Calvinism vs. Arminianism

[marks]

The fear of the LORD keeps you from walking away according to those scriptures.

For me, where I find security, is my belief that being joined to God I share His life, which is eternal.

Peter puts it this way, that we are guarded for our heavenly inheritance by God's power, which works through our faith. I think this means that the fact of our faith is a demonstration of God's power in us, just like light from a lightbulb shows the power of electricity in it.

There IS no 'walking away', we are a part of His body. A finger doesn't just wiggle off on it's own.

Much love!

 

[justbyfaith]

1Pe 1:17, And if ye call on the Father, who without respect of persons judgeth according to every man's work, pass the time of your sojourning here in fear:

 

[justbyfaith]

Same God, different Testament.
Same God, different Covenant.

That isn't what you said.

You pitted the New Testament God against a different God of the Old Testament.

That is Old Testament God, vs the God that Sent His Son to create the New Testament.

 

[Behold]

No, that is the reason why you start threads.

You started this very Thread, not because you are "pastor of the forum" as you proclaim.
But its because i told you for 3 days, last week, that you never write any Threads.

So, you wrote a "click bait", that is really just your own theology of "self saving", "you can lose your salvation".....guised as a different title. = click bait.

You cut and pasted the dictionary on these topics, as your "Thread", then you spit on OSAS, in the Thread.... as that is why you posted it, and because you need to see it.

You're not fooling anyone, except yourself.

 

[justbyfaith]

You started this very Thread, not because you are a teacher, or because you are "pastor of the forum" as you proclaim.
But its because i told you for 3 days, last week, that you never write any Threads.

So, you wrote a "click bait", that is really just your own theology of "self saving", "you can lose your salvation".....guised as a different title.

You posted the dictionary on these topics, as your "Thread", then you spit on OSAS, in the Thread.

You're not fooling anyone, except yourself.

No, actually I wrote this thread because I was led of the Holy Spirit to do so; after I shared the things that I shared in the thread with my wife and realized that it was a good message for the people here on this message board.

You are quick to judge, @Behold.

That is going to come up and bite you one of these days.

 

[marks]

1Pe 1:17, And if ye call on the Father, who without respect of persons judgeth according to every man's work, pass the time of your sojourning here in fear:

Do you present this verse as if it supports your assertion?

justbyfaith said: ↑
The fear of the LORD keeps you from walking away according to those scriptures.

Because that's not what this verse says.

Would you agree or disagree?

Much love!

 

[justbyfaith]

Because that's not what this verse says.

It is what is taught by Jeremiah 32:38-40 and Psalms 19:9 (kjv).

1 Peter 1:17 merely gives a New Testament substantiation for fearing the Lord.

 

[marks]

It is what is taught by Jeremiah 32:38-40 and Psalms 19:9 (kjv).

1 Peter 1:17 merely gives a New Testament substantiation for fearing the Lord.

9 The fear of the Lord is clean, enduring for ever: the judgments of the Lord are true and righteous altogether.

This verse doesn't support your assertion either.


38 And they shall be my people, and I will be their God:
39 And I will give them one heart, and one way, that they may fear me for ever, for the good of them, and of their children after them:
40 And I will make an everlasting covenant with them, that I will not turn away from them, to do them good; but I will put my fear in their hearts, that they shall not depart from me.

In this case, we're talking about Israel, not the church.

I don't find anywhere that God uses fear as His means to keep His children from departing from Him.

I think a lot of confusion can result from trying to define rebirth in gentiles by God's covenant with Israel.

Much love!

 

[justbyfaith]

9 The fear of the Lord is clean, enduring for ever: the judgments of the Lord are true and righteous altogether.

This verse doesn't support your assertion either.


38 And they shall be my people, and I will be their God:
39 And I will give them one heart, and one way, that they may fear me for ever, for the good of them, and of their children after them:
40 And I will make an everlasting covenant with them, that I will not turn away from them, to do them good; but I will put my fear in their hearts, that they shall not depart from me.

In this case, we're talking about Israel, not the church.

I don't find anywhere that God uses fear as His means to keep His children from departing from Him.

I think a lot of confusion can result from trying to define rebirth in gentiles by God's covenant with Israel.

Much love!

Look at verse 38.

Gentile Christians are not the people of God?

Look at verse 40.

The everlasting covenant is not the New Covenant / New Testament?

 

[marks]

Look at verse 38.

Gentile Christians are not the people of God?

Look at verse 40.

The everlasting covenant is not the New Covenant / New Testament?

That doesn't address my post. Look at the context.

Gentile Christians are not OT Israel.

The OT covenant is not the new covenant, no. These are not the same. One replaces the other. One makes the other obsolete. One is better than the other.

Much love!

 

[justbyfaith]

That doesn't address my post. Look at the context.

Gentile Christians are not OT Israel.

The OT covenant is not the new covenant, no. These are not the same. One replaces the other. One makes the other obsolete. One is better than the other.

Much love!

Therefore the Old Covenant is not the everlasting covenant; that is referring to the New Covenant; which Jeremiah is speaking of in Jeremiah 32:38-40 and which also applies to Gentiles; since it is the New Testament in Jesus' blood.

And Gentile Christians are the people of God.

Jer 32:38, And they shall be my people, and I will be their God:
Jer 32:39, And I will give them one heart, and one way, that they may fear me for ever, for the good of them, and of their children after them:
Jer 32:40, And I will make an everlasting covenant with them, that I will not turn away from them, to do them good; but I will put my fear in their hearts, that they shall not depart from me.

What is the one way that God will give to them but faith in Jesus Christ (John 14:6)?

This everlasting covenant is clearly speaking of the New Testament; and it most assuredly applies both to Israel and the Gentile church.

 

[marks]

Therefore the Old Covenant is not the everlasting covenant; that is referring to the New Covenant; which Jeremiah is speaking of in Jeremiah 32:38-40 and which also applies to Gentiles; since it is the New Testament in Jesus' blood.

And Gentile Christians are the people of God.

Jer 32:38, And they shall be my people, and I will be their God:
Jer 32:39, And I will give them one heart, and one way, that they may fear me for ever, for the good of them, and of their children after them:
Jer 32:40, And I will make an everlasting covenant with them, that I will not turn away from them, to do them good; but I will put my fear in their hearts, that they shall not depart from me.

What is the one way that God will give to them but faith in Jesus Christ (John 14:6)?

This everlasting covenant is clearly speaking of the New Testament; and it most assuredly applies both to Israel and the Gentile church.

The old covenant is not the new covenant, and gentiles are not Israel.

Yes, the gentiles are the people of God, having found grace in Christ. Yes, Noah found grace in the eyes of the Lord. No, the gentile church is not building an ark.

Similarities between different people do not make them the same audience for a passage of Scripture which is given to one of them.

And no, the gentile church is not the nation of Israel, with whom God made that covenant.

Much love!

 

[marks]

Therefore the Old Covenant is not the everlasting covenant; that is referring to the New Covenant; which Jeremiah is speaking of in Jeremiah 32:38-40 and which also applies to Gentiles; since it is the New Testament in Jesus' blood.

And Gentile Christians are the people of God.

Jer 32:38, And they shall be my people, and I will be their God:
Jer 32:39, And I will give them one heart, and one way, that they may fear me for ever, for the good of them, and of their children after them:
Jer 32:40, And I will make an everlasting covenant with them, that I will not turn away from them, to do them good; but I will put my fear in their hearts, that they shall not depart from me.

What is the one way that God will give to them but faith in Jesus Christ (John 14:6)?

This everlasting covenant is clearly speaking of the New Testament; and it most assuredly applies both to Israel and the Gentile church.

What if we were to quote more of the passage . . .

Jeremiah 32:37-43
37) Behold, I will gather them out of all countries, whither I have driven them in mine anger, and in my fury, and in great wrath; and I will bring them again unto this place, and I will cause them to dwell safely:
38) And they shall be my people, and I will be their God:
39) And I will give them one heart, and one way, that they may fear me for ever, for the good of them, and of their children after them:
40) And I will make an everlasting covenant with them, that I will not turn away from them, to do them good; but I will put my fear in their hearts, that they shall not depart from me.
41) Yea, I will rejoice over them to do them good, and I will plant them in this land assuredly with my whole heart and with my whole soul.
42) For thus saith the LORD; Like as I have brought all this great evil upon this people, so will I bring upon them all the good that I have promised them.
43) And fields shall be bought in this land, whereof ye say, It is desolate without man or beast; it is given into the hand of the Chaldeans.

It goes on, but it seems clear to me this is speaking of national Israel, who will be regathered to their promised land.

Much love!

 

[Nancy]

The members of this forum would disagree with you.

Much love!

Hi Marks,
What I find hard to understand is why some think that "humanity" does NOT mean individuals, person's, people, humans (that last should be s bit of a tip off, hahaha!)
Jesus died for PEOPLE not trees, earth, animals, the sky... I will always SMH at this doctrine and, I give you kudos for standing your ground.

 

[marks]

Hi Marks,
What I find hard to understand is why some think that "humanity" does NOT mean individuals, person's, people, humans (that last should be s bit of a tip off, hahaha!)
Jesus died for PEOPLE not trees, earth, animals, the sky... I will always SMH at this doctrine and, I give you kudos for standing your ground.

You picked my teaser post to quote! I was hoping to be challenged on an overgeneralization.



But yes, it seems clear to me. It's just the normal way we use language.

Much love!

 

[Nancy]

You picked my teaser post to quote! I was hoping to be challenged on an overgeneralization.



But yes, it seems clear to me. It's just the normal way we use language.

Much love!

Oopsie, sry!

 

[justbyfaith]

The old covenant is not the new covenant, and gentiles are not Israel.

Yes, the gentiles are the people of God, having found grace in Christ. Yes, Noah found grace in the eyes of the Lord. No, the gentile church is not building an ark.

Similarities between different people do not make them the same audience for a passage of Scripture which is given to one of them.

And no, the gentile church is not the nation of Israel, with whom God made that covenant.

Much love!

It seems to me that you are hardening your heart to the reality of the matter.

What if we were to quote more of the passage . . .

Jeremiah 32:37-43
37) Behold, I will gather them out of all countries, whither I have driven them in mine anger, and in my fury, and in great wrath; and I will bring them again unto this place, and I will cause them to dwell safely:
38) And they shall be my people, and I will be their God:
39) And I will give them one heart, and one way, that they may fear me for ever, for the good of them, and of their children after them:
40) And I will make an everlasting covenant with them, that I will not turn away from them, to do them good; but I will put my fear in their hearts, that they shall not depart from me.
41) Yea, I will rejoice over them to do them good, and I will plant them in this land assuredly with my whole heart and with my whole soul.
42) For thus saith the LORD; Like as I have brought all this great evil upon this people, so will I bring upon them all the good that I have promised them.
43) And fields shall be bought in this land, whereof ye say, It is desolate without man or beast; it is given into the hand of the Chaldeans.

It goes on, but it seems clear to me this is speaking of national Israel, who will be regathered to their promised land.

Much love!

Of course the New Covenant was originally given to Israel and Gentiles were included into it.

The everlasting covenant in Jeremiah 32:40 is the New Covenant; even the New Testament in Jesus' blood.

It was given to Israel first and foremost (Matthew 15:24) but also applies to Gentiles (Acts of the Apostles 10, Ephesians 3:6).

 

[justbyfaith]

So, @marks, if Jeremiah 32:38-40 does not apply to Gentiles, what you're saying is that Gentiles can walk away from God themselves when it comes to our application of John 10:27-30?

 

[marks]

So, @marks, if Jeremiah 32:38-40 does not apply to Gentiles, what you're saying is that Gentiles can walk away from God themselves when it comes to our application of John 10:27-30?

I'm sorry, what? That doesn't sound like anything I've said.

Much love!

 

[marks]

It seems to me that you are hardening your heart to the reality of the matter.

That's an interesting reply.

You find it important to publicly share your negative opinion of me. Why is that? Instead of giving a meaningful reply to what I wrote.

Any response to my post? Or just a personal shot at me?

Much love!