Earth, Created to stand forever

[bbyrd009]

Where did you attend college, do you have your Thd. Doctorate?

how bout you voice any objections to the translation, and we can go from there? Do you see anything wrong with it? Are your sources telling you anything different? What sources?

 

[bbyrd009]

Where did you attend college, do you have your Thd. Doctorate?

you don't need all that to do an etymology of a word tho, actually imo that is possibly the worst thing you could do lol, but anyway
παρα | Abarim Publications Theological Dictionary (New Testament Greek)
ερχομαι | Abarim Publications Theological Dictionary (New Testament Greek)
or similar and voila.

a point is to see that the word does not translate exactly, and maybe doesn't mean what is sometimes interpreted
even broadly interpreted

you'd still be looking sundown tomorrow for a believer to agree that Paul never said
"to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord"

 

[Truth7t7]

how bout you voice any objections to the translation, and we can go from there? Do you see anything wrong with it? Are your sources telling you anything different? What sources?

No degrees as expexted, All hot wind as I thought.

 

[Truth7t7]

you don't need all that to do an etymology of a word tho, actually imo that is possibly the worst thing you could do lol, but anyway

bbyrd009 Degree Below?

παρα | Abarim Publications Theological Dictionary (New Testament Greek)
ερχομαι | Abarim Publications Theological Dictionary (New Testament Greek)
or similar and voila.

a point is to see that the word does not translate exactly, and maybe doesn't mean what is sometimes interpreted
even broadly interpreted

you'd still be looking sundown tomorrow for a believer to agree that Paul never said
"to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord"

That's your degree?

I thought you were somebody, doctorate, Phd?

Your gonna lead us to the promised land?

Dictionary (New Testament Greek)
ερχομαι | Abarim Publications Theological Dictionary (New Testament Greek)

 

[bbyrd009]

I thought you were somebody, doctorate, Phd?

No degrees as expexted, All hot wind as I thought.

well seems to me hidden from the wise suggests that any interp of yours that matches the wise should be suspect, and not accepted, don't you think? So see you are asking me to point out how illegit i am

 

[twinc]

well seems to me hidden from the wise suggests that any interep of yours that matches the wise should be suspect, and not accepted, don't you think?

to return to the original topic - it seems no one has read what 2Peter3:10-13 says - twinc

 

[bbyrd009]

to return to the original topic - it seems no one has read what 2Peter3:10-13 says - twinc

imo Peter is making an obvious allusion to the eventual end of all creation in heat death--approx 5 billion years from now in our neck of the woods--and using that as a symbol of God's greatness, compared to what we tend to focus on; Peter was chiding them for some problem that cropped up, i forget what. 'Turn the other cheek' was being scoffed at or something

To suggest that this Conflagration is something that ppl should worry about happening tonight or in their generation or something is not where you're going is it?

 

[verzanumi24]

It is not I who has chosen to believe some of the scriptures and ignored others.

How do you explain:

2 Peter 3:7
But the heavens and the earth which are now preserved by the same word, are reserved for fire until the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men.

...and:

2 Peter 3:10
But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night, in which the heavens will pass away with a great noise, and the elements will melt with fervent heat; both the earth and the works that are in it will be burned up.

2 Peter 3:10 is referring to the atmosphere that surrounds the Earth. Peter 3:7 is not saying that the planet will be no more, but that what's on the surface of the Earth will be consumed by fire. Jesus said the meek will inherit the earth. He didn't say the meek will inherit another Earth. When the word "The" is use before a sentence, it referring to the original article and not something else. Grammar is important even when it comes to the Bible


.


.

 

[Truth7t7]

2 Peter 3:10 is referring to the atmosphere that surrounds the Earth. Peter 3:7 is not saying that the planet be no more, but that what's on the surface of the Earth will be consumed by fire. Jesus said the meek will inherit the earth. He didn't say the meek will inherit another Earth. When the word "The" is use before a sentence, it referring to the original article and not something else. Grammar is important even when it comes to the Bible


.


.

This existing heaven and earth will be "Dissolved" by the Lord' fire in judgment, then the New Heaven, Earth, And Jerusalem Are Revealed For Eternity.

When Jesus Christ Return's, It's Final Judgment By Fire, No Mortal Human Survives.

1 Corinthians 3:13KJV
13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.

Luke 17:29-30KJV
29 But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all.
30 Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed.

Malachi 3:2KJV
2 But who may abide the day of his coming? and who shall stand when he appeareth? for he is like a refiner's fire, and like fullers' soap:

Nahum 1:5KJV
5 The mountains quake at him, and the hills melt, and the earth is burned at his presence, yea, the world, and all that dwell therein.

Zechariah 14:12KJV
12 And this shall be the plague wherewith the Lord will smite all the people that have fought against Jerusalem; Their flesh shall consume away while they stand upon their feet, and their eyes shall consume away in their holes, and their tongue shall consume away in their mouth.

2 Thessalonians 1:7-8KJV
7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,
8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:

Matthew 13:40KJV
As therefore the tares are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall it be in the end of this world.

2 Peter 3:10-13KJV
10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,
12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?
13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.

Revelation 21:1-5KJV
1 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.
2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.
4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.
5 And he that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful.

 

[verzanumi24]

This existing heaven and earth will be "Dissolved" by the Lord' fire in judgment, then the New Heaven, Earth, And Jerusalem Are Revealed For Eternity.

When Jesus Christ Return's, It's Final Judgment By Fire, No Mortal Human Survives.

1 Corinthians 3:13KJV
13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.

Luke 17:29-30KJV
29 But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all.
30 Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed.

Malachi 3:2KJV
2 But who may abide the day of his coming? and who shall stand when he appeareth? for he is like a refiner's fire, and like fullers' soap:

Nahum 1:5KJV
5 The mountains quake at him, and the hills melt, and the earth is burned at his presence, yea, the world, and all that dwell therein.

Zechariah 14:12KJV
12 And this shall be the plague wherewith the Lord will smite all the people that have fought against Jerusalem; Their flesh shall consume away while they stand upon their feet, and their eyes shall consume away in their holes, and their tongue shall consume away in their mouth.

2 Thessalonians 1:7-8KJV
7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,
8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:

Matthew 13:40KJV
As therefore the tares are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall it be in the end of this world.

2 Peter 3:10-13KJV
10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,
12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?
13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.

Revelation 21:1-5KJV
1 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.
2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.
4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.
5 And he that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful.

All those are referring to what will take place on the surface of the Earth and above(the atmosphere that surounds the Earth). But that will take place a little over a thousand years after Jesus returns. When Jesus returns He is going to punish the Nations for the evil they have done, with massive Earth quakes around the world. But He will not wipe humanity off the Earth. He will allow a few to live and Jesus along with the saints, whom at that time are glorified and will rule over them as kings and priests. When that age or time period has come to and end, then all those who are dead, He will resurrect them, and they too will be given the opportunity to repent. It is at the end of that age, God will set out to make all things new.


There are scriptures scattered throughout the Bible(Old and New Testament) that refer to what I'm saying. It's not the planet itself that is the problem, it's the people on it that is. Once the wicked are remove, then the Earth will be a wonderful place to live. The Earth will become the center or head equators for everything that will be planned for the universe. The saints, who will be kings, will bring their glory and honor into the City that God will bring from Heaven to the Earth.

 

[bbyrd009]

the atmosphere that surounds the Earth

this seems well put. Imo it is happening right now--for Weinstein it happened yesterday, for instance--but whatever.
Now, is Jesus "punishing" him? i guess that's kind of one way to look at it, but tbh i suspect Christ forgives him; it is prolly Christians who will be doing all the punishment i guess

 

[bbyrd009]

this pov of Jesus maybe coming back this evening or tomorrow bodily with a flamethrower in hand is a bunch of hooey though guys, that is not the intent of that passage imo. If you're going to go there you should be equally afraid of a flood i guess. A local flood maybe, to get around the rainbow or whatever.

Peter is giving a discourse on humility here, not prophesying about some literal event for us to worry about. So we got "absent from the body" all over again imo. Start at v1 and read, i mean pls. Plainly restated in conclusion,

Conclusion

14Therefore, dear friends, while you wait for these things, make every effort to be found at peace with Him without spot or blemish.z
15Also, regard the patience of our Lord as an opportunity for salvation, just as our dear brother Paul has written to you according to the wisdom given to him.aa
16He speaks about these things in all his letters in which there are some matters that are hard to understand. The untaught and unstable twist them to their own destruction,ab as they also do with the rest of the Scriptures.

17Therefore, dear friends, since you know this in advance, be on your guard

although i understand why this passage was invoked in this venue, don't get me wrong

 

[ScottA]

2 Peter 3:10 is referring to the atmosphere that surrounds the Earth. Peter 3:7 is not saying that the planet will be no more, but that what's on the surface of the Earth will be consumed by fire. Jesus said the meek will inherit the earth. He didn't say the meek will inherit another Earth. When the word "The" is use before a sentence, it referring to the original article and not something else. Grammar is important even when it comes to the Bible


.


.

There is no contradiction in the scriptures, so our disagreement is silly. The reason there are two possible ways to consider what is written...is because it speaks of two earths, the old and the new. Grammar does not explain away the use of parable meaning. On the contrary, it is purposely there to confound the wicked - but we should not be deceived.

 

[verzanumi24]

There is no contradiction in the scriptures, so our disagreement is silly. The reason there are two possible ways to consider what is written...is because it speaks of two earths, the old and the new. Grammar does not explain away the use of parable meaning. On the contrary, it is purposely there to confound the wicked - but we should not be deceived.

I didn't say there was contradiction in the scripture. I only questioned some people and or your understanding of what you read. And those scriptures are not parables. If memory serves me rights, Jesus was the only one in the Bible that used parables, and in private He would tell the meaning. So I don't know what scriptures you are talking about that are parables. The Book of Revelation is not a parable.....the name alone tells you what it is......a revelation or a revealing. Some of those scriptures that Truth7t7 post earlier are referring to two different events that he and or you are mixing into one event.


You don't seem to understand that soon after Jesus returns and punish the Nations, there will still be mortal human beings for the saints to rule over when Jesus and the saints sit as kings over the Earth. They can't be kings by themselves, because a king or kings in this case need citisens or subjects to rule over. You also don't seem to understand that there will be a second resurrection and dare I say it, a third resurrection. Not knowing God's plan(it's hidden in the Old Testament Holy Days) on how He will save the countless human beings, whom lived and died and have never even heard about the true God will cause one to come to a false understanding of the scriptures they are quoting.

 

[bbyrd009]

i could name 100 nations that have already seen the day of the Lord i guess

 

[ScottA]

I didn't say there was contradiction in the scripture. I only questioned some people and or your understanding of what you read. And those scriptures are not parables. If memory serves me rights, Jesus was the only one in the Bible that used parables, and in private He would tell the meaning. So I don't know what scriptures you are talking about that are parables. The Book of Revelation is not a parable.....the name alone tells you what it is......a revelation or a revealing. Some of those scriptures that Truth7t7 post earlier are referring to two different events that he and or you are mixing into one event.


You don't seem to understand that soon after Jesus returns and punish the Nations, there will still be mortal human beings for the saints to rule over when Jesus and the saints sit as kings over the Earth. They can't be kings by themselves, because a king or kings in this case need citisens or subjects to rule over. You also don't seem to understand that there will be a second resurrection and dare I say it, a third resurrection. Not knowing God's plan(it's hidden in the Old Testament Holy Days) on how He will save the countless human beings, whom lived and died and have never even heard about the true God will cause one to come to a false understanding of the scriptures they are quoting.

Okay, we were talking about the earth lasting forever...now you have brought up more to sort through. One thing at a time:

1. I did not mean that you said there was a contradiction in the scriptures, but rather that it does not work for us to pit one scripture against another in defense of our different positions. Such an argument or discussion cannot offer any resolution. We must first agree that the scriptures are correct and then reconcile them. What I was indicating is that your explanation and position could not be reconciled with Peter's clear indication that the earth elements would be destroyed.

2. As for parables, "All things come in parables." Mark 4:11

3. As for Jesus' return and the saints reigning with Him, that is a big topic of its own...and you have already not represented it accurately. Indeed, the saints are as kings and do reign even now.

4. As for the resurrection, you have not represented it well either. There is but one resurrection, but in two forms: one of the dead, and one of the living. But both were resurrected with Christ. As for a third resurrection, all things are "in Christ", who was resurrected just once. Instead of looking at multiple resurrections, you would do better to look at each "fold." It is the different folds that are the multiple factor, not the number of resurrections.

 

[verzanumi24]

Okay, we were talking about the earth lasting forever...now you have brought up more to sort through. One thing at a time:

1. I did not mean that you said there was a contradiction in the scriptures, but rather that it does not work for us to pit one scripture against another in defense of our different positions. Such an argument or discussion cannot offer any resolution. We must first agree that the scriptures are correct and then reconcile them. What I was indicating is that your explanation and position could not be reconciled with Peter's clear indication that the earth elements would be destroyed.

2. As for parables, "All things come in parables." Mark 4:11

3. As for Jesus' return and the saints reigning with Him, that is a big topic of its own...and you have already not represented it accurately. Indeed, the saints are as kings and do reign even now.

4. As for the resurrection, you have not represented it well either. There is but one resurrection, but in two forms: one of the dead, and one of the living. But both were resurrected with Christ. As for a third resurrection, all things are "in Christ", who was resurrected just once. Instead of looking at multiple resurrections, you would do better to look at each "fold." It is the different folds that are the multiple factor, not the number of resurrections.

Jesus was refering to the gospel He preached......He preached it in parables to hide His message from those who rejected Him.


Matthew 13:34 (Darby)
34 All these things Jesus spoke to the crowds in parables, and without a parable he did not speak to them,

Mark 4:11-12 (Darby)
11 And he said to them, To you is given [to know] the mystery of the kingdom of God; but to them who are without, all things are done in parables,
12 that beholding they may behold and not see, and hearing they may hear and not understand, lest it may be, they should be converted and they should be forgiven.

By taking a scripture out of the context it can cause the person to come to a wrong conclusion. I don't post scriptures to contradict other scriptures. I post scriptures to give a particular scripture a deeper or clearer understanding. The majority of christians just know a few scriptures that seem to support what they believe. But that is like trying to figure out what the jigsaw puzzle is with only part of the pieces put together. Most chritians don't even know the purpose for God making human beings, let alone God's plan of salvation that goes beyond Jesus' sacrifice on the cross. To many, if one dies and didn't repent, the person is doomed, but that is false. Jesus say if the blind lead the blind both will fall in a ditch, and most pastors and ministers are spiritually blind, so they lead the congration into a spiritual ditch so-to-speak.

 

[BARNEY BRIGHT]

God's spiritual children, not his earthly children. Those proven worthy who receive of the divine nature, inherent life, life in themselves, and thus able to bestow life even as the Father. As God did not create the earth in vain, but created it to be inhabited, so too many of the worlds found throughout the universe.

I have not found anywhere in scripture that there will be other living beings, intelligent or not inhabited on other world's. Isn't this just speculation?

 

[Truth7t7]

I have not found anywhere in scripture that there will be other living beings, intelligent or not inhabited on other world's. Isn't this just speculation?

You won't find this teaching in the Holy Bible because it's not there.

Found in the Book Of Mormon and their planet Kalob, and inheritance of celestial planets and Mormon wives.

 

[BARNEY BRIGHT]

There are no scriptures, this was merely a speculative remark, based upon the Lord's word that he did not create the earth in vain, but intended it to be inhabited, thus it is a good assumption that this is his future intention in regards to many of the other worlds throughout the universe.

There is a visible or seen universe and there are spiritual realms unseen to man. Do you truly imagine that the Lord created the universe in vain, that he had no future intention for it. Are the stars in the sky simply for our viewing pleasure? If so why create some which scientist have confirmed are billions of light years away beyond our sight?

Man is part of the seen or visible realm just as is the universe, therefore it is only natural to speculate that the universe was created for him and others who will one day inhabit this universe. Our God is a God of order and purpose we can't imagine him creating things without some purpose.

If you are going to be speculative, why not say since the physical universe is man plane of existence, after man is perfected he will eventually colonize other planets through out the universe.