Daniels 70-Weeks Timeline

[Marty fox]

Well, Saints Paul, Matthew, Luke, John, Peter and John the Baptist all refer to the start of Daniel’s seventieth week. As for a reference to the entirety of the seventy weeks, we can point to how Jesus alludes to the Seventy Weeks in cryptic language.

The verse I am thinking of is when Peter asked Jesus how often should he forgive, then suggested what he thought was generous "Up to seven times," he posits.

"Then Peter came to Him and said, “Lord, how often shall my brother sin against me, and I forgive him? Up to seven times?” Jesus said to him, “I do not say to you, up to seven times, but up to seventy times seven." (Matthew 18:21-22)​

Jesus answer was cryptic, but I think he was referring to the long era of forgiveness 490 years that God was giving his people Israel until he introduced his New Covenant. In other words, if it was good enough for God to wait seventy times seven, it is good enough for us to forgive seventy times seven too.

Surely Jesus had Daniel in mind when he made that statement.

But we are to forgive people more than 70 times 7. Jesus 70 times 7 was different from Daniels because Daniels was a times table. Jesus was answering the question of are we to forgive 7 times thus Jesus was using the 7 to show an unlimited number.


Which verses were you referring to which the people you mentioned?

Mathew would of confirmed Jesus fulfilling them like he did with other prophecies Jesus fulfilled like he did here in the examples below

22 All this took place to fulfill what the Lord had said through the prophet: 23 “The virgin will conceive and give birth to a son, and they will call him Immanuel” (which means “God with us”).

5 “In Bethlehem in Judea,” they replied, “for this is what the prophet has written:

6 “‘But you, Bethlehem, in the land of Judah,
are by no means least among the rulers of Judah;
for out of you will come a ruler
who will shepherd my people Israel.’”

14 So he got up, took the child and his mother during the night and left for Egypt, 15 where he stayed until the death of Herod. And so was fulfilled what the Lord had said through the prophet: “Out of Egypt I called my son.”

3 In those days John the Baptist came, preaching in the wilderness of Judea 2 and saying, “Repent, for the kingdom of heaven has come near.” 3 This is he who was spoken of through the prophet Isaiah:

“A voice of one calling in the wilderness,
‘Prepare the way for the Lord,
make straight paths for him.’”

12 When Jesus heard that John had been put in prison, he withdrew to Galilee. 13 Leaving Nazareth, he went and lived in Capernaum, which was by the lake in the area of Zebulun and Naphtali— 14 to fulfill what was said through the prophet Isaiah:

15 “Land of Zebulun and land of Naphtali,
the Way of the Sea, beyond the Jordan,
Galilee of the Gentiles—
16 the people living in darkness
have seen a great light;
on those living in the land of the shadow of death
a light has dawned.”

17 From that time on Jesus began to preach, “Repent, for the kingdom of heaven has come near.”

There are many more examples from Matthew and did you see that at times Matthew quoted which prophet said these verses?

Not once did Mathew or any NT writer or even Jesus Himself state that Jesus fulfilled any of the 70 weeks.

How about my other two points showing that the 70 weeks were to the Jews before the cross?

 

[Christian Gedge]

But we are to forgive people more than 70 times 7. Jesus 70 times 7 was different from Daniels because Daniels was a times table

I’ve already said Jesus was speaking cryptically. Suffice it to say that Daniel’s prophecy was in mind.

 

[covenantee]

Not once did Mathew or any NT writer or even Jesus Himself state that Jesus fulfilled any of the 70 weeks.

Who brought in the everlasting righteousness of Daniel 9:24?

 

[covenantee]

Not once did Mathew or any NT writer or even Jesus Himself state that Jesus fulfilled any of the 70 weeks.

When Jesus said in Mark 1:15 that the time was fulfilled, what time was He referring to?

 

[Christian Gedge]

When Jesus said in Mark 1:15 that the time was fulfilled, what time was He referring to?

Good question Covenantee! It may be worth comparing Johns introductory announcement with that of Jesus? John’s cry was, “the time is near,” differing slightly from Jesus’, “the appointed period of time is fulfilled (completed).” The difference is subtle, but significant. John was the preacher of the sixty-ninth week, whereas Jesus was the preacher of the seventieth.

@Marty fox Read Mark 1:15 in the AMPC (classic edition)

 

[Brakelite]

But none of the necessary conditions have been fulfilled, therefore there is no everlasting righteousness (Dan 9:24) on earth right now. If anything there is presently more evil on earth than has been seen in the last 100 years!

It's not our righteousness that is everlasting, and you are judging that promise by man's weakness. How many times have you mentioned previously on many threads, that the righteousness of Christ is imputed?
KJV Psalms 119:142, 144
142 Thy righteousness is an everlasting righteousness, and thy law is the truth.
144 The righteousness of thy testimonies is everlasting: give me understanding, and I shall live.

The promise is everlasting righteousness. His righteousness. The righteousness of Christ. That promise has been granted you and me and everyone else, if they believe. And it is everlasting.

 

[Marty fox]

When Jesus said in Mark 1:15 that the time was fulfilled, what time was He referring to?

The time of the kingdom of Jesus on earth. Jesus ministry was the fulfillment of the kingdom that started back in Daniels days in Daniel 2:44

 

[Marty fox]

Good question Covenantee! It may be worth comparing Johns introductory announcement with that of Jesus? John’s cry was, “the time is near,” differing slightly from Jesus’, “the appointed period of time is fulfilled (completed).” The difference is subtle, but significant. John was the preacher of the sixty-ninth week, whereas Jesus was the preacher of the seventieth.

@Marty fox Read Mark 1:15 in the AMPC (classic edition)

Sorry but what is AMPC?

I used to believe like you until a Jewish Christian showed me my current view

 

[Marty fox]

Who brought in the everlasting righteousness of Daniel 9:24?

Daniel 9:24 was fulfilled when the temple worship and sacrifice was reastabished after Antiochus Epehanies death.

Only Jesus can literally and is capable of it but the temple worship and sacrifice pointed to Jesus. It was how they lived righteously before the cross. It was stopped by Antiochus and reestablish after the Maccabean revolt.

Again please see the 3 points from my previous post. Don’t you think that there is a reason that Matthew didn’t plainly confirm Jesus fulfilling the 70 weeks like he did with other fulfilled prophecies that Jesus fulfilled?

Gabriel came and gave Daniel the prophecy of the 70 weeks as an answer to Daniels prayer in the first part of Daniel chapter 9 why was Daniel praying? Why would Gabriel give that prophecy at that time if it was about Jesus in the far future?

Remember that the times of Antiochus and the Maccabees happened after the 70 weeks prophecy was given it wasn’t a coincidence and if you were a Jew living through those days what would you think the 70 weeks were about especially since the dates line up?

 

[Marty fox]

Daniels prayer the reason that the 70 weeks prophecy was given.

Daniel 9:-19
9 In the first year of Darius son of Xerxes (a Mede by descent), who was made ruler over the Babylonian kingdom— 2 in the first year of his reign, I, Daniel, understood from the Scriptures, according to the word of the Lord given to Jeremiah the prophet, that the desolation of Jerusalem would last seventy years. 3 So I turned to the Lord God and pleaded with him in prayer and petition, in fasting, and in sackcloth and ashes.

4 I prayed to the Lord my God and confessed:

“Lord, the great and awesome God, who keeps his covenant of love with those who love him and keep his commandments,5 we have sinned and done wrong. We have been wicked and have rebelled; we have turned away from your commands and laws. 6 We have not listened to your servants the prophets, who spoke in your name to our kings, our princes and our ancestors, and to all the people of the land.

7 “Lord, you are righteous, but this day we are covered with shame—the people of Judah and the inhabitants of Jerusalem and all Israel, both near and far, in all the countries where you have scattered us because of our unfaithfulness to you. 8 We and our kings, our princes and our ancestors are covered with shame, Lord, because we have sinned against you. 9 The Lord our God is merciful and forgiving, even though we have rebelled against him; 10 we have not obeyed the Lord our God or kept the laws he gave us through his servants the prophets. 11 All Israel has transgressed your law and turned away, refusing to obey you.

“Therefore the curses and sworn judgments written in the Law of Moses, the servant of God, have been poured out on us, because we have sinned against you. 12 You have fulfilled the words spoken against us and against our rulers by bringing on us great disaster. Under the whole heaven nothing has ever been done like what has been done to Jerusalem. 13 Just as it is written in the Law of Moses, all this disaster has come on us, yet we have not sought the favor of the Lord our God by turning from our sins and giving attention to your truth. 14 The Lord did not hesitate to bring the disaster on us, for the Lord our God is righteous in everything he does; yet we have not obeyed him.

15 “Now, Lord our God, who brought your people out of Egypt with a mighty hand and who made for yourself a name that endures to this day, we have sinned, we have done wrong. 16 Lord, in keeping with all your righteous acts, turn away your anger and your wrath from Jerusalem, your city, your holy hill. Our sins and the iniquities of our ancestors have made Jerusalem and your people an object of scorn to all those around us.

17 “Now, our God, hear the prayers and petitions of your servant. For your sake, Lord, look with favor on your desolate sanctuary. 18 Give ear, our God, and hear; open your eyes and see the desolation of the city that bears your Name. We do not make requests of you because we are righteous, but because of your great mercy. 19 Lord, listen! Lord, forgive! Lord, hear and act! For your sake, my God, do not delay, because your city and your people bear your Name.”


Daniel knew that Jeremiah’s 70 years were coming to an end and that the people were still not repenting thus the 70 years would become 70 weeks of prophecy. The Jews would eventually return and rebuild Jerusalem but not as a free people but under foreign control.

 

[covenantee]

Daniel 9:24 was fulfilled when the temple worship and sacrifice was reastabished after Antiochus Epehanies death.

Only Jesus can literally and is capable of it but the temple worship and sacrifice pointed to Jesus. It was how they lived righteously before the cross. It was stopped by Antiochus and reestablish after the Maccabean revolt.

Again please see the 3 points from my previous post. Don’t you think that there is a reason that Matthew didn’t plainly confirm Jesus fulfilling the 70 weeks like he did with other fulfilled prophecies that Jesus fulfilled?

Gabriel came and gave Daniel the prophecy of the 70 weeks as an answer to Daniels prayer in the first part of Daniel chapter 9 why was Daniel praying? Why would Gabriel give that prophecy at that time if it was about Jesus in the far future?

Remember that the times of Antiochus and the Maccabees happened after the 70 weeks prophecy was given it wasn’t a coincidence and if you were a Jew living through those days what would you think the 70 weeks were about especially since the dates line up?

Not who was capable of it.

You didn't answer the question.

Who brought in the everlasting righteousness of Daniel 9:24?

 

[covenantee]

Sorry but what is AMPC?

I used to believe like you until a Jewish Christian showed me my current view

Mark 1:15
Amplified Bible, Classic Edition

15 And saying, The [appointed period of] time is fulfilled (completed), and the kingdom of God is at hand; repent (have a change of mind which issues in regret for past sins and in change of conduct for the better) and believe (trust in, rely on, and adhere to) the good news (the Gospel).

 

[Enoch111]

It's not our righteousness that is everlasting

Did I even suggest that it is "OUR righteousness"? The Bible says "everlasting righteousness" and the only person who can establish and maintain everlasting righteousness (and peace) on earth is the Lord Jesus Christ. And indeed He will do so AFTER His second coming. Which means that all talk about Daniel's prophecy of 70 weeks being completely fulfilled is nonsense. Right now Revelation 12 is being fulfilled. In the near future Revelation 13 will be fulfilled. And everlasting righteousness will only be fulfilled when Revelation 21 is fulfilled.

 

[covenantee]

The time of the kingdom of Jesus on earth. Jesus ministry was the fulfillment of the kingdom that started back in Daniels days in Daniel 2:44

Mark 1
14 Now after that John was put in prison, Jesus came into Galilee, preaching the gospel of the kingdom of God,
15 And saying, The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the gospel.

The expression "kingdom of God" is found only in the NT.

I concur that Daniel 2:44 foretells that Kingdom, which Jesus established at His first coming.

Daniel said that it would be established in "the days of these kings". Daniel described four empires, the last of which was the Roman empire, during which time Jesus came and established the Kingdom of God.

So when Jesus said "the time is fulfilled", He was referring to the time when the Kingdom of God would be established, which was during the time of the Roman empire and the time of Daniel's 70th week.

 

[Brakelite]

The answer to Daniels prayer was a revelation of Israel's probationary period of grace afforded to them to prepare for the coming of their Messiah. To claim the prophecy is about the Antichrist is blatant Jesuit thinking born in the counter reformation. Nor is it about Antiochus, and for several reasons which I will reveal later. But I have a question. The prayer of Daniel was motivated by his ignorance of the meaning of a vision. There was no vision in Daniel 9, only the explanation. Therefore that explanation was for the vision given in Daniel 8. Not the vision about the sheep and the goat, that was understood. But rather the vision(Marah) of the 2300 days. That astonished Daniel and he fainted. Why? Why faint when his prayer previously included the prayer for his people motivated by the desire to see them return home? Why was he horrified of the angel was literally saying 2300 days? That's only a little over 6 years away. Daniel would have been delighted with that would be not? No. Because Daniel knew that the 2300 days actually meant 2300 years. The explanation of that time line, the 70 weeks, was also prophetic time...70x7=490 years. The beginning of both periods began at the same time...457bc.
Now, to Antiochus.
Through preterism, Satan has laid hold of the liberal wing of Protestantism. Through futurism he has laid hold of the conservative wing. Although these two systems appear to be opposites, they really have several striking similarities and they both meet in the abyss of satanic deception.
In both systems, Antichrist is understood as a literal blasphemous individual. Both see this individual as a desecrator of the literal Jewish Temple for three and a half literal years. The only difference is that, in the case of preterism this person was Antiochus Epiphanes, while in the case of futurism it will be an individual who has not yet appeared.
But the most notable similarity is that both systems derived their
hermeneutical methodology from Papal Jesuit theologians and both
systems shield the Papacy from being detected as the great Antichrist of Scripture!! By shifting the fulfillment of prophecy backwards or forwards, these prophetic systems have attempted to change God’s prophetic times.
The Protestant reformers held the almost unanimous view that the Papacy was the predicted Antichrist of Bible prophecy. They shared several theological concepts: 1) The fourth beast of Daniel 7 is imperial Rome. 2) The “restrainer” of II Thessalonians 2 is the Roman Empire. 3) The Antichrist is not an individual, but rather a succession of popes who, taken together, constitute an apostate religious system. 4) The time periods in symbolic prophecy are to be understood figuratively, not literally. 5) The “temple” in which the Antichrist sits is not the literal Jerusalem temple, but rather, the Christian Church. 6) The word “Antichrist” does not denote a blasphemous
individual who openly denies and defies God, but rather, one who opposes Christ by posing as the vicar of Christ. 7) Though not unanimous, most Protestant reformers believed that the little horn of Daniel 7 represents the Roman Catholic Papal system.
When we think of the Protestant Reformation, expressions such as sola scriptura (Scripture alone), sola fide (faith alone), sola gratia (grace alone) come to mind. However, all these “solas” grew out of a realization that the Roman Catholic system was the predicted Antichrist of Bible prophecy.
You see, the Protestant reformers knew for certain that in the prophetic flow, the lion (Babylon), the bear (Medo-Persia), the leopard (Greece), and the dragon (Rome) had already ruled the world. They also knew that Rome had been divided into ten kingdoms when the Barbarians carved up the Empire. They also knew that the predicted Antichrist was to arise among these ten kingdoms of Western Europe. They saw clearly and distinctly that they were living in the time of the little horn.
The historicist hermeneutical method made it quite simple. A correct understanding of Bible prophecy gave them the unmistakable mandate to unmask this system which had usurped the prerogatives of Christ and adulterated the truth of God.

I can give quotes from history confirming the above of you want

I will now detail my reasons why I believe Antiochus cannot be the little horn of Daniel 7.
a. Antiochus does not rise after 10 kings. He was the 8th king in the Syrian line of Seleucid kings. Besides, the prophecy calls for 10 kingdoms to exist contemporaneously, not successively.
b. Antiochus belonged to the 3rd empire (Greece) in actual historical sequence from Daniel’s time.
c. He was not ‘diverse’ from any other king.
d. He did not ‘pluck up’ 3 other kings.
e. He was not ‘stouter’ than his fellows. His father was known as Antiochus the Great, not Epiphanes.
f. He did not prevail until the end of time, the judgment.
g. The kingdom following was Rome, not the kingdom of the saints.

Reasons why Antiochus cannot be the little horn of Daniel 8.
a. Antiochus was not a horn in his own right. He was of the Seleucid line therefore was a part of one of the four.
b. He did not wax exceeding great. In fact his father was greater, but neither was as great as even Babylon or Media Persia, certainly no greater than Alexander. Yet the prophecy demands that the little horn be greater than any empire before it.
c. He does not fit the time periods. According to Maccabees 1:54,59, and 4:52 Antiochus suppressed the sacrifices exactly 3 years. This fits neither the 1260 days , (times time and half a time,) nor the 2300 days (evenings and mornings of Daniel 8:14). These figures do not compliment one another NOR do they meet the reign of Antiochus.
d. The 2300 days is prophetic. Using the day/year principle established elsewhere as being the standard and norm for interpreting prophetic time periods, it is a literal 2300 years.

 

[Brakelite]

Did I even suggest that it is "OUR righteousness"?

You inferred it yes as our righteousness is the only righteousness that is not everlasting.

And indeed He will do so AFTER His second coming

All the scriptures pertaining to the gospel and the cross teach that the everlasting righteousness of Christ was established at Calvary... In the 'midst of the week'.

 

[Marty fox]

Not who was capable of it.

You didn't answer the question.

Who brought in the everlasting righteousness of Daniel 9:24?

I did answer Jesus, but that wasn’t the time Daniel 9:24 was talking about.

You also haven’t addressed my other two points what do you think about them?

It’s ok if we’re disagree I think that this is the first time we have had a disagreement.

 

[Marty fox]

Mark 1
14 Now after that John was put in prison, Jesus came into Galilee, preaching the gospel of the kingdom of God,
15 And saying, The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the gospel.

The expression "kingdom of God" is found only in the NT.

I concur that Daniel 2:44 foretells that Kingdom, which Jesus established at His first coming.

Daniel said that it would be established in "the days of these kings". Daniel described four empires, the last of which was the Roman empire, during which time Jesus came and established the Kingdom of God.

So when Jesus said "the time is fulfilled", He was referring to the time when the Kingdom of God would be established, which was during the time of the Roman empire and the time of Daniel's 70th week.

I don’t believe that Rome was the fourth kingdom I believe it was Greece but that’s a different topic.

King Nebuchadnezzar was told that he was one of the kings and kingdoms and the rock cut out from the mountain did smash Babylon. How does the rock cut from the mountain destroy each kingdom (Daniel 2:34-35 & 45) if it didn’t come until Jesus? Those kingdoms were long gone by the time Jesus came.

The kingdom started in Daniels days with the faithful before the cross remaining faithful to God and then Jesus came and called it to Himself and sent it worldwide.

 

[CadyandZoe]

Here is my timeline and dates for Daniels 70-weeks prophecy.

"Seventy weeks are determined for your people and for your holy city… Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the command to restore and build Jerusalem until Messiah the Prince, there shall be seven weeks and sixty-two weeks …
And after the sixty-two weeks Messiah shall be cut off, but not for Himself; … he shall confirm a covenant with many for one week; but in the middle of the week he shall bring an end to sacrifice and offering.” (Daniel 9:24-27 NKJV abbrev.)​

As you can see, I have it starting 457 BC date being Artaxerxes' 7th year. However, there have been no small number of differences when it comes to the terminus a quo of Daniels weeks. Some say the first year of Cyrus in 538 BC. Others say Darius (520 BC) Still others, Artaxerxes' 20th year (444 BC)

As if that wasn’t as all over the place enough, the crucifixion of Jesus – the high point of the prophecy – has ranged from AD 29 to AD 33!

We could do without the muddle and, as you can see, the diagram shows exactly 7 + 62 + ½ weeks from the emperor’s decree until the cross. Let’s discuss.

Good chart. Did you draw this?

 

[covenantee]

I did answer Jesus, but that wasn’t the time Daniel 9:24 was talking about.

You also haven’t addressed my other two points what do you think about them?

It’s ok f we’re disagree I think that this is the first time we have had a disagreement.

Why do you begin the 70 weeks at 605 BC rather than 457 BC?