Do Men Have Authority Over Women?

[Michiah-Imla]

@TLHKAJ has exposed it very well. You ought to re-read her posts.

Birds of a feather flock together.

 

[Wrangler]

Yes, we birds flock together as there is safety in numbers from predators.

 

[Bob Estey]

See 1 COR 11:3. 1st WHAT, then HOW. Depending on the translation, it refers to either a woman or wife and it does say WHAT, 'the head of woman/wife is man.'

Quietthinker tends to make tangential points, not quite on topic, an instinctive derailer. The HOW we can leave up to God, about this and most things of Scripture. I often pray for the Holy Spirit to lead me to be the husband she needs, to do and say what she needs. Then, I follow the Spirit. Easy.

I think Quietthinker was right on the mark. Only God has authority over men. Only God has authority over women.

 

[Bob Estey]

Yes, keep doing that, it is good. A woman has no teaching authority over a man. This is also shown in all the scriptures by the things that were done and happened. This does not mean they could not prophecy or be spiritually gifted in certain ways.

The 'a woman is not allowed to speak in church, but to be quiet', mean not to speak in church services, as in not have teaching authority in the church to speak during the service in a ministerial capacity with men present, as in be a pastor, apostle office of a prophet, in a teaching ministry is what to speak in church means. But they can talk to other people.

I think that Quietthinker got it right when he said men don't have authority over themselves. I would conclude, then, that men don't have authority over women, either. Why would anyone want to have authority over another person?

 

[Wrangler]

I think Quietthinker was right on the mark. Only God has authority over men. Only God has authority over women.

Deny 1 COR 11:3 all you want.

 

[Bob Estey]

I'm taking Paul literally as well within the historical context that he lived. That's the part you fail to do. You see do not speak in church, ignore the rest of the context of the passage and historical context, and say "PAUL SAYS WOMEN CANNOT SPEAK IN A CHURCH BUILDING AT ALL!" That's not exegesis, that is stupidity.

Let me ask why a man would want to have authority over another person? Doesn't all power rest with God? Isn't that the way it SHOULD be?

 

[Bob Estey]

How on earth is that usurping God because he put men in authority over women in the church and in the home? You really have no idea what you are talking about.

Why would any man want to have authority over another person? Isn't that God's job? "For THINE is the kingdom, and the POWER, and the glory ..."

 

[Bob Estey]

Deny 1 COR 11:3 all you want.

I'm trying to figure out why anyone would want to have authority over another human being. That's God's job, not ours.

 

[BarneyFife]

Paul was quite a missionary, and in the end he was crucified, I believe.

Beheaded, if I'm not mistaken

 

[reformed1689]

Let me ask why a man would want to have authority over another person? Doesn't all power rest with God? Isn't that the way it SHOULD be?

How is that even relevant? It's not about what man wants or does not want, it is about what God has commanded and setup.

 

[Bob Estey]

How is that even relevant? It's not about what man wants or does not want, it is about what God has commanded and setup.

How is it relevant? You want to have authority over women, do you not - to be their God. Isn't that what the thread is about?

 

[reformed1689]

How is it relevant? You want to have authority over women, do you not - to be their God. Isn't that what the thread is about?

If you think that is what this thread is about you have completely missed the point.

 

[Scott Downey]

I'm trying to figure out why anyone would want to have authority over another human being. That's God's job, not ours.

God delegates authority.
Example here, Jesus commends the Roman Centurion for understanding about authorities.
Luke 7
1 After He had finished all that He had to say in the hearing of the people, He went to Capernaum.

2 Now a [Roman] centurion’s slave, who was highly regarded by him, was sick and on the verge of death. 3 When the centurion heard about Jesus, he sent some Jewish elders to Him, asking Him to come and save the life of his slave. 4 When they reached Jesus, they pleaded with Him earnestly [to come], saying, “He is worthy for You to do this for him, 5 because he loves our nation and he built us our synagogue [at his own expense].” 6 And Jesus went with them. But when He was near the house, the centurion sent friends to Him, saying, “Lord, do not trouble Yourself further, for I am not worthy for You to come under my roof. 7 Therefore I did not even consider myself worthy to come to You. But just speak a word, and my slave will be healed. 8 For I also am a man subject to authority, with soldiers under me; and I say to this one, ‘Go,’ and he goes, and to another, ‘Come,’ and he comes, and to my slave, ‘Do this,’ and he does it.” 9 Now when Jesus heard this, He was amazed at him, and turned and said to the crowd that was following Him, “I say to you, not even in Israel have I found such great faith [as this man’s].” 10 When the messengers who had been sent returned to the house, they found the slave in good health.

 

[Scott Downey]

When someone 'despises authority', they despise God who ordained the authority, it is characteristic of demons, fallen angels, the devil, as it is rebellion against God.
They are then 'lawless ones'. Jesus also says this to them,

1. Matthew 7:23
   And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!’
   In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations
2. Matthew 13:41
   The Son of Man will send out His angels, and they will gather out of His kingdom all things that offend, and those who practice lawlessness,
   In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations
3. Matthew 23:28
   Even so you also outwardly appear righteous to men, but inside you are full of hypocrisy and lawlessness.

And one of the big lawless ones is the devil himself. Beings are described lawless when they do not submit to the law of God.

2 Peter 2:10
and especially those who indulge in the corrupt passions of the sin nature, and despise authority. Presumptuous and reckless, self-willed and arrogant [creatures, despising the majesty of the Lord], they do not tremble when they revile angelic majesties,

Jude 1:8
Nevertheless in the same way, these dreamers [who are dreaming that God will not punish them] also defile the body, and reject [legitimate] authority, and revile and mock angelic majesties.

Ephesians 6:5
Slaves, be obedient to those who are your earthly masters, with respect for authority, and with a sincere heart [seeking to please them], as [service] to Christ—

 

[Bob Estey]

If you think that is what this thread is about you have completely missed the point.

But the name of the thread is, "Do men have authority over women." I said, "How is it relevant? You want to have authority over women, do you not - to be their God. Isn't that what the thread is about?" How am I missing the point?

 

[Bob Estey]

God delegates authority.
Example here, Jesus commends the Roman Centurion for understanding about authorities.
Luke 7
1 After He had finished all that He had to say in the hearing of the people, He went to Capernaum.

2 Now a [Roman] centurion’s slave, who was highly regarded by him, was sick and on the verge of death. 3 When the centurion heard about Jesus, he sent some Jewish elders to Him, asking Him to come and save the life of his slave. 4 When they reached Jesus, they pleaded with Him earnestly [to come], saying, “He is worthy for You to do this for him, 5 because he loves our nation and he built us our synagogue [at his own expense].” 6 And Jesus went with them. But when He was near the house, the centurion sent friends to Him, saying, “Lord, do not trouble Yourself further, for I am not worthy for You to come under my roof. 7 Therefore I did not even consider myself worthy to come to You. But just speak a word, and my slave will be healed. 8 For I also am a man subject to authority, with soldiers under me; and I say to this one, ‘Go,’ and he goes, and to another, ‘Come,’ and he comes, and to my slave, ‘Do this,’ and he does it.” 9 Now when Jesus heard this, He was amazed at him, and turned and said to the crowd that was following Him, “I say to you, not even in Israel have I found such great faith [as this man’s].” 10 When the messengers who had been sent returned to the house, they found the slave in good health.

Where did Jesus say, "Paul is the boss"?

 

[Wrangler]

But the name of the thread is, "Do men have authority over women." I said, "How is it relevant? You want to have authority over women, do you not - to be their God. Isn't that what the thread is about?" How am I missing the point?

Yes, you are deliberately, it seems, missing the point. The thread is not about what God's children want. It's about what is the divine order.

And I must say, you relating the 2 is obviously a means to undermine the divine order, slander it in some way. Consider, for the sake of argument WHAT DIFFERENCE, AT THIS POINT, DOES IT MAKE? Suppose men want authority over wives? Suppose men DON'T want authority over wives? It does not change the divine order.

Said differently, 1 COR 11:3, Eph 5:24, Col 3:18 and others do not pivot the command based on what God's children want. So, the question is, why are you pursuing the line of thought you are?

 

[Bob Estey]

Yes, you are deliberately, it seems, missing the point. The thread is not about what God's children want. It's about what is the divine order.

And I must say, you relating the 2 is obviously a means to undermine the divine order, slander it in some way. Consider, for the sake of argument WHAT DIFFERENCE, AT THIS POINT, DOES IT MAKE? Suppose men want authority over wives? Suppose men DON'T want authority over wives? It does not change the divine order.

Said differently, 1 COR 11:3, Eph 5:24, Col 3:18 and others do not pivot the command based on what God's children want. So, the question is, why are you pursuing the line of thought you are?

It's not about what people want. (I suppose some men would love to boss women around.) It's about what God wants, and God wants all people treated fairly.

 

[Lambano]

Do Men Have Authority Over Women?
Do men have authority over themselves?

I think that Quietthinker got it right when he said men don't have authority over themselves. I would conclude, then, that men don't have authority over women, either. Why would anyone want to have authority over another person?

I don't see that anybody has authority over anybody else in the church, period.

I remember one of my pastors saying that the only thing the preacher has authority over is what happens in the sanctuary between 11:00 A.M. and 12:00 P.M. Sunday morning.

As for men learning from women... "Wisdom is vindicated by her children."

 

[Wrangler]

It's not about what people want. (I suppose some men would love to boss women around.) It's about what God wants, and God wants all people treated fairly.

This thread is not about people treating fairly. And you did not back up your claim of what God wants with 1 single verse.

Your notion of fair goes against a women submitting to a man does it, contrary to 1 COR 11:3, Eph 5:24, Col 3:18 et al?