Celebrate Halloween?

[aspen]

aspen one would be skeptical of just about anything you say since you posted that evil is not a force.
EVIL IS NOT A FORCE??!! REALLY??!! until you retract that statement i won't even debate with you at all. even non christians believe evil is a force often times.

http://www.str.org/s...Article&id=5124

"Augustine approached the problem from a different angle. He asked: Do we have any convincing evidence that a good God exists? If independent evidence leads us to conclude that God exists and is good, then He would be incapable of creating evil. Something else, then, must be its source.

If Augustine's approach is fair, it prompts a pair of syllogisms that lead to a different conclusion. First: 1) All things that God created are good; 2) evil is not good; 3) therefore, evil was not created by God. Second: 1) God created every thing; 2) God did not create evil; 3) therefore, evil is not a thing."

 

[teamventure]

Christians should enlighten and offer alternatives to celebrating Halloween, but I don't think the best way to do that is preventing a 3 year old Buzz Lightyear from going door to door to collect free candy and accolades for his costume.

Accusing parents and their small children of celebrating pagan rituals because they go door-to-door for treats is as ridiculous as it is counterproductive.




Those that feel that any participation in Halloween activities amounts to the participation in the original purpose of the holiday must then apply that principle evenly.

Therefore:
- Those who accept Easter candy in their baskets from a person dressed like a giant bunny are actually willfully celebrating the Resurrection of Christ.

- Those that open Christmas presents from Santa on Christmas morning are actually willfully celebrating the birth of Christ.

Or to put a finer point on it:
if Buzz Lightyear taking candy from a neighbor is actually honoring the pagan gods, then those taking candy from a bunny or accepting presents from Santa are actually honoring Jesus Christ.

your post is full of straman fallacies so i won't even bother. i never said that celebrating halloween is the same as taking part in pagan rituals. i'm saying that you can't christianize something that was founded as a pagan ritual. sheesh.

 

[biggandyy]

Why?

 

[teamventure]

http://www.str.org/s...Article&id=5124

"Augustine approached the problem from a different angle. He asked: Do we have any convincing evidence that a good God exists? If independent evidence leads us to conclude that God exists and is good, then He would be incapable of creating evil. Something else, then, must be its source.

If Augustine's approach is fair, it prompts a pair of syllogisms that lead to a different conclusion. First: 1) All things that God created are good; 2) evil is not good; 3) therefore, evil was not created by God. Second: 1) God created every thing; 2) God did not create evil; 3) therefore, evil is not a thing."

Aspen, if you believe in the words of men more than the words of God then how can you call yourself a Christian.
Ephesions ch 6 :for we wrestle not against flesh and blood but against spiritual forces!!

you don't believe in Satan, demons, evil spirits, or the devil?

 

[Foreigner]

your post is full of straman fallacies so i won't even bother.

-- But then you proceeded to.
People always yell "strawman!" but when asked to show how it is, they never can. It would appear you fall nicely into that group.

i never said that celebrating halloween is the same as taking part in pagan rituals. i'm saying that you can't christianize something that was founded as a pagan ritual. sheesh.

-- It is quite an ego to assume that after six pages of posts on this thread I was speaking solely and directly to you.
Legend in your own mind...

 

[teamventure]

-- But then you proceeded to.
People always yell "strawman!" but when asked to show how it is, they never can. It would appear you fall nicely into that group.




-- It is quite an ego to assume that after six pages of posts on this thread I was speaking solely and directly to you.
Legend in your own mind...

my apologies foreigner, if you truly weren't posting to me then i retract my strawman fallacy allogation.

 

[aspen]

Aspen, if you believe in the words of men more than the words of God then how can you call yourself a Christian.
Ephesions ch 6 :for we wrestle not against flesh and blood but against spiritual forces!!

you don't believe in Satan, demons, evil spirits, or the devil?

Why are you assuming that Augustine is speaking words of men? Are you claiming that he did not have a relationship with God? If so, where is your evidence? And, how does his view of evil contradict the Bible?

BTW, the Devil and all the demons were created good.

Finally, I never said that I do not believe that evil exists - I said evil is not a force - it is the absence of good.

 

[teamventure]

so did they rebel against God and turn evil?

 

[aspen]

so did they rebel against God and turn evil?

according to Isaiah, Lucifer rebelled against God and took 1/3 of the angels with him. The Devil is 'lesser good' - he is a broken form of Lucifer, whom God created.

 

[teamventure]

so the devil isn't evil? he's just less good? you're confusing.

 

[aspen]

so the devil isn't evil? he's just less good? you're confusing.

Think of it this way;

Cold is not a force, it is just lesser heat. Evil has the same relationship to Good.
Cold is dependent on heat to be measured - heat is not dependent on cold.

 

[teamventure]

not what ephesians 6 says. take your apostacy doctrine some place else.

 

[Foreigner]

No problem teamventure. You're a good man.

Aspen, what point are you trying to make, specifically.

I haven't heard someone speak that way since a used car salesman tried to sell me an Impala with 142,000 miles on it.

It sounds like more of a justification or excuse to do was is 'less bad' than actually being good.

 

[teamventure]

• thanks Foreigner. oh and good post.

 

[aspen]

No problem teamventure. You're a good man.

Aspen, what point are you trying to make, specifically.

I haven't heard someone speak that way since a used car salesman tried to sell me an Impala with 142,000 miles on it.

It sounds like more of a justification or excuse to do was is 'less bad' than actually being good.

My point is clear - read the quote I posted. And if you haven't heard me talk about this before, you have not been paying attention; I have written about this classic view of evil all over this board.

Perhaps you are comfortable agreeing with Teamventure that Augustine's theology is heretical, but both Calvin and Luther relied on it.

 

[Rex]

I may not know much, but what I do know is my salvation is not based on what Augustine, Calvin or Luther believed.

 

[aspen]

I may not know much, but what I do know is my salvation is not based on what Augustine, Calvin or Luther believed.

What does this conversation have to do with salvation?

 

[Raeneske]

Christians should enlighten and offer alternatives to celebrating Halloween, but I don't think the best way to do that is preventing a 3 year old Buzz Lightyear from going door to door to collect free candy and accolades for his costume.

Accusing parents and their small children of celebrating pagan rituals because they go door-to-door for treats is as ridiculous as it is counterproductive.




Those that feel that any participation in Halloween activities amounts to the participation in the original purpose of the holiday must then apply that principle evenly.

Therefore:
- Those who accept Easter candy in their baskets from a person dressed like a giant bunny are actually willfully celebrating the Resurrection of Christ.

- Those that open Christmas presents from Santa on Christmas morning are actually willfully celebrating the birth of Christ.

Or to put a finer point on it:
if Buzz Lightyear taking candy from a neighbor is actually honoring the pagan gods, then those taking candy from a bunny or accepting presents from Santa are actually honoring Jesus Christ.

I understand your points, but I would like to point some things out.

1) Christians didn't celebrate Easter at first. This is also a Pagan holiday, with a Christian "feel" attached to it.
2) Christmas is not Christian as well. It is a Pagan holiday.

Jesus was not born December 25th, he kept this well hidden from us, so we do not end up idolizing the day he was born, instead of looking up to Him. I've seen many reports on people trying to figure out when Christ was born, but I doubt this is something we'll ever know.

If Easter just so happened to fall on the date when Christ was ressurected, that would be fine. However, it does not do this. As a matter of fact, that is documented proof that the calender was advanced more than a week (the number in the month, not the weekly cycle), because Easter would have legitamatly fallen on the date that Christ was resurrected.

 

[teamventure]

My point is clear - read the quote I posted. And if you haven't heard me talk about this before, you have not been paying attention; I have written about this classic view of evil all over this board.

Perhaps you are comfortable agreeing with Teamventure that Augustine's theology is heretical, but both Calvin and Luther relied on it.

maybe they should have relied on the word of God.

 

[JoshuaXiong]

They like want every holiday to be Christian like, so they try to make something up with Halloween when it's clearly not.