybe it was meant to be seen by somebody....one thing is for sure....it can’t hurt anything....



"Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the Gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand; by which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain. For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; and that He was buried, and that He rose again the third day according to the scriptures" (1st Corinthians 15:1-4).

It might seem almost a work of supererogation to answer a question like this. We hear the word, "Gospel" used so many times. People talk of this and of that as being "as true as the Gospel," and I often wonder what they really mean by it.

First I should like to indicate what it is not.

THE GOSPEL IS...
Not The Bible

In the first place, the Gospel is not the Bible. Often when I inquire, "What do you think the Gospel is?" people reply, "Why, it is the Bible, and the Bible is the Word of God." Undoubtedly the Bible is the Word of God, but there is a great deal in that Book that is not Gospel.

"The wicked shall be turned into Hell with all the nations that forget God." That is in the Bible, and it is terribly true; but it is not Gospel.

"It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God." That is in the Bible, but it is not the Gospel.

Our English word, "gospel" just means the "good spell," and the word "spell," is the old Anglo-Saxon word for, "tidings", the good tidings, the good news. The original word translated. "Gospel," which we have taken over into the English with little alteration is the word, "evangel," and it has the same meaning, the good news. The Gospel is God's good news for sinners. The Bible contains the Gospel, but there is a great deal in the Bible which is not Gospel.

Not The Commandments

The Gospel is not just any message from God telling man how he should behave. "What is the Gospel?" I asked a man this question some time ago, and he answered, "Why I should say it is the Ten Commandments and the Sermon on the Mount, and I think if a man lives up to them he is all right." Well, I fancy he would be; but did you ever know anybody who lived up to them? The Sermon on the Mount demands a righteousness which no unregenerate man has been able to produce. The law is not the Gospel; it is the very antitheses of the Gospel. In fact, the law was given by God to show men their need of the Gospel .

"The law," says the Apostle Paul, speaking as a Jewish convert, "was our schoolmaster to bring us to Christ. But after that Christ is come we are no longer under the schoolmaster."

Not Repentance

The Gospel is not a call to repentance, or to amendment of our ways, to make restitution for past sins, or to promise to do better in the future. These things are proper in their place, but they do not constitute the Gospel; for the Gospel is not good advice to be obeyed, it is good news to be believed. Do not make the mistake then of thinking that the Gospel is a call to duty or a call to reformation, a call to better your condition, to behave yourself in a more perfect way than you have been doing in the past.

Not Giving Up The World

Nor is the Gospel a demand that you give up the world, that you give up your sins, that you break off bad habits, and try to cultivate good ones. You may do all these things, and yet never believe the Gospel and consequently never be saved at all.

THERE ARE SEVEN DESIGNATIONS OF THE GOSPEL in the New Testament, but over and above all these, let me draw your attention to the fact that when this blessed message is mentioned, it is invariably accompanied by the definite article. Over and over and over again in the New Testament we read of the Gospel. It is the Gospel not a Gospel. People tell us there are a great many different Gospels; but there is only ONE. When certain teachers came to the Galatians and tried to turn them away from the simplicity that was in Christ Jesus by teaching "another Gospel, "the apostle said that it was a different gospel, but not another; for there is none other than the Gospel. It is downright exclusive; it is God's revelation to sinful man.

Not Comparative Religion

The scholars of this world talk of the Science of Comparative Religions, and it is very popular now-a-days to say, "We cannot any longer go to heathen nations and preach to them as in the days gone by, because we are learning that their religions are just as good as ours, and the thing to do now is to share with them, to study the different religions, take the good out of them all, and in this way lead the world into a sense of brotherhood and unity."

So in our great universities and colleges men study this Science of Comparative Religions, and they compare all these different religious systems one with another. There is a Science of Comparative Religions, but the Gospel is not one of them. All the different religions in the world may well be studied comparatively, for at rock bottom they are all alike; they all set men at trying to earn his own salvation. They may be called by different names, and the things that men are called to do maybe different in each case, but they all set men trying to save their own souls and earn their way into the favor of God. In this they stand in vivid contrast with the Gospel, for the Gospel is that glorious message that tells us what God has done for us in order that guilty sinners maybe saved.

 

[BloodBought 1953]

Andrew Farley won't teach you this truth. You need to read the Bible for yourself and stop listening to these uneducated, ear tickling, million-dollar ministry teachers


Not that I owe “ you” any kind of explanation , but so an on- looking world might know the Truth.....I have read the Bible through many times.....some Books Of the Bible I have read 50 times probably....Farley is about one of twenty Teachers I listen to.... I don’t agree with any of them 100%..... not even Farley.....
You see— thank God— I am not Arrogant like you....I know and understand the Bible quite well, but I am smart enough and humble enough to know and admit that there are MANY God-Chosen Teachers out there that are smarter than you and I .....know the Bible better than you and I.....and God says that He has sent certain Teachers to help us in our understanding of God’s Ways......
If you are too Proud and Stiff- Necked to take advantage of Gifted Teachers That God has sent our way —- it’s YOUR loss, not mine...
In your Pride and Arrogance, you think you are in no need of being taught by somebody that just might be a little wiser than you in the Ways Of God.....Yep , you rely solely upon yourself—- and Boy, does it show!

 

[Ferris Bueller]

But please explain, since you don't agree with take on this. What does the "deliberately keep on sinning" have to do with having no more sacrifice for sins left? How will the "deliberately keep on sinning" result to having no more sacrifice for sins left?

It says it right there. Deliberately sinning is turning your back on the sacrifice of Christ. When a person does that the only thing left to look forward to is the fire of God's Judgment because you can't have the protection of a sacrifice that you have rejected.

 

[Heart2Soul]

Andrew Farley won't teach you this truth. You need to read the Bible for yourself and stop listening to these uneducated, ear tickling, million-dollar ministry teachers


Not that I owe “ you” any kind of explanation , but so an on- looking world might know the Truth.....I have read the Bible through many times.....some Books Of the Bible I have read 50 times probably....Farley is about one of twenty Teachers I listen to.... I don’t agree with any of them 100%..... not even Farley.....
You see— thank God— I am not Arrogant like you....I know and understand the Bible quite well, but I am smart enough and humble enough to know and admit that there are MANY God-Chosen Teachers out there that are smarter than you and I .....know the Bible better than you and I.....and God says that He has sent certain Teachers to help us in our understanding of God’s Ways......
If you are too Proud and Stiff- Necked to take advantage of Gifted Teachers That God has sent our way —- it’s YOUR loss, not mine...
In your Pride and Arrogance, you think you are in no need of being taught by somebody that just might be a little wiser than you in the Ways Of God.....Yep , you rely solely upon yourself—- and Boy, does it show!

Is this the best you can do in responding to another child of God who is seeking truth?
The Bible says to teach with humility remembering you were at one time unskilled in the knowledge of His Word.

 

[BloodBought 1953]

unbelievers do not get to inherit the kingdom.

I could not agree more! If a man lives an entire life without becoming a Believer in Jesus Christ and dies never having becoming a Believer —— HE IS LOST! I never heard or taught otherwise....
I “ DO” believe that a Saved Believer can Fall into Error and even lose his Faith. I think before that man dies, there is a very good chance that God will “ bring him back to his senses” , In the manner of the Prodigal Son finally “ coming to HIS senses....”
Even if a man does NOT get turned around , I think God will exercise His option to kill this man and bring him “ Home” years earlier than would have been the case, had he kept his Faith
I can understand the viewpoint of the other side on this matter.....Heck, I used to “agree” with it.....But I have since learned that even if we foolishly choose to “Let Go” Of the Grip Of God—— He ain’t gonna “ let go” of us. “ NO ONE can pluck us from God’s Hand”......that “ NO ONE include even ourselves !
The Words, “ No One” are absolute ! There can be NO exceptions . The Bible does NOT say, “ no one but the Believer Himself “ and neither should we.
The Bible also says that if WE are UNFAITHFUL —- HE “ REMAINS” Faithful.....God can NOT go back on His Word !
I firmly believe that “ Amazing” Grace is , indeed , AMAZING! If you disagree, that suits me fine.....I understand how one might disagree....Nobody's Salvation depends upon what they think about this issue.....God bless ...

 

[BloodBought 1953]

You make your calling and election sure by DOING SOMETHING.

Religion says “ Do” ......Christians says “ Done”

God will not save anybody “Working” for their Salvation— or as you so subtly put it, “Doing Something” for your Salvation.....He WILL Save all of those who are “ TRUSTING” for their Salvation....
Newbies.....please ask God to show you what HE Truly wants from you in order to Save your Soul.....You MUST do His Will! What would that “ Will “ be? The Disciples asked that SAME question .....Jesus had a Golden opportunity to say “ Do do this , or Don’t do that—- at LEAST “ DO SOMETHING!” ( as the self-taught, Mr. Bueller maintains)
Of course , most Baby Christians know what Jesus Said.....Legalists seem to ignore it.....Jesus said That the WILL Of The Father was to , “ BELIEVE on the ONE that He sent.” THAT Plus NOTHING got a certain Thief on a Cross Saved ....it will also get YOU Saved.....Faith in the Shed Blood Of Jesus Plus NOTHING for your Salvation .....we are called upon to “ DO” Many things AFTER we are Saved ( mainly to love others and help carry their Burdens) ....these Additions do not GET us Saved ....they do not KEEP us Saved and they do not PROVE that we are Saved.....
Wanna PROVE that you are Saved? Jesus said that if you will simply “ Acknowledge “ ME” Before Men — I will Acknowledge “ YOU” before My Father” ......see how simple that is? Simply Believe. Don’t confuse Salvation with Discipleship or Sanctification .
If you are blessed enough by God to be a Believer you have the Holy Spirit within you .... let that Spirit hang around long enough by continuing Your Walk Of Faith the SAME WAY that you Started it ——- FAITH PLUS NOTHING — and NOT by trying to be a “good little boy” -and it’s a good bet that Good Stuff will flow out if you—- Naturally. That means stop worrying about it. Just do YOUR Part, which is to Believe , and then God will be free to do HIS Part, which is to “work in and through you” to accomplish those things that he desires . You will “ Find Yourself” Doing Things That please God , Without “ Doing Something”...... most generally just “ Dead Works”
Modern- Day Judaizers , Legalists and Tate’s don’t “ GET” that . They never will. Don’t be like them .Try to actually Trust God......

 

[BloodBought 1953]

Out of courtesy and respect to those who think you can lose your salvation, let's examine their argument and ask ourselves why John 5:24 has to mean you can not lose eternal life as you contend. Put your thinking cap on and honestly ask yourself if there is a way to understand eternal life in a way that allows it to be lost and yet it still be eternal life. There is. Can you think of that way? Probably not. But let me know.

I'm sure you think there is only one way to see John 5:24......your way.....the once saved always saved way. I will show you there is another way. A rational, legitimate way. But first take the time to think how it can still mean what it says but mean you can lose eternal life. I'm not going to take a doctrinal stance on it either way (like I say, it's a meaningless argument). Whether what you believe is right or wrong is not the point. I just want to demonstrate to you the narrow, closed off, limited thinking of your teaching.

Yawn....

 

[BloodBought 1953]

Good start. It's clear that the promise is for those who are believing, not for those who don't believe, or who no longer believe. But he's going to say the person being spoken about in John 5:24 is in fact a true believer who does in fact have eternal life. What would you say to him in response? Can the verse ONLY be understood to mean the person who has eternal life can not lose that eternal life? Or is it possible that it can also mean a person can have eternal life and be able to lose that eternal life without stripping 'eternal life' of it's eternal quality?

Wow ......that was about clear as mud....such convolution over what God has made so simple....John 3:16 for example. Simply “ Believe” in Jesus , which means to COMPLETELY put Every Aspect of your Salvation in HIS hands — NOT YOURS—- and your will receive Eternal Life
One must Believe the Gospel Of 1Cor15:1-4 this side of the Cross in order to be Saved...It has Two Parts. That FIRST Part? That “ Jesus died for your Sins” part ? You and your weak, confused ilk do not actually Believe that part of the Gospel.Thats why you dont understand Grace, btw. You can’t understand something that has never been extended to you . And Grace is what Saves a Person...it’s seldom mentioned in your posts and when it is —- you fail to understand it .You try to “ DO SOMETHING “ , as you previously stated, to Merit it.The Utter Absurdity Of your “ Doctrine”——- trying to Merit a thing that “ Merit” destroys..... I hope Newbies don’t Fall for your “ Works” for Salvation Baloney ....no matter how well you subtly disguise it .....Satan used subtlety in The Garden....he still uses it today ....and why not ? It Still Works . On Some . Not me.

 

[BloodBought 1953]

I'm not taking a postion either way about it. I just want to show that, right or wrong, there is a legitimate way that 'eternal life' in John 5:24 is very much eternal and everlasting, yet can be lost. See, the problem with Christians is they are so closed minded and dogmatic it makes them incapable of appreciating alternate views to scripture that they never thought of and, therefore, can not see, but which may very well be true.

See, the problem with Christians is they are so closed minded and dogmatic it makes them incapable of appreciating alternate views to scripture that they never thought of and, therefore, can not see, but which may very well be true.

Lol....you GOT to be kidding ! Right? YOU Hypocrite! YOU are the One that criticizes ME for trying to glean Wisdom from God- Sent Teachers and NOW you accuse people of being “ Incapable Of appreciating alternate views.” This place does not need me nor others to destroy your Confused Pablum—- you are like “ justbyfaithplusluckyrepentance” —- you Trip your own selves up and don’t even realize it....lol....keep it up! I can go take a well-warned break!