Christians Cast into "Hell" for Not Abiding?

[Christ4Me]

So then, all men have eternal life?

It is either eternal life with God or eternal damnation apart from God and all that is good.

 

[Christ4Me]

I’m going to pick your brain here. What, in that passage above, do you think the fewer and lesser stripes are?

For those not ready that did not have the knowledge to know to repent is why they would get lesser stripes, but still getting stripes.

And what do you make of the parable about the man thrown into prison because he didn’t forgive, where he was told he wouldn’t come out until he paid the last farthing? Do you think maybe that prison is the “outer darkness?”

Yes. Being cast to earth at the rapture event is the outer darkness as they are denied entrance to the Kingdom of light in Heaven.

 

[Enoch111]

It says hell will be thrown into the lake of fire in the end.

I already told you that that word is not "hell" but Hades. Big difference. And Hades is only metaphorically cast into the Lake of Fire, since it is actually located in "the lower parts of the earth". So what does it really mean? When death is TERMINATED on earth (death metaphorically cast into the Lake of Fire) then there is also no need for Hades. Hence it is metaphorically cast into the Lake of Fire. Sheol/Hades exists to receive unredeemed souls waiting for the Great White Throne Judgment. When that judgment is over, there is no need for Hades.

 

[stunnedbygrace]

It is either eternal life with God or eternal damnation apart from God and all that is good.

So all men are born with eternal life in them but it’s just a matter of where they spend that eternal life?

 

[Christ4Me]

So all men are born with eternal life in them but it’s just a matter of where they spend that eternal life?

eh.. I would not call eternal life in the lake of fire as eternal life, but eternal torment.

 

[stunnedbygrace]

eh.. I would not call eternal life in the lake of fire as eternal life, but eternal torment.

Yes but to live eternally in torment, one has to have eternal life in them, don’t they? And how did they come to that eternal life when Jesus is the only way to eternal life?

 

[Christ4Me]

Yes but to live eternally in torment, one has to have eternal life in them, don’t they? And how did they come to that eternal life when Jesus is the only way to eternal life?

I believe the distinction is how eternal torment is not the same as eternal life with God when only those saved by Jesus Christ have that particular eternal life.

So yes, those cast into the lake of fire are living forever in torment but hardly one with God in living with God and all that is good to never be seated from Him by sin ever again.

 

[stunnedbygrace]

Hmm…okay.

 

[Christ4Me]

Hmm…okay.

If still not sure, then ask Jesus. Each of us are to prove everything with Him anyway by the scripture.

As it is, I doubt those being tormented forever in the lake of fire would use that term "eternal life". They would agree with God's word as calling it the second death as living forever in torment apart from all that is good and God and thus everlasting life.

 

[stunnedbygrace]

Yeah, I don’t know, doesn’t make sense to me that the second death is eternal life, but if it makes sense to you, cool.

 

[Christ4Me]

Yeah, I don’t know, doesn’t make sense to me that the second death is eternal life, but if it makes sense to you, cool.

Revelation 20:10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever. 11 And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them. 12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works. 13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works. 14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. 15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

Like I said, I would not call it "eternal life". Scripture testify that second death in the lake of fire as being tormented day and night for ever and ever.

 

[stunnedbygrace]

Revelation 20:10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever. 11 And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them. 12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works. 13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works. 14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. 15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

Like I said, I would not call it "eternal life". Scripture testify that second death in the lake of fire as being tormented day and night for ever and ever.

I think you need to read that more carefully. It really only says the devil will be tormented forever.

 

[Robert Gwin]

Correct only because Gehenna in scripture has always been a reference to a place on earth where the dead corpses are burning and the worms die not.

I assure you those Pharisees were not cast into the dump outside Jerusalems walls. Jesus was speaking figuratively, and futuristically as well.

 

[Christ4Me]

I think you need to read that more carefully. It really only says the devil will be tormented forever.

Why bother resurrecting the dead to cast them into the lake of fire if they are not being tormented for ever and ever day & night also? Why not just leave them in hell when hell & death is cast into the lake of fire?

The Great White Throne Judgment is forever just as His promise of eternal life with God is forever.

If the dead just ceased to exists, then where is God judgment on them?

And why not just have Satan & his angels ceased to exists as well? Who wants evil around?

Designated and judged into the lake of fire is eternal for the assurance that they will not mess with His kingdom of Heaven ever again.

 

[bbyrd009]

Hmm…okay.

or not, lol
but whatevs

 

[bbyrd009]

The Great White Throne Judgment is forever just as His promise of eternal life with God is forever.

the problem with Knowing Stuff might be mostly that we memorize some phrase that speaks to us, and then…establish? a mental image of how that must apply, which closes our brains to any other new understanding.

There is only One Immortal
No one has ever gone up to heaven
eternal from aion: a space of time, an age

so see, “eternal life” is presented to…a cult-of-sol sensibility, who will natch interpret via their filter, but see how you are not like qualifying your statements at all or anything? Presenting your pov as facts? Bc it absolutely has to be that way, right?

 

[Christ4Me]

I assure you those Pharisees were not cast into the dump outside Jerusalems walls. Jesus was speaking figuratively, and futuristically as well.

Jesus is warning believers that if they do not forgive their brethren, neither will God forgive them Matthew 6:14-15 & they will not be allowed to hold fellowship in that City of God above at the Marriage Supper table. Since the accuser of our brethren will be cast out from Heaven when the doors are shut. then that Gehenna is on earth that the non-abiding believers will be cast into that for not forgiving the brethren, but there will be a payment in full, as there will be a coming out. Matthew 5:21-26

They are the garbage dump at the rapture event for why there are vessels unto dishonor, vessels of wood & earth, that are in His House 2 Timothy 2:20 That is why departing from iniquity is how a believer is ready to be received as that vessel unto honor; 2 Timothy 2:21 This is why the least are called the least in the kingdom of Heaven for how they break even the last of His commandments and teach other so. Matthew 5:19

This is why they will be resurrected after the great tribulation to serve the King of kings on earth from all over the world in raising up the generations following as they will teach their children to forgive those who asks for forgiveness.

 

[bbyrd009]

I believe the distinction is how eternal torment is not the same as eternal life with God when only those saved by Jesus Christ have that particular eternal life.

So yes, those cast into the lake of fire are living forever in torment but hardly one with God in living with God and all that is good to never be seated from Him by sin ever again.

so, great example here, see, the first sentence, who can argue? You have stated your “belief,” and being as how beliefs are understood to be subject to change, discussion and growth for all may follow, etc
but the second sentence, who could not but disagree? You have now stated a “fact”—that you cannot Quote btw—and fwiw surely is not true, and can only cause others less advanced in their walk to fear—which is btw the real sin imo, if Yah is love but anyway point is i know you mean well ok, but i am now more or less forced to consign you to the dump until you rebound, see? Wish i had more time to dbl check here, but gotta run.

 

[Christ4Me]

the problem with Knowing Stuff might be mostly that we memorize some phrase that speaks to us, and then…establish? a mental image of how that must apply, which closes our brains to any other new understanding.

There is only One Immortal
No one has ever gone up to heaven
eternal from aion: a space of time, an age

so see, “eternal life” is presented to…a cult-of-sol sensibility, who will natch interpret via their filter, but see how you are not like qualifying your statements at all or anything? Presenting your pov as facts? Bc it absolutely has to be that way, right? lol

"No one has ever gone up to heaven" is derived from this scripture which was said while Jesus was on earth.

John 3:13 And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.

But now that Jesus has died, risen from the dead, and have ascended to Heaven, taking Paradise aka Abraham's bosom with Him, is why Paradise is now in Heaven where Paul testified indirectly of the apostle John having been taken to Paradise in Heaven for the Book of Revelation.

2 Corinthians 12:1It is not expedient for me doubtless to glory. I will come to visions and revelations of the Lord. 2 I knew a man in Christ above fourteen years ago, (whether in the body, I cannot tell; or whether out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth such an one caught up to the third heaven. 3 And I knew such a man, (whether in the body, or out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth 4 How that he was caught up into paradise, and heard unspeakable words, which it is not lawful for a man to utter.

Revelation 1:9 I John, who also am your brother, and companion in tribulation, and in the kingdom and patience of Jesus Christ, was in the isle that is called Patmos, for the word of God, and for the testimony of Jesus Christ. 10 I was in the Spirit on the Lord's day, and heard behind me a great voice, as of a trumpet, 11 Saying, I am Alpha and Omega, the first and the last: and, What thou seest, write in a book, and send it unto the seven churches which are in Asia; unto Ephesus, and unto Smyrna, and unto Pergamos, and unto Thyatira, and unto Sardis, and unto Philadelphia, and unto Laodicea.

1 Peter 3:18 For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit:

So although it was true at the time when Jesus was on earth that no man had ascended up to Heaven, but it is because of Jesus Christ having ascended there is why we can ascend up into Heaven after we die and at the rapture event of those abiding in Him.

2 Corinthians 5:7 (For we walk by faith, not by sight 8 We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.

9 Wherefore we labour, that, whether present or absent, we may be accepted of him. 10 For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad. 11 Knowing therefore the terror of the Lord, we persuade men; but we are made manifest unto God; and I trust also are made manifest in your consciences.

 

[Christ4Me]

so, great example here, see, the first sentence, who can argue? You have stated your “belief,” and being as how beliefs are understood to be subject to change, discussion and growth for all may follow, etc

I agree as well in regards to our growth.

but the second sentence, who could not but disagree? You have now stated a “fact”—that you cannot Quote btw—and fwiw surely is not true, and can only cause others less advanced in their walk to fear—which is btw the real sin imo, if Yah is love but anyway point is i know you mean well ok, but i am now more or less forced to consign you to the dump until you rebound, see? Wish i had more time to dbl check here, but gotta run.

Did you skip this reference or had forgotten about it when mentioned earlier in another post to another member? Here it is again.

Revelation 20:10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever. 11 And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them. 12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works. 13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works. 14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. 15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

What would be the point of resurrecting them when their spirits were already in hell? Just cast hell along with them into the lake of fire.

But they were resurrected and cast into the lake of fire afterwards for not having their names in the Book of Life. It is not that big of a leap to believe that they too are burning in the lake of fire forever and ever day & night too with the devil.

It is our sensibility that is offended, but we are okay with society in keeping hardened criminals behind bars for life and even give the death penalty. No one in their right mind would let them go and invite them to live in their homes, but we do have some states letting them go now as signs of the times, but in no way are they letting them live in their homes. Makes me wonder if their families are living in homes are out of that city or even out of that state.

God's promise of a good eternal life is assured by having His judgment as eternal so that nobody will mess with His kingdom ever again.

You would think Satan would think twice after being let out of the pit for a thousand years, but no, he staged another rebellion. One may see why His judgment on Satan and every other unbelieving sinner is forever so the good He has promised us in the Kingdom of Heaven is forever.