The mind got born again
too, flesh replaced! Flesh is basically mind given to body. The mind deal has me reeling somewhat. Quite the little doctrine you have going on.
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The mind got born again
too, flesh replaced! Flesh is basically mind given to body. The mind deal has me reeling somewhat. Quite the little doctrine you have going on.
How else can we interpret John when he says we cannot sin? Or whatever is born of God overcomes the world?
Separate soul and spirit. John says "if we say we say we have no sin" (soul), and then the wonderful verse you quote (spirit). We are who we are by a birthing, not by what we do. Doing doesnt define an individual, doing is always an act of love only.
Great verses in 1 John to tell the believer who they are.
CoreIssue
Well-Known Member
The bible says sin resides in the flesh.
At salvation our spirits are born again. No mention of our minds being born again, only a change in our thinking and that we will continue to sin.
Our flesh is glorified at the resurrection, not born again.
Our minds are not even mentioned in eternity.
Our hearts are also talked about. So I guess you believe they are borne again.
Mind Definition and Meaning - Bible Dictionary
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H. Richard
Well-Known Member
You can start by acknowledging that the child of God has been given the very righteousness of God by imputation. You can finish by acknowledging that the child of God overcomes the world by their faith, not their works.
1 John 5:4-5
4 For whatever is born of God overcomes the world. And this is the victory that has overcome the world — our faith.
5 Who is he who overcomes the world, but he who believes that Jesus is the Son of God?
NKJV
Nothing in the above says our works overcome the world. But the religious think they are due rewards for their works.
According to Romans 7 a child of God has two natures, sinful and not sinful and they war against each other. God's plan of salvation only saves the born again spirit. That is why Paul is thanking God for Jesus Christ because Jesus has save us from our sinful flesh.. Not by changing our sinful flesh. Corruption can not be made non-corruption.
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Isn't Paul describing what it is like to be an unregenerate Jew under the law in Romans 7?
1stCenturyLady
Well-Known Member
You do know that in Romans 8 the spirit being spoken of is the Holy Spirit. How does the Spirit communicate to us? In our mind and conscience. When you are filled with the Spirit our conscience is super-sensitive to His leading.
Romans 8 indeed says that 'if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his'.
1stCenturyLady
Well-Known Member
Of course, when read in context from verse 7 and not out of that context by starting with verse 14. Any time you see someone holding on for dear life to Romans 7 to justify their weakness over sin, you know that person is still unregenerate and doesn't want to do anything about it - just not be held accountable. Faith and obedience go hand in hand. You cannot do one without the other and be saved. The Jews obeyed the law but did not have faith. There are some who say they have faith, but love darkness. 1 John 1:6 is such a person and is not saved.
1stCenturyLady
Well-Known Member
1stCenturyLady
Well-Known Member
Again, silly. You've completely misinterpreted "flesh" as our body. The flesh is our nature - and the mind is part of that.
What type of sin are you talking about when you say we will continue to sin? And are you saved if you commit adultery, murder, lying, or steal?
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CoreIssue
Well-Known Member
He never said we cannot sin.
The world as being our enemy controlling what we do, not what you are implying.
You cannot support your claims.
John said:
“Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God. In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother.” (1 John 3:9–10)
“For whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that overcometh the world, even our faith.” (1 John 5:4)
This does not agree with your position.
1stCenturyLady
Well-Known Member
CoreIssue
Well-Known Member
You are quoting 218 year old ASV English. Try modern.
"9 No one who is born of God will continue to sin, because God’s seed remains in them; they cannot go on sinning, because they have been born of God." NIV
1 John 5:4 New International Version (NIV)
4 for everyone born of God overcomes the world. This is the victory that has overcome the world, even our faith.
1stCenturyLady
Well-Known Member
Not sure what you are fighting for - the right to sin? A Christian gave up that right. They have a new Master. Those who sin - their master is the devil.
H. Richard
Well-Known Member
***
NO !!!!, That idea is just what the religious use to try and harmonize their idea that Paul is saying a person has to stop sinning. There is absolutely nothing in Romans 7 that says it was his past conclusions. Only man says that. I can post the entire chapter if you wish to say it is.
What the religious do is use chapter 8 to negate chapter 7. That is because they do not see any difference in their nature.
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CoreIssue
Well-Known Member
1stCenturyLady
Well-Known Member
1stCenturyLady
Well-Known Member
ROFL
Not "has to first," but "will after." - receive the Spirit. It is not we have to first stop sinning to receive Christ and the Spirit. NO! We can do nothing without Christ. But AFTER we receive the Spirit we WILL STOP SINNING. Why, because we are dead to sin.
Yes, Paul is saying a person will stop sinning, but only if they have the Spirit and not just the LAW. And so does John, and Jude. 1 John 3:4-9; Jude 1:4 speaks against your doctrine that we will keep sinning. It is you who "sees nothing different in their nature."
Romans 7 is about the LAW trying to be kept while we were yet sinners. Sin was the problem. We've been freed from the law by becoming freed from SIN.
Romans 7:5-6 5 For when we were in the flesh, (Romans 8:9 says we are not in the flesh anymore but in the Spirit) the sinful passions which were aroused by the law were at work in our members to bear fruit to death. 6 But now we have been delivered from the law, having died to what we were held by, so that we should serve in the newness of the Spirit and not in the oldness of the letter.
7 What shall we say then? Is the law sin? Certainly not! On the contrary, I would not have known sin except through the law. For I would not have known covetousness unless the law had said, “You shall not covet.” 8 But sin, taking opportunity by the commandment, produced in me all manner of evil desire. For apart from the law sin was dead. 9 I was alive once without the law, but when the commandment came, sin revived and I died. 10 And the commandment, which was to bring life, I found to bring death. 11 For sin, taking occasion by the commandment, deceived me, and by it killed me. 12 Therefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy and just and good.
13 Has then what is good become death to me? Certainly not! But sin, that it might appear sin, was producing death in me through what is good, so that sin through the commandment might become exceedingly sinful.
Verse 9 said, 9 I was alive once without the law, but when the commandment came, sin revived and I died. Paul is talking about mankind, not, presently. The commandment came on Mt. Sinai! Was Paul alive then?
Romans 7 is about the LAW OF SIN AND DEATH! - trying to be kept in our own strength.
Romans 8:2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus has made me free from the law of sin and death. The Spirit working through us.
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