Does God pick who is saved?

[MatthewG]

Does God pick who is saved and does those saved persons he chose to save, do they have a choice in choosing whether or not they wanted to be saved to begin with?

Or is it Human beings who choose to want to be saved to the Kingdom of Heaven, and by faith, as God adopts children into his kingdom?

With Israel being counted, there seemed to be 3,000 people who did not bow to Baal, which he reserved for himself, of course these 3,000 willingly servants of Yahavah must have been devoted to not bow to Baal. I believe there was an elect people group, being the bride in that age. Even with them being begotten, the Kingdom reigns and people come in by being adopted in and through faith.

While it seemed that Yahavah did seem to have a group of elect people in mind who would bring in the new administration of Christ which operates on the spirit, in that day in age, does God still pick and choose today if that is the case for gentile believers?

 

[dev553344]

Does God pick who is saved and does those saved persons he chose to save, do they have a choice in choosing whether or not they wanted to be saved to begin with?

Or is it Human beings who choose to want to be saved to the Kingdom of Heaven, and by faith, as God adopts children into his kingdom?

With Israel being counted, there seemed to be 3,000 people who did not bow to Baal, which he reserved for himself, of course these 3,000 willingly servants of Yahavah must have been devoted to not bow to Baal. I believe there was an elect people group, being the bride in that age. Even with them being begotten, the Kingdom reigns and people come in by being adopted in and through faith.

While it seemed that Yahavah did seem to have a group of elect people in mind who would bring in the new administration of Christ which operates on the spirit, in that day in age, does God still pick and choose today if that is the case for gentile believers?

God is the only being that can save people so yes. And yes we have a choice.

 

[Lambano]

Ah, yes. The question of God's sovereignty vs. Man's responsibility. We've been debating this for thousands of years without any definitive conclusion. The Bible teaches both.

 

[MatthewG]

Ah, yes. The question of God's sovereignty vs. Man's responsibility. We've been debating this for thousands of years without any definitive conclusion. The Bible teaches both.

What does the spirit tell you?

 

[MatthewG]

God is the only being that can save people so yes. And yes we have a choice.

Thank you for sharing your answer Dev.

 

[Lambano]

What does the spirit tell you?

I'm not receiving any direction one way or the other. All I know is that I'm responsible for what I do, and God does what He does. And He gets to say who He lets into His kingdom - and for His own reasons. I can only speculate about some of the reasons why God left it ambiguous that way in the Bible.

 

[MatthewG]

I'm not receiving any direction one way or the other. All I know is that I'm responsible for what I do, and God does what He does. And He gets to say who He lets into His kingdom - and why. I can only speculate about some of the reasons why God left it ambiguous that way in the Bible.

Thank you for your answer and another question came to my mind. Why didn’t God save Adam and Eve?

 

[Lambano]

Thank you for your answer and another question came to my mind. Why didn’t God save Adam and Eve?

"Save" in terms of preventing them from eating the forbidden fruit, or "save" in terms of their post-mortem destiny?

 

[MatthewG]

"Save" in terms of preventing them from eating the forbidden fruit, or "save" in terms of their post-mortem destiny?

You may free decide either way. The thought of the question just simply popped into my head, sir.

 

[Lambano]

The latter we don't know.

The former....

I am convinced that The Fall was part of God's plan from the beginning. For whatever God has planned for us to become, it is necessary that Humankind experientially know Good and Evil. And yet The Man and The Woman were responsible for their choices. We can talk about Compatibilism or God being outside of space and time and knowing what choices will be made because they already have been made, but we won't reach any definitive conclusion.

 

[mailmandan]

Romans 8:29 - For whom He foreknew, He also predestined to be conformed to the image of His Son, that He might be the firstborn among many brethren. 30 Moreover whom He predestined, these He also called; whom He called, these He also justified; and whom He justified, these He also glorified.

Predestination means that God has a purpose that is determined before it comes to pass. However, predestination does not negate free will, but is based on God's foreknowledge of those who would choose Him.

 

[Jack]

"Does God pick who is saved?"

Did God make everyone EXACTLY as He pleased KNOWING who will burn in Hell forever? God doesn't make mistakes.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

Does God pick who is saved and does those saved persons he chose to save, do they have a choice in choosing whether or not they wanted to be saved to begin with?

Or is it Human beings who choose to want to be saved to the Kingdom of Heaven, and by faith, as God adopts children into his kingdom?

With Israel being counted, there seemed to be 3,000 people who did not bow to Baal, which he reserved for himself, of course these 3,000 willingly servants of Yahavah must have been devoted to not bow to Baal. I believe there was an elect people group, being the bride in that age. Even with them being begotten, the Kingdom reigns and people come in by being adopted in and through faith.

While it seemed that Yahavah did seem to have a group of elect people in mind who would bring in the new administration of Christ which operates on the spirit, in that day in age, does God still pick and choose today if that is the case for gentile believers?

If you look carefully at the Scriptures, it is always God who does the choosing based on the counsel of His own will and not because some man chases or desires it.

 

[MatthewG]

If you look carefully at the Scriptures, it is always God who does the choosing based on the counsel of His own will and not because some man chases or desires it.

He does try to get the Israelites to pay attention a lot, but they were still hard headed enough to not listen.

I’m just curious to know how one is saved to the Kingdom of Heaven?

Do we have participation in building up the spiritual body here for the afterlife afterwards?

 

[O'Darby]

The latter we don't know.

The former....

I am convinced that The Fall was part of God's plan from the beginning. For whatever God has planned for us to become, it is necessary that Humankind experientially know Good and Evil. And yet The Man and The Woman were responsible for their choices. We can talk about Compatibilism or God being outside of space and time and knowing what choices will be made because they already have been made, but we won't reach any definitive conclusion.

Surely. We are told that salvation in Christ was God's plan from before the creation, so obviously "the need for salvation" was there as well. I always think it's significant that the Fall was on the part of the very first human couple who disobeyed an extremely simple divine command - i.e., it was inevitable and unavoidable. This is what I think the Genesis account conveys - i.e., the Fall was God's plan for humanity, not that a nasty serpent threw a monkey wrench into God's plan for innocent, obedient humans. I believe the Genesis account simply conveys "You aren't holy, you are incapable of satisfying God's standards, you are finite creatures wholly dependent on God. Now get on with your lives."

As you suggest, the Fall and the knowledge of Good and Evil were necessary for humans to become all that God wanted them to become - mature moral agents capable of genuine communion with Him. In the accounts of Near Death Experiences, we often find references to the earthly life being a "school" - and I believe there is considerable truth in this. The poet Keats called life on earth "the vale of soul-making," which conveys the same idea.

 

[Jack]

He does try to get the Israelites to pay attention a lot, but they were still hard headed enough to not listen.

I’m just curious to know how one is saved to the Kingdom of Heaven?

Do we have participation in building up the spiritual body here for the afterlife afterwards?

Matthew doesn't believe in Hell, but he will.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

He does try to get the Israelites to pay attention a lot, but they were still hard headed enough to not listen.

I’m just curious to know how one is saved to the Kingdom of Heaven?

Do we have participation in building up the spiritual body here for the afterlife afterwards?

Yes we see God always talling to HIs own when we wander to get us to turn back. But that is to His own. God had a special covenant with Israel and how it all worked out in the nitty gritty of daily living is not well known when it came to their hard heartedness.

 

[O'Darby]

Matthew doesn't believe in Hell, but he will.

So "believing in Hell" is a prerequisite to salvation in your theology? It's question #34 on the 125-question exam for entrance into heaven, for which only a perfect score of 125 earns a passing grade? Eek. I don't know enough about @MatthewG's theology to discuss it, but even Universalists typically "believe in Hell." They simply believe the purpose is remedial and consistent with God's wish for all to be saved, not penal eternal torment.

The atheists at the forum I recently left used to laugh at Christians purportng to read the mind of God. I'm starting to see what they were laughing about.

 

[Ziggy]

Thank you for your answer and another question came to my mind. Why didn’t God save Adam and Eve?

He did.
We are.

God named them Adam. Adam represents the fullness of all mankind ever to walk the face of the earth.
Then there is division between Man and Woman, but they are still mankind.
And we don't see the salvation of Adam until we come to the New Testament.
Where God would have all man to be saved.
And he sacrificed his son for the life of all.
All is Adam, Adam is mankind.

In the process of time.In the fullness of time.

The entire bible is man's walk through the ages in this life, in this world.
We have had from Genesis to the Gospel to get it right.
And when the time was right, God sent Adam the gift of salvation.
And here we are.


hugs

 

[BlessedPeace]

The latter we don't know.

The former....

I am convinced that The Fall was part of God's plan from the beginning. For whatever God has planned for us to become, it is necessary that Humankind experientially know Good and Evil. And yet The Man and The Woman were responsible for their choices. We can talk about Compatibilism or God being outside of space and time and knowing what choices will be made because they already have been made, but we won't reach any definitive conclusion.

What we know as Genesis was written 5000 b.c in ancient Sumer. It has been changed since the . This is why there are differing accounts of the creation of man and woman.