I would say unless you are an elect you have a will under the bondge of the god of htis world .Free will the food the diciples knew not of is to do the will of the father.
About the Signs of the Second Coming of Jesus
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ARE fulfilled. No.
BECOMING fulfilled. Yes.
The Gospel to the Ends of the Earth...:
* Was BEGUN by Jesus.
* Is CONTINUING by Mankind.
* Is COMPLETED by the Lord Gods Angel.
* THEN...shall the World as we know it Come to an End.
Matt 24:14 (foretelling prophecy)
[14] And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.
Rev 14:6 (John's witnessing of the future)
[6] And I saw another angel fly in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach unto them that dwell on the earth, and to every nation, and kindred, and tongue, and people,
Glory to God,
Taken
You still not seeing the picture, guessing you are young earth, would that be correct ?
It was millions of years before satan rebelled , you quoted Job, and that's a good starting point ,yet you miss the destruction of the first age, and I'm not talking about the flood of Noah . It was not a mere 48 hours
Let's go to the beginning
Genesis 1:1 "In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth."
There are two bodies mentioned in this verse; the heaven and the earth. It simply stated a fact and left the time factor out. The verse not only did not say when, but left it totally to our imagination, as to the eternal span of time, and how the creation took place.
Genesis 1:2 "And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep."
Who is that Spirit of God? He is the Holy Spirit, and it is God's Spirit that moved upon the face of the waters.
In the Hebrew translation of the word, "was", as used in this verse "...the earth was without form,..."; in the original text it reads "became without form...". This same mistranslation of the word "became", and turning it into the word "was" is also present in Genesis 2:7. It should read there; "..and man became a living soul."
was
1961 hayah
hayah (haw-yaw); a primitive root [compare OT:1933]; to exist, i.e. be or become, come to pass (always emphatic, and not a mere copula or auxiliary):KJV - beacon, altogether, be (-come), accomplished, committed, like), break, cause, come (to pass), do, faint, fall, follow, happen, have, last, pertain, quit (oneself-), require, use.
void
922
bohuw (bo'-hoo); from an unused root (meaning to be empty); a vacuity, i.e. (superficially) an undistinguishable ruin:
KJV - emptiness, void.
The correct Hebrew translation from the Massoretic Hebrew text for the words, "without form" is "tohu-va bohu" in the Hebrew Strong's dictionary. So we see that the earth was not "created without form", but it "became [tohu] without form and void". Lets go to Strong's Hebrew dictionary, reference number 1961 to verify the word "was", that we read in this verse. "Yahah, haw-yaw; a prime root, to exit; to become, or come to pass." [#1961]
satan, lucifer or who else you want to call him , is the serpent
Reporting to my post # 190 above, based in the Word of God, the source of the truth, on God's six Days of works for restitution of all things, and one Day of rest (a total of seven days) plus the Scriptures that teach that one Day is with the Lord as a thousand years (2 Pet.3:8) so MANKIND would go through six God Days of 1,000 years each (a total of 6,000 years) plus a Millennium of 1,000 years rest (now a total of 7,000 years).
2 Peter 3:v.8
8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one Day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one Day.
Psalms 90:v. 4 and 12
4 For a thousand years in thy sight are but as yesterday when it is past, and as a watch in the night.
12 So teach us to number our days, that we may apply our hearts unto wisdom.
Genesis is a description of GOD's plan of restitution or restoration of all things after the rebellion in Eden. Acts 3:v.18 to 26
What did happen really? There was an eternity before the rebellion of the inhabitants of Eden that was ruled by a Cherub created to protect the Garden of GOD.(Ezekiel 28:v.14)
After the rebellion of Cherub and his followers (Epistle of Jude 1:v.6 combined with Genesis 6:v.2 among others Scriptures), the Earth was filled of
corruption and over the years there were extreme darkness on Earth and also extreme corruption among the inhabitants- Gen. 6: v.2 - except Noah and his family, so he found grace in the eyes of the Lord. It was around year 1.556, or had passed one Day and half from the rebellion in Eden, and 1,056 years since the beginning of GOD's work in the first Day.
In fact, there was a gap of time in around 500 years or a half Day from the fall of the sons of GOD in the Garden of Eden until the moment in which GOD started to work at the evening of the first Day. "In Biblical times or in the beginning, the time was divided into two parts: Êrev (afternoon) and Bôker (morning). Érev starts at sunset, or according to Genesis 3: 8, "daybreak", and ended at sunrise, where Bôker starts. Even today Jews use the word "êrev" as a reference to the first part of the night that goes even after sunset"
That said, how to interpret Genesis 1?
Genesis 1 - The mystery of GOD's Plan revealed to Moses:
Genesis 1:v.1 onwards; - 1 - In the beginning, God created the heavens(four(4) heavens) and the earth.
The mystery of Genesis - that is a revelation of God's plan of restoration of all things which had been destroyed times ago in the God's Garden - the Garden of Eden - , even the restoration of MAN that God had made to live in Eden.
What I think interesting and wonderful is the fact that God revealed that mystery to Moses only around 2,500 years or two Days and half, after He had started His works of restoration. This is the first detail that I pick out to comment and emphasize.
Therefore, when God revealed Genesis to Moses, God had already made all His works of the 1st Day, and of the 2nd Day, so 2,000 years of work, right? (two Days -2,000 years- but there is a gap of 500 years from the events occurred in the Garden of Eden until GOD starts His works of the first Day, this which I will try to explain further below).
Another detail that I highlight in Genesis is when God finished His works of the first Day, as He revealed to Moses.
In fact, literally GOD started to work from the middle of the first Day, that was in the evening (afternoon), and finished in the morning of the next Day, and were the FIRST Day (of 1,000 years of work), as is written in the verse 5, right?
That said, a third detail arises: There was a gap of 500 years from Eden and the beginning/ starting of God's work of restoration-Genesis 1.
On the other words, the works of FIRST Day of God's creation was from year 500 to 1500.
In that occasion or around 1,500 years of Gods' works, Noah was about 456 years old, and when he was 500 years old, Noah started to build the Ark for his salvation and his family, as God's had commanded him. And in the same occasion or period, God's children ruled by a Cherub in Eden had become completely corrupted as is written in Genesis 6- as God revealed to Moses after around 2.500 years.
continues next post
2 Peter 3:v.8
8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one Day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one Day.
Psalms 90:v. 4 and 12
4 For a thousand years in thy sight are but as yesterday when it is past, and as a watch in the night.
12 So teach us to number our days, that we may apply our hearts unto wisdom.
Genesis is a description of GOD's plan of restitution or restoration of all things after the rebellion in Eden. Acts 3:v.18 to 26
What did happen really? There was an eternity before the rebellion of the inhabitants of Eden that was ruled by a Cherub created to protect the Garden of GOD.(Ezekiel 28:v.14)
After the rebellion of Cherub and his followers (Epistle of Jude 1:v.6 combined with Genesis 6:v.2 among others Scriptures), the Earth was filled of
corruption and over the years there were extreme darkness on Earth and also extreme corruption among the inhabitants- Gen. 6: v.2 - except Noah and his family, so he found grace in the eyes of the Lord. It was around year 1.556, or had passed one Day and half from the rebellion in Eden, and 1,056 years since the beginning of GOD's work in the first Day.
In fact, there was a gap of time in around 500 years or a half Day from the fall of the sons of GOD in the Garden of Eden until the moment in which GOD started to work at the evening of the first Day. "In Biblical times or in the beginning, the time was divided into two parts: Êrev (afternoon) and Bôker (morning). Érev starts at sunset, or according to Genesis 3: 8, "daybreak", and ended at sunrise, where Bôker starts. Even today Jews use the word "êrev" as a reference to the first part of the night that goes even after sunset"
That said, how to interpret Genesis 1?
Genesis 1 - The mystery of GOD's Plan revealed to Moses:
Genesis 1:v.1 onwards; - 1 - In the beginning, God created the heavens(four(4) heavens) and the earth.
The mystery of Genesis - that is a revelation of God's plan of restoration of all things which had been destroyed times ago in the God's Garden - the Garden of Eden - , even the restoration of MAN that God had made to live in Eden.
What I think interesting and wonderful is the fact that God revealed that mystery to Moses only around 2,500 years or two Days and half, after He had started His works of restoration. This is the first detail that I pick out to comment and emphasize.
Therefore, when God revealed Genesis to Moses, God had already made all His works of the 1st Day, and of the 2nd Day, so 2,000 years of work, right? (two Days -2,000 years- but there is a gap of 500 years from the events occurred in the Garden of Eden until GOD starts His works of the first Day, this which I will try to explain further below).
Another detail that I highlight in Genesis is when God finished His works of the first Day, as He revealed to Moses.
In fact, literally GOD started to work from the middle of the first Day, that was in the evening (afternoon), and finished in the morning of the next Day, and were the FIRST Day (of 1,000 years of work), as is written in the verse 5, right?
That said, a third detail arises: There was a gap of 500 years from Eden and the beginning/ starting of God's work of restoration-Genesis 1.
On the other words, the works of FIRST Day of God's creation was from year 500 to 1500.
In that occasion or around 1,500 years of Gods' works, Noah was about 456 years old, and when he was 500 years old, Noah started to build the Ark for his salvation and his family, as God's had commanded him. And in the same occasion or period, God's children ruled by a Cherub in Eden had become completely corrupted as is written in Genesis 6- as God revealed to Moses after around 2.500 years.
continues next post
Continuations of post above
In accord Scriptures, the Flood occurred around year 1656, yes, Scriptures prove it. Therefore, the 1st Day of God's works had ended, and the 2nd started from around 1,500, in the exact time of Noah, and finished in the year 2,500, even in the time of Moses, as God revealed to Moses. I think this marvelous.
Later, after the Flood, or about 2,080 years of works, as GOD revealed to Moses, He called Abram, because the Most High God had planned to form - to create - a nation for Himself exclusively. Abram was the God's chosen, and from the seed of Abram, God Almighty would go to work and executing His plan in to have a peculiar nation for Himself. Then from Abraham and Sara GOD made be born Isaac, and from Isaac, Jacob, and from Jacob his twelve sons. Time after Jacob and family went down into Egypt with threescore and ten persons, and in the Egypt the Lord God - in continuation of His works of the second Day - made them as the stars of heaven in multitude, and then was born Moses around 427 years after Abraham, or around year 2,500 of God's works in His Plan of restoration, that is in the middle of the third Day, i.e. from 2,000 to 3,000 years of works.
Note that Moses wrote every things GOD revealed unto him, i.e. all works He had made since the FIRST Day, lets say, from year zero.
But the most important detail GOD revealed to Moses is about the beginning. Genesis 1:1 - In the beginning, God created the heavens (four(4) heavens) and the earth, that is, in JESUS God created the heavens and the earth; without JESUS was not any thing made that was made, right?
Hebrews 1:v.1-2
- 1 God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets, -
- 2 Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;
John 1:v.3 All things were made by Him-by JESUS-; and without Him-without JESUS- was not any thing made that was made.
Why did God say to Moses as is written in Genesis 1:1-"in the beginning", and not "in JESUS"? Yes, why?
Now, now, it because the name of JESUS could not be revealed in that moment, or in that occasion, evidently. In the beginning -JESUS- was the Word, and the Word was God, and was with God-JESUS.
In fact, the NAME of JESUS would be revealed only and only in the fourth Day, or after 4,000 years of creation, as God said to Moses, and Moses spoke of JESUS in the verse 16, not by NAME but as the Greater Light. Greater Light has nothing to do with the sun of a 24hours day, and the Lesser Light has nothing to do with the moon that receives light from the sun to be visible. Spiritually, the Lesser Light is the person of Holy Spirit- he receives light of the Greater Light-JESUS-, as said JESUS in John 16:v.12-15, right? Check it out.
Again: "In the beginning God created heavens...", yes, in JESUS He created the 1st, the 2nd and the 3rd heavens, and the fourth heaven, that is the heaven of the heavens, understand? However, until today, until this present time, God-JESUS- made the ONLY the first two heavens, in fact, two heavenly places have already been planted by GOD here on Earth(Isaiah 51:v.16 and 40:v.22) until the present time here in the earth. The next will be the third heaven, the Kingdom of God(Luke 20:v.35-36 and Revelation 11:v.15 to 18. Check it out)
The third heaven, which was visited by the Apostle Paul, it is the next heaven, that is the next celestial environment, the environment of the Kingdom of God, that will be still established or planted here in the Earth-1Cor.15:v.24-26 and Revelation 11:v.15. Check it out. JESUS said: Luke 20:v.35-36: 35 But they which shall be accounted worthy to obtain that world, and the resurrection from the dead, neither marry, nor are given in marriage: 36 Neither can they die any more: for they are equal unto the angels; and are the children of God, being the children of the resurrection.
What will happen from now on?
- Now see, the first two heavenly places - the Old and New Covenants- will be DISSOLVED or DISMANTLED in the days ahead -2Peter 3:v.7 and 11-13;
- The Kingdom of God will be"planted"/established in the earth (Revelation 5:v.10; 11:v.15-18 among others);
- The heaven of the heavens will be established or planted only after the Millennium of Christ and will be Eternal. Revelation 20:v.7-15;
- Satan will be cast into the bottomless pit that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years be fulfilled;
- And so on
In my view, we are already living in the beginning of the seventh and last Day, or in the beginning of the first century of the seventh and last millennium, the millennium of Christ, the millennium of Judgment, the Judgment Seat of Christ, and the millennium of Vengeance-2 Thessalonians 1:v.7-12.
May our God bless and keep us, and give us His protection
Now unto the King Eternal, Immortal, Invisible(the Word is God), the only Wise God, be Honor and Glory for ever and ever. Amen.
In Christ JESUS
Oseas
In accord Scriptures, the Flood occurred around year 1656, yes, Scriptures prove it. Therefore, the 1st Day of God's works had ended, and the 2nd started from around 1,500, in the exact time of Noah, and finished in the year 2,500, even in the time of Moses, as God revealed to Moses. I think this marvelous.
Later, after the Flood, or about 2,080 years of works, as GOD revealed to Moses, He called Abram, because the Most High God had planned to form - to create - a nation for Himself exclusively. Abram was the God's chosen, and from the seed of Abram, God Almighty would go to work and executing His plan in to have a peculiar nation for Himself. Then from Abraham and Sara GOD made be born Isaac, and from Isaac, Jacob, and from Jacob his twelve sons. Time after Jacob and family went down into Egypt with threescore and ten persons, and in the Egypt the Lord God - in continuation of His works of the second Day - made them as the stars of heaven in multitude, and then was born Moses around 427 years after Abraham, or around year 2,500 of God's works in His Plan of restoration, that is in the middle of the third Day, i.e. from 2,000 to 3,000 years of works.
Note that Moses wrote every things GOD revealed unto him, i.e. all works He had made since the FIRST Day, lets say, from year zero.
But the most important detail GOD revealed to Moses is about the beginning. Genesis 1:1 - In the beginning, God created the heavens (four(4) heavens) and the earth, that is, in JESUS God created the heavens and the earth; without JESUS was not any thing made that was made, right?
Hebrews 1:v.1-2
- 1 God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets, -
- 2 Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;
John 1:v.3 All things were made by Him-by JESUS-; and without Him-without JESUS- was not any thing made that was made.
Why did God say to Moses as is written in Genesis 1:1-"in the beginning", and not "in JESUS"? Yes, why?
Now, now, it because the name of JESUS could not be revealed in that moment, or in that occasion, evidently. In the beginning -JESUS- was the Word, and the Word was God, and was with God-JESUS.
In fact, the NAME of JESUS would be revealed only and only in the fourth Day, or after 4,000 years of creation, as God said to Moses, and Moses spoke of JESUS in the verse 16, not by NAME but as the Greater Light. Greater Light has nothing to do with the sun of a 24hours day, and the Lesser Light has nothing to do with the moon that receives light from the sun to be visible. Spiritually, the Lesser Light is the person of Holy Spirit- he receives light of the Greater Light-JESUS-, as said JESUS in John 16:v.12-15, right? Check it out.
Again: "In the beginning God created heavens...", yes, in JESUS He created the 1st, the 2nd and the 3rd heavens, and the fourth heaven, that is the heaven of the heavens, understand? However, until today, until this present time, God-JESUS- made the ONLY the first two heavens, in fact, two heavenly places have already been planted by GOD here on Earth(Isaiah 51:v.16 and 40:v.22) until the present time here in the earth. The next will be the third heaven, the Kingdom of God(Luke 20:v.35-36 and Revelation 11:v.15 to 18. Check it out)
The third heaven, which was visited by the Apostle Paul, it is the next heaven, that is the next celestial environment, the environment of the Kingdom of God, that will be still established or planted here in the Earth-1Cor.15:v.24-26 and Revelation 11:v.15. Check it out. JESUS said: Luke 20:v.35-36: 35 But they which shall be accounted worthy to obtain that world, and the resurrection from the dead, neither marry, nor are given in marriage: 36 Neither can they die any more: for they are equal unto the angels; and are the children of God, being the children of the resurrection.
What will happen from now on?
- Now see, the first two heavenly places - the Old and New Covenants- will be DISSOLVED or DISMANTLED in the days ahead -2Peter 3:v.7 and 11-13;
- The Kingdom of God will be"planted"/established in the earth (Revelation 5:v.10; 11:v.15-18 among others);
- The heaven of the heavens will be established or planted only after the Millennium of Christ and will be Eternal. Revelation 20:v.7-15;
- Satan will be cast into the bottomless pit that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years be fulfilled;
- And so on
In my view, we are already living in the beginning of the seventh and last Day, or in the beginning of the first century of the seventh and last millennium, the millennium of Christ, the millennium of Judgment, the Judgment Seat of Christ, and the millennium of Vengeance-2 Thessalonians 1:v.7-12.
May our God bless and keep us, and give us His protection
Now unto the King Eternal, Immortal, Invisible(the Word is God), the only Wise God, be Honor and Glory for ever and ever. Amen.
In Christ JESUS
Oseas
Have you ever read that Christ was foreordained before the foundation of the world to go to Calvary and be crucified? You speak of things through human reasoning which had led your understanding astray.
\42270993\
Yes I have ,and to go even deeper I know the entire Word of God is written in the stars
Now, ask yourself why He had to do that .
My reasoning is not through flesh eye's
Yes I have ,and to go even deeper I know the entire Word of God is written in the stars
Now, ask yourself why He had to do that .
My reasoning is not through flesh eye's
Timtofly
Well-Known Member
quietthinker
Well-Known Member
Timtofly
Well-Known Member
He did, because He did want to. There is no limitation placed on God to provide Salvation for all mankind. God wanted all mankind to freely accept that Atonement.
God did not force all of mankind to accept against their own desire not to be saved. "Should all humanity want to be saved?" is the point of contention. Should God have not allowed sin to be a deciding factor? Should God have forced all to be perfect? Or on the flip side, should God force all to confess they are not perfect, and that confession be enough to redeem them?
Timtofly
Well-Known Member
No because we have knowledge from conception given to us by God, that we can decide between what we know, and what God's Word tells us. Then we are socially educated, which then gives us more choices to decide from. Then Satan feeds us false information, as the father and originator of lies. Last of all, we have our imagination to create more fiction. We cannot rely on our imagination, since sin makes us decieve ourselves, and can never originate truth. Imagination gives us hypothesis. We test those hypothesis, and if we only get feed back from Satan, we think we have knowledge and fact, but all we have is fiction that Satan convinces us is fact.
quietthinker
Well-Known Member
Imagination cuts both ways. We imagine....from the most basic to the complex. When I say to you, that flower is yellow you imagine what you deem to be yellow. If I say, it tastes good, you 'taste' that according to your imagination.
Faith in a sense is imagination of sorts.
When a designer designs he imagines first. Without a picture in his imagination a builder does not construct and so on.
Imagination, intellect and application combine for outcome.
In God's imagination and his word he created inhabited Worlds.
It behooves us to imagine well for imagining poorly ultimately kills.
We are asked to imagine how God sees us....not how we see ourselves. God sees us as valuable enough to die for.
You're saying everybody will be saved? I hope not because that would mean Satan has deceived you.
Timtofly
Well-Known Member
Nope, but if you interpret my post wrong, is that why you have questions?
God providing Atonement for all mankind does not mean all will be saved.
Limiting Atonement to only who God chooses, is Satan's deception and the theology of many decieved humans.
Should humanity just imagine all will be saved?
We should know without doubt that Atonement was given to everyone without prejudice. We should know that many will reject God's Atonement. There should be no guess work nor theory of imagination involved one bit.
Tough question: Did God know who would burn in Hell "forever and ever" when He created us?
Timtofly
Well-Known Member
Amen! God created us exactly as pleased Him!
I believe that's true.
"The rich man also died"
"being in torments"
"he cried"
"I am tormented in this flame"
"this place of torment"
Luke 16:22-28 (NKJV)
22 The rich man also died and was buried. 23 And being in torments in Hades, he lifted up his eyes and saw Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom. 24 Then he cried and said, 'Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus that he may dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame.' 25 But Abraham said, 'Son, remember that in your lifetime you received your good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things; but now he is comforted and you are tormented. 26 And besides all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed, so that those who want to pass from here to you cannot, nor can those from there pass to us.' 27 Then he said, 'I beg you therefore, father, that you would send him to my father's house, 28 for I have five brothers, that he may testify to them, lest they also come to this place of torment.'
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