Are Jehovah's witnesses real Christians?

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Ronald Nolette

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Only in your twisting-- All sin, God leaves the door open to those to repent and turn around-Acts 3:19) They would only be doomed if they did not repent and turn around. King Mannaseh was a rotten to the core individual--He did great sins against God and man, in his captivity he truly repented and God forgave him and restored him as king.

Well as you do not know which sin the writer was speaking of ( for it is a singular sin written) then anything you say is moot.
 

Angel Faith

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Charles eldershunning l thought so.
With the generations long cover-up of elder pedophiles activity in the JW organization, and the punishment of shunning for violating its conspiracy of silence, I doubt God would call those complicit in that evil, and,or,those who stay and ignore it, his own.

IMPO, they're a Satanic cult.
 

Keiw

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Well as you do not know which sin the writer was speaking of ( for it is a singular sin written) then anything you say is moot.
No it is clear, its any sin that one knows is sin yet still does it. The practice of it.
 

Aunty Jane

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With the generations long cover-up of elder pedophiles activity in the JW organization, and the punishment of shunning for violating its conspiracy of silence, I doubt God would call those complicit in that evil, and,or,those who stay and ignore it, his own.
Can you name me an organisation on earth that has not been infiltrated by pedophiles? They are very good con artists. Even the Boy Scouts were plagued by these sick individuals. They hide in every church and institution that has access to children.

Only in recent decades has child abuse been seen as a crime under the law. Sexual abuse was seen as something unfortunate, but not actually criminal under the law unless physical harm was proven.

Using the Bible principle as to the production of “two or three witnesses” to any criminal activity, it was not going to be easy to prove a crime that no one else witnessed. The abusers schemed to eliminate all witnesses to their crime. Grooming their victims meant that they had earned the trust of the child’s parents and with threats, the abuser continued to assault his victims.

There were no “cover ups” as such, but no way to scripturally address the problem. Added to that was the way the legal system initially handled these cases, forcing the victims to confront their abusers in court and with the defense lawyers bent on winning, would put the victims through rigorous cross examination, creating more trauma for the victim than the original abuse. Why would anyone recommend that course?

Children were not seen to be credible witnesses in the early days. So when the trauma associated with child abuse was legally and medically identified, then laws were implemented to address what was formerly swept under the rug as something we just didn’t talk about.

Old school men were traditionally in the role of judges in court and sexual crimes to a man were viewed very differently than from the female point of view. Females and more compassionate males in the law professions aided the implementation of the laws we have now.

Our elders are not the police, but at least now we can use the law to bring perpetrators to justice without further trauma to the victim.
We have a firm child abuse policy now that hopefully will prevent any abusers getting away with anything in the future.
 

Aunty Jane

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IMPO, they're a Satanic cult.
What if your opinion was based on misinformation? What if you had lived in the first century and Jesus and his apostles came along and the religious leaders that you relied upon to administer Bible truth had nothing good to say about those apparent apostates?

What did Jesus tell us to expect as his disciples?

Matthew 5:11-12...
“Happy are you when people reproach you and persecute you and lyingly say every sort of wicked thing against you for my sake. 12 Rejoice and be overjoyed, since your reward is great in the heavens, for in that way they persecuted the prophets prior to you.”

John 15:18-21...
“If the world hates you, you know that it has hated me before it hated you. 19 If you were part of the world, the world would be fond of what is its own. Now because you are no part of the world, but I have chosen you out of the world, for this reason the world hates you. 20 Keep in mind the word I said to you: A slave is not greater than his master. If they have persecuted me, they will also persecute you; if they have observed my word, they will also observe yours. 21 But they will do all these things against you on account of my name, because they do not know the One who sent me.”

Who were the first Christians’ most vehement opposers and persecutors? Wasn’t it the ones who claimed to worship the same God? Who was responsible for invalidating the word of God by the introduction of human traditions? The very ones pointing the fingers at Jesus and his disciples. (Matthew 15:7-9)

We see Christendom as the modern day mirror image of corrupt Judaism....and history is repeating.
I came out of Christendom so I know first hand what that side of the fence is like....most of our opposers have never even spoken to Jehovah’s Witnesses without a pre-conceived prejudice manufactured by the religious system that they grew up in. I was one of them.....when JW’s came to my door I told them to leave.....then out of the blue one day, my father dropped dead with no warning. He was only 52 and it left our close family devastated.....but in my heart I wanted to know where he was....was he as devastated as we were at that sudden separation? Was he missing us like we were missing him? I was haunted by the prospect that he was suffering like we were.

I asked my questions about death and the afterlife but what I got was platitudes....no real scriptural answers.
I was frustrated beyond anything I had ever felt before because I wanted the Bible’s answer to my questions, not man’s opinion of what they thought the Bible said.

When JW’s came to my door I put my questions to them, imagining that they would also be hard pressed to give me the Bible’s answers. To my complete surprise, they asked if I had a Bible and asked me to go and get it.....then they gave me scriptures to look up in my own KJV, and each scripture answered my question.

I was so intrigued that the ones I thought would be of no help at all, were the only ones who did not give me empty platitudes, they just provided God’s word on everything.....I wanted to know more as I has a million questions.....they came and studied the Bible with me and answered all my questions.

The more I had to do with them, the more I came to see that they were nothing like what I had been led to believe.
I began to understand what the first Christians had to do in order to become separated from the Jewish system and to take up the challenge of being ostracized by friends and family for telling an unpopular truth to an indoctrinated people who were functioning under the guidance of complete hypocrites. (Matthew 10:34-39)

Consider the possibility that satan has never changed his tactics.
 
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Angel Faith

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What if your opinion was based on misinformation? What if you had lived in the first century and Jesus and his apostles came along and the religious leaders that you relied upon to administer Bible truth had nothing good to say about those apparent apostates?

What did Jesus tell us to expect as his disciples?

Matthew 5:11-12...
“Happy are you when people reproach you and persecute you and lyingly say every sort of wicked thing against you for my sake. 12 Rejoice and be overjoyed, since your reward is great in the heavens, for in that way they persecuted the prophets prior to you.”

John 15:18-21...
“If the world hates you, you know that it has hated me before it hated you. 19 If you were part of the world, the world would be fond of what is its own. Now because you are no part of the world, but I have chosen you out of the world, for this reason the world hates you. 20 Keep in mind the word I said to you: A slave is not greater than his master. If they have persecuted me, they will also persecute you; if they have observed my word, they will also observe yours. 21 But they will do all these things against you on account of my name, because they do not know the One who sent me.”

Who were the first Christians’ most vehement opposers and persecutors? Wasn’t it the ones who claimed to worship the same God? Who was responsible for invalidating the word of God by the introduction of human traditions? The very ones pointing the fingers at Jesus and his disciples. (Matthew 15:7-9)

We see Christendom as the modern day mirror image of corrupt Judaism....and history is repeating.
I came out of Christendom so I know first hand what that side of the fence is like....most of our opposers have never even spoken to Jehovah’s Witnesses without a pre-conceived prejudice manufactured by the religious system that they grew up in. I was one of them.....when JW’s came to my door I told them to leave.....then out of the blue one day, my farther dropped dead with no warning. He was only 52 and it left our close family devastated.....but in my heart I wanted to know where he was....was he as devastated as we were at that sudden separation? Was he missing us like we were missing him? I was haunted by the prospect that he was suffering like we were.

I asked my questions about death and the afterlife but what I got was platitudes....no real scriptural answers.
I was frustrated beyond anything I had ever felt before because I wanted the Bible’s answer to my questions, not man’s opinion of what they thought the Bible said.

When JW’s came to my door I put my questions to them, imagining that they would also be hard pressed to give me the Bible’s answers. To my complete surprise, they asked if I had a Bible and asked me to go and get it.....then they gave me scriptures to look up in my own KJV, and each scripture answered my question.

I was so intrigued that the ones I thought would be of no help at all, were the only ones who did not give me empty platitudes, they just provided God’s word on everything.....I wanted to know more as I has a million questions.....they came and studied the Bible with me and answered all my questions.

The more I had to do with them, the more I came to see that they were nothing like what I had been led to believe.
I began to understand what the first Christians had to do in order to become separated from the Jewish system and to take up the challenge of being ostracized by friends and family for telling an unpopular truth to an indoctrinated people who were functioning under the guidance of complete hypocrites. (Matthew 10:34-39)

Consider the possibility that satan has never changed his tactics.
I made bold and italicized that which I'm replying to in your post.

Consider researching the subject, Jehovah Witness elder Pedophiles.

Yes, it's true. Satan has never changed his tactics. However Jesus tells us everything done in the dark shall be brought into the light. Luke 8:17

 

Aunty Jane

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I made bold and italicized that which I'm replying to in your post.

Consider researching the subject, Jehovah Witness elder Pedophiles.
And where may I ask did you get that info from? The video you linked to will not play in Australia.
Hate sites are a dime a dozen...

Yes, it's true. Satan has never changed his tactics. However Jesus tells us everything done in the dark shall be brought into the light. Luke 8:17
We are so looking forward to that.....it will be a complete vindication of every lie told about us.....
 

Angel Faith

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And where may I ask did you get that info from? The video you linked to will not play in Australia.
Hate sites are a dime a dozen...


We are so looking forward to that.....it will be a complete vindication of every lie told about us.....
It's a documentary regarding the Pedophile database the JW elders have compiled among their own.

Impossible to be a JW and not know of this.

I'll not debate this with you.
 

Aunty Jane

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It's a documentary regarding the Pedophile database the JW elders have compiled among their own.
Really, so you have access to this information and JW's don't? Does that sound fishy or what?


Impossible to be a JW and not know of this.
First I have ever heard of it......and why single us out when every church in existence has worse infiltration of these rock spiders than we do?
What about your own church? And I don't mean the building you might attend locally.....I mean the global church system that you support.
I'll not debate this with you.
I wouldn't expect you to unless you were interested in the truth....
You brought it up.
 

Keiw

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It's a documentary regarding the Pedophile database the JW elders have compiled among their own.

Impossible to be a JW and not know of this.

I'll not debate this with you.
Many things are said against the JW,s by ones whose hearts turned to hatred. Does truth come out of hate filled hearts? Or does a personal distorted view come out? The Pharisees clearly showed which it was. They hated Jesus and said he got his power from demons. Gods chosen scholars of those days.
Paedophiles get in every where they can gain trust. No one knows they are that way. They learn, and look loving and kind. In every religion on earth they are--it proves one thing for sure= No mortal on earth knows if another is truly saved, or what their heart is really like, and they have no right telling others they are saved. Only blind guides do it. Run from them.
 
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Angel Faith

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Really, so you have access to this information and JW's don't? Does that sound fishy or what?



First I have ever heard of it......and why single us out when every church in existence has worse infiltration of these rock spiders than we do?
What about your own church? And I don't mean the building you might attend locally.....I mean the global church system that you support.

I wouldn't expect you to unless you were interested in the truth....
You brought it up.
And you prefer to remain blind and thus call children and emotionallh traumatized adult survivors of JW elder abuse liars.

Sad. But beats shunning, huh? You live with that.
 

Angel Faith

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Many things are said against the JW,s by ones whose hearts turned to hatred. Does truth come out of hate filled hearts? Or does a personal distorted view come out? The Pharisees clearly showed which it was. They hated Jesus and said he got his power from demons. Gods chosen scholars of those days.
Paedophiles get in every where they can gain trust. No one knows they are that way. They learn, and look loving and kind. In every religion on earth they are--it proves one thing for sure= No mortal on earth knows if another is truly saved, or what their heart is really like, and they have no right telling others they are saved. Only blind guides do it. Run from them.
Many hate filled perverts find sanctuary because those afraid of truth prefer to call it lies.
The Priests of the Roman church have proliferated for years. So too those in Protestant churches.

When does it stop? When people care more for children than lies. Pedophilia is Satanic. So too are those who enable it in any way. We know what Jesus said about harming little ones. Imagine those who will answer for turning away from the truth of what was happening to them when they are called to answer for that.
 

Ronald Nolette

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You are exactly opposite sir, He worshipped Jehovah in obedience to Jesus

Well as I worship the Father, cuz nobody knows if His name is Jehovah or not ,Ribiirt, I also worship YHWH of Hosts who is now called jesus as we are commanded to.
More exactingly, although those who practice Judaism are not Christians, they were God's people when Jesus came, and he was sent to them sir.

And I agree with you. thos who practice teh corrupted Judaism known as Jehovah Witness are not christians either. By denying His physical resurrection, you place yourself outside teh care of God the Father.
 

Keiw

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Many hate filled perverts find sanctuary because those afraid of truth prefer to call it lies.
The Priests of the Roman church have proliferated for years. So too those in Protestant churches.

When does it stop? When people care more for children than lies. Pedophilia is Satanic. So too are those who enable it in any way. We know what Jesus said about harming little ones. Imagine those who will answer for turning away from the truth of what was happening to them when they are called to answer for that.
JW,s do not condone Paedophiles. They council the parents to go to the police.
 
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Aunty Jane

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Many hate filled perverts find sanctuary because those afraid of truth prefer to call it lies.
The Priests of the Roman church have proliferated for years. So too those in Protestant churches.
I couldn't agree more....but you behave as if nothing has been done to remedy a very difficult situation. The elders in our organization are not the police, and in times past, as has already been shown to you, pedophilia, like sodomy was not considered a "crime" in those earlier times, particularly by males in the judicial system, who did not view it as such.

You cannot fix a problem until you identify the problem for what it is. As I said, only when the victims came forth much later, and it was demonstrated how badly they were traumatized, did the judicial system get on board...but not in a helpful way for the victims at first. It is only in recent decades that things have changed for the better.
Our child abuse policy has taken those recommendations seriously, and reflects nothing but support for the victims. You act as if nothing has changed...when it has. We are doing all we can to protect our children.

We have never condoned pedophilia but it is a sad fact of life that these people exist and are very good at hiding what they are. Our organization has never been a haven for child abuse because, unlike Christendom, we do not separate our children from their parents in our places of worship. We have no Sunday School or Youth camps where predators may hide their intentions, so it is not something endemic in our brotherhood....and we have measures in place now to protect the victim, not the predator.
When does it stop?
It stops when Jesus comes to judge those who cause harm to others. This world is in its death throes and we are powerless to prevent these horrible people from doing what they want....Jesus has the power to stop all of it, but its not the time for judgment just yet....not till every precious sheep in in the pen....then we can watch him go to work on all the things that make God angry.....pedophilia is only one in a long list.
When people care more for children than lies. Pedophilia is Satanic. So too are those who enable it in any way.
If anyone condones pedophilia or any kind of sexual abuse, they will answer to God for that, even if they never answer to man.
Enablers come in many forms, God knows who they are. Can we really expect justice in a corrupt world, ruled by the devil?
Pedophile rings have judges, lawyers and prominent wealthy business men deeply embedded in them.....so you tell me when people in top positions are going to start caring for those children? It won't stop until God stops it....permanently.
How many children go missing in America and in other nations who will end up as child sex slaves? God knows.
We know what Jesus said about harming little ones. Imagine those who will answer for turning away from the truth of what was happening to them when they are called to answer for that.
There is a big difference between deliberately lying about something and being deluded, or in denial about it. The time period in which these things occurred is also something to be taken into consideration. It wasn't always viewed as a "crime".
Are these people deluded? Do pedophiles think that they are doing anything wrong? They know that the world thinks they are criminals, but the flesh is stronger than many of them can conquer, so they hide on the internet feeding each other the desires of their wicked flesh.

Do the victim's parents want to think that their child has been abused by someone they trusted? Its a hard reality to come to terms with.....they, through misplaced trust, allowed it to take place. This is not a black and white issue.....many factors make it a difficult subject to address adequately.
 
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