Can a Christian have a demon?

[Soverign Grace]

Without a doubt demon possession is a thing to be taken seriously, and as we draw nearer to the consummation of all things, so we will witness this more and more. But I am reluctant to speak of Christians as being demon possessed, presuming they are indeed truly converted. No converted person can be such without the holy Spirit dwelling within...and remember, the Spirit is the Spirit of Christ. Can Christ and the devil share the same space? I know that OSAS is a thing, but I would suggest that if any church going individual is demon possessed, he is no longer in the faith.
1Ti 4:1 Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;

We are seeing more and more people and the things they do that can only be called demonic.

Without a doubt demon possession is a thing to be taken seriously, and as we draw nearer to the consummation of all things, so we will witness this more and more. But I am reluctant to speak of Christians as being demon possessed, presuming they are indeed truly converted. No converted person can be such without the holy Spirit dwelling within...and remember, the Spirit is the Spirit of Christ. Can Christ and the devil share the same space? I know that OSAS is a thing, but I would suggest that if any church going individual is demon possessed, he is no longer in the faith.
1Ti 4:1 Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;

We are seeing more and more people doing things that can only be called demonic. It looks to me as if the lines are being drawn between believers and unbelievers in the Democrat and Republican parties. I don't know if you have the same two political parties in NZ but you probably see the differences very clearly.

I've wondered about it because I'd always heard the same thing that you said - Can Christ and the devil share the same space. But Derek Prince and Rev. Basham said that a Christian could have a demon.

I always heard that you couldn't lose your salvation, yet that verse shows some leave the faith. I wonder why it's taught that you can't lose your salvation. What is OSAS?

Rev. Basham said that he had a demon and he was a pastor. It's something that there are different views on this.

 

[Soverign Grace]

The way to help a Christian away from demonic power and influence is through a better influence and power. It is through knowledge of the truth. The truth sets us free. So then God's people indeed perish through lack of knowledge. This fact magnifies the efforts of people who walk in the truth (or have walked in the truth) to help their brethren be freed from bondage.

Of course these brethren that are in bondage are usually as proud as any Pharisee and will resent any help...thinking that they who are trying to help them are just doing so in the same bondage they are in. These are the ones who will perish...even while claiming to be saved.

But God indeed gives grace to the humble...and sends the religiously proud away.

If a person resists the truth in a brother...then his/her condemnation is just and assured. There is no surer way to reject Christ than to send a brother away who walks in the truth.

I think that you made a good point - I was reading yesterday about how important it is to read the word every day to renew our minds. Gods people are apparently perishing from lack of knowledge. I think that this should probably be taught in church yet I've never heard this in a sermon.

 

[brakelite]

I see it as more insidious than even that. There is a fanaticism I have seen in many evangelicals....this obsession with their own salvation. This claiming to be righteous while they live a very common life according to the flesh....but religiously. The Pharisees were more honest than these in many ways...but that same religious pride is there....judging others as "unsaved" while they themselves are actually worse than the ones they are condemning....since their sins are more severe than the sins of the flesh.

And a strange confusion is manifest when they observe Christians living in accordance to God's commandments who have gotten to that place through faith, but condemning them as "working their way to salvation" while they themselves cast aside the law rightly claiming the law was made for sinners, but failing to recognise that they themselves belong to that class for whom the law was made.

 

[Dave L]

Those who came to Jesus were saved when He walked the earth. We know that He drove demons out of people such as the man of Gadara. He sent them into the pigs and they rushed off a cliff. But do you think that a Christian today can have a demon in them even though they're saved? That's what I read in one book and listened to a sermon by Derek Prince.

What makes me wonder it too is that I've seen Christians fall back and I wondered if it was more than just the flesh. The co-worker who led my husband to Christ backslid badly - he began drinking and hanging with worldly people. I just wonder if it's something more than the flesh driving peoples behavior and why they can't seem to overcome a problem. It might also be that pastors teach erroneous doctrine - that Christians can't have a demon.

I think our spirit immersed (baptized) in the Holy Spirit is safe. But our flesh is the Devil's playground. And I think even Christians can experience demonic powers working against them through the flesh. Paul suffered from this when he said God sent a messenger of Satan to keep him humble in light of the revelations he received. Not that we are on Paul's level but it's part of the spiritual battles Paul describes in several places.

The Gadarene demoniac was a born again believer even though a legion (6000) demons possessed him. It says he ran and worshiped Jesus while being delivered Mark 5:6–9. Only the born again can recognize the true Christ. All who came to Christ for deliverance were also believers to be redeemed at Calvary.

 

[brakelite]

I think there is also a misunderstanding by some as to the difference between possession and oppression.

 

[Episkopos]

I think our spirit immersed (baptized) in the Holy Spirit is safe. But our flesh is the Devil's playground. And I think even Christians can experience demonic powers working against them through the flesh. Paul suffered from this when he said God sent a messenger of Satan to keep him humble in light of the revelations he received. Not that we are on Paul's level but it's part of the spiritual battles Paul describes in several places.

The Gadarene demoniac was a born again believer even though a legion (6000) demons possessed him. It says he ran and worshiped Jesus while being delivered Mark 5:6–9. Only the born again can recognize the true Christ. All who came to Christ for deliverance were also believers to be redeemed at Calvary.

You are missing the real playground of the devil here....the mind....especially the religious mind that is looking to get the "right" beliefs in order. We know someone is living in the futility of their minds when they go shopping to see which doctrines they agree with. How can a person be further from the living truth than that?

 

[Dave L]

You are missing the real playground of the devil here....the mind....especially the religious mind that is looking to get the "right" beliefs in order. We know someone is living in the futility of their minds when they go shopping to see which doctrines they agree with. How can a person be further from the living truth than that?

flesh = mind.

 

[Episkopos]

flesh = mind.

Of course not...otherwise the mind could not be renewed to become the mind of Christ.

You are missing the part of the truth that you lack...which is the greater part. And because of that you can't see what you are lacking. Your condition is very straightforward and to be expected. But you are deceived into trusting your mind....that's where the devil has all they who do so. You have exchanged one lie for another because you are looking for an accuracy of beliefs rather than new life in Christ.

Many believers get caught in this web of deceit through their minds. They think that being religious makes them justified.....but it's the opposite. Better to remain uninstructed in the mind than to fill it with religious ideas.

 

[Dave L]

Of course not...otherwise the mind could not be renewed to become the mind of Christ.

You are missing the part of the truth that you lack...which is the greater part. And because of that you can't see what you are lacking. Your condition is very straightforward and to be expected. But you are deceived in your mind....that's where the devil has all they who do so. You have exchanged one lie for another because you are looking for an accuracy of beliefs rather than new life in Christ.

Many believers get caught in this web of deceit through their minds. They think that being religious makes them justified.....but it's the opposite. Better to remain uninstructed in the mind than to fill it with religious ideas.

“Let no man beguile you of your reward in a voluntary humility and worshipping of angels, intruding into those things which he hath not seen, vainly puffed up by his fleshly mind,” (Colossians 2:18)

 

[Episkopos]

“Let no man beguile you of your reward in a voluntary humility and worshipping of angels, intruding into those things which he hath not seen, vainly puffed up by his fleshly mind,” (Colossians 2:18)

You are being religiously simplistic and illogical here. An arm can be broken....and a mind can be fleshly or carnal.

Is every arm broken (see how simple I have to explain things to you)??? Is every mind carnal? But put on the mind of Christ.

 

[brakelite]

Only the born again can recognize the true Christ.

I disagree. I believe many of the rulers of Israel knew full well who Jesus was but refusd to acknowledge Him for fear of losing their exalted political and religious positions.
Jesus Himself suggested as much when He told the parable of the evil tenants who recognised the Son of the King when He came to collect the fruit of the vineyard, but killed Him anyway in the hope of retaining the vineyard.

 

[Dave L]

You are being religiously simplistic and illogical here. An arm can be broken....and a mind can be fleshly or carnal.

Is every arm broken (see how simple I have to explain things to you)??? Is every mind carnal? But put on the mind of Christ.

“Let no one who delights in humility and the worship of angels pass judgment on you. That person goes on at great lengths about what he has supposedly seen, but he is puffed up with empty notions by his fleshly mind.” (Colossians 2:18)

Grk “by the mind of his flesh.” In the translation above, σαρκός (sarkos) is taken as an attributive genitive. The phrase could also be translated “by his sinful thoughts,” since it appears that Paul is using σάρξ (sarx, “flesh”) here in a morally negative way.

Biblical Studies Press. (2005). The NET Bible First Edition; Bible. English. NET Bible.; The NET Bible. Biblical Studies Press.

 

[Dave L]

I disagree. I believe many of the rulers of Israel knew full well who Jesus was but refusd to acknowledge Him for fear of losing their exalted political and religious positions.
Jesus Himself suggested as much when He told the parable of the evil tenants who recognised the Son of the King when He came to collect the fruit of the vineyard, but killed Him anyway in the hope of retaining the vineyard.

Nobody is that stupid to reject God if they know he is God.

 

[Episkopos]

“Let no one who delights in humility and the worship of angels pass judgment on you. That person goes on at great lengths about what he has supposedly seen, but he is puffed up with empty notions by his fleshly mind.” (Colossians 2:18)

Grk “by the mind of his flesh.” In the translation above, σαρκός (sarkos) is taken as an attributive genitive. The phrase could also be translated “by his sinful thoughts,” since it appears that Paul is using σάρξ (sarx, “flesh”) here in a morally negative way.

Biblical Studies Press. (2005). The NET Bible First Edition; Bible. English. NET Bible.; The NET Bible. Biblical Studies Press.

Completely illogical reasoning. But hey, you can believe as you want to. You are welcome to your own mind....as be it religious as you want it to be. And you can ignore my testimony of a different KIND of life....an alien life....the life OF Jesus Christ...that blows away all the silly human reasoning and belief systems about God. Your choice.

 

[icxn]

Thanks for sharing you can read.
Can't say your revealed fruits are impressive.

Glory to God,
Taken

There's a story in the Desert Fathers, if you allow me...

Abba Daniel said, ‘At Babylon the daughter of an important person was possessed by a devil. A monk for whom her father had a great affection said to him, “No-one can heal your daughter except some anchorites (hermits) whom I know; but if you ask them to do so, they will not agree because of their humility. Let us therefore do this: when they come to the market, look as though you want to buy their goods and when they come to receive the price, we will ask them to say a prayer and I believe she will be healed.” When they came to the market they found a disciple of the old men setting there selling their goods and they led him away with the baskets, so that he should receive the price of them. But when the monk reached the house, the woman possessed with the devil came and slapped him. But he only turned the other cheek, according to the Lord’s Command. (Matt. 5.39) The devil, tortured by this, cried out, “What violence! The commandment of Jesus drives me out.” Immediately the woman was cleansed. When the old men came, they told them what had happened and they glorified God saying, “This is how the pride of the devil is brought low, through the humility of the commandment of Christ.”‘​

If you had turned the other cheek to Archangel by saying, "Perhaps you are right brother. Please forgive me and pray for me." I believe you would have helped him greatly in seeing his error... and who knows, perhaps he would have responded with a similar reply admitting that he was wrong passing judgment on you. The demons that like to turn us against each other would have been put to shame. Your humility and love and your heavenly reward on account of these would have increased a hundredfold. Other readers would have been edified. God would have been glorified...

But responding to the iron of criticism with the same iron increases (sharpens) it even more.

Forgive me.

 

[Dave L]

Completely illogical reasoning. But hey, you can believe as you want to. You are welcome to your own mind....as be it religious as you want it to be. And you can ignore my testimony of a different KIND of life....an alien life....the life OF Jesus Christ...that blows away all the silly human reasoning and belief systems about God. Your choice.

You need to drop the personal denigration of those you disagree with and stick to scripture.

 

[Episkopos]

You need to drop the personal denigration of those you disagree with and stick to scripture.

I'm not trying to help you anymore...you see...remain as you are.

 

[justbyfaith]

I think that I for one have been influenced by demons in the (recent) past without being possessed by them.

 

[Taken]

There's a story in the Desert Fathers, if you allow me...

Abba Daniel said, ‘At Babylon the daughter of an important person was possessed by a devil. A monk for whom her father had a great affection said to him, “No-one can heal your daughter except some anchorites (hermits) whom I know; but if you ask them to do so, they will not agree because of their humility. Let us therefore do this: when they come to the market, look as though you want to buy their goods and when they come to receive the price, we will ask them to say a prayer and I believe she will be healed.” When they came to the market they found a disciple of the old men setting there selling their goods and they led him away with the baskets, so that he should receive the price of them. But when the monk reached the house, the woman possessed with the devil came and slapped him. But he only turned the other cheek, according to the Lord’s Command. (Matt. 5.39) The devil, tortured by this, cried out, “What violence! The commandment of Jesus drives me out.” Immediately the woman was cleansed. When the old men came, they told them what had happened and they glorified God saying, “This is how the pride of the devil is brought low, through the humility of the commandment of Christ.”‘​

Thanks for sharing your favoring of "The Dessert Fathers".

Not something I find of my interest.

If you had turned the other cheek to Archangel by saying, "Perhaps you are right brother. Please forgive me and pray for me."

Unclear...

"What" exactly IYO should I have ask 'him' to forgive me for?

And "why" exactly IYO should I ask a stranger, not knowing his Standing, to pray for me?

I believe you would have helped him greatly in seeing his error... and who knows, perhaps he would have responded with a similar reply admitting that he was wrong passing judgment on you. The demons that like to turn us against each other would have been put to shame. Your humility and love and your heavenly reward on account of these would have increased a hundredfold. Other readers would have been edified. God would have been glorified...

But responding to the iron of criticism with the same iron increases (sharpens) it even more.

Forgive me.

Nothing to forgive you for.

God Bless,
Taken

 

[Episkopos]

I think that I for one have been influenced by demons in the (recent) past without being possessed by them.

The battlefield is the mind. If we believe a lie...it gives ground to the devil to use us in his way. The truth always sets us free....because the truth so so difficult and heavy that it puts the mind below it. A lie puffs up the mind.