Demonology, Exorcism "Deliverance"

[RevDrRed]

Not quite sure where to put this post, So Im putting it here.

In the Bible (OT and NT) we see exorcisms being performed. Jesus performed a few Himself.

My question is this:
If the prophets and Jesus Himself felt a desire to understand Demonology and perform exorcisms (deliverance), right upto the 1800's they were being performed, and even today in Eastern nations are being performed; Why do Western Christians no longer see an importance in Demonology? Is this lack of knowledge of Demonology and an ever decreasing number of exorcists in the West connected somehow to the amount and level of evil in Western Christian nations? Or in this "post-modern" world, have Christians wrongfully concluded demons (and therefore evil) do not exist?

I ask seriously, please no sarcasm.

 

[Trekson]

I can't speak for all of western christiandom, but I do believe they are still being performed by serious believers. I doubt the Catholic method to be very effective. I have partaken of two such endeavors but admittedly they were about 20 yrs. ago. It's not something you advertise about out of respect for the ex- possessed person. It's a common method of spiritual warfare in some circles, but I would agree that it's no longer part of most "mainstream" denominations.

 

[RevDrRed]

I understand many dont advertise it out, but i do know exorcists. They dont advertise or speak of the cases by name, which is understandable. The work seems to find them somehow (word of mouth maybe?). But going by the few i know, those they know, and society today, it seems to be on a decline.

 

[Rach1370]

I wonder if we don't hear of it more often because there are very few people who would call themselves "exorcists"....in other words...they don't take it on as a job title and go around seeking out demon possessed. But any Christian has the authority of Christ to cast demons out...what probably happens is that a person here or there comes across someone suffering from demon persecution or possession and deals with it. But then may never come across something like that again in their lives. That's why, I imagine, you hear stories of Christians experiencing a demon attack on themselves or others...possession even of others, but you don't know 'an exorcist'...if you know what I mean.

 

[Angelina]

We call it "Deliverance" in my country and it is performed by Church members and leaders on a regular basis over here. I myself, have been in this ministry for 20 plus years now. I agree with Rach, it is the Holy Spirit that executes these gifts as he does with all the others but you really do need to be called into this area most times and you need to know your authority.

Most believers are not up to dealing with demonic entities because they are very scary but they [demons] absolutely tremble in the sight of a child of God who knows who they are in Jesus ^_^

Bless ya!

 

[Foreigner]

I know a number of pastors personally who have cast out demons.
They do not consider themselves "exorcists."
They state they have simply called upon the name of Jesus and trusted with their whole hearts in the authority granted them through the Holy Spirit.

 

[Angelina]

I do not consider myself an exorcist either...think that's a Catholic word. It is not an uncommon thing over here though esp in the Pentecostal Churches...Pastor's know their authority in Christ and they also have the added bonus of being shepherd over the sheep. Demons recognize authority unless they themselves [Pastor] have a breach in their armor...that's when problems can occur ... h34r:

Shalom!

 

[Arnie Manitoba]

Not quite sure where to put this post, So Im putting it here.

In the Bible (OT and NT) we see exorcisms being performed. Jesus performed a few Himself.

My question is this:
If the prophets and Jesus Himself felt a desire to understand Demonology and perform exorcisms (deliverance), right upto the 1800's they were being performed, and even today in Eastern nations are being performed; Why do Western Christians no longer see an importance in Demonology? Is this lack of knowledge of Demonology and an ever decreasing number of exorcists in the West connected somehow to the amount and level of evil in Western Christian nations? Or in this "post-modern" world, have Christians wrongfully concluded demons (and therefore evil) do not exist?

I ask seriously, please no sarcasm.

RevDrRed (welcome)

One of the best and most informative modern day sources on this subject is by highly regarded author and historian Father Malachi Martin.

it is titled "Hostage to the Devil" and is a documentary of the exorcisms of 5 living Americans. It is compiled from recordings , witness statements , and credible sources present at the time. No drama is added. It is a documentary.

Sober reading for the strong in faith , very informative regarding the interaction of evil spirit with human . The book is available used and sometimes new at reasonable cost.

I also have at least 6 hours of recorded live interviews with Mr. Martin before he passed away ..... he said possession was usually quite rare (about 1 in every "suspected" thousand cases) . (the other 999 were attributed to mental health issues etc,)

However he stated that recently (in the 1990's interview) the number of actual genuine cases had increased by 800% .... the interviewer asked him to repeat the answer .... thinking he had mis-spoke. . Apparently some of the highest rates were in Vancouver BC Canada and lowest in places like (sin city) Las Vegas.

I have much more information (and opinion) if you need .... just ask.

It is a serious subject , care must be taken when we "hear" of some so-called charismatics walking thru the shopping mall casting demons out of everybody there ..... they suffer from deluded and wishful thinking that i am sure the devil approves because it brings mockery to the whole subject.

best wishes.
Arnie M.

 

[aspen]

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/11/13/us/13exorcism.html

 

[Arnie Manitoba]

http://www.nytimes.c...13exorcism.html

good article ..... a few years ago the Vatican also started "exorcism classes" to familiarize and train bishops and priests.

By the way .... I find it interesting that the Roman Catholic Latin rite of exorcism is still the world standard and authority.

The charismatics who go through the shopping malls casting out demons on a whim and a prayer don't like to hear that .... but they are just a silly side show anyway. They bring mockery to a serious subject and I expect the devil is pleased with their nonesense.

 

[aspen]

good article ..... a few years ago the Vatican also started "exorcism classes" to familiarize and train bishops and priests.

By the way .... I find it interesting that the Roman Catholic Latin rite of exorcism is still the world standard and authority.

The charismatics who go through the shopping malls casting out demons on a whim and a prayer don't like to hear that .... but they are just a silly side show anyway. They bring mockery to a serious subject and I expect the devil is pleased with their nonesense.

Exorcism has an interesting history - apparently in the 1700s in France, a priest and minister had a contest with each other regarding who could exercise a demon from a local girl. Long story short - the priest was successful - of course in reality it was God - afterwards, Catholics continued to focus on exorcisms and Protestants dropped out of the practice, until the 20th century and the rise of Pentecostalism. I cannot remember where I read this information, but it sure was an interesting piece of history.

 

[Arnie Manitoba]

Exorcism has an interesting history - apparently in the 1700s in France, a priest and minister had a contest with each other regarding who could exercise a demon from a local girl. Long story short - the priest was successful - of course in reality it was God - afterwards, Catholics continued to focus on exorcisms and Protestants dropped out of the practice, until the 20th century and the rise of Pentecostalism. I cannot remember where I read this information, but it sure was an interesting piece of history.

on that same note .... when the protestants started up again they used the original catholic rituals. Interesting.

Reading "Hostage to the Devil" explains how hard exorcism can be (fierce spiritual battle).... and the toll it takes on the participants (priest and aides) .... sometimes takes several days

With that in mind Malachi Martin was informed by a pentecostal type that all she did was walk around casting demons out all over the place in the name of Jesus ....

With tongue in cheek Malachi replied ...... " I wish I had known it was so easy "

By the way for anyone who needs to know .... The Official Roman Catholic Rite of Exorcism removes the possessing demon spirit by the power of the name of The Lord Jesus Christ .... nothing else ..... but it is not as simple as walking through a shopping mall doing it at random. ..... or bonking somebody on the head on a stage and knocking them over backwards. Most of that stuff is just a charismatic circus act .... don't be fooled by it.

 

[Angelina]

Christians don't randomly go around in the public arena casting out devils.That is not how it works.

Most times Deliverance's are conducted in a Church or combined Church environment under the covering of Leaders and Pastors of that Church or combined service. It is always done in an orderly manner. It usually happens either after the preaching of the word or when the ministers give an alter call. We have one very well known minister in this area who has come out of retirement because of the great need that is out there in the community...sometimes it can be a random thing but mostly it is something that the Church is doing as a normal part of their service [particularly night services] or that the combined Churches have organised.


^_^ Blessings!!!

 

[Arnie Manitoba]

Christians don't randomly go around in the public arena casting out devils.That is not how it works.

Most times Deliverance is conducted in a Church or combined Church environment under the covering of Leaders and Pastors of that Church or combined service. It is always done in an orderly manner. It usually happens either after the preaching of the word or when the ministers give an alter call. We have one very well known minister in this area who has come out of retirement because of the great need that is out there in the community...

^_^ Blessings!!!

Blessings to you too.

Are you able to describe what actually happens to the "possessed" during those exorcisms?

How do they know it is a case of possession in the first place?

What are the symptoms determining the possession ?

What are the signs that the demon has actually left?

How can you know for sure?

If those pastors and leaders are really that busy , are you saying there is a large amount of "possessed" people in your church?

Are you sure they are not simply folks who "think" they have devils ..... who come to the front to have them "cast out" ..... then they "feel better" for a while ...... until a couple months later they seem to have a "new batch of devils" that need removing again ..... then back up to the front again ?

And why is it that the charismatic churches ..... with all that huge filling of Holy Spirit ..... seem to have more devils than anyone else .... ?

I am not trying to be too critical Angelina , sorry ..... my observation is that these situations are mostly emotionalism confused with spiritualism.

"Feel good emotions " that are confused with Holy Spirit
"Feel bad emotions " that are confused with the devil

We all have bad days that can be gloomy as Hell
And good days that make us feel near to Heaven.
Emotions are like that sometimes.

Best wishes Angelina , and I hope you always "feel good" , and you are always filled with the Holy Spirit and all His blessings.

 

[Mungo]

In Catholicism the rite of exorcism is only permitted to be carried out by a priest.

There are lay people, particularly Catholic Charismatics, who perform "deliverances", which technically is not exorcism and thus doesn't contravene Church rules.

As I understand it there are 3 levels of demonic activity - oppression, infestation and possession; the latter being rare.

All Catholic Diocese (in England and Wales anyway) are supposed to have an official exorcist.

 

[RevDrRed]

Thankyou for the information.
Ill look into what you provided, Arnie and Aspen

Thankyou everyone for the information. I appreciate your help.

 

[Angelina]

I have taken the queue that the Rev has been given the information that he wants so I will not go into any further detail [although, I was just about to answer your questions AM] Perhaps another time... ^_^

Shalom!!!

 

[RevDrRed]

I have taken the queue that the Rev has been given the information that he wants so I will not go into any further detail [although, I was just about to answer your questions AM] Perhaps another time... ^_^

Shalom!!!

The more information the better. I will take a look at everything people suggest. If you have info, Id love to hear it.

 

[aspen]

I wonder what is going to happen to Bob Larson when he stumbles upon a real demon.......

 

[IanLC]

We call our "exorcisms" deliverance or the "casting out of spirits/demons". Some come out by the laying on of hands or by prayer circles where some of the ministers and church mothers pray, call on the name of Jesus, and place a bible on the individual, and some pray in the Holy Ghost until the "spirit or demon" comes out. Many demons do not manifest though in a service except when we have prayer services, tarrying services or deliverance services. Most of the time if one manifests in a service they tell the people to either call on Jesus, or pick up a Bible and they move the children into another room and open the doors of the church.