A serious questions for the Jehovah's Witnesses on these threads.

[Ronald Nolette]

No one said we were. That is your perception and it is in error.

You are cherry picking again.....trying to fit your beliefs into scripture.

James 2:13-14; 17-26....
"For the one who does not practice mercy will have his judgment without mercy. Mercy triumphs over judgment.
14 Of what benefit is it, my brothers, if someone says he has faith but he does not have works? That faith cannot save him, can it?. . . . .
So, too, faith by itself, without works, is dead.
18 Nevertheless, someone will say: “You have faith, and I have works. Show me your faith without the works, and I will show you my faith by my works.” 19 You believe that there is one God, do you? You are doing quite well. And yet the demons believe and shudder. 20 But do you care to know, O empty man, that faith without works is useless? 21 Was not Abraham our father declared righteous by works after he offered up Isaac his son on the altar? 22 You see that his faith was active along with his works and his faith was perfected by his works, 23 and the scripture was fulfilled that says: “Abraham put faith in Jehovah, and it was counted to him as righteousness,” and he came to be called Jehovah’s friend.

24 You see that a man is to be declared righteous by works and not by faith alone. 25 In the same manner, was not Raʹhab the prostitute also declared righteous by works after she received the messengers hospitably and sent them out by another way? 26 Indeed, just as the body without spirit is dead, so also faith without works is dead."

Did James contradict Paul or are they on the same page? We need BOTH.....no one is saved by either one on their own merits. You can't have one without the other. We show BY our works that we are genuine Christians.
In the final judgment on this world, it is those found "DOING" the will of God who will be saved. (Matthew 7:21-23) The word in Greek is "poieō" and it involves action.

Once again, you r lack of misunderstanding the Scriptures is breath taking!

Faith without works is useless. But works do not save a person. works are the result of one being given a new nature and is a new creature in christ! those who live in their flesh cannot please God! The Wathctower lies saying only 144,000 can be born again, Jesus says YOU must!

 

[Aunty Jane]

In light of Thomas touching the wounds of Christ, I can’t imagine how JW maintain Jesus was not resurrected bodily.

It doesn’t require imagination at all......spirit beings are invisible like Jehovah is....they inhabit a non material world, to which we are given only glimpses through portals with the visions of the prophets. Spirit beings can materialise, as angels have done in Bible times. The three who visited Abraham at Mamre were in human form....these were to all appearances, human.....eating and drinking what Abraham and later Lot provided for them. They physically escorted a reluctant Lot out of Sodom before they brought the city to ruin.

Gabriel was also in human form when he visited Daniel, and some 500 years later when he visited Mary.

Jesus was raised as a spirit, not in a fleshly body, but he had the ability to materialise any body that he wished after his resurrection. He stayed on earth for 40 days to strengthen his disciples. There is no evidence that he stayed with any of them during that time, despite the fact that he had been their constant companion and teacher for three and a half years. The Bible states that he “appeared” to them and on occasion he “disappeared” right before their eyes.

It is also important to note that the Jews were forbidden to communicate with spirits because of the deceptiveness of the demons. All forms of spiritism were banned in Israel, so to remain in spirit form whist communicating with his disciples would have been against Jehovah’s law.

Materialising a body with wounds to convince a doubting Thomas was a concession to help him to believe that Jesus was indeed raised from the dead. Can we imagine that God would raise his son with a badly beaten and battered body? No! That body was offered as a sacrifice so he would not have taken it back.

At that time the apostles did not expect Jesus’ resurrection to be in a spiritual body. This is why he told his disciples to stay in Jerusalem to await the outpouring of the holy spirit because only then would all be revealed to them about the spiritual nature of his, and their own resurrection and destiny.

Christ was raised in the same kind of body that his elect will have when they are all resurrected.....and ready to bring the blessings of God’s Kingdom to redeemed mankind, fulfilling Revelation 21:1-5....

 

[Keiw]

So says you- God says different! Jesus raised His body from the grave and ascended to heaven in that body now glorified which will happen to all who believe in His death and physical resurrection for sin!

Until you accept that truth- y0u have no part in the kingdom of God, no matter how religious you are with the Watchtower.

John 2:19-24​

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King James Version​

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19 Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.
20 Then said the Jews, Forty and six years was this temple in building, and wilt thou rear it up in three days?
22 BUT HE SPAKE OF THE TEMPLE OF HIS BODY.
22 When therefore he was risen from the dead, his disciples remembered that he had said this unto them; and they believed the scripture, and the word which Jesus had said.

Until you can accept that- Gods wrath remains upon you --John3:36.

Sadly you will find out the opposite.

 

[Keiw]

Once again, you r lack of misunderstanding the Scriptures is breath taking!

Faith without works is useless. But works do not save a person. works are the result of one being given a new nature and is a new creature in christ! those who live in their flesh cannot please God! The Wathctower lies saying only 144,000 can be born again, Jesus says YOU must!

Some of the NT is to the little flock only. Like at the Lords supper, only members of the little flock were present and Jesus made that covenant with them. 1Cor 11:27--some are unworthy to eat and drink of the last supper.

 

[Aunty Jane]

Until you can accept that- Gods wrath remains upon you --John3:36.

Be careful....with the judgment that you give to others, you yourself will be judged....remember?
No one appointed you as judge of anyone unless your name is Jesus Christ......perhaps you think it is?

Read the whole passage....preferably in modern English....
John 3:25-36....
“Now a discussion arose between some of John's disciples and a Jew over purification. And they came to John and said to him, “Rabbi, he who was with you across the Jordan, to whom you bore witness—look, he is baptizing, and all are going to him.” John answered, “A person cannot receive even one thing unless it is given him from heaven. You yourselves bear me witness, that I said, ‘I am not the Christ, but I have been sent before him.’ The one who has the bride is the bridegroom. The friend of the bridegroom, who stands and hears him, rejoices greatly at the bridegroom's voice. Therefore this joy of mine is now complete. He must increase, but I must decrease.” He who comes from above is above all. He who is of the earth belongs to the earth and speaks in an earthly way. He who comes from heaven is above all. He bears witness to what he has seen and heard, yet no one receives his testimony. Whoever receives his testimony sets his seal to this, that God is true. For he whom God has sent utters the words of God, for he gives the Spirit without measure. The Father loves the Son and has given all things into his hand. Whoever believes in the Son has eternal life; whoever does not obey the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God remains on him.” (ESV)

We see the setting and can understand John’s words at the end.....the ones you are so fond of quoting out of context. “Believing” in the son of God doesn’t have the narrow meaning that you want to give it. It requires “obedience” to all of Christ’s teachings (not just the convenient ones). Those who disobey the son, disobey his Father, who assigned him his earthly mission. The Father “sent” his son and declares his love for him...he has “given all things into his hand”.....he has “given him authority over all things in heaven and on earth” (Matthew 28:18)

We have two separate beings here, and one is clearly superior to the other because if they were equals, none of what God gives his son would have been necessary....he would already possess all things and have all authority.

It is your own spiritual blindness that astounds me even in the face of the scriptures presented to you.....you cannot or will not admit that there are gigantic holes in your cherished belief system. But that is entirely your problem.....all will be revealed in its due time.
We will wait and see what Jesus has to say then....shall we?

 

[Aunty Jane]

Some of the NT is to the little flock only. Like at the Lords supper, only members of the little flock were present and Jesus made that covenant with them.

There is no discernment between those with “the heavenly calling” and those who are not called to this station. (Hebrews 3:1)

1 Corinthians 1:2...KJV Paul wrote....
“2 Unto the church of God which is at Corinth, to them that are sanctified in Christ Jesus, called to be saints, with all that in every place call upon the name of Jesus Christ our Lord, both theirs and ours”.

There are those “called to be saints WITH all those who call upon the name of Jesus Christ, BOTH THEIR LORD AND OURS”
There are those called to be saints and those who are not, all are serving the same Lord Jesus Christ.
The fact that they all want to go to heaven means that they have not read the Bible at all and fail to understand what the calling and choosing of the “saints” is really all about. Not all Christians are going to heaven and they cannot accept this.

 

[Dropship]

If Satan had a bucket list it'd go something like this-
Make people refuse to celebrate Jesus's birth. (christmas)
Make people refuse to celebrate his resurrection. (easter)
Make people avoid the christian cross.
Make people dislike churches.
Make people prefer to die rather than have transfusions.

 

[Aunty Jane]

If Satan had a bucket list it'd go something like this-
Make people refuse to celebrate Jesus's birth. (christmas)
Make people refuse to celebrate his resurrection. (easter)
Make people avoid the christian cross.
Make people dislike churches.
Make people prefer to die rather than have transfusions.
View attachment 27478

If you think satan looks like that then I can understand why your list would read that way...that is way off base.

My list would read something like...he would....
Make people celebrate Jesus's birth, even though it’s not the right date, and Christmas is based on a pagan festival in honour of a false god. The fact that Jesus would not have celebrated his own birthday seems lost on those determined to do things their way. (2 Cor 6:14-18)

Make people celebrate his resurrection even though we are told only to commemorate Christ’s death and Easter is not even mentioned in the Bible because it’s the name of a pagan fertility goddess whose emblems were rabbits and eggs.

Make people venerate the cross because it was an ancient symbol of the God Tammuz who was worshiped by the apostate Israelites. It’s an ancient religious symbol that has nothing to do with Jesus Christ. No one knows what configuration the torture stake (stauros) was and we are forbidden to make images of anything to use in our worship. (Exodus 20:4-6)

Make people think that churches are buildings instead of congregations of genuine Christians who actually practice their Christianity 24/7....not just in a building once a week. All had to be in agreement. (1 Cor 1:10)

Make people think that they will die if they don’t have blood transfusions. Taking blood into the body is against God’s law and modern medicine has discovered that blood transfusions are not only unnecessary, but actually dangerous. Whole hospitals are now dedicated to non-blood management of their patients.

You really should do some serious research on these topics....

 

[Keiw]

There is no discernment between those with “the heavenly calling” and those who are not called to this station. (Hebrews 3:1)

1 Corinthians 1:2...KJV Paul wrote....
“2 Unto the church of God which is at Corinth, to them that are sanctified in Christ Jesus, called to be saints, with all that in every place call upon the name of Jesus Christ our Lord, both theirs and ours”.

There are those “called to be saints WITH all those who call upon the name of Jesus Christ, BOTH THEIR LORD AND OURS”
There are those called to be saints and those who are not, all are serving the same Lord Jesus Christ.
The fact that they all want to go to heaven means that they have not read the Bible at all and fail to understand what the calling and choosing of the “saints” is really all about. Not all Christians are going to heaven and they cannot accept this.

Much of the bible cannot be understood unless one is taught by the teachers Jesus appointed. 41,000 religions, they think, claiming to be christian. Jesus started 1. 1Cor 1:10 shows-no division, unity of thought--- that means all of Gods 1 truth=1 religion has Jesus. He said they would be hated because the world hated him first-they murdered him.

 

[Keiw]

If Satan had a bucket list it'd go something like this-
Make people refuse to celebrate Jesus's birth. (christmas)
Make people refuse to celebrate his resurrection. (easter)
Make people avoid the christian cross.
Make people dislike churches.
Make people prefer to die rather than have transfusions.
View attachment 27478

truth is just the opposite. See how the god of this system of things has the world blinded-2Cor 4:4-- The Lords evening meal is what Jesus asked to be remembered--Only the anointed members of the little flock were present at the last supper. A covenant made by Jesus to them alone.

 

[Wrangler]

My list would read something like...he would....
Make people celebrate Jesus's birth, even though it’s not the right date, and Christmas is based on a pagan festival in honour of a false god.

Of all the absurd religious objections, this stands as the most absurd! Opposing honoring Christ via celebrating his birthday makes no sense whatsoever.

Wrong date? So what? The precise date matters not.

Based on pre-existing festival? Part of time honored cultural appropriation. Non-Irish people celebrate St Patrick’s Day. Black people play basketball, football and baseball even though invented by White People.

In our culture, we honor people by celebrating the anniversary of their birth. Kind of weird to not honor the savior of the world this way. Not part of Jewish culture? Don’t care.

 

[Keiw]

Of all the absurd religious objections, this stands as the most absurd! Opposing honoring Christ via celebrating his birthday makes no sense whatsoever.

Wrong date? So what? The precise date matters not.

Based on pre-existing festival? Part of time honored cultural appropriation. Non-Irish people celebrate St Patrick’s Day. Black people play basketball, football and baseball even though invented by White People.

In our culture, we honor people by celebrating the anniversary of their birth. Kind of weird to not honor the savior of the world this way. Not part of Jewish culture? Don’t care.

Who deserves the celebration? The creator or created?

 

[Wrangler]

Who deserves the celebration? The creator or created?

Both. All glory to God but honor is due many. See honor your mother and father. See debate on obeisance v worship.

 

[Keiw]

Both. All glory to God but honor is due many. See honor your mother and father. See debate on obeisance v worship.

The eternal one=YHWH(Jehovah)

 

[Aunty Jane]

Of all the absurd religious objections, this stands as the most absurd! Opposing honoring Christ via celebrating his birthday makes no sense whatsoever.

Wrong date? So what? The precise date matters not.

Based on pre-existing festival? Part of time honored cultural appropriation. Non-Irish people celebrate St Patrick’s Day. Black people play basketball, football and baseball even though invented by White People.

In our culture, we honor people by celebrating the anniversary of their birth. Kind of weird to not honor the savior of the world this way. Not part of Jewish culture? Don’t care.

Justification always makes me smile......Does God observe anyone's "time honored cultural appropriation" when it is in opposition to his word? Who said it was OK to mimic the pagans? Not God. (2 Cor 6:14-18)
There are only two birthdays mentioned in the Bible....Pharaoh's and Herod's. Someone lost their life at both of them at the whim of the pagan ruler.

The date of Jesus birth is not recorded in the Bible because birthdays were a pagan practice and God's people were told NOT to imitate them in any way, especially those steeped in spiritism. (Deut 18:9-12)

Birthdays were used to produce horoscopes and to divine the child's future according to their star sign. Astrology and divining the future was forbidden to God's people. The other customs remain the same as they were in ancient pagan practice.
If you think God approves of those things now, when he clearly didn't back in Bible times, then perhaps I need to introduce you to the God of the Bible rather than the god of 'appropriated culture'.....? My God does not change because the devil's tactics don't change.....does yours?

 

[Wrangler]

Justification always makes me smile......Does God observe anyone's "time honored cultural appropriation" when it is in opposition to his word?

Glad to make you smile. The idea that celebrating birthdays goes against God’s word ought to be a justification that makes you smile big time. What year is it, sweetie?

 

[Dropship]

..Christmas is based on a pagan festival....Easter is not even mentioned in the Bible because it’s the name of a pagan fertility goddess whose emblems were rabbits and eggs.
..the cross..It’s an ancient religious symbol that has nothing to do with Jesus Christ
..modern medicine has discovered that blood transfusions are not only unnecessary, but actually dangerous.

1- Christianity took over Christmas and Easter, thereby stamping out any silly pagan beliefs..
2- "The message of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God" (1 Cor 1:18)
3- Why are blood banks crying out for donors if there's an alternative to blood?

 

[Dropship]

Another thing- why do JW's call God 'Jehovah'?
Trying to 'humanise' him by slapping a name on him is surely a bit disrespectful and reduces him to the ranks of other named "gods" like this egyptian freak show?-



When Moses asked his name God replied "I am that I am"; in other words he's too majestic and awesome to have a name..

 

[RLT63]

Justification always makes me smile......Does God observe anyone's "time honored cultural appropriation" when it is in opposition to his word? Who said it was OK to mimic the pagans? Not God. (2 Cor 6:14-18)
There are only two birthdays mentioned in the Bible....Pharaoh's and Herod's. Someone lost their life at both of them at the whim of the pagan ruler.

The date of Jesus birth is not recorded in the Bible because birthdays were a pagan practice and God's people were told NOT to imitate them in any way, especially those steeped in spiritism. (Deut 18:9-12)

Birthdays were used to produce horoscopes and to divine the child's future according to their star sign. Astrology and divining the future was forbidden to God's people. The other customs remain the same as they were in ancient pagan practice.
If you think God approves of those things now, when he clearly didn't back in Bible times, then perhaps I need to introduce you to the God of the Bible rather than the god of 'appropriated culture'.....? My God does not change because the devil's tactics don't change.....does yours?

Then you should have no idea how old you are.

 

[Wrangler]

When Moses asked his name God replied "I am that I am"; in other words he's too majestic and awesome to have a name..

Yet, in the very next verse God said his name was YHWH, to be remembered for all generations.

God did not say his name was "I am that I am", only a unique attribute - eternally existing. The same cannot be said of sons, who by definition come after and are created by their fathers.