Calling all Law Keepers.

[tabletalk]

The sinner lays a hand on the head of a spotless animal and sin was transferred into the body of the animal, then killed as a sacrifice, bearing sins in its body. The spotless lamb, Jesus, bore our sins in His body making payment for all. God found no pleasure in animal sacrifice and it was always His plan from the beginning to redeem us and He is very pleased with His beloved Son, our Redeemer. God has always been about having a relationship with us, not religion. God is not distant, religion says He is.

Romans 10:9, If you declare with your mouth, "Jesus is Lord," and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.

The confession is to confess Jesus is Lord, this is the good confession. To confess your sins that are already paid for by His blood is a work of the flesh.

The Holy Spirit convicts the world of sin, the sin of unbelief.

John 16:8, When he comes, he will prove the world to be in the wrong about sin and righteousness and judgment:

Believers are not of the world.

John 15:19, If you belonged to the world, it would love you as its own. As it is, you do not belong to the world, but I have chosen you out of the world. That is why the world hates you.

The book of 1John was written to Believers.
If you don't object to that conclusion, God says in verse #8. "If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us." applies to Believers. Then we confess (agree with God) our sins.

 

[bbyrd009]

The sinner lays a hand on the head of a spotless animal and sin was transferred into the body of the animal, then killed as a sacrifice, bearing sins in its body. The spotless lamb, Jesus, bore our sins in His body making payment for all. God found no pleasure in animal sacrifice and it was always His plan from the beginning to redeem us and He is very pleased with His beloved Son, our Redeemer. God has always been about having a relationship with us, not religion. God is not distant, religion says He is.

Romans 10:9, If you declare with your mouth, "Jesus is Lord," and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.

The confession is to confess Jesus is Lord, this is the good confession. To confess your sins that are already paid for by His blood is a work of the flesh.

The Holy Spirit convicts the world of sin, the sin of unbelief.

John 16:8, When he comes, he will prove the world to be in the wrong about sin and righteousness and judgment:

Believers are not of the world.

John 15:19, If you belonged to the world, it would love you as its own. As it is, you do not belong to the world, but I have chosen you out of the world. That is why the world hates you.

so, you can sin all you like, and no record is kept, and you don't have to admit when you are wrong to people you have wronged, that would even be a sin.

What about "confess your sins to each other" then?

@ByGrace , i'd be curious your opinion here, too. How do you handle "your works will be judged," or "anyone who teaches people to ignore the law," or the other verses that Armadillo won't go near? ty

 

[bbyrd009]

Can you keep teh law without breaking it, i do seriously doubt it, as none keep teh law not one because as they admit the are not perfect.

yes, i can keep it fine now, and no, there was once a time when i could not keep it, struggled with various laws, etc. But of course breaking only one law, one time, is enough to get the punishment of death, and the question for a believer is not "can they keep the law perfectly," but do they follow Jesus command to confess their sin to the offended, confession unto salvation, because obviously if you have to keep apologizing for a sin you are at least still apologizing for the sin, and this works a change in you that i should not even have to describe. And when you have to keep offering to make it right however the offended feels will make it right, it is going to get expensive to keep committing that sin, right.

as a simple illumination here, you might just follow the average 85 year old believer around for a day and silently count their sins.
Another perspective is that i am not even trying to "not sin" anymore, while at the same time i am doing my best to be quick to confess if someone comes to me with a complaint, which btw used to be virtually impossible for me.

i'm not even sure how that changed tbh, i think it had something to do with being more forgiving, somehow. For example i am not offended at your comments, like i once would have been, which is a kind of forgiveness, even if it is pitched as "not being offended."

Whats it going to be law or grace, one or teh other...

well then, disregarding the Universalist Whisperings in this v for the moment, please explain how you interpret this v?

Therefore, whoever breaks one of the least of these commands and teaches people to do so will be called least in the kingdom of heaven. But whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

which might hopefully clear up all of your confusion



(if you have any other questions i would be happy to guide you, don't hesitate to ask!)
(love that one, lol)

 

[bbyrd009]

Something to do with, not my will but your will be done, tends to put you in teh firing line, I chose God she chose the world as is so often teh case, and I got off lightly.

so you say, but wadr i do not believe you, as i can observe your confusion @ faith/works. (i am being evil here now for an example, but observe how that stuff comes back on you)

Or at least i believe you believe that is true, but there is another side to the story we are not hearing. Not that it is any of my business but would you be willing to present her side, etc--rhetorical question, that.

 

[bbyrd009]

you got it well done. Pat on the back...

so now you are going to truncate a quote to suit yourself, see, and if i was married to you i would get tired of that myself! No offense meant, i think you are a great guy, ok. The troubling implications of this particular quote we might deal with another time, or you might ask SWIM to point out, or i guess i even mocked a post or two ago, dunno if that is in this thread or not though; at the bottom of one of my posts, (i love that one) or something similar.

 

[Armadillo]

so, you can sin all you like, and no record is kept, and you don't have to admit when you are wrong to people you have wronged, that would even be a sin.

What about "confess your sins to each other" then?

If someone is under Grace and knows it and they "sin" then they need a refresher course on what being in Christ means because they are living beneath who they are.

Romans 12:2, Do not conform to the pattern of this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind. Then you will be able to test and approve what God's will is--his good, pleasing and perfect will.

Ephesians 4:23, to be made new in the attitude of your minds;

If you want to confess your sins to another, go for it, if it makes you feel better. As for forgiveness, ask for it because those you ask forgiveness from do keep a record, God doesn't. And if someone does you wrong, forgive them without them asking for it.

Romans 14:23, Anything not of faith is sin.

Believers live by faith, yes? So how can they sin? New creation, New Covenant with better promises and the old you, is dead.

2 Corinthians 5:17, Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, the new creation has come: The old has gone, the new is here!

Psalm 103:12, He has removed our sins as far from us as the east is from the west.

 

[bbyrd009]

If someone is under Grace and knows it and they "sin" then they need a refresher course on what being in Christ means because they are living beneath who they are.

ah, and what about some unintentional offense that one might give in the process of creating whatever, building a structure next to a neighbor or whatever?

If you want to confess your sins to another, go for it, if it makes you feel better.

ha well pretty obviously it makes me feel worse lol--pretty sure that's the whole point--but nonetheless "confession is unto salvation."

As for forgiveness, ask for it because those you ask forgiveness from do keep a record

got any Scrip here? I observe that yes, some do, but some do not.

Believers live by faith, yes? So how can they sin?

oh, they might be believers but have no faith, falling into the "crying Lord, Lord" category, iow most believers are surely like this, "the wide path," if it can be argued that "the world = death," or iow no path at all.

 

[amadeus]

How is it the integrity of the heart when one has to look away?
This is too funny...

Job 31:1 I made a covenant with mine eyes; why then should I think upon a maid?

 

[bbyrd009]

one might have to look away simply because the woman is virtually naked or whatever, although i do get you. I don't leer at women lustfully anymore, but i am still a man, subject to temptation

 

[Armadillo]

oh, they might be believers but have no faith,

That makes no sense.

 

[amadeus]

one might have to look away simply because the woman is virtually naked or whatever, although i do get you. I don't leer at women lustfully anymore, but i am still a man, subject to temptation

Quite a number of years ago I recall a very old preacher behind the pulpit saying something to this effect: "There may be snow on top, but there is still fire down below"

We might call that blunt or some might doubt that it should not be said in public, but sometimes we need to face even the worst parts of the truth.

 

[bbyrd009]

That makes no sense.

so you say, but what might those convicted of crying "Lord, Lord" say? There is a difference in faith and belief that is included in Scripture, while also being occluded, as the Lex will tell you, they are different words in the original, but often scribed to be the same now. Iow satan believes too, but has no faith.

 

[Truth]

There are 613 commandments in the O T, some are for children, some are for men, some are for Levits, and some are for the Kohan the High priests from Aaron's linage. there were many,many people that kept the Law, But the law did not bring anyone to Perfection!! God SAID that if you keep my Commandments, THAT blessed shall you BE when you go out, blessed shall be the Fruit of your loins, blessed shall be the fruit of your flocks, and your fields, and your Vineyards and so on!!! God also said IF you do not Keep My Commandments, THEN CURSED shall you be when you go out and so on!!! keeping Gods Commandments only brings Blessing's NOT perfection, there is only one that ever reached perfection, and that is Our Savior, and anyone trying to reach perfection is only chasing their Tail. Gods commandments are Gods will, they are His instructions on how to live before Him, and man. And mainly summed up within the 10 Commandments, But can we keep them, NO! whatever day you say you keep, do you rest, do you set that day aside, totally to him, or do you go shopping, watch football, spend your day doing whatever you feel like doing! My wife and I keep the Sabbath, sundown to sundown and we read His word, we discuss His word, we do not cook, clean, watch TV, we leave the world outside, dedicated to the Lord our God. Also keeping the Commandments is easy, we keep them based upon principle, not the letter of the Law, but by there principle's. You shall love the Lord with all your Heart, and Soul, and all your Being. And you shall Love your neighbor as yourself. the first one Love God is a commandment, right! Paul says if you keep one then you must keep them all.

 

[Angelina]

Its not about ignoring the law, its all about walking in Love and letting Love take care of it. Only those not walking in love will have any care for the law, Love does not need laws to do whats right, thats why it is Love.

Amen. Love is what love does ~

 

[GodsGrace]

Job 31:1 I made a covenant with mine eyes; why then should I think upon a maid?

The matter of the heart goes deep.
Too deep for us to even understand.
IF it's a matter of the heart, like many think they understand,
then a man could look upon a woman all he wants to, there will be no lust because his heart has changed.
If there is need to look away, that means the heart has not changed!
I'm not saying this goal will be achieved, I'm just explaining what it means for the law to be written on the heart.

Many say that we no longer need to obey it BECAUSE it's written on the heart... when in reality and as Jesus explained, we need to obey even MORE! And change internally even MORE!

 

[amadeus]

The matter of the heart goes deep.
Too deep for us to even understand.
IF it's a matter of the heart, like many think they understand,
then a man could look upon a woman all he wants to, there will be no lust because his heart has changed.
If there is need to look away, that means the heart has not changed!
I'm not saying this goal will be achieved, I'm just explaining what it means for the law to be written on the heart.

Many say that we no longer need to obey it BECAUSE it's written on the heart... when in reality and as Jesus explained, we need to obey even MORE! And change internally even MORE!

Of course with regard to becoming an overcomer, I disagree with most, but along the way until the particular point under discussion or any others is under control [overcome?], the problem remains.

The "written on the heart" is the good part, but people who are believers, I believe, too often do not really want to change certain things about themselves so they obstruct the way of the Holy Spirit in them [quench the Spirit] preventing the writing from occurring.

 

[GodsGrace]

Of course with regard to becoming an overcomer, I disagree with most, but along the way until the particular point under discussion or any others is under control [overcome?], the problem remains.

The "written on the heart" is the good part, but people who are believers, I believe, too often do not really want to change certain things about themselves so they obstruct the way of the Holy Spirit in them [quench the Spirit] preventing the writing from occurring.

If everything could be under control, we wouldn't be human.
I won't repeat, I think I've been understood.

 

[amadeus]

If everything could be under control, we wouldn't be human.
I won't repeat, I think I've been understood.

I do understand you. Every time we are to make a new decision affecting our walk with God we need to be ready to again turn the reins over to Him. Often or always we may need to ask Him for help to do even that.

 

[Richard_oti]

I guess you missed it all

Ulay, ulay lo'

you see none keep teh law, not one.. for one to keep the law one must nor break the law, if one breaks the law than one is not keeping it..

Indubitably. Just as you yourself have transgressed Leviticus 19:15 in your response. Thus you also are a law breaker and not keeping it.

Jam 2:8 Howbeit if ye fulfil the royal law, according to the scripture, Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself, ye do well: 9 but if ye have respect of persons, ye commit sin, being convicted by the law as transgressors. 10 For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet stumble in one point, he is become guilty of all. 11 For he that said, Do not commit adultery, said also, Do not kill. Now if thou dost not commit adultery, but killest, thou art become a transgressor of the law. 12 So speak ye, and so do, as men that are to be judged by a law of liberty. 13 For judgment is without mercy to him that hath showed no mercy: mercy glorieth against judgment.

You know this bit,

As should you.

Rom 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
Rom 8:2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.
Rom 8:3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:
Rom 8:4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
Rom 8:5 For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit.

Rom 8:7 because the mind of the flesh is enmity against God; for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can it be:

But you see, the law is the flesh, and so those who choose the law will always be condemned, for that is what the law does.

And as above, the mind of the flesh can not subject itself unto the law of God.

Remember the woman perused by the religious who wanted to kill her, by every account Jesus "by the law ", should have stoned her to death, but He choose as God would do, teh grace, Love bit, she certainly didnt deserve it, never earned it, and yet here we see the religious still killing people just like them,, by teh law, if thats what you really want to do, than that is your problem..

Actually, they were transgressing more than one law in wanting to stone her. What do you think Jesus wrote in the sand? Take a read of John 8:3-11. Then read Leviticus 20:10. Were thy lawfully attempting to have her stoned? Were they themselves in transgression of Leviticus 19:15 and 35? I feel silly even pointing this out to you, for you should know this bit by now.

THEN Jesus asked where her accusers were, neither did he condemn her, saying: "Go and sin no more".

1 John 3:4 Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.

And even though you only subscribe to the "two", all the instruction falls under the two.

 

[mjrhealth]

@Richard_oti Would you at all be a seventh day adventist??