Kermos
Well-Known Member
You are basing a doctrine on a few verses that could perhaps be taken in a Trinitarian way. But, they don't come out and say outright that Jesus is God, whereas I've shown a half dozen verses that specifically say he was a man (Acts 2:22 et. al.), whereas God is NOT a man (Hos 11:9, et. al.). I've also shown where Jesus had a God and a Father, the same as ours to be specific. I've shown where God knew things Jesus didn't know. I've shown that God and Jesus had two different wills. I've shown that Jesus was tempted, whereas God can not be tempted. I showed that Jesus increased in wisdom. I've shown that God is the head of Christ (aren't they supposed to be equal?). I've shown that Jesus will be subject to, or under, God. I've shown that God granted Jesus certain powers and privileges. I've shown where Jesus was made lower than the angels (Heb 2:9). I've shown that Jesus did not preach his own doctrine, but that of the Father.
But that's not all; you'd also have to explain why God talks and prayers to Himself so often. You'd also have to explain how a descendant (seed) of men (Abraham, Jacob, Isaac, David) could be God. All of these clear verses would have to be made to fit with the "I AM" argument, or the "I AM" could be made to fit with the many clear verses. We certainly can't throw any of them away.
I might suggest you look at other usages of "ego eimi." A blind man used the same phrase. Is the blind man therefore also God? There are many other usages of "ego eimi." Be careful about jumping to conclusions just because Jesus said he was before Abraham. We were also chosen before Abraham (Eph 1:4). Could it be that, as I've said many times, the logos of John 1:1 was a plan God had in His mind from the beginning? Part of that plan was of course Jesus Christ, but it also includes us. We, like Jesus, were certainly in God's mind, but none of us existed until we were born, including Jesus. There are plenty of verses that say Jesus was born.
So, the sayings of Jesus Christ are insufficient for you, Rich R. A believer in Jesus the Lord doesn't reject Jesus' sayings such as Jesus Christ saying "Truly, truly, I say to you, before Abraham was born, I AM" (John 8:58), so according to the Christ, Lord Jesus existed in eternity past which means He is uncreated thus He proclaims that He is YHWH God for there is NO other that exists in eternity past (Isaiah 45:5).
The Apostle Paul calls Jesus "the great God" (τοῦ μεγάλου Θεοῦ) with "looking for the blessed hope and the appearing of the glory of our great God and Savior, Christ Jesus" (Titus 2:13).
The Apostle Peter calls Jesus "the God" (τοῦ Θεοῦ) with "Simon Peter, a bond-servant and apostle of Jesus Christ, To those who have received a faith of the same kind as ours, by the righteousness of our God and Savior, Jesus Christ" (2 Peter 1:1).
The Apostle Thomas calls Jesus "my God" wirh "My Lord and my God" (John 20:28).
The Apostle John calls Jesus "the Word" and "God" with "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God" (John 1:1).
You, Rich R, are a dangerously unreliable source!
Immanuel (Matthew 1:23 "God with us"), Jesus, is truly Almighty God, YHWH, with us (Revelation 1:8).