Did Jesus tell the Pharisees that they were gods? - John 10:34

[St. SteVen]

Jesus answered them, “Is it not written in your Law, ‘I have said you are “gods”’[c]? - John 10:34 NIV

This interesting interchange between Jesus and his Jewish opponents (Pharisees?) leaves me wondering
what Jesus was trying to say about his Jewish opponents, or anyone for that matter. Seems as though Jesus answered their
blasphemy charge by saying they too were gods (sons of God), quoting Psalm 82:6 to make his point. (quoted below)

What do you make of this?
Here's the context of John 10:34

John 10:22-39 NIV
Then came the Festival of Dedication[a] at Jerusalem. It was winter,
23 and Jesus was in the temple courts walking in Solomon’s Colonnade.
24 The Jews who were there gathered around him, saying,
“How long will you keep us in suspense? If you are the Messiah, tell us plainly.”
25 Jesus answered, “I did tell you, but you do not believe.
The works I do in my Father’s name testify about me,
26 but you do not believe because you are not my sheep.
27 My sheep listen to my voice; I know them, and they follow me.
28 I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish;
no one will snatch them out of my hand.
29 My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all[b];
no one can snatch them out of my Father’s hand.
30 I and the Father are one.”
31 Again his Jewish opponents picked up stones to stone him,
32 but Jesus said to them,
“I have shown you many good works from the Father. For which of these do you stone me?”
33 “We are not stoning you for any good work,”
they replied, “but for blasphemy, because you, a mere man, claim to be God.”
34 Jesus answered them, “Is it not written in your Law, ‘I have said you are “gods”’[c]?
35 If he called them ‘gods,’ to whom the word of God came—and Scripture cannot be set aside—
36 what about the one whom the Father set apart as his very own and sent into the world?
Why then do you accuse me of blasphemy because I said, ‘I am God’s Son’?
37 Do not believe me unless I do the works of my Father.
38 But if I do them, even though you do not believe me, believe the works,
that you may know and understand that the Father is in me, and I in the Father.”
39 Again they tried to seize him, but he escaped their grasp.

Psalm 82:6 NIV
“I said, ‘You are “gods”;
you are all sons of the Most High.’


/ @Phil .

 

[Randy Kluth]

Jesus answered them, “Is it not written in your Law, ‘I have said you are “gods”’[c]? - John 10:34 NIV

This interesting interchange between Jesus and his Jewish opponents (Pharisees?) leaves me wondering
what Jesus was trying to say about his Jewish opponents, or anyone for that matter. Seems as though Jesus answered their
blasphemy charge by saying they too were gods (sons of God), quoting Psalm 82:6 to make his point. (quoted below)

What do you make of this?
Here's the context of John 10:34

John 10:22-39 NIV
Then came the Festival of Dedication[a] at Jerusalem. It was winter,
23 and Jesus was in the temple courts walking in Solomon’s Colonnade.
24 The Jews who were there gathered around him, saying,
“How long will you keep us in suspense? If you are the Messiah, tell us plainly.”
25 Jesus answered, “I did tell you, but you do not believe.
The works I do in my Father’s name testify about me,
26 but you do not believe because you are not my sheep.
27 My sheep listen to my voice; I know them, and they follow me.
28 I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish;
no one will snatch them out of my hand.
29 My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all[b];
no one can snatch them out of my Father’s hand.
30 I and the Father are one.”
31 Again his Jewish opponents picked up stones to stone him,
32 but Jesus said to them,
“I have shown you many good works from the Father. For which of these do you stone me?”
33 “We are not stoning you for any good work,”
they replied, “but for blasphemy, because you, a mere man, claim to be God.”
34 Jesus answered them, “Is it not written in your Law, ‘I have said you are “gods”’[c]?
35 If he called them ‘gods,’ to whom the word of God came—and Scripture cannot be set aside—
36 what about the one whom the Father set apart as his very own and sent into the world?
Why then do you accuse me of blasphemy because I said, ‘I am God’s Son’?
37 Do not believe me unless I do the works of my Father.
38 But if I do them, even though you do not believe me, believe the works,
that you may know and understand that the Father is in me, and I in the Father.”
39 Again they tried to seize him, but he escaped their grasp.

Psalm 82:6 NIV
“I said, ‘You are “gods”;
you are all sons of the Most High.’

Good question! I don't really know, but I'll give you what I think.

I think the sense of "gods" has more to do with referring to divinely-appointed leaders than actual avatars, or God-men. Jesus was saying that if in the Bible men acting with the authority of God is normal for Israel's leaders, why would the Pharisees find fault with him, who was appointed by God to act on God's behalf?

 

[St. SteVen]

I think the sense of "gods" has more to do with referring to divinely-appointed leaders than actual avatars, or God-men. Jesus was saying that if in the Bible men acting with the authority of God is normal for Israel's leaders, why would the Pharisees find fault with him, who was appointed by God to act on God's behalf?

Thanks for your response.
What you are saying seems to have some merit.
But how does that fit in the discussion Jesus was having with the "Pharisees"?

 

[Lambano]

Actually, it makes me wonder about the 82nd Psalm itself. Who are the "elohim" being judged by Elohim in verse 1?

מִזְמוֹר לְאָסָף אֱֽלֹהִים נִצָּב בַּעֲדַת־ אֵל בְּקֶרֶב אֱלֹהִים יִשְׁפֹּֽט ׃82:1

God stands in the congregation of the mighty (or 'God's congregation');
He judges among the gods.

If referring to the leaders of God's congregation (and Jesus clearly understands the Psalm this way), why does the Psalm refer to them as "gods"? If referring to lower-case "g" gods, why exhort them (if such even exist!) to rule with justice for the weak and needy? And for that matter, why is the God of Israel referred to in the plural in Hebrew anyway?

Just another one of those "whiskey, tango, foxtrot?" things in the Bible that I don't understand. But like Mark Twain said, "It ain't the parts of the Bible I don't understand that bother me; it's the parts I DO understand."

 

[Lambano]

Thanks for your response.
What you are saying seems to have some merit.
But how does that fit in the discussion Jesus was having with the "Pharisees"?

I guess the argument goes, "Hey, if God called the leaders of the Assembly (that's you guys) 'gods' and 'sons of The Most High God', why are you throwing rocks at me for claiming to be 'The Son of God'? Look at the miracles I'm doing and tell me which of us has the better claim?"

 

[MatthewG]

Here is some information, via Holman Study Bible: NKJV Large Print Edition, Hardcover: Holman Bible Publishers: 9781433607509: Amazon.com: Books. - I definitely never purposely bought this book, it was sent by mistake and I kept it.

Psalms 82:6-7 Kings who failed to perform responsibly and ethically deserved death. The concept finds support in the book of Ezekiel (Ezek. 28:1-29), where the Lord banished His divine servant, the king of Tyre, from His presence to die like a common man.

First verse: Psalms 82:1; Exodus 22:9;28; John 10:34

Ps 82:
1 God presides in the great assembly;
he renders judgment among the “gods”:

Exodus 22:9 In all cases of illegal possession of an ox, a donkey, a sheep, a garment, or any other lost property about which somebody says, ‘This is mine,’ both parties are to bring their cases before the judges.[a] The one whom the judges declare[b] guilty must pay back double to the other.

Exodus 22:28 “Do not blaspheme God[a] (Do not revile the judges) or curse the ruler of your people.

John 10:34
34 Jesus answered them, “Is it not written in your Law, ‘I have said you are “gods”’[a]?

• Tyre’s King Overthrown (First 2 Verses, and verse 9: of Ezekiel 28 out of 29 verses total)​

  28 The word of the Lord came again to me, saying, 2 “Son of man, say to the [a]leader of Tyre, ‘Thus says the Lord [b]God,
  
  “Because your heart is lifted up
  And you have said, ‘I am a god,
  I sit in the seat of [c]gods
  In the heart of the seas’;
  Yet you are a man and not God,
  Although you make your heart like the heart of God—

• Ezekiel 28:9
  
  9 Dost thou really say, `I [am] God,' Before him who is slaying thee? And thou [art] man, and not God, In the hand of him who is piercing thee.​

 

[St. SteVen]

Actually, it makes me wonder about the 82nd Psalm itself. Who are the "elohim" being judged by Elohim in verse 1?

מִזְמוֹר לְאָסָף אֱֽלֹהִים נִצָּב בַּעֲדַת־ אֵל בְּקֶרֶב אֱלֹהִים יִשְׁפֹּֽט ׃82:1

God stands in the congregation of the mighty (or 'God's congregation');
He judges among the gods.

If referring to the leaders of God's congregation (and Jesus clearly understands the Psalm this way), why does the Psalm refer to them as "gods"? If referring to lower-case "g" gods, why exhort them (if such even exist!) to rule with justice for the weak and needy? And for that matter, why is the God of Israel referred to in the plural in Hebrew anyway?

Just another one of those "whiskey, tango, foxtrot?" things in the Bible that I don't understand. But like Mark Twain said, "It ain't the parts of the Bible I don't understand that bother me; it's the parts I DO understand."

There you are "wondering" again. - LOL

Perhaps this raises the whole idea of the "The Divine Council." (Council of the gods)
Which is introduced in the book of Job when Satan appears before the council.

Job 1:6-7 NIV
One day the angels[a] came to present themselves before the Lord,
and Satan[b] also came with them.
7 The Lord said to Satan, “Where have you come from?” ...

Footnote​

1. Job 1:6 Hebrew the sons of God

Job 2:1-2 NIV
On another day the angels[a] came to present themselves before the Lord,
and Satan also came with them to present himself before him.
2 And the Lord said to Satan, “Where have you come from?” ...

Footnote​

1. Job 2:1 Hebrew the sons of God

 

[Rockerduck]

Jesus is referring to earthly judges that were or are representing God, like the head priests. Jesus was talking to Pharisees who judged. Jesus was admonishing them for not being righteous Judges over the Jewish People.

 

[St. SteVen]

I guess the argument goes, "Hey, if God called the leaders of the Assembly (that's you guys) 'gods' and 'sons of The Most High God', why are you throwing rocks at me for claiming to be 'The Son of God'? Look at the miracles I'm doing and tell me which of us has the better claim?"

Exactly.
That's how I read it as well.
Did Jesus tell "the Pharisees" that they were gods? Appears so.
What does that say about us?

 

[St. SteVen]

Jesus is referring to earthly judges that were or are representing God, like the head priests. Jesus was talking to Pharisees who judged. Jesus was admonishing them for not being righteous Judges over the Jewish People.

This came up earlier from @Randy Kluth
I'll ask you the same question that I asked him. (waiting for a response)

But how does that fit in the discussion Jesus was having with the "Pharisees"?

 

[mailmandan]

What does the Bible mean by “you are gods” / “ye are gods” in Psalm 82:6 and John 10:34? | GotQuestions.org

What does the Bible mean by “you are gods” / “ye are gods” in Psalm 82:6 and John 10:34? Are human beings in fact “little gods”?

www.gotquestions.org

 

[Rockerduck]

Exactly.
That's how I read it as well.
Did Jesus tell "the Pharisees" that they were gods? Appears so.
What does that say about us?

The Psalm 82 referred to the judges of Israel, which were divinely appointed. Christians have the mind of Christ in us.

1 Corinthians 2:15-16 -
But he that is spiritual judgeth all things, yet he himself is judged of no man.
16 For who hath known the mind of the Lord, that he may instruct him? but we have the mind of Christ.

 

[Lambano]

Did Jesus tell "the Pharisees" that they were gods? Appears so.

I dunno. Is the 82nd Psalm really claiming that the leaders of the Assembly are gods, or being sarcastic to remind the leadership of whom they are accountable to?

6 “I said, ‘You are “gods”;
you are all sons of the Most High.’
7 But you will die like mere mortals;
you will fall like every other ruler.”

Does Jesus's argument stand or fall on Psalm 82 not being sarcastic?

 

[Lambano]

Proof-texting is fun!

 

[MatthewG]

Proof-texting is fun!

Learning is what is fun friend.

Learning is a good thing, a wise choice to go and do.

The one who gets wisdom loves life; the one who cherishes understanding will soon prosper. (Proverbs 19:8)
36 But he who fails to find me harms himself; all who hate me love death.” (Proverbs 8:36 speaking of wisdom)

 

[St. SteVen]

What does the Bible mean by “you are gods” / “ye are gods” in Psalm 82:6 and John 10:34? | GotQuestions.org

What does the Bible mean by “you are gods” / “ye are gods” in Psalm 82:6 and John 10:34? Are human beings in fact “little gods”?

www.gotquestions.org

Thanks for the link. I like this explanation from that page.

Now, let’s look at how Jesus uses this passage. When Jesus quotes Psalm 82, He says that the statement “you are gods” was directed to those “to whom the word of God came” (John 10:35). That is, those who received the message of God were called “gods.” Jesus had just claimed to be the Son of God (John 10:25–30). The unbelieving Jews responded by charging Jesus with blasphemy, since He claimed to be God (verse 33). Jesus then quotes Psalm 82:6 and says, “If he called them ‘gods,’ to whom the word of God came—and Scripture cannot be set aside—what about the one whom the Father set apart as his very own and sent into the world?” Jesus’ point is this: you charge me with blasphemy based on my use of the title “Son of God”; yet your own Scriptures apply the same term to others besides God. If those who hold a divinely appointed office or those who have a divine position in the spiritual realm can be considered “gods,” how much more can the One whom God has chosen and sent (John 10:34–36)?

 

[St. SteVen]

Does Jesus's argument stand or fall on Psalm 82 not being sarcastic?

That's a great question.

 

[St. SteVen]

The Psalm 82 referred to the judges of Israel, which were divinely appointed. Christians have the mind of Christ in us.

1 Corinthians 2:15-16 -
But he that is spiritual judgeth all things, yet he himself is judged of no man.
16 For who hath known the mind of the Lord, that he may instruct him? but we have the mind of Christ.

Does that make us gods?

 

[St. SteVen]

I dunno. Is the 82nd Psalm really claiming that the leaders of the Assembly are gods, or being sarcastic to remind the leadership of whom they are accountable to?

I suppose we need some context. (a whole chapter worth)

Psalm 82​

A psalm of Asaph.​

1 God presides in the great assembly;
he renders judgment among the “gods”:

2 “How long will you[a] defend the unjust
and show partiality to the wicked?[b]
3 Defend the weak and the fatherless;
uphold the cause of the poor and the oppressed.
4 Rescue the weak and the needy;
deliver them from the hand of the wicked.

5 “The ‘gods’ know nothing, they understand nothing.
They walk about in darkness;
all the foundations of the earth are shaken.

6 “I said, ‘You are “gods”;
you are all sons of the Most High.’
7 But you will die like mere mortals;
you will fall like every other ruler.”

8 Rise up, O God, judge the earth,
for all the nations are your inheritance.

Footnotes​

1. Psalm 82:2 The Hebrew is plural.
2. Psalm 82:2 The Hebrew has Selah (a word of uncertain meaning) here.

 

[Lambano]

Does that make us gods?

Not yet?

2 Beloved, now we are children of God, and it has not appeared as yet what we will be. We know that when He appears, we will be like Him, because we will see Him just as He is. - 1 John 3:2