BREAKING OF BREAD

[marksman]

1Co 11:19 For also heresies need to be among you, so that the approved ones may become revealed among you.
1Co 11:20 Then you coming together into one place, it is not to eat the Lord's supper.
1Co 11:21 For each one takes his own supper first in the eating; and one is hungry, and another drunken.
1Co 11:22 For do you not have houses in which to eat and to drink? Or do you despise the assembly of God, and shame those who have not? What do I say to you? Shall I praise you for this? I do not praise.
1Co 11:23 For I received from the Lord what I also delivered to you, that the Lord Jesus in the night in which He was betrayed took bread;
1Co 11:24 and giving thanks, He broke and said, Take, eat; this is My body which is broken on behalf of you; this do in remembrance of Me.
1Co 11:25 In the same way the cup also, after supping, saying, This cup is the New Covenant in My blood; as often as you drink, do this in remembrance of Me. See Luke 22:19, 20
1Co 11:26 For as often as you may eat this bread, and drink this cup, you solemnly proclaim the death of the Lord, until He shall come.
1Co 11:27 So that whoever should eat this bread, or drink the cup of the Lord, unworthily, that one will be guilty of the body and of the blood of the Lord.
1Co 11:28 But let a man examine himself, and so let him eat of the bread, and let him drink of the cup;
1Co 11:29 for he eating and drinking unworthily eats and drinks judgment to himself, not discerning the body of the Lord.
1Co 11:30 For this reason many among you are weak and feeble, and many sleep.
1Co 11:31 For if we discerned ourselves, we would not be judged.
1Co 11:32 But being judged, we are corrected by the Lord, that we not be condemned with the world.
1Co 11:33 So that, my brothers, coming together to eat, wait for one another.
1Co 11:34 But if anyone is hungry, let him eat at home, that you may not come together for judgment. And the other things I will set in order whenever I come.

Part two to follow.

 

[marksman]

PART TWO

This passage of scripture is used time and time again to justify giving people a bit of bread and a sip of wine under the heading of the Lord's Supper. However, when one studies all of the passage and the meaning of words in Greek, you find out that is has nothing at all to do with the Lord's supper.

This passage is Paul's instruction on how to conduct themselves during their communal meals and was necessary as some things were happening that were bringing the gathering into disrepute explained by Paul as not discerning the body of the Lord.

One has to draw a longbow to make this a bread/sip scenario as first the NT Church did not have a bread/sip scenario but they did have communal meals all the time. In this case, to make this passage a bread/sip scenario, you have to ignore the meat of it. (pun intended).

I am not going to do a line by line exposition, rather I will bring out relevant parts and words that show the real meaning of the passage.

So let's start with verse 20 where it says that it is not the Lord's supper you eat. The word supper in the Greek means banquet or feast. That in itself rules out the bread/sip scenario as you cannot have a banquet with a bread/sip scenario. If I put on a banquet for someone, the table is laden with all sorts of goodies that are enough to make your mouth water.

It was standard practice that everyone would contribute to the meal if you were able to. Obviously slaves and some widows were unable to so everyone mucked in and made sure there was enough for themselves and the others who could contribute to the meal.

Verse 21 says that some of them were eating without regard to others. Which means that some went without and those eating got drunk. How can this happen with the bread/sip scenario?

Verse 22. If anyone was hungry they were told to eat at home first. Hunger would not have been solved with the bread/sip scenario.

Verse 23. This instruction was given as part of the Passover meal which the church celebrated once a year because it was a Jewish church that did not stop being Jews so they would have adopted the Jewish feasts. In the beginning, it was known as "The Way" a sect of Judaism. That meant once a year Passover meal, not once a week Lord's Supper which is not a meal.

With the Passover meal, taking bread by the head of the house and passing it round to the guests was normal as part of the meal. There were four glasses of wine, each one indication something to do with the celebration. Up till the Passover that Jesus officiated over they had always met to celebrate their deliverance from Egypt and the anticipated messiah who was going to deliver them from Roman occupation. That is why they always left an empty chair at the meal in the hope he was going to come that evening.

The cup that Jesus took was the last one and he was using it to instruct the followers what the new covenant was all about. Which was a covenant in his blood, not the blood of animals as had been until now.

In verses 24 and 25 when he said it was his body and blood, those present would know that it was not literally his body and blood because Jews were forbidden to eat human flesh and drink human blood. So that puts paid to Catholic teaching on the subject.

 

[Paul Christensen]

PART TWO

This passage of scripture is used time and time again to justify giving people a bit of bread and a sip of wine under the heading of the Lord's Supper. However, when one studies all of the passage and the meaning of words in Greek, you find out that is has nothing at all to do with the Lord's supper.

This passage is Paul's instruction on how to conduct themselves during their communal meals and was necessary as some things were happening that were bringing the gathering into disrepute explained by Paul as not discerning the body of the Lord.

One has to draw a longbow to make this a bread/sip scenario as first the NT Church did not have a bread/sip scenario but they did have communal meals all the time. In this case, to make this passage a bread/sip scenario, you have to ignore the meat of it. (pun intended).

I am not going to do a line by line exposition, rather I will bring out relevant parts and words that show the real meaning of the passage.

So let's start with verse 20 where it says that it is not the Lord's supper you eat. The word supper in the Greek means banquet or feast. That in itself rules out the bread/sip scenario as you cannot have a banquet with a bread/sip scenario. If I put on a banquet for someone, the table is laden with all sorts of goodies that are enough to make your mouth water.

It was standard practice that everyone would contribute to the meal if you were able to. Obviously slaves and some widows were unable to so everyone mucked in and made sure there was enough for themselves and the others who could contribute to the meal.

Verse 21 says that some of them were eating without regard to others. Which means that some went without and those eating got drunk. How can this happen with the bread/sip scenario?

Verse 22. If anyone was hungry they were told to eat at home first. Hunger would not have been solved with the bread/sip scenario.

Verse 23. This instruction was given as part of the Passover meal which the church celebrated once a year because it was a Jewish church that did not stop being Jews so they would have adopted the Jewish feasts. In the beginning, it was known as "The Way" a sect of Judaism. That meant once a year Passover meal, not once a week Lord's Supper which is not a meal.

With the Passover meal, taking bread by the head of the house and passing it round to the guests was normal as part of the meal. There were four glasses of wine, each one indication something to do with the celebration. Up till the Passover that Jesus officiated over they had always met to celebrate their deliverance from Egypt and the anticipated messiah who was going to deliver them from Roman occupation. That is why they always left an empty chair at the meal in the hope he was going to come that evening.

The cup that Jesus took was the last one and he was using it to instruct the followers what the new covenant was all about. Which was a covenant in his blood, not the blood of animals as had been until now.

In verses 24 and 25 when he said it was his body and blood, those present would know that it was not literally his body and blood because Jews were forbidden to eat human flesh and drink human blood. So that puts paid to Catholic teaching on the subject.

In many churches they have a morning tea after the Sunday service. If the last supper was held today, it might not have been bread and wine, it might have been muffins and coffee. Wine as the normal drink in the First Century in the same way as tea and coffee are today.

I don't think that I am being disrespectful to the Lord here - just being realistic. If Jesus and His disciples were having their evening supper in 2020, and were finishing their meal with muffins and coffee, He would have handed the muffins around, saying "this is my body" etc., and would have poured out the coffee saying, "This is the New Testament in my blood". He would have then said, as often as you have a meal like this, do this in remembrance of me".

So, when the church became formalised and ritualistic, then the relatively informal nature of the communal meal, called "the communion" which tells more of the fellowship of believers remembering the death and resurrection of Christ, evolved into the Lord's "snack" involving a wafer, water-biscuit, or small square of bread, and a small sip of "communion" wine, Ribena, grape juice, or even raspberry cordial!

So something that is connected with the communal fellowship of believers around a meal, turned into a formalise ceremony, thereby losing much of the real meaning of it.

 

[marksman]

PART THREE

Again in verse 25, it says as oft as you drink it.....Bear in mind that no one drank it each week in a bread/sip scenario. Although this was the Corinthian (gentile) church, when starting a church, Paul ALWAYS went to the Jewish synagogue first to preach the gospel. That means the first converts in any church were Jews and as there is nowhere in scripture where Paul taught the weekly bread/sip idea and the new converts did not see any need to stop being Jewish, the situation would have been the annual Passover meal.

So in 25 and 26, he was saying when you meet for the Passover meal you are celebrating a New Covent brought about by his blood on Calvary, not by animals. And every year, which indicated they did not ditch the Passover meal, they were to join in the meal as a celebration and remembrance of him, not of the deliverance from Egypt.

Verse 29 talks about eating and drinking unworthily. What does that mean? It means not discerning the body of the Lord. What is the body of the Lord? His physical body? No. That was dead and buried a few hours later. And a few days later he physically rose from the dead and then just over a month later he ascended into heaven leaving his physical body behind.

The body of the Lord here means the people who are gathered to remember his death. By not waiting for everyone to arrive and by not providing food for everyone, they were not discerning the body of the Lord bearing in mind that we are all members of the body of Christ.

This is confirmed in verse 33 which says that when they come together to eat they should wait for one another. Don't be selfish and start eating and drinking before others arrive especially those who could not contribute to the meal. If you are that hungry, eat something at home before you come. No mention at all about bread/sip rituals that have invaded the church.

Some points about specific words. In verse 20 the word supper in the Greek means dinner, chief meal or feast. Bread/sip? I don't think so.

In verse 24 when he talked about this being his body, the Greek word had a wide application. It could mean literally or figuratively and it could mean slave.

When the word cup is used it meant figuratively a lot or fate. In other words, they were sharing in his lot or fate, his death, and resurrection. In other words, they were identifying with what happened to him.

And when the word 'eat' is used it means meat as in verse 33 "When you come together to eat (meat). That rules out the bread/sip scenario.

 

[marksman]

In many churches they have a morning tea after the Sunday service. If the last supper was held today, it might not have been bread and wine, it might have been muffins and coffee. Wine as the normal drink in the First Century in the same way as tea and coffee are today.

I don't think that I am being disrespectful to the Lord here - just being realistic. If Jesus and His disciples were having their evening supper in 2020, and were finishing their meal with muffins and coffee, He would have handed the muffins around, saying "this is my body" etc., and would have poured out the coffee saying, "This is the New Testament in my blood". He would have then said, as often as you have a meal like this, do this in remembrance of me".

So, when the church became formalised and ritualistic, then the relatively informal nature of the communal meal, called "the communion" which tells more of the fellowship of believers remembering the death and resurrection of Christ, evolved into the Lord's "snack" involving a wafer, water-biscuit, or small square of bread, and a small sip of "communion" wine, Ribena, grape juice, or even raspberry cordial!

So something that is connected with the communal fellowship of believers around a meal, turned into a formalise ceremony, thereby losing much of the real meaning of it.

Yes, and I am pleased to say that there has been a resurgence in the celebration of the Passover meal as many Christians now are wanting to experience it for themselves so they have got together to try and replicate an authentic Passover meal. There is a synagogue about an hour's drive from where I live that puts on a Passover meal for gentiles to enable them to experience the Jewish way.

 

[Philip James]

In verses 24 and 25 when he said it was his body and blood, those present would know that it was not literally his body and blood because Jews were forbidden to eat human flesh and drink human blood. So that puts paid to Catholic teaching on the subject.

Then many of his disciples who were listening said, "This saying is hard; who can accept it?"

Since Jesus knew that his disciples were murmuring about this, he said to them, "Does this shock you?

What if you were to see the Son of Man ascending to where he was before?

Christ is risen!
Alleluia!

 

[Marymog]

PART THREE

Again in verse 25, it says as oft as you drink it.....Bear in mind that no one drank it each week in a bread/sip scenario. Although this was the Corinthian (gentile) church, when starting a church, Paul ALWAYS went to the Jewish synagogue first to preach the gospel. That means the first converts in any church were Jews and as there is nowhere in scripture where Paul taught the weekly bread/sip idea and the new converts did not see any need to stop being Jewish, the situation would have been the annual Passover meal.

So in 25 and 26, he was saying when you meet for the Passover meal you are celebrating a New Covent brought about by his blood on Calvary, not by animals. And every year, which indicated they did not ditch the Passover meal, they were to join in the meal as a celebration and remembrance of him, not of the deliverance from Egypt.

Verse 29 talks about eating and drinking unworthily. What does that mean? It means not discerning the body of the Lord. What is the body of the Lord? His physical body? No. That was dead and buried a few hours later. And a few days later he physically rose from the dead and then just over a month later he ascended into heaven leaving his physical body behind.

The body of the Lord here means the people who are gathered to remember his death. By not waiting for everyone to arrive and by not providing food for everyone, they were not discerning the body of the Lord bearing in mind that we are all members of the body of Christ.

This is confirmed in verse 33 which says that when they come together to eat they should wait for one another. Don't be selfish and start eating and drinking before others arrive especially those who could not contribute to the meal. If you are that hungry, eat something at home before you come. No mention at all about bread/sip rituals that have invaded the church.

Some points about specific words. In verse 20 the word supper in the Greek means dinner, chief meal or feast. Bread/sip? I don't think so.

In verse 24 when he talked about this being his body, the Greek word had a wide application. It could mean literally or figuratively and it could mean slave.

When the word cup is used it meant figuratively a lot or fate. In other words, they were sharing in his lot or fate, his death, and resurrection. In other words, they were identifying with what happened to him.

And when the word 'eat' is used it means meat as in verse 33 "When you come together to eat (meat). That rules out the bread/sip scenario.

Wow. Very well articulated. Is this your interpretation or are you repeating someone else’s interpretation?

Paul asked (rhetorically) Is not the cup of thanksgiving for which we give thanks a participation in the blood of Christ? And is not the bread that we break a participation in the body of Christ?

What is your interpretation of that passage?

Bible study Mary

 

[Marymog]

PART THREE

Again in verse 25, it says as oft as you drink it.....Bear in mind that no one drank it each week in a bread/sip scenario. Although this was the Corinthian (gentile) church, when starting a church, Paul ALWAYS went to the Jewish synagogue first to preach the gospel. That means the first converts in any church were Jews and as there is nowhere in scripture where Paul taught the weekly bread/sip idea and the new converts did not see any need to stop being Jewish, the situation would have been the annual Passover meal.

So in 25 and 26, he was saying when you meet for the Passover meal you are celebrating a New Covent brought about by his blood on Calvary, not by animals. And every year, which indicated they did not ditch the Passover meal, they were to join in the meal as a celebration and remembrance of him, not of the deliverance from Egypt.

Verse 29 talks about eating and drinking unworthily. What does that mean? It means not discerning the body of the Lord. What is the body of the Lord? His physical body? No. That was dead and buried a few hours later. And a few days later he physically rose from the dead and then just over a month later he ascended into heaven leaving his physical body behind.

The body of the Lord here means the people who are gathered to remember his death. By not waiting for everyone to arrive and by not providing food for everyone, they were not discerning the body of the Lord bearing in mind that we are all members of the body of Christ.

This is confirmed in verse 33 which says that when they come together to eat they should wait for one another. Don't be selfish and start eating and drinking before others arrive especially those who could not contribute to the meal. If you are that hungry, eat something at home before you come. No mention at all about bread/sip rituals that have invaded the church.

Some points about specific words. In verse 20 the word supper in the Greek means dinner, chief meal or feast. Bread/sip? I don't think so.

In verse 24 when he talked about this being his body, the Greek word had a wide application. It could mean literally or figuratively and it could mean slave.

When the word cup is used it meant figuratively a lot or fate. In other words, they were sharing in his lot or fate, his death, and resurrection. In other words, they were identifying with what happened to him.

And when the word 'eat' is used it means meat as in verse 33 "When you come together to eat (meat). That rules out the bread/sip scenario.

Hi,

I was looking forward to your interpretation of vs 30:
That is why many of you are weak and ill, and some have died” (1 Cor. 11:30).

Why would Paul believe that sickness, death, and damnation result from an unworthy reception of the Bread and a sip of wine?

Why did you add the word meat to vs33?

 

[Nancy]

Yes, and I am pleased to say that there has been a resurgence in the celebration of the Passover meal as many Christian now are wanting to experience it for themselves so they have got together to try and replicate an authentic Passover meal. There is a synagogue about an hours drive from where I live that puts on a Passover meal for gentiles to enable them to experience the Jewish way.

Back in the mid 1990's, the Church I attended did the Seder every year. No wine of course, but let me tell you...when all was said and done...we sure did a LOT of drinking grape juice, lol. I can only imagine how much wine they drank during their Passover meals! Well, it takes place over a good period of time so, hopefully the time it took for their next glass of wine, a good amount of time and food past, lol.

 

[Enoch111]

This passage of scripture is used time and time again to justify giving people a bit of bread and a sip of wine under the heading of the Lord's Supper. However, when one studies all of the passage and the meaning of words in Greek, you find out that is has nothing at all to do with the Lord's supper.

I did not expect such a nonsensical statement from you. If 1 Corinthians 11:20-34 is not about the Lord's Supper, then nothing is. It seems that you are promoting some very quirky doctrines recently (or has it been all along?).

The proper way to understand that passage is that the early Christians first had a fellowship meal, which was then followed up by a worship service during which the Breaking of Bread (the Lord's Supper) took place.

Paul was rebuking the ones who were failing to share in true fellowship (since some remained hungry), while some were over-indulging and even getting drunk.

 

[Enoch111]

I can only imagine how much wine they drank during their Passover meals!

The Jews always mingled their wine with water. Furthermore, the word "wine" can apply to pure grape juice also in the Bible.

 

[marksman]

I did not expect such a nonsensical statement from you. If 1 Corinthians 11:20-34 is not about the Lord's Supper, then nothing is. It seems that you are promoting some very quirky doctrines recently (or has it been all along?).

The proper way to understand that passage is that the early Christians first had a fellowship meal, which was then followed up by a worship service during which the Breaking of Bread (the Lord's Supper) took place.

Paul was rebuking the ones who were failing to share in true fellowship (since some remained hungry), while some were over-indulging and even getting drunk.

I look forward to an extensive exegesis of the passage from you that proves what I said was wrong. Until then, have a nice day.

 

[marksman]

Back in the mid 1990's, the Church I attended did the Seder every year. No wine of course, but let me tell you...when all was said and done...we sure did a LOT of drinking grape juice, lol. I can only imagine how much wine they drank during their Passover meals! Well, it takes place over a good period of time so, hopefully the time it took for their next glass of wine, a good amount of time and food past, lol.

That's right. The feasts were an integral part of the Jewish way of life and they celebrated them every year without fail. The Seder meal took place at the end of the Passover week so that week was definitely not one to be missed.

Oh and those who believe that it was talking about the bread/sip variety, why do you think that they are called feasts? If you don't know I will tell you. They were feasts which meant the table was laden with enough food to sink a ship.

 

[Preacher4Truth]

I did not expect such a nonsensical statement from you. If 1 Corinthians 11:20-34 is not about the Lord's Supper, then nothing is. It seems that you are promoting some very quirky doctrines recently (or has it been all along?).

The proper way to understand that passage is that the early Christians first had a fellowship meal, which was then followed up by a worship service during which the Breaking of Bread (the Lord's Supper) took place.

Paul was rebuking the ones who were failing to share in true fellowship (since some remained hungry), while some were over-indulging and even getting drunk.

It's been "all along."

 

[marksman]

Hi,

I was looking forward to your interpretation of vs 30:
That is why many of you are weak and ill, and some have died” (1 Cor. 11:30).

Why would Paul believe that sickness, death, and damnation result from an unworthy reception of the Bread and a sip of wine?

Why did you add the word meat to vs33?

I did not comment on v 30 as it was not essential in the explanation of the meal. As I said I was not going to comment on the passage verse by verse. However, when I read that verse I think of Ananias and Saphira dropping dead because they told a lie. That and verse 30 reminds us that following Jesus in those days was a serious preoccupation and could have dramatic consequences if you disobeyed the Lord.

As I said throughout the whole teaching there was NO bread/sip of wine scenario.

I did not add the word meat in v 33. It is there in the original Greek.

 

[marksman]

Wow. Very well articulated. Is this your interpretation or are you repeating someone else’s interpretation?

Paul asked (rhetorically) Is not the cup of thanksgiving for which we give thanks a participation in the blood of Christ? And is not the bread that we break a participation in the body of Christ?

What is your interpretation of that passage?

Bible study Mary

I don't as a practice use other people's work and pass it off as mine.

And as I said at the beginning I am working with a literal translation of scripture. which does not say what you say it does.

 

[marksman]

Then many of his disciples who were listening said, "This saying is hard; who can accept it?"

Since Jesus knew that his disciples were murmuring about this, he said to them, "Does this shock you?

What if you were to see the Son of Man ascending to where he was before?

Christ is risen!
Alleluia!

Sorry but I can't find those words in the passage in 1 Corinthians 11.

 

[marksman]

The Jews always mingled their wine with water. Furthermore, the word "wine" can apply to pure grape juice also in the Bible.

Whatever pure grape juice is. Having done an extensive study of Jewish life and culture, I can assure you that the Jews were alcoholic wine drinkers.

 

[Philip James]

Sorry but I can't find those words in the passage in 1 Corinthians 11.

Well that's because they're in John 6:60-62 .

Peace be with you!

 

[marksman]

Well that's because they're in John 6:60-62 .

Peace be with you!

Well, there is the problem. I wasn't doing an exegesis of John 6. I was covering 1 Corinthians 11.