about Suicide

[gpresdo]

Yes we do need to repent.
But God is also a just God.


Ok, so the guy who accepted Jesus Christ, and committed a sin, and gets killed in a car accident 5 minutes later will go to hell?

That means we all go to hell, because we are all sinners.
Or are you the kind of guy repenting 24 hours/day?

Now u are questioning God as unfair.
Let's let Him handle it...as with the death bed repentance.........and without baptism.

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

Let's let Him handle it...as with the death bed repentance.........and without baptism.

Jesus accepted the thief on the Cross who was not baptized... so if one gets saved on their death bed and has no opportunity to get baptized, the Lord will accept them.

Thiis an extreme circumstance and not something thsat should be taught as doctrine because we need to get baptized out of obedience to the Word of the Lord that teaches us to get baptized.

 

[Triumph1300]

Now u are questioning God as unfair.

Not at all.
Exactly the opposite.

 

[gpresdo]

Jesus accepted the thief on the Cross who was not baptized... so if one gets saved on their death bed and has no opportunity to get baptized, the Lord will accept them.

Thiis an extreme circumstance and not something thsat should be taught as doctrine because we need to get baptized out of obedience to the Word of the Lord that teaches us to get baptized.

Not true. Baptism is required and Christ may have extended special dispensation to the Thief........although He could have already been baptized......
Why do you say that?....when you know you have no scripture to back it up? This is what gives Christianity a bad name to the new believing Christian.....and cause them to doubt the entire Bible.

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

Not true. Baptism is required and Christ may have extended special dispensation to the Thief........although He could have already been baptized......
Why do you say that?....when you know you have no scripture to back it up? This is what gives Christianity a bad name to the new believing Christian.....and cause them to doubt the entire Bible.

You deny the Words of the Lord Jesus when He told the thief that he would be with Him in paradise?

It's pure speculation to claim the thief had already been baptized because you have no scripture to prove that.

And then you contradict yourself by saying "Christ may have extended special dispensation to the Thief."

People with conflicting messages are what give Christianity a bad name... you're all over the map! Do better!

 

[strepho]

Suicide is in category of murder. It's taking your own life.

Luke chapter 16 . Richman and Lazarus. Jesus tells us that their are two sides of the gulf.
Saints in paradise.
Wicked and spirtualty dead are in sheol.
Neither side can cross over. No one can cross over the gulf.

Proverbs chapter 23:7. One who repeatedly considers suicide is practicing sin.
Those who commit suicide are rejecting Jesus and not submitting to Gods will.

I personally believe that who ever commits suicide, will face very angry God.

On judgement day. Jesus will decide who is worthy and those found unworthy.

Let's leave the judging to Jesus.

 

[mailmandan]

Certain people may try to argue that the thief on the cross may have been converted, was water baptized, yet the fruit of that is being crucified as a thief? - (highly unlikely)

In Matthew 27:39-44, we see that those who passed by, along with the chief priests' scribes and elders blasphemed, mocked and shook their heads at Jesus and EVEN THE ROBBERS WHO WERE CRUCIFIED WITH HIM REVILED HIM WITH THE SAME THING. More fruit? I certainly don't see being crucified as a thief, blaspheming, mocking and shaking your head at Jesus as being the fruit of repentance/faith.

Yet, moments later, we see that one of the thieves had a "change of mind" (repentance) placed his faith in Christ for salvation and was saved (Luke 23:40-43). Of course, he died while still hanging on the cross before having the opportunity to be water baptized.

 

[Hobie]

As so many others these days, false teacher David Jeremiah teaches you can kill yourself and end up in heaven (Dr. Jeremiah Audio Clip).

I've had the funerals of a number of people who have taken their own lives, and quite often family members will come and say, "Is there any forgiveness if someone takes their own life." And I need to report that that sin is neither accorded any greater or lesser value in the economy of God than the other sins which are chronicled in the word of God. And it is possible, I believe, for a person who has gone through some terrible stress in their life and in a moment of not thinking clearly has ended their life that person very easily might find his place in heaven; especially because he could have given his heart to Christ in this life; and even to take one's life does not undue what God does in the inward act of salvation. (Saul's Suicide, tape TTW13)

This speaks directly against Matthew 24:13; John 15:1-6; Romans 11:22; 1 Corinthians 15:2; Colossians 1:23; Hebrews 3:6, 14; 12:25; and 1 John 5:4. Committing suicide is not enduring to the end (Matthew 24:13). It is not abiding in Christ (John 15:1-6). It is not continuing in His goodness (Romans 11:22). It is not holding fast the word (1 Corinthians 15:2).

It is definitely being moved away from the hope of the gospel (Colossians 1:23). It is not holding fast the confidence and the rejoicing of the hope firm to the end (Hebrews 3:6). It is not holding the beginning of our confidence steadfast to the end (Hebrews 3:14). It is refusing and turning away from Him who speaks from heaven (Hebrews 12:25). And, it is not overcoming the world (1 John 5:4), but rather being overcome by the world and the devil (1 Peter 5:8; 1 John 5:18).

This kind of teaching on suicide opens wide the door of death and Hades (Luke 16:19-31; Revelation 20:11-15) to those in despair.

Some might argue, "What about Samson? He committed suicide." Samson's "suicide" was actually an act of war, as he killed three thousand Philistines in his vengeance upon them (Judges 16:28-30). He died in his effort to kill others, as he said, "Let me die with the Philistines!" (Judges 16:30). It was not, as a typical suicide of our day, because of a lack of hope, or a deranged mind. He died with the Philistines to "take vengeance on the Philistines" for his two eyes (Judges 16:28). Plus, this was the only choice he had, to kill them as he did.

Typical suicidal people today are those who have no hope, and they are thus not in Christ (Ephesians 2:12; 1 Peter 1:3; 3:15), or they have been moved away from the hope of the gospel and are thus lost (Colossians 1:21-23). Those with deranged minds, or who "might have a mental breakdown," are those who do not have a sound mind and are therefore not in Christ (Isaiah 26:3; 2 Timothy 1:7). These people will end up in hell if they die in such a state. Such people are not saved.

Those that self murder (commit suicide) are in violation of these biblical truths:

Matthew 24:13
But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.

*Those that self murder failed to abide In Christ until
the end of their lives, therefore they will not be saved

John 15:1-6
I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman.
Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit.
Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you.
Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me.
I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.
If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.

Romans 11:22
Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.

1 Corinthians 15:2
By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain.

Colossians 1:23
If ye continue in the faith grounded and settled, and be not moved away from the hope of the gospel, which ye have heard, and which was preached to every creature which is under heaven

Hebrews 3:6
But Christ as a son over his own house; whose house are we, if we hold fast the confidence and the rejoicing of the hope firm unto the end.

Hebrews 3:14
For we are made partakers of Christ, if we hold the beginning of our confidence stedfast unto the end;

Hebrews 12:25
See that ye refuse not him that speaketh. For if they escaped not who refused him that spake on earth, much more shall not we escape, if we turn away from him that speaketh from heaven:

1 John 5:4
For whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that overcometh the world, even our faith.

1 Corinthians 3:16,17
Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?
If any man destroys the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are.

The problem is what do you do with Samson...
Hebrews 11:32
And what shall I more say? for the time would fail me to tell of Gedeon, and of Barak, and of Samson, and of Jephthae; of David also, and Samuel, and of the prophets:

Judges 16:28-30
28 And Samson called unto the Lord, and said, O Lord God, remember me, I pray thee, and strengthen me, I pray thee, only this once, O God, that I may be at once avenged of the Philistines for my two eyes.
29 And Samson took hold of the two middle pillars upon which the house stood, and on which it was borne up, of the one with his right hand, and of the other with his left.
30 And Samson said, Let me die with the Philistines. And he bowed himself with all his might; and the house fell upon the lords, and upon all the people that were therein. So the dead which he slew at his death were more than they which he slew in his life.

 

[Jack]

If they were "good" people they would have submitted themselves to the Lord resisted the devil making him flee (James 4:7) and they would not have whacked themselves.

If they were temporarily insane they are still 'good' people. You seem quite merciless.

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

Let's leave the judging to Jesus.

And... let's not forget that He judges based on what He has already said.

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

The problem is what do you do with Samson...

He died in an act of war against an enemy and since he is in God's Faith Hall of Fame... he did not commit suicide.

The discussion here is about those that feel sorry for themselves not knowing the Lord... even as they claim they are Christians and may have known the Lord at one time.... killed themselves.

If they were temporarily insane they are still 'good' people. You seem quite merciless.

Who's fault is that?

Those that fail to submit themselves to the Lord open the door to the devil to take over their thoughts.

This is what happened to the OSAS peoples which is why they went nuts.

 

[Jack]

Who's fault is that?

Those that fail to submit themselves to the Lord open the door to the devil to take over their thoughts.

I hope God has more mercy on you!

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

I hope God has more mercy on you!

Submit to the Lord... and He'll have mercy on you.

Be rebellious and live after the flesh, and He won't!

We're all responsible for the path we choose in life... choose wisely!

 

[Jack]

Submit to the Lord... and He'll have mercy on you.

Be rebellious and live after the flesh, and He won't!

We're all responsible for the path we choose in life... choose wisely!

View attachment 38008

You sound quite merciless!

 

[mailmandan]

You sound quite merciless!

He also sounds like a troll who only cares about attacking the doctrine of OSAS and judging and condemning believers in the OSAS camp. He seems to be suffering from a severe case of anti-OSAS derangement syndrome.

 

[Lambano]

You sound quite merciless!

Maybe. If this is Big Boy's clumsy way of discouraging someone who is contemplating taking their own life from committing the deed, then I'll give him the benefit of the doubt. Though I question the effectiveness of using the fear of post-mortem punishment with someone who is suffering depression or going through a real hard time, if it works, it works. But as someone who grieves for a lost friend and some brothers and several brothers and sisters in Christ who took this way out, who can only pray God will be merciful, this comes across as heartless.

And if anyone reading this is contemplating suicide, DON'T. I want you to get help. Talk to somebody. Your pastor or a trusted brother or sister in Christ. In the US, the suicide hotline is 988. And this page has resources for our non-US readers.

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

You sound quite merciless!

So you believe one can live in sin... and God will have mercy on them anyway and let them in to Heaven???

Why not just go ahead and believe in universalism than???

 

[Jack]

So you believe one can live in sin... and God will have mercy on them anyway and let them in to Heaven???

Fairy tale / LIE!

Why not just go ahead and believe in universalism than??? View attachment 38018

Because it's not true.

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

Fairy tale / LIE!

OK, so if you think I'm being without mercy... and God's Word clearly states whoever confesses and forsakes their sin shall have mercy:

Proverbs 28:13
He that covereth his sins shall not prosper: but whoso confesseth and forsaketh them shall have mercy.

How is it that I'm the bad guy here when it';s the Lord that said this???

If one believe God has mercy on those that continue in their sin and accepts them anyway... why wouldn't they go ahead and believe in universalism?

 

[Jack]

OK, so if you think I'm being without mercy... and God's Word clearly states whoever confesses and forsakes their sin shall have mercy:

Proverbs 28:13
He that covereth his sins shall not prosper: but whoso confesseth and forsaketh them shall have mercy.

How is it that I'm the bad guy here when it';s the Lord that said this???

If one believe God has mercy on those that continue in their sin and accepts them anyway... why wouldn't they go ahead and believe in universalism?

When you're judging others who are in situations that you don't have a clue! And what's even sadder is that God is going to judge YOU the same way.