Did Jesus raise hiself from the dead or did God yhe father raise him
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Aunty Jane
Well-Known Member
Not sure you actually read the post I was responding to….
If Jesus was the Father, then he had “sons” not “brothers”….that was my point…..@Gabriel _Arch
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Aunty Jane
Well-Known Member
You said Jesus was the Father….if he was the Father then he did not have “brothers”….he had “sons”….No?
No scripture says that Jesus is the Father…he is the son. He has a Father who is also his God. (Rev 3:12)
This is ancient Hebrew, don’t forget…..name meant something…..”God with us” means what?
Jesus wasn’t the original “Immanuel” of Isaiah‘s prophesy. Do you know the story?
When Gabriel told Mary of the son she would have by holy spirit, he said that his name would be “Jesus”. (Luke 1:30-33)
You right i did not actually read, for there were some back and forth, i got lost in the midst.
Gabriel, was saying Jesus is the FATHER, is somehow correct, because if we've seen Jesus, we've seen the FATHER. Since, Jesus is the image of the invisible GOD (Colossians 1:15, Hebrews 1:3)
But on the other hand, Jesus is not the FATHER, though also sort of a Father figure to mankind. This because Jesus Himself paid the ransom to bring salvation, redemption, freedom and everlasting life to all mankind.
Isaiah 9:6, among others, His name shall be called, - Mighty God, Everlasting Father -
And GOD the FATHER holds the title of, ALL MIGHTY cum ALL MOST HIGH GOD and the FATHER of all. Now, am not doing this in correction, but merely sharing, thank you.
Jesus was the FATHER, merely being the image of the invisible FATHER. And, Jesus is not the FATHER KING HIMSELF, whom resides in Heaven and in secret.
Jesus is sort of the second inline, Father Prince and God to all creation while subjected to the FATHER. Which creation apparently he laid the foundation and is all the works of His hands with the FATHER.
Jesus is the Prince God subjected to the FATHER KING GOD. And His capability is vital to the mission, but only to a certain extend. For the Trinity in whole and togetherness, FATHER and the Holy Spirit as well, painted the picture in perfection.
Aunty Jane
Well-Known Member
It can happen in the back and forth……welcome to the forum BTW…
Nowhere in all of scripture is Jesus ever called “the Father” because God is his Father too….even in heaven, the Father is the God of Jesus. ( Rev 3:12; John 20:17)
He is the “firstborn of ALL creation” according to Col 1:15-17.
And an “image” is a copy of the real thing. Since he cannot reflect his invisible Father physically, he is the image of him in personality, and one with him in purpose. “Like father, like son”….
Yes that is correct…..he is a “father figure” because he is a life giver to all who accept him as God’s son and redeemer. He is also a “mighty god” in that he is divine and with the power of God’s spirit was able to do powerful works.…but never is Jesus called “Almighty”….that title is reserved for his Father.
Indeed, I have no issue at all with that….. it’s good to share our thoughts in a spirit of mildness.
Col 1 By Jesus all things were created.
Colossians 1
15 He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation.
16 For by Him all things were created that are in heaven and that are on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers. All things were created through Him and for Him.
17 And He is before all things, and in Him all things consist.
ONLY Jesus / Jehovah / God are called "Mighty God" in the Bible. NOBODY else! They are the same. Even the JW bible says so.
Your JW propaganda appreciated though, so the Truth can be shown that Jesus is God and Hell fire is "forever and ever"!
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Ronald Nolette
Well-Known Member
John 2:18-21
King James Version
18 Then answered the Jews and said unto him, What sign shewest thou unto us, seeing that thou doest these things?19 Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.
20 Then said the Jews, Forty and six years was this temple in building, and wilt thou rear it up in three days?
21 But he spake of the temple of his body.
Galatians 1:1
Paul, an apostle, (not of men, neither by man, but by Jesus Christ, and God the Father, who raised him from the dead
Romans 8:11-13
King James Version
11 But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.The trinity raised jesus.
There is not even one verse that says Jesus raised himself from the dead. The word "Father" is not a living being. It's a name and tile that we use to describe parents. God is Spirit and that's what it says got Jesus up.
Hebrews 2:12 - Bible Gateway
1 Corinthians 9:5
Do we have no right to take along a believing wife, as do also the other apostles, the brothers of the Lord, and Cephas?
Romans 8:29 - Bible Gateway
Brethren means brothers
JUB
¶ For unto those who he knew beforehand, he also marked out beforehand the way that they might be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.
KJV
For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.
AKJV
For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.
LSB
Because those whom He foreknew, He also predestined to become conformed to the image of His Son, so that He would be the firstborn among many brothers;
LEB
because those whom he foreknew, he also predestined to be conformed to the image of his Son, so that he should be the firstborn among many brothers.
TLB
For from the very beginning God decided that those who came to him—and all along he knew who would—should become like his Son, so that his Son would be the First, with many brothers.
BRETHREN - Definition from the KJV Dictionary
Definition of BRETHREN from the King James Bible Dictionary
brethren
BRETH'REN, n. plu. of brother. It is used almost exclusively in solemn and scriptural language,in the place of brothers. See Brother.
Aunty Jane
Well-Known Member
That is not what I said.....my point was that Jesus is not the Father......he had “brothers” not “sons”.BRETHREN - Definition from the KJV Dictionary
Definition of BRETHREN from the King James Bible Dictionaryav1611.com
brethren
BRETH'REN, n. plu. of brother. It is used almost exclusively in solemn and scriptural language,in the place of brothers. See Brother.
please read my original post to Gabriel Arch again.
Gabriel _Arch
Well-Known Member
Not true. Though I know there's no chance of correcting an errant denominational teaching.
Gabriel _Arch
Well-Known Member
Apparently yes, if you were to put in direct context of the Scripture. But Jesus did say, He have the authority to lay down His life and lift it up again, even before fulfilling the mission. Therefore, it was His own effort to fulfill in the end, and according to GOD's righteousness indeed He will be resurrected without a question.
Jesus can say, I laied down My life for the sins of the world and raised it up again in fulfillment. Can any one say it is false, besides the FATHER and the Holy Spirit played the role in the resurrection?
Next, let's be realistic here, you say the word 'Father' is not a living being, since GOD is Spirit, fair enough. Now, how do you answer this in John 1:18, No one has ever seen GOD; the only God, who is at the FATHER's side, He has made HIM known.
GOD indeed is Spirit and an invisible living being who art in Heaven and in secret, and Jesus who have seen has made HIM known. In Heavenly term, they are Spirit beings, ranking from top to bottom, as similar on earth that are visible. The verse say, to what is in Heaven it's like a shadow here on earth.
Apparently, you debunk the Scripture by making your own point over it, to say, Father is a term we only use on parent here on earth. Therefore, Jesus saying, I and the FATHER are one, is false? How many times Jesus used the term, FATHER, in the Gospel, haven't you any clue?
Am merely perplexed my friend where are you heading with such a strange testimony, sorry. To add, you say GOD is Spirit and HE the Spirit resurrected Jesus, is false! GOD is Spirit but HE is not the Holy Spirit, the Holy Spirit is another person in the Trinity.
If i were to distinguish to prove they are three different person, hence believe the Scripture it is the truth. Am not going to quote Scripture, for you should already know by now the Gospel, if you're a born again.
When John the Baptist baptized Jesus, three different person in the Trinity was present individually. Jesus came out of the water, the first person in the Trinity. Next, the Holy Spirit descended on Him in the form of a dove, the second person in the Trinity. Finally, a voice spoke from Heaven who is GOD the FATHER who reside in heaven and in secret, the third person in the Trinity.
All of this took place at the same time, and there were witnesses to testify about it, and we are disciple to testify accordingly. Peace be with you all in the name of Lord Jesus Christ and be enrich in the Word.
You are wrong, it is Scriptural in Colossians 1:15, for the error is in your part. And, i may find it difficult to beat because i too perceive the denomination you represent., sorry
False, He has His limits in obedience subjected only to the FATHER. For instant, He know not the hour and time, for only the FATHER knows.
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