BreadOfLife ~ UNPROVEN CLAIMS..

[Taken]

"IF" YOU claim to be forgiven of ALL past sin –

I have never claimed what your words say.

claim you no longer sin –

Correct.

then you are claiming to be WITHOUT sin.

No. You said "IF"... and I didn't say what YOU SAID.

It’s that simple.

A TRUTH IS NEVER SIMPLE...
SINCE YOU Have APPOINTeD YOURSELF the DICTATOR....creating YOUR OWN...
"IF"..."THEN" scenario, and PRETENDING it Applies to Other People.

However – as I have shown you on numerous occasions – Scripture disagrees with you (1 John 1:8).

You are too DISHONEST to ADMIT "you" make FALSE ACCUSATIONS and CLAIMS and then Pick a Verse and say...SEE, SEE, the Truth is NOT IN YOU....another FALSE Accusation BASED ON YOUR OWN FALSE CLAIM.

You have PROVED without a DOUBT...
You make FALSE CLAIMS for OTHER People,
Then ATTEMPT to Badger people with the WORD OF GOD, that does not APPLY to them.

THAT is YOUR FRUIT...Dishonesty, and then trying to USE the WORD OF GOD, to support your DISHONESTY.

Jesus gave a WARNING to People who DO what YOU DO.. You should HEED His WARNING!

Matt 7
[23] And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[Taken]

Now, -- exactly what Topic and what Post did @Taken assert that repentance ERASES a person's ability to sin? -- Because he clears appears to be denying the doctrine which you accuse.


Whew,
Bobby Jo

Don't hold your breath...

BreadOfLife...REWRITES others words, then looks for a Scripture AGAINST what "he" has rewritten....and then pretends he is the appointed dictator, to tell people what the Scripture says FOR them...
AFTER, he has changed and rewritten their words.

Your assertion is Correct...I deny BOL's false claims he repeatedly attempts to MAKE "FOR ME".

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[Bobby Jo]

Turn the other cheek doesn't mean what 95% of Christians think it does.
Look it up.

EXACTLY. We "turn the other cheek" as Jesus did for those who didn't know what they were doing, -- that is to say, the world. But we DO NOT turn the other cheek for those who profess Christianity. We hold THEM ACCOUNTABLE!

Matt. 5:39 But I say to you, Do not resist one who is evil. But if any one strikes you on the right cheek, turn to him the other also;​

Luke 6:27 “But I say to you that hear, Love your enemies, do good to those who hate you, 28 bless those who curse you, pray for those who abuse you. 29 To him who strikes you on the cheek, offer the other also​

Bobby Jo

 

[Bobby Jo]

OK, @Taken,

Quote @BreadOfLife:

claim you no longer sin –​

Quote @Taken:

Correct.​

As Ricky used to say: LUCY!! You got some 'splain'in to do.

At face value, I'm not aware that ANYONE ~no longer sins~.

Certainly we are free of sin when we repent, but we still continue to sin either by commission, or by omission, typically by BOTH. So, -- PLEASE EXPLAIN/CLARIFY your position.

Thanks,
Bobby Jo

 

[Helen]

This thread is about @Taken's obsession with ME.

It must make you proud to know that a whole thread has been dedicated to you alone Your very own thread.

I have read some of it...but I find nothing much new.
But then again, Solomon said "there is nothing new under the sun". LOL

Bless you. ...H

 

[Taken]

OK, @Taken,

Quote @BreadOfLife:

claim you no longer sin –​

Quote @Taken:

Correct.​

As Ricky used to say: LUCY!! You got some 'splain'in to do.

At face value, I'm not aware that ANYONE ~no longer sins~.

Certainly we are free of sin when we repent, but we still continue to sin either by commission, or by omission, typically by BOTH. So, -- PLEASE EXPLAIN/CLARIFY your position.

Thanks,
Bobby Jo

My position is:

MY SIN "was" AGAINST GOD, for having been BORN IN SIN, having corrupted my SOUL, WITHIN my Corrupt Flesh.

WHEN, I trusted to hear, follow, believe Thee Lord's Word,
AND CONFESSED I
TRUSTED TO CHOOSE TO Heartfully GIVE MY LIFE TO the Lord God...

He ACCEPTED my Confession...
AND He FORGAVE MY DISBELIEF IN Him.

AND He "MADE" me Wholly Whole BY, THROUGH, and IN Him, ONCE and FOREVER.

He MADE me BORN of His SEED.

He MADE me established as "his son".

Whosoever IS BORN "of" God, DOES NOT SIN, CAN NOT SIN.

1 John 3:9
[9] Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

I am BORN of God, and thus am WHOSOEVER, and openly CLAIM, I sin NO MORE, Because I am BORN OF GOD.

His POWER WITHIN ME KEEPS me FOREVER
FAITHFUL "TO" Him.

Forever my Standing IS Established "IN" and "WITH" Him.

Scripture is crystal clear...

Matt 12
[30] He that is not with me is against me; and he that gathereth not with me scattereth abroad.

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[BreadOfLife]

BoL
Do remarrieds receive communion now?

Did they 10 years ago?

Were they ALLOWED INTO A CHURCH before 1918?

THE DOCTRINE HAS CHANGED.
ACCEPT IT.

That shows your ignorance.
This is NOT a doctrine but a DISCIPLINE.

I suggest you learn the difference before making your usual false claims.

 

[ScottA]

I find it hilarious that you create an entire thread about my exposing your lies - when ALL you had to do is to open up your Bible and turn to 1 John 1:8, where it says emphatically:

1 John 1:8
If we claim to be without sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us.

Now, pay attention . . .

When a Christian repents of his sin and asks for forgiveness in the name of Jesus – he is forgiven. According your own warped theology – this not only makes you free from you past sin, but it also erases your ability to commit FUTURE sins. So, you are saying that you are without sin, which, according to Scripture is a LIE.

This is a lie that you have repeated DOZENS of times on this forum – so this isn’t an “unproven claim”.
Your obsession with me seems to have reached a breaking point . . .

You are not reconciling scripture against scripture.

Your claiming one scripture that superficially suits you, that when taken out of context would appear to contradict these below, just proves you unknowledgeable:

1 John 3:6
Whoever abides in Him does not sin.

1 John 5:18
We know that whoever is born of God does not sin;

1 John 3:9
Whoever has been born of God does not sin, for His seed remains in him; and he cannot sin, because he has been born of God.

...Strike three, you're out!

 

[BreadOfLife]

I see you are Again trying to RE-WRITE SCRIPTURE.

The Scripture does NOT say what you say...

The Scripture SAYS:

1 John 1:
[8a] If we say that we have no sin,

You repeatedly HAVE ACCUSED people of making that CLAIM....

You have NOT ONCE QUOTED ANY PERSON making that CLAIM...

Your DISHONESTY revealed.

Then the simplest solution to this communication gap is to answer a few questions:

a) Were you forgiven of ALL of your past sins?
b) Has God erased those sins and hold you no longer accountable?
c) Have you stopped sinning since being born again?

If your answer is "Yes" to all of the above - then you are claiming to be WITHOUT sin and the truth is NOT in you per 1 John 1:8 . . .

 

[BreadOfLife]

You are not reconciling scripture against scripture.

Your claiming one scripture that superficially suits you, that when taken out of context would appear to contradict these below, just proves you unknowledgeable:

1 John 3:6
Whoever abides in Him does not sin.

1 John 5:18
We know that whoever is born of God does not sin;

1 John 3:9
Whoever has been born of God does not sin, for His seed remains in him; and he cannot sin, because he has been born of God.

...Strike three, you're out!

Actually - you never even threw a pitch because you took ALL 3 verses out of context.

1 John 3:6, 9 is talking about living a life of sin. Christians don't live a life of willful sin - we stumble secause we are imperfect.
We strive NOT to sin but we still stumble - as Paul admits in Romans 7:15-25.

As for 1 John 5:18 - John is talking about sin that causes death, or "Mortal" sin.
Once again, he is talking about living a life of willful sin - not occasionally stumbling.
Context is NOT your friend . . .

 

[ScottA]

Then the simplest solution to this communication gap is to answer a few questions:

a) Were you forgiven of ALL of your past sins?
b) Has God erased those sins and hold you no longer accountable?
c) Have you stopped sinning since being born again?

If your answer is "Yes" to all of the above - then you are claiming to be WITHOUT sin and the truth is NOT in you per 1 John 1:8 . . .

No...that is not at all how it works.

Now you pay attention...

When one is [actually] born again of the spirit of God, he is born again having died, and that which has died can no more sin for he is dead.

And he who has been made alive by the spirit of God is no longer that man of sin, but is One with God who does not sin. To call such a one a sinner, is to call God a sinner, it is blaspheme.

 

[BreadOfLife]

YOU are RIGHT! -- I missed the sentence structure which incompletely attempted to convey (missing the ["to" your own theology]) where you were ACCUSING ANOTHER of espousing a theology where ~repentence erases your ability to commit FUTURE sins~. OF COURSE you didn't cite their actual post. Next time, let me suggest that you reference their actual post so we can follow along.

Now, -- exactly what Topic and what Post did @Taken assert that repentance ERASES a person's ability to sin? -- Because he clears appears to be denying the doctrine which you accuse.


Whew,
Bobby Jo

I understand that it is easy to get the wrong impression from a conversation if there are no references. I will try to include them in the future.

As for your question in RED - I have had MANY conversations with @Taken over the years and have gleaned this information from those conversations. This is the classic Protestant position on sin and forgiveness.

 

[ScottA]

Actually - you never even threw a pitch because you took ALL 3 verses out of context.

1 John 3:6, 9 is talking about living a life of sin. Christians don't live a life of willful sin - we stumble secause we are imperfect.
We strive NOT to sin but we still stumble - as Paul admits in Romans 7:15-25.

As for 1 John 5:18 - John is talking about sin that causes death, or "Mortal" sin.
Once again, he is talking about living a life of willful sin - not occasionally stumbling.
Context is NOT your friend . . .

You reading and claiming the verses all out of context...does nothing for your claim. Your multitude of wrongs doesn't make a right. Not even.

 

[BreadOfLife]

No...that is not at all how it works.

Now you pay attention...

When one is [actually] born again of the spirit of God, he is born again having died, and that which has died can no more sin for he is dead.

And he who has been made alive by the spirit of God is no longer that man of sin, but is One with God who does not sin. To call such a one a sinner, is to call God a sinner, it is blaspheme.

Then Paul and John are blasphemers. And since they were inspired by the Holy Spirit (GOD) to write what they wrote - then you are calling GOD a hypocrite.

BOTH of them speak to themselves sinning and having sin in their lives (Rom. 7:12-25, 1 John 1:8).

 

[BreadOfLife]

You reading and claiming the verses all out of context...does nothing for your claim. Your multitude of wrongs doesn't make a right. Not even.

I didn't just "claim" that you posted those verses out of context - explained to you HOW you posted them out of context.
Your understanding of the Word of God is very limited . . .

 

[ScottA]

Then Paul and John are blasphemers. And since they were inspired by the Holy Spirit (GOD) to write what they wrote - then you are calling GOD a hypocrite.

BOTH of them speak to themselves sinning and having sin in their lives (Rom. 7:12-25, 1 John 1:8).

You show your lack of knowledge again.

Isaiah 42:19
"Who is blind but My servant, Or deaf as My messenger whom I send? Who is blind as he who is perfect, And blind as the Lord’s servant?"

Paul and John walked the line between the dead and the living. They spoke to both and even included themselves, and their words include things that only apply to the dead in Christ and others that only apply to the living in Christ. As Paul explained "I have become all things to all men, that I might by all means save some."

Thus, it is now wrong for you to read their writings and not perceive the difference between the dead and the living, and accuse the spiritual children of God using one word against another. You commit an offence which Christ warned about.

 

[GodsGrace]

That shows your ignorance.
This is NOT a doctrine but a DISCIPLINE.

I suggest you learn the difference before making your usual false claims.

Yes...what you've just stated is what I hear from my friends that are upset about the change.

If it's ONLY a discipline, why have about 10 bishops from Germany (I believe) written to the current Pope asking him to CLARIFY the little asterisk down at the bottom of item no. 8 of Amoris Laetitia?

Also, you must surely know that a doctrine is not a dogma.
I'm speaking about doctrine here...which is simply THE TEACHING of a church.

And for anyone that would like even more information as to what a doctrine is, they could find it here.

Doctrine Definition and Meaning - Bible Dictionary

 

[Taken]

Then the simplest solution to this communication gap is to answer a few questions:

Ha. The way to bridge a communication GAP with you...is for you to stop SPEAKING FOR ME!

a)

Were you forgiven of ALL of your past sins?

I have never said That.

I have said; Thee Lord God has forgiven ALL of my Sins.

b)

Has God erased those sins and hold you no longer accountable?

I have never said that.

I have said; Thee Lord God has covered my Sins.

I have said; Thee Lord God has Forgiven ALL of my Sins, Covered them, and Remembers them no more.

c)

Have you stopped sinning since being born again?

I have said; I sin NO MORE. And Yes, that became effective, AFTER being born again.

If your answer is "Yes" to all of the above - then you are claiming to be WITHOUT sin and the truth is NOT in you per 1 John 1:8 . . .

Hogwash.... 1 John 1:8 makes NO "IF" condition...
1) about God "forgiving" a man
2) about God "erasing" sin
3) about a man "stopping sinning"

1 John 1:8 condition of "IF" is "IF" a man claims to HAVE NO SIN.

Noone has claimed that.

The communication will NEVER IMPROVE between us AS LONG AS you keep trying to SPEAK FOR ME....or REWRITE Scripture.

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[Taken]

Then Paul and John are blasphemers. And since they were inspired by the Holy Spirit (GOD) to write what they wrote - then you are calling GOD a hypocrite.

BOTH of them speak to themselves sinning and having sin in their lives (Rom. 7:12-25, 1 John 1:8).

You display absolute ignorance of understanding what things mean, then make up unGodly accusations toward others because of your utter lack of wisdom.

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[Bobby Jo]

Well, from MY PERSPECTIVE, -- Paul wrote that he has a "thorn in the flesh" which he asked GOD to remove three times, but GOD let Paul suffer with imperfections so that he would not become puffed up:

2 Cor. 12:5 5 On behalf of this man I will boast, but on my own behalf I will not boast, except of my weaknesses. 6 Though if I wish to boast, I shall not be a fool, for I shall be speaking the truth. But I refrain from it, so that no one may think more of me than he sees in me or hears from me. 7 And to keep me from being too elated by the abundance of revelations, a thorn was given me in the flesh, a messenger of Satan, to harass me, to keep me from being too elated. 8 Three times I besought the Lord about this, that it should leave me; 9 but he said to me, “My grace is sufficient for you, for my power is made perfect in weakness.” I will all the more gladly boast of my weaknesses, that the power of Christ may rest upon me.​

On this subject, it appears to me that @BreadOfLife IS CORRECT in his premise, and no matter how someone might attempt to parse repentance and forgiveness, each of us still have temptations and still sin regardless of being "born again".

Quote @Taken, Post #158:

I have said; I sin NO MORE. And Yes, that became effective, AFTER being born again.​

So unless someone has attained what GOD had already disallowed, no man can assert that he sins no more. And if he does, then he is certainly misguided/confused/doctrinally-misinformed/deluded/etc..


Bobby Jo