BreadOfLife ~ UNPROVEN CLAIMS..

[Enoch111]

Well then tell me which is right:
Eternal Security
or
Conditional Eternal Security

Of course eternal security.

Jesus said unto her, I Am the Resurrection, and the Life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live: And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this? (John 11:25,26)

For I know that my Redeemer liveth, and that he shall stand at the latter day upon the earth: And though after my skin worms destroy this body, yet in my flesh shall I see God: Whom I shall see for myself, and mine eyes shall behold, and not another;though my reins be consumed within me. (Job 19:25-27)

 

[FHII]

Here's the funny thing... It seemed that Bread of Life had been absent for some time before this thread. Or am I wrong?

Why bring him up again if so?

 

[Taken]

That's just it - you talk out of both sides of your mouth.
.
FIRST, you say that you no longer sin - and in fact CANNOT sin.
THEN you say that you "never claimed" to be without sin.

This is a gigantic hypocrisy - and more of your dishonestly . . .

Per your USUAL, you try to speak for me what is FALSE.

FIRST, I was "BORN" IN SIN, Darkness, Against God, and "COMMITTED" SIN Against God.

MY SIN, was never ABOUT YOU or Against YOU or any other human.

THEN, I "Learned About God, About Christ", and BELIEVED IN Him".

THEN, I CHOSE to "GIVE MY LIFE" TO THEE Lord God.

THEN, My Faithful and True Lord God, FORGAVE MY SIN, AGAINST HIM.

THEN, My Faithful and True Lord Gods SPIRIT entered ME, and Cleansed me with HIS BLOOD, Birthed me with HIS SEED, COVERED MY SIN with HIS LIGHT...

THEN you say that you "never claimed" to be without sin.

THAT IS CORRECT, I NEVER CLAIMED TO "BE" "WITHOUT SIN." <--- THAT IS "YOUR" CLAIM.

That is your BELIEF, that a man WHO SINS NO MORE, is somehow "WITHOUT SIN".

Not ONCE did I claim that, OR believe that.

I CLAIMED:
I SINNED AGAINST God,
God FORGAVE MY SIN Against "Him"!
God COVERED MY SIN, with His Light.

You SAID, that means the slate is WIPED Clean... I never said that, YOU DID.

I said MY SIN is FORGIVEN.
I said MY SIN is COVERED.

Obviously, YOU are without Understanding...
Covered SIN, isn't SIN WIPED clean...
It is SIN that is STILL IN ME, and COVERED!

Good grief, do you think when you lay in bed at night UNDER the Covers, YOU DISAPPEAR?
LOL

MY Lord God, CAN NO LONGER SEE MY SIN.
Obviously YOU are completely UNAWARE, thee Lord God, IS PURE LIGHT, and Pure Light OVERCOMES "DARKNESS" which is what SIN is.

My Lord God's SPIRIT, POWER, LIGHT, SEED, TRUTH, remains WITH me, and WITHIN me FOREVER!

My Lord God's Spirit, Power, Light, Seed, Truth....IS MY KEEPER....

NEVER "AGAIN", can SIN, or Darkness, ENTER me and CAUSE ME to SIN AGAINST Thee Lord God.

This is a gigantic hypocrisy - and more of your dishonestly . . .

That IS YOUR False Accusation.....
Because YOU are WITHOUT Understanding of What thee Lord God has OFFERED YOU, OR that you have Accepted.

YOU are the hypocrite, claiming YOU are Born Again, Baptized IN the Spirit of God, and Continue to STAND AGAINST HIM, by YOU continuing TO SIN.

My Lord God, has FREED me FROM ever AGAIN, SINNING AGAINST Him.

He has FORGIVEN MY SIN, Once and Forever.
He has Covered MY SIN, Once and Forever.
He has RESTORED and SAVED MY soul, Once and Forever.
He has BIRTHED Me with HIS Seed, ONCE and Forever.

I BELONG TO MY Lord God.
He KEEPS me FOREVER WITH HIm.
He FOREVER is IN and WITH me, and I IN and WITH Him.

Your psychobabble of trying to project your LACK of Understanding upon MY relationship with MY Lord God, is but RUBBISH.

You are the Hypocrite, claiming to be BORN AGAIN...Without repentance, Without belief, Without your knowledge.....and then PREACH you continue to COMMIT SIN.

You are the Fraud, wagging your tongue, Pointing your Finger, Accusing others of Committing SIN...

It is your Church with a LONG history (as you so proudly like to speak of), that teaches you Receive the Baptism of the Holy Spirit of God, without repentance or belief in God....and then teaches the POWER of God within a person CAN NOT KEEP THEM FROM Sinning AGAINST GOD...and that YOU SIN AGAINST men..."AS IF" you were a JEW "under" Mosaic Law.

Apparently THAT suits YOU.
I am NOT you, or LIKE YOU.

I don't subscribe to YOUR FALSE teachers, or YOUR teaching, or am subject to YOUR FALSE ACCUSATIONS.

I am NOT a Jew.
i am NOT under Mosaic Law.
I am NOT a Catholic who TRIES to be "BOTH" under the OLD and NEW Covenant.
I do not SIN against men...nor can men Forgive me OF SIN.

Mark 2:
[7]... who can forgive sins but God only?

Pat on head for your lack of wisdom.

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[Taken]

Your text is gone!
Too late to figure out why....

@Taken
I mean late, as in my time..almost 1 a.m.

Humm...Don't know what you are referencing specific.

God Bless,
Taken

 

[Waiting on him]

Nope. Been EXPLAINED to you multiple times.



Not "IF".... I am forgiven (past tense) of ALL of my Sins... And have said so on more than one occasion.

I was BORN IN SIN.
I COMMITTED SIN.

^ THAT IS NOT CLAIMING TO HAVE NO SIN!



LOL...HAVE....So you are momentarily cleansed and HAVE NO SIN? LOL
So what Are YOU CLAIMING....at CERTAIN MOMENTS....YOU CLAIM YOU HAVE NO SIN...

LOL Priceless!!

That does not APPLY TO ME...What applies to me ... IS From the moment of MY Conversion...I CAN NEVER AGAIN COMMIT SIN, which is Exactly what I have said...

First of ALL...MY SIN, was AGAINST God...
Not YOU, not ANY other man!

YOU CLAIM YOU CONTINUE TO "COMMIT" SIN. I agree that YOU DO.

Secondly...AFTER my Conversion, I "COMMIT" Sin NO MORE.

Not ONCE did I say..."I have no sin".

^ THAT IS YOUR FALSE ACCUSATION.

MY SIN was CONFESSED, as I have said.

^ THAT IS NOT CLAIMING TO HAVE NO SIN!
^ THAT IS "PRECISELY" CLAIMING to HAVE SIN and Committed SIN and CONFeSSED having SIN!! DUH!!

MY SIN was WAS AGAINST God, and FORGIVEN, BY thee Lord God...
NOT YOU, NOT ANY OTHER man!



CORRECT....It is a Scriptural TRUTH, that I believe, and KNOW WHY I no longer SIN, and CANNOT Sin....and Obviously YOU DON'T!

MY Conversion ... Included SEVERAL THINGS, that were EXPRESSLY POINTED OUT TO YOU on more that one occasion, that you called verbose ranting..
(Dancing around pfft..nonsense)

My Conversion INCLUDED, receiving Gods SEED and my spirit being BORN AGAIN from Gods SEED.....hello...Which MAKES ME "born of God.!

Now the Scriptural TRUTH...

WHOSOEVER is BORN OF GOD...does NOT COMMIT sin, CANNOT sin...

1 John 3:9
[9] Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin,
Because he IS born of God!!!



No it IS NOT! THAT is YOU NOT knowing the difference BETWEEN "HAVE" and "COMMITTING" Sin.!!! NOT MY explanation...that is YOUR WORDS...you eat them! Your made up nonsense does not APPLY TO ME!

Scripture says no such thing.
I said no such thing.

YOU projecting YOUR MADE UP definitions on me....HAS NOTHING to do with me....and NOTHING to do with 1 John 1:8

1 John 1:8 (Expressly says)
[8a ]If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves,

A man who CONFESSES his SIN ... DUH...
IS NOT claiming to "HAVE NO SIN'.

^ YOUR, repeated to ad nausum, comprehension FAILURE!!

[8b] and the truth is not in us.

^ According to this Scripture ONLY APPLIES, AFTER a person has CLAIMED to HAVE NO SIN! DUH...which DOES NOT APPLY TO ME,
Proved repeatedly.

YOU have repeatedly claimed, the Truth is not in me...<--- Yet another of YOUR FALSE ACCUSATIONS.

DUH! Jesus IS the TRUTH, Part of MY CONVERSION, was the TRUTH ENTERED ME.

^ Not ONCE have I claimed to HAVE NO SIN!

Not ONCE could you produce ONE quote of me saying, "i have no sin".

WHAT YOU REPEATEDLY PRODUCE IS YOUR WORDS, of YOUR FALSE ACCUSATION....and then SAY it is what I said, WHICH IS A LIE!

^ ROTTEN FRUIT!!

MY SIN ...WAS (past) AGAINST GOD.
...Pss 51:5
MY God...FORGAVE MY SIN.
...1 John 1:9
MY God...CLEANSED MY SIN.
...1 John 1: 7c
My God CLEANSED ME FROM "ALL" UNRIGHTEOUSNESS
...1 John 1:9
MY God COVERED MY SIN, WITH HIS LIGHT.
...Rom 4:7
MY GOD REMEMBERS MY SIN NO MORE.
...Heb 10;17
MY GOD'S SPIRIT (POWER) KEEPS me FREE from SIN AGAINST GOD.
...Rom 6:22
MY GOD GAVE ME HIS SEED, and BIRTHED Me a NEW spirit.
...Ezek 11;10
...Ezek 18:31
...Ezek 36:26
....1 John 3:9
...and HIS SPIRIT DWELLS IN ME, WITH ME.
...John 14:20
And WHERE GOD IS, there IS NO SIN STANDING AGAINST HIM!
...Matt 20:30
....

ALL THAT ^ may certainly BE FOREIGN TO YOU...since YOU CLAIMED YOU were "born again"...WITHOUT repenting, WITHOUT confessing your sin Against God, WITHOUT Believing IN Him, IN Christ, WITHOUT your Knowledge.

Apparently it is YOUR CHURCH'S PRACTICE to TEACH you RECEIVE Baptism of the Holy Spirit...WITHOUT Confession of Belief....
And then spend a LIFETIME...following Jewish Laws, that claim....MEN sin against MEN.
And in JEWISH LAW there WAS NO Jesus REVEALED in the FLesh....and NO BLOOD OF JESUS TO CLEANSE a man ONCE and FOREVER....

Since you continue to SIN...How shameful you must feel to KEEP asking the Lord Over and over to Forgive you....AND seriously...
Does your Church teach Jesus must REPEATEDLY CLEANSE YOU WITH HIS BLOOD?

Do you CONFESS to the Lord His INteRNAL POWER was NOT SUFFICIENT TO KEEP YOU FROM SIN? YIPES!

EIther you WeRE NEVER Cleansed of ALL Unrighteousness, Born of God, Kept Free from Sin By Gods INTERNAL Light and Power...

Or you have been HOODWINKED by your Church, teaching you you were BORN AGAIN of God....WITHOUT you confessing Belief in God or confession Of YOUR SINS...and Cleansed of ALL Unrighteousness.

Does your Church teach...Gods INDWELLING SPIRIT is NOT POWERFUL ENOUGH TO KEEP YOU FREE FROM "STANDING AGAINST HIM"?



Utterly pitiful BOL!

Glory to God,
Taken

Wow!!! What great liberty we have in Christ. If this ever was to leak out in the CC they would see they don’t need this religious hierarchy. All they need is Christ.

 

[GodsGrace]

Of course eternal security.

Jesus said unto her, I Am the Resurrection, and the Life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live: And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this? (John 11:25,26)

For I know that my Redeemer liveth, and that he shall stand at the latter day upon the earth: And though after my skin worms destroy this body, yet in my flesh shall I see God: Whom I shall see for myself, and mine eyes shall behold, and not another;though my reins be consumed within me. (Job 19:25-27)

Of course conditional security:

Colossians 1:22-23
22yet He has now reconciled you in His fleshly body through death, in order to present you before Him holy and blameless and beyond reproach— 23if indeed you continue in the faith firmly established and steadfast, and not moved away from the hope of the gospel that you have heard, which was proclaimed in all creation under heaven, and of which I, Paul, was made a minister.


Ezekiel 18:24-26
24“But when a righteous man turns away from his righteousness, commits iniquity and does according to all the abominations that a wicked man does, will he live? All his righteous deeds which he has done will not be remembered for his treachery which he has committed and his sin which he has committed; for them he will die. 25“Yet you say, ‘The way of the Lord is not right.’ Hear now, O house of Israel! Is My way not right? Is it not your ways that are not right? 26“When a righteous man turns away from his righteousness, commits iniquity and dies because of it, for his iniquity which he has committed he will die.

E, I'm not here to debate this with you...
but to show you that both doctrine can be supported by scripture.
We both believe we're right.
So HOW to decide who really is?
It can't be done...this argument has been going on forever...even before Jesus was born.

So it's not enough to turn to scripture to check what one teaches...like a pastor, for instance. It takes more.

 

[GodsGrace]

Humm...Don't know what you are referencing specific.

God Bless,
Taken

I wanted to reply to your post to me.
When I clicked on REPLY,,,everything would NOT post to my reply page.
It was late, so I didn't figure out why.

Just didn't want you to think I was ignoring your reply to me.

 

[Taken]

I don’t know Taken

You’ve danced around my question regarding your supposed sinlessness for awhile now

WHAT "supposed" sinlessness?

I NEVER claimed that.

If you are sinless

I Never claimed that.

Did you claim that for me?
If so, then why should I be held to explain what you said?

in the past, present, and future, it means that you now love perfectly.

I know of no such teaching... about MEN being sinnless or about what you mean perfect love is. Where is that teaching?

So do you love perfectly? Every minute of your day?

Can't answer, until you define sinnless, define love perfectly, define every minute of my day.

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[brakelite]

WRONG.
Your last post simply solidifies how little you know about the Catholic faith.

You claim that we don't read Scripture to learn about doctrine - which is flat-out horse manure.
ALL Catholic doctrine is supported with Scriptural references.

It's blindingly clear that you've never cracked open a Catechism.

Which brings us to the very point @Phoneman777 was making in the thread... The church which the papacy thinks we should join.... Your claim that your doctrines are upheld by scripture is denied by your own church BoL. Read again the first post of @Phoneman777 's thread.

 

[Taken]

Ezekiel 18:24-26
24“But when a righteous man turns away from his righteousness, commits iniquity and does according to all the abominations that a wicked man does, will he live? All his righteous deeds which he has done will not be remembered for his treachery which he has committed and his sin which he has committed; for them he will die. 25“Yet you say, ‘The way of the Lord is not right.’ Hear now, O house of Israel! Is My way not right? Is it not your ways that are not right? 26“When a righteous man turns away from his righteousness, commits iniquity and dies because of it, for his iniquity which he has committed he will die.

E, I'm not here to debate this with you...
but to show you that both doctrine can be supported by scripture.
We both believe we're right.
So HOW to decide who really is?
It can't be done...this argument has been going on forever...even before Jesus was born.

So it's not enough to turn to scripture to check what one teaches...like a pastor, for instance. It takes more.

Hi H ~

Colossians 1:22-23
22yet He has now reconciled you in His fleshly body through death, in order to present you before Him holy and blameless and beyond reproach— 23if indeed you continue in the faith firmly established and steadfast, and not moved away from the hope of the gospel that you have heard, which was proclaimed in all creation under heaven, and of which I, Paul, was made a minister. [/QUOTE]

"He has"...."you"..."His"...

This is about Jesus...who Fulfilled "HIS" mission "HE" came to Accomplish on Earth.

He said: He came to GIVE HIS Body of Flesh, for the LIFE of the World.

John 6:51
[51] I am the living bread which came down from heaven: if any man eat of this bread, he shall live for ever: and the bread that I will give is my flesh, which I will give for the life of the world.

Just Before Jesus' Body of Flesh DIED on the Cross...He SAID...

John 19
[30] When Jesus therefore had received the vinegar, he said, It is finished: and he bowed his head, and gave up the ghost.

What was "FINISHED"?

WHAT "HE" came to "ACCOMPLISH".

(Isaiah notifies us the Word of God would NOT RETURN to God, void, without having Accomplished what he was sent to Do)

Isaiah 55:
[11] So shall my word be that goeth forth out of my mouth: it shall not return unto me void, but it shallaccomplish that which I please, and it shall prosper in the thing whereto I sent it.

John 19
[28] After this, Jesus knowing that all things were nowaccomplished, that the scripture might be fulfilled, saith, I thirst.

SO WHAT expressly did Jesus come to ACCOMPLISH?

He came TO GIVE HIS FLESH...FOR the Life of ....who? The ENTIRE WORLD.

Did He give HIS Flesh body?
...Yes

AND...So, HE, Christ Jesus Accomplished what HE, was sent tO DO?
...Yes

AND EVERY man of the ENTIRE WORLD ... HAS a GIFT from thee Lord God?
...Yes?

But, But But....Giving BY THE Lord God...
IS ONLY HALF of the EQUASION...

What ABOUT EVERY man of the Entire world?

Does a man HAVE TO "TAKE" the Gift?
OR
IS the Lord Gods GIFT, "FORCED" upon Every man of the Entire World?

Giving is what the Lord God has Accomplished.
"TAKING" is what is NOT ACCOMPLISHED, by every single man of the Entire world.

I can notify you I HAVE a GIFT for you.
I can notify you it is especially FOR YOU.
I can tell you WHAT the GIFT is.
I can hand deliver the Gift TO YOU...

Does that mean YOU MUST "TAKE" IT?
No.

Thee ALL KNOWING Lord God...KNEW not ALL men WOULD "TAKE" His Gift.

Does that UNDO, Him having GIVEN His Gift to them? No.

Does a man WHO REJECTS "TAKING" His Offered Gift, mean, His Gift was NOT given them? No.

It means THEY REJECTED and REFUSED to "TAKE" His GIft.

Thee ALL Knowing Lord God....informs us...
HE caused DIVISION among men.

Luke 12
[51] Suppose ye that I am come to give peace on earth? I tell you, Nay; but rather division:

He HAS Given His Gift of Salvation to the Entire World.
He FORCES NOONE to TAKE His GIFT of Salvation.
Those WHO freely Choose TO TAKE HIS GIFT...are DIVIDED FROM...
THose WHO freely Choose TO REJECT HIS GIFT.

BOL argues about this repeatedly, because he FAILS to recognize, the Lord Accomplished GIVING His Gift to ALL...but that many REJECT TAKING the Lords Gift., and thus Lose their Gift.

BOL teaches a man ACCEPTS the Lords Gift, and can THEN reject the Lords Gift..which is false.

Every man has been GIVEN the Lords GIFT, when the Lord's flesh died on the Cross.

Every man MUST TAKE the Lords Gift or forfeit it, and BE without it, by rejecting it,
(Not by taking it then throwing in back in the Lords face, as BreadOfLife teaches).

Once a man HAS FREELY chosen to ACCEPT the Lords Gift of Salvation....it's a one time event of YOUR Acceptance and the Lord God Accepting YOU GIVING YOUR FLESH unto DEATH....JUST AS HE DID.

Just as IF I offered you A gift....you either take it or reject it. You do not over and over and over Take the Gift I offered to you.

The Lord God provided the SECURITY "IN" His Gift He Gave to the Entire World...

If a man hearing and learning and believing IN the Gift thee Lord God provided, that man IS IN the Security of the Lords Gift....

If that man NEVER TAKES possession, by Agreeing to ACCEPT the Lords Gift....He loses his security, his salvation, his gifts of measures of faith ..... ie all the things thee Lord God has GIVEN for the Entire World.

Just as if YOU refused a Gift I had for you...
You don't take "it"... YOU thus do not HAVE IT... By your own Choice YOU rejected it.

Have you been IN a Church building, observing men following the teaching of Jesus Christ, praising Him, learning about Him, believing in Him...being enlightened, secure in learing about His gifts of salvation and quickening....??

And then NEXT WEEK...they Choose to Give their life to the Lord and Accept His Gifts?

What about LAST WEEK? Were they Saved or Born Again? No.

Were they being given measures of Faith? Yes
Were they being warned to stay the course or they put themselves in jeopardy, vulnerability of influences of the corruption of the world, to maybe Walk away and follow something other than thee Lord God? Yes.

Were they taught, they have to Choose to submit to the Lord ... or not? Yes.

Were they taught, Their Submission, is a Choice to BE SURE OF...Because it is FOREVER? Yes.

Is it a choice from their Logical mind God accepts? No.

Why not? Because the Carnal Mind is Against God....and wishy washy, ever changing to boot!

It is a choice from their Natural spirit in their heart...God accepts? Yes.

And right after they Confess their belief, from their natural spirit in their heart...

What does God do?
Gives them a NEW SPIRIT.
And NEW HEART.

Ezek 11:19
Ezek 18:31
Ezek 36:26

Does God give a man A NEW SPIRIT, that will REJECT GOD? No

Does God give a man A NEW HEART, that will REJECT God? No.

And what about the OLD natual spirit and old heart..........DEAD!

Can a DEAD MAN, who knows nothing, then know to ACCEPT or REJECT God? No.

So....a natural spirit in a natural heart of a natural man..is THAT which ACCEPTS their Lord Gods GIFT of Salvation.

And ONCE a man ACCEPTS the Lords Gift...
FROM that natural mans natural spirit in his natural heart......

The mans flesh is crucified dead with Christ.
The mans OLD spirit becomes dead.
The mans OLD heart becomes dead.
The mans Corrupt SOUL becomes Restored, back to what it was...(which was good, as Gen taught GOOD is how God described His creation of mankind).

So....then HOW many times was the Lord crucified? Once
How many times does the Lord forgive a man for being born in sin and having committed sin against Him? Once
What is a mans SIN against God?
......Disbelief
How does the man REMAIN FOREVER IN BELIEF IN God?
......By the POWER of Gods Spirit within a man.
How many times is a mans soul restored?
once
How many times is a man born again and he receives a new spirit?
Once
How many times is a man given a new heart?
Once.
....How many times can Gods Spirit come and go in and out of NATURAL men?
....MANY TIMES.
How many times can thee Lord Gods Spirit come and go in and out of a CONVERTED man?
....Come IN Once and Never Leave.

Yes Scripture teaches Men IN the process of learning are secure....
They are being enlightened, believing, following....and at the same time being taught they are still vulnerable to the worlds corruption, and without their ACCEPTANCE of the Lords Gift, they ARE at risk falling away.

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[Taken]

Wow!!! What great liberty we have in Christ. If this ever was to leak out in the CC they would see they don’t need this religious hierarchy. All they need is Christ.

Yes...it is ABOUT being IN COMMITTED AGREEMENT with thee HOLY Father Lord God Almighty, who is NOT OF this world.

Yes...it is ABOUT being IN COMMITTED AGREEMENT to become Accepted IN CHRIST'S Church, which is "NOT OF THIS WORLD".

It is NOT about LIP Service "ABOUT" thee Lord God, and then being Commited to an Earthly man, making him your Holy Father...or an Earthy Church "OF" this world.

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[Taken]

I wanted to reply to your post to me.
When I clicked on REPLY,,,everything would NOT post to my reply page.
It was late, so I didn't figure out why.

Just didn't want you to think I was ignoring your reply to me.

Don't know about a missing post...but know you are always diligent in responding to posts, so no issue there.

God Bless,
Taken

 

[GodsGrace]

Hi H ~

Colossians 1:22-23
22yet He has now reconciled you in His fleshly body through death, in order to present you before Him holy and blameless and beyond reproach— 23if indeed you continue in the faith firmly established and steadfast, and not moved away from the hope of the gospel that you have heard, which was proclaimed in all creation under heaven, and of which I, Paul, was made a minister.

"He has"...."you"..."His"...

This is about Jesus...who Fulfilled "HIS" mission "HE" came to Accomplish on Earth.

He said: He came to GIVE HIS Body of Flesh, for the LIFE of the World.

John 6:51
[51] I am the living bread which came down from heaven: if any man eat of this bread, he shall live for ever: and the bread that I will give is my flesh, which I will give for the life of the world.

Just Before Jesus' Body of Flesh DIED on the Cross...He SAID...

John 19
[30] When Jesus therefore had received the vinegar, he said, It is finished: and he bowed his head, and gave up the ghost.

What was "FINISHED"?

WHAT "HE" came to "ACCOMPLISH".

(Isaiah notifies us the Word of God would NOT RETURN to God, void, without having Accomplished what he was sent to Do)

Isaiah 55:
[11] So shall my word be that goeth forth out of my mouth: it shall not return unto me void, but it shallaccomplish that which I please, and it shall prosper in the thing whereto I sent it.

John 19
[28] After this, Jesus knowing that all things were nowaccomplished, that the scripture might be fulfilled, saith, I thirst.

SO WHAT expressly did Jesus come to ACCOMPLISH?

He came TO GIVE HIS FLESH...FOR the Life of ....who? The ENTIRE WORLD.

Did He give HIS Flesh body?
...Yes

AND...So, HE, Christ Jesus Accomplished what HE, was sent tO DO?
...Yes

AND EVERY man of the ENTIRE WORLD ... HAS a GIFT from thee Lord God?
...Yes?

But, But But....Giving BY THE Lord God...
IS ONLY HALF of the EQUASION...

What ABOUT EVERY man of the Entire world?

Does a man HAVE TO "TAKE" the Gift?
OR
IS the Lord Gods GIFT, "FORCED" upon Every man of the Entire World?

Giving is what the Lord God has Accomplished.
"TAKING" is what is NOT ACCOMPLISHED, by every single man of the Entire world.

I can notify you I HAVE a GIFT for you.
I can notify you it is especially FOR YOU.
I can tell you WHAT the GIFT is.
I can hand deliver the Gift TO YOU...

Does that mean YOU MUST "TAKE" IT?
No.

Thee ALL KNOWING Lord God...KNEW not ALL men WOULD "TAKE" His Gift.

Does that UNDO, Him having GIVEN His Gift to them? No.

Does a man WHO REJECTS "TAKING" His Offered Gift, mean, His Gift was NOT given them? No.

It means THEY REJECTED and REFUSED to "TAKE" His GIft.

Thee ALL Knowing Lord God....informs us...
HE caused DIVISION among men.

Luke 12
[51] Suppose ye that I am come to give peace on earth? I tell you, Nay; but rather division:

He HAS Given His Gift of Salvation to the Entire World.
He FORCES NOONE to TAKE His GIFT of Salvation.
Those WHO freely Choose TO TAKE HIS GIFT...are DIVIDED FROM...
THose WHO freely Choose TO REJECT HIS GIFT.

BOL argues about this repeatedly, because he FAILS to recognize, the Lord Accomplished GIVING His Gift to ALL...but that many REJECT TAKING the Lords Gift., and thus Lose their Gift.

BOL teaches a man ACCEPTS the Lords Gift, and can THEN reject the Lords Gift..which is false.

Every man has been GIVEN the Lords GIFT, when the Lord's flesh died on the Cross.

Every man MUST TAKE the Lords Gift or forfeit it, and BE without it, by rejecting it,
(Not by taking it then throwing in back in the Lords face, as BreadOfLife teaches).

Once a man HAS FREELY chosen to ACCEPT the Lords Gift of Salvation....it's a one time event of YOUR Acceptance and the Lord God Accepting YOU GIVING YOUR FLESH unto DEATH....JUST AS HE DID.

Just as IF I offered you A gift....you either take it or reject it. You do not over and over and over Take the Gift I offered to you.

The Lord God provided the SECURITY "IN" His Gift He Gave to the Entire World...

If a man hearing and learning and believing IN the Gift thee Lord God provided, that man IS IN the Security of the Lords Gift....

If that man NEVER TAKES possession, by Agreeing to ACCEPT the Lords Gift....He loses his security, his salvation, his gifts of measures of faith ..... ie all the things thee Lord God has GIVEN for the Entire World.

Just as if YOU refused a Gift I had for you...
You don't take "it"... YOU thus do not HAVE IT... By your own Choice YOU rejected it.

Have you been IN a Church building, observing men following the teaching of Jesus Christ, praising Him, learning about Him, believing in Him...being enlightened, secure in learing about His gifts of salvation and quickening....??

And then NEXT WEEK...they Choose to Give their life to the Lord and Accept His Gifts?

What about LAST WEEK? Were they Saved or Born Again? No.

Were they being given measures of Faith? Yes
Were they being warned to stay the course or they put themselves in jeopardy, vulnerability of influences of the corruption of the world, to maybe Walk away and follow something other than thee Lord God? Yes.

Were they taught, they have to Choose to submit to the Lord ... or not? Yes.

Were they taught, Their Submission, is a Choice to BE SURE OF...Because it is FOREVER? Yes.

Is it a choice from their Logical mind God accepts? No.

Why not? Because the Carnal Mind is Against God....and wishy washy, ever changing to boot!

It is a choice from their Natural spirit in their heart...God accepts? Yes.

And right after they Confess their belief, from their natural spirit in their heart...

What does God do?
Gives them a NEW SPIRIT.
And NEW HEART.

Ezek 11:19
Ezek 18:31
Ezek 36:26

Does God give a man A NEW SPIRIT, that will REJECT GOD? No

Does God give a man A NEW HEART, that will REJECT God? No.

And what about the OLD natual spirit and old heart..........DEAD!

Can a DEAD MAN, who knows nothing, then know to ACCEPT or REJECT God? No.

So....a natural spirit in a natural heart of a natural man..is THAT which ACCEPTS their Lord Gods GIFT of Salvation.

And ONCE a man ACCEPTS the Lords Gift...
FROM that natural mans natural spirit in his natural heart......

The mans flesh is crucified dead with Christ.
The mans OLD spirit becomes dead.
The mans OLD heart becomes dead.
The mans Corrupt SOUL becomes Restored, back to what it was...(which was good, as Gen taught GOOD is how God described His creation of mankind).

So....then HOW many times was the Lord crucified? Once
How many times does the Lord forgive a man for being born in sin and having committed sin against Him? Once
What is a mans SIN against God?
......Disbelief
How does the man REMAIN FOREVER IN BELIEF IN God?
......By the POWER of Gods Spirit within a man.
How many times is a mans soul restored?
once
How many times is a man born again and he receives a new spirit?
Once
How many times is a man given a new heart?
Once.
....How many times can Gods Spirit come and go in and out of NATURAL men?
....MANY TIMES.
How many times can thee Lord Gods Spirit come and go in and out of a CONVERTED man?
....Come IN Once and Never Leave.

Yes Scripture teaches Men IN the process of learning are secure....
They are being enlightened, believing, following....and at the same time being taught they are still vulnerable to the worlds corruption, and without their ACCEPTANCE of the Lords Gift, they ARE at risk falling away.

Glory to God,
Taken[/QUOTE]




You write very complete thoughts and you have an enviable method of presenting the gospel.

You know I don't agree with unconditional security...I do believe it is conditional upon our being IN THE LORD when we die.

The N.T. has scripture that shows it is possible to just walk away from God and fall from our faith. This problem existed also in O.T. times.

I'm not here to debate this...I just wanted to show @Enoch111 that anything could be proven from the bible and so I think other methods are also necessary to arrive at a truth. And even then, I'm not too sure we should be 100% sure that we've arrived.

God is too big,,,and we're too small.
Jesus kind of changed that, didn't He?

I couldn't agree more with you that Jesus accomplished and finished what HE was supposed to do. Are WE supposed to do anything except believe? Is that enough to change the world? If so, how.

Just want to say that it's not the case that one could be saved one week, lost one week, saved the next week,,,etc etc.

Leaving God is serious business and our salvation does not go "on" and "off" continuously.

I can say that I respect anyone who believes in unconditional eternal security if they're living a life God would be happy with. I hear from too many that tell me they could live as they want to and never forfeit their salvation....this I cannot agree with and will post verse after verse (not that it helps...but there's those reading along that should know that Jesus DID teach how we are to behave).

 

[JohnPaul]

If I were Breadman,
I'd hightail it off this thread.

Me too GodsGrace.

 

[JohnPaul]

I believe you have misunderstood what I said. As far as BOL is concerned, any criticism of the RCC is a lie (no matter how true and factual).

As to calling other's doctrines lies, whether you wish to call them that or not, the fact remains that ALL FALSE DOCTRINES ARE LIES. Now please note what the apostle John says: Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son. (1 John 2:22)

My short time here, I've never seen BreadOfLife deny Jesus is Chist, or the Father and the Son.

 

[Enoch111]

My short time here, I've never seen BreadOfLife deny Jesus is Christ, or the Father and the Son.

Why don't you read things properly??? That was not even the issue and not even suggested. The topic was BOL calling everyone who criticizes the RCC a liar. That's his standard response.

Then someone (perhaps you) said we should never call false doctrines lies and those who promote them as liars. So the Scripture was quoted to show that the apostle John himself called false teachers liars, deceivers, and antichrists.

Could we apply those terms to Roman Catholic hierarchy? Absolutely. They have been deceiving their adherents fro centuries.

 

[JohnPaul]

Why don't you read things properly??? That was not even the issue and not even suggested. The topic was BOL calling everyone who criticizes the RCC a liar. That's his standard response.

Then someone (perhaps you) said we should never call false doctrines lies and those who promote them as liars. So the Scripture was quoted to show that the apostle John himself called false teachers liars, deceivers, and antichrists.

Could we apply those terms to Roman Catholic hierarchy? Absolutely. They have been deceiving their adherents fro centuries.

Then why did you post it? I’m no one to call anyone’s beliefs a lie, I can only judge for myself what is true belief for me. I left the Roman Catholic Church because of what I felt. I never used the term false, you did.

False to me is doctrines that don’t believe in Jesus Christ as Son of God our Lord and Savior, such as Judaism, Islam, Buddhism, Hinduism and so forth.

If the Roman Catholic Church brings BoL close to God the father and our Lord Jesus Christ, then good for him and the Church.

 

[aspen]

WHAT "supposed" sinlessness?

I NEVER claimed that.



I Never claimed that.

Did you claim that for me?
If so, then why should I be held to explain what you said?



I know of no such teaching... about MEN being sinnless or about what you mean perfect love is. Where is that teaching?



Can't answer, until you define sinnless, define love perfectly, define every minute of my day.

Glory to God,
Taken

Well, I guess I have the wrong person. I am sorry.

Sin is incomplete love. If everyone loved perfectly, as Christ does and as we were created to do, sin would cease to exist by definition. Take any sin and apply Christ’s practice - murder cannot be carried out in thought or deed if you stop and take the perspective of the person, experience sympathy, empathy, love, and finally forgiveness for them and yourself for not meeting your expectations. You cannot even lie because you know what it feels like to be lied to and eventually- probably in heaven our sanctification will be perfected and we will not have to go through all these clunky steps - we will naturally repair all relationships and sin will be defeated

 

[Taken]

You write very complete thoughts and you have an enviable method of presenting the gospel.

Thank you.

You know I don't agree with unconditional security...

Neither do I. I believe the Lord Himself set the "CONDITION"..

John 6:51
51 I am the living bread which came down out of heaven: if any man eat of this bread, he shall live for ever: yea and the bread which I will give is my flesh, for the life of the world.

And that is what I was speaking of...ie A man meeting that condition...WHEN...he accepts the Lords offering, AND...Becomes "CONVERTED".

do believe it is conditional upon our being IN THE LORD when we die.

Yes, it is. And an OT mans Salvation was "conditional" upon Keeping Faithful to God throughout his Life until his Death. And How another could Observe another man being "faithful", was by the other mans obedience to their Laws, and doing good works.

So, I do agree, at the end of a mans physical life...he must be IN the Lord.

Jesus brought us a new covenant, a new promise, For the man WHO heard, learned, followed, believed, (IN God AND IN Christ Jesus), received measures of faith, continued following, continued faith increase...that was his security...LEADING up to and Preparing that man FOR "CONVERSION...

How many men FAILED, under the OT? Continuously violating the Laws, yearly giving an animals blood and repeatedly Repenting?

Laws can NOT save a Man. Animal blood can not SAVE a man. We required PURE BLOOD, to pay for the SIN (of disbelief in God)...and oops...NO human has Pure BLOOD to give.
Jesus ... WiTH PURE BLOOD came and OFFERED HIS, for the FORGIVENESS of the WHOLE WORLD...AND death of HIS Flesh for the LIFE of the WHOLE WORLD...

AND WOW WOW WOW...Miraculously, through the Power/Spirit of God....WE can ACCEPT, Jesus' SINLESS Flesh as PAYMENT for our Corrupt Flesh, and Jesus' PURE Blood as PAYMENT for our Corrupt Blood (which our Blood IS our natural life); (Gen 9:4)...
BEFORE OUR NATURAL PHYSICAL DEATH!

Being Crucified WITH Christ...a Spiritual and Acceptable Death, for us, TO receive Forever Forgiveness...and JUSTIFICATION...to Receive A NEW BODY, a Glorified body.
We in the meantime...
1) continue to live in our physically alive body
2) spiritually Live IN Christ's RISEN Body
(Which is How we are IN Him)

NOW...like you said...Before our physical death...which we know not when that shall be...we, THE Converted, are Already Prepared...Wholly Whole;
Our, body, soul, spirit...
Saved in Christ...Secure IN Christ Jesus..
Once IN Christ...the Converted are SECUR-ED in Christ, and no one can take that man Away from Christ.

God Bless,
Taken

 

[Taken]

GodsGrace ~

The N.T. has scripture that shows it is possible to just walk away from God and fall from our faith. This problem existed also in O.T. times.

Correct...That Possibility Exists....UNTIL...
A man is CONVERTED "IN" Christ.
Believers can walk away. Believers can DOUBT. Believers can be without Wisdom and withou understanding....BELIEVING does not SAVE a man....CONVERSION DOES.

The Disciples believed...doubted, denied, wondered, EVEN JUDAS.
What was different between the 11 and Judas?
The 11 CONTINUED in "their Security" ...thee Lord Jesus...to hear, listen, learn, believe, following...AND....every day were being prepared, receiving INCREASED FAITH from God...AND...ALL 11 Confessed to the Lord Jesus, their Belief IN HIM, that He is the Son of God....AND...ALL 11 BECAME BAPTIZED IN the Spirit...CONVERTED.

And JUDAS? The Jew, the Treasurer and keeper of the Disciples funds? JUDAS presents himself as believing Jesus was a "TEACHER", as Judas ONLY addressed Jesus as "RABBI", not "Lord"...Judas also attempted to reprimand Mary for using expensive oil to wash Jesus' feet, and tried to argue with Jesus, that money used for the Oil would be better to be put in the Treasury of the disciples. When Jesus did not agree, JUDAS, proceeded to BETRAY Jesus on the Evening He was in the garden Praying.

Judas Lost his security. Judas Lost his Salvaton.

Glory to God,
Taken