Forgiveness. Must we forgive ALL sins against us?

[Truman]

It's good you forgave them, for your sake. I kissed one woman on one night in 2005. Except for that, the last woman I kissed was my wife. That was over 17 years ago. What happened? The best I can figure out, I got sick. I think she got some bad council.
Earlier in my life, I drank a lot and sometimes abused drugs. A sick person on medication can look a lot like a dope addict. I forgive them. This life is a passing mist. We can't keep it. I have my eyes on my home in the New Jerusalem.

 

[quietthinker]

I forgave my husband and his mistress for breaking up two marriages and marrying each other. It is up to God whether He does too, but God told me my husband would not repent.

But my husband did not have cause to divorce me, and I didn't divorce him or even sign his paperwork. He is still the last man I kissed after 20 years and I still wear my rings.

The problem with a love for sin is it disables repentance. It’s seductive nature causes blindness and an unwillingness to see.

 

[Psalm51]

This post is a question of what do you think.

I think we ought to forgive men for any and all trespasses, regardless of their sin

Let us take a page out of Stephen's book – simply ask God to not charge them with it, if He will! It's all according to His providence! But with all compassion we should see others, friends and enemies, as fallible people such as ourselves. This must be genuine and from the heart.

 

[ChristisGod]

I don't build strawmen. I base my posts on the word of God.

Romans 3:25

Old Covenant vs. New Covenant.

Sorry both OT and NT saints were saved by faith. Try reading Hebrews 11 sometime.

Is hypocrisy a sin ? yes or no

Before you answer read Jesus teaching on it in Matthew 23 and how many times He condemns the sin of being a hypocrite.

hope this helps !!!

 

[ChristisGod]

And they stoned Stephen as he was calling on God and saying, "Lord Jesus, receive my spirit." Then he knelt down and cried out with a loud voice, "Lord, do not charge them with this sin." And when he had said this, he fell asleep.
(Acts 7:59-60)

Did the accusers know what they were doing when they stoned Stephen? He denounced them for being "stiff-necked and uncircumcised in heart and ears" and for "resisting the Holy Spirit" (Acts 7:51), but how can we, if even possible, determine intentionality? This requires a complete comprehension of the other person, in every facet imaginable. I think there is only One who can do that really. I do not believe it is our role to determine intentionality, degree of sin, etc. We are not on the judgment seat.

If we pray for and believe that the Lord exercises lovingkindness and longsuffering in the forgiveness of our sins, why would we not forgive anyone else for anything?

Amen that is the Christian way and Jesus said we are to forgive our brother who sins against us 70 x 7 daily. In other words there is no limit to forgiveness.

Matthew 18:21-35
Then Peter came to Jesus and asked, “Lord, how many times shall I forgive my brother or sister who sins against me? Up to seven times?”

22 Jesus answered, “I tell you, not seven times, but seventy-seven times.

23 “Therefore, the kingdom of heaven is like a king who wanted to settle accounts with his servants. 24 As he began the settlement, a man who owed him ten thousand bags of gold was brought to him. 25 Since he was not able to pay, the master ordered that he and his wife and his children and all that he had be sold to repay the debt.

26 “At this the servant fell on his knees before him. ‘Be patient with me,’ he begged, ‘and I will pay back everything.’ 27 The servant’s master took pity on him, canceled the debt and let him go.

28 “But when that servant went out, he found one of his fellow servants who owed him a hundred silver coins. He grabbed him and began to choke him. ‘Pay back what you owe me!’ he demanded.

29 “His fellow servant fell to his knees and begged him, ‘Be patient with me, and I will pay it back.’

30 “But he refused. Instead, he went off and had the man thrown into prison until he could pay the debt. 31 When the other servants saw what had happened, they were outraged and went and told their master everything that had happened.

32 “Then the master called the servant in. ‘You wicked servant,’ he said, ‘I canceled all that debt of yours because you begged me to. 33 Shouldn’t you have had mercy on your fellow servant just as I had on you?’ 34 In anger his master handed him over to the jailers to be tortured, until he should pay back all he owed.

35 “This is how my heavenly Father will treat each of you unless you forgive your brother or sister from your heart.”

 

[marks]

no doubt the readers here will make their own determination

Yep.

 

[CharismaticLady]

Sorry both OT and NT saints were saved by faith. Try reading Hebrews 11 sometime.

Is hypocrisy a sin ? yes or no

Before you answer read Jesus teaching on it in Matthew 23 and how many times He condemns the sin of being a hypocrite.

hope this helps !!!

you seem to love breaking bearing false witness

 

[ChristisGod]

you seem to love breaking bearing false witness

no you seem to be ok with hypocrisy not being a sin and defend Peters life being a hypocrite when Paul rebuked him for that sinful behavior.

 

[Curtis]

For clarification/ confirmation, what death are you referring to?

Is that the first death, that is when one ceases to breath and goes to the grave?

Or is that the second death, that is when one is cast in the lake of fire called hell?

It seems to me you are referring to the second death.

If it’s indeed the second death that you refer to, are you saying you believe that there are sins that does not have such penalty/wage? And in that case you would have an absolute list of sins that have such wage/penalty and of sins that do not have such wage/penalty.

Tong
R4014

The context of Paul’s writings is spiritual death, as in Ephesians 2 - being dead in their sins - which is rather obvious since the warnings are that walking in the sins of the flesh, will keep the brethren out of heaven.

 

[Curtis]

I’d like to know your answers to ask these questions:

Can one ask in prayer, for forgiveness of sins he may be committing in the future or for future sins that God sees in he will be committing?

Putting that even further, can one at the time of his conversion and repentance, call on the name of the Lord and ask for forgiveness of all his sins, past and old sins, and future sins that God sees he will be committing?

Tong
R4016

No.
Scripture makes clear that old sins and past sins are forgiven at salvation, and that per 1John 1:9, we must confess future sins for them to also be forgiven- past sins forgiven at salvation by repentance - future sins forgiven after repentance.

Otherwise scripture would not clearly stipulate that old sins and past sins are forgiven at salvation in two different verses.

 

[Tong2020]

Tong2020 said: ↑
For clarification/ confirmation, what death are you referring to?

Is that the first death, that is when one ceases to breath and goes to the grave?

Or is that the second death, that is when one is cast in the lake of fire called hell?

It seems to me you are referring to the second death.

If it’s indeed the second death that you refer to, are you saying you believe that there are sins that does not have such penalty/wage? And in that case you would have an absolute list of sins that have such wage/penalty and of sins that do not have such wage/penalty.

The context of Paul’s writings is spiritual death, as in Ephesians 2 - being dead in their sins - which is rather obvious since the warnings are that walking in the sins of the flesh, will keep the brethren out of heaven.

Are you referring to that death then such as that in Eph. 2 or the second death (hell)?

As I pointed out, if it’s hell then you would have an absolute list of sins that have such wage/penalty and of sins that do not have such wage/penalty. Can you share those absolute list of sins?

Tong
R4028

 

[Tong2020]

Tong2020 said: ↑
I’d like to know your answers to ask these questions:

Can one ask in prayer, for forgiveness of sins he may be committing in the future or for future sins that God sees in he will be committing?

Putting that even further, can one at the time of his conversion and repentance, call on the name of the Lord and ask for forgiveness of all his sins, past and old sins, and future sins that God sees he will be committing?

No.
Scripture makes clear that old sins and past sins are forgiven at salvation, and that per 1John 1:9, we must confess future sins for them to also be forgiven- past sins forgiven at salvation by repentance - future sins forgiven after repentance.

Otherwise scripture would not clearly stipulate that old sins and past sins are forgiven at salvation in two different verses.

Then I guess you don’t believe that the Jesus’ sacrifice for the atonement and forgiveness of your sins was not accepted by God until your conversion and repentance. But of course that is not the case with the sacrifice of Christ, nor is the truth. The resurrection of Jesus Christ 3 days after His death refutes such position.

Tong
R4029

 

[Curtis]

Then I guess you don’t believe that the Jesus’ sacrifice for the atonement and forgiveness of your sins was not accepted by God until your conversion and repentance. But of course that is not the case with the sacrifice of Christ, nor is the truth. The resurrection of Jesus Christ 3 days after His death refutes such position.

Tong
R4029

Your refutation is not even close.

Jesus paid the price for all sins on the cross - yet scripture is crystal clear that it takes repentance and faith, for His sin atonement to be APPLIED to us - otherwise all humanity would be saved.

However since SCRIPTURE SAYS old sins are forgiven at salvation, and SCRIPTURE SAYS sins that are past are forgiven at salvation, it becomes crystal clear that His atonement is applied to repented-of sins, and clear that we can’t repent of sins we haven’t committed, so that per 1 John 1:9, we must confess our sins when we commit them, to ALSO have His already-completed atonement of our sin be applied to new sins.

TO WHIT:

Jesus took all the sins of the whole world on the cross, so the logical human reasoning is that all our sins are saved at salvation- including future sins.


But when scripture tells us twice that old sins and sins that are past are forgiven at salvation, we must drop our human reasoning, and believe God.


2Pe 1:9 But he that lacketh these things is blind, and cannot see afar off, and hath forgotten that he was PURGED from his OLD SINS.


Rom 3:25 Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of SINS THAT ARE PAST through the forbearance of God;


The obvious conclusion about why our future sins are not automatically forgiven at salvation is that we must repent of our sins as part of our conversion to have them forgiven (Acts 3:19 ; Acts 20:21 ; 1John 1:9), but we can’t pre-repent of FUTURE sins - so only OLD sins and PAST sins are forgiven at salvation - not future sins.


But even if we couldn’t conclude any reasons why only old sins and past sins are forgiven at salvation, we have to accept that it is true because the word of God says it.


So hyper-grace doctrine coming from human reasoning, which claims that all our sins - past, and present, and future - are forgiven at salvation is wrong, and we must repent of future sins to apply the atonement of Jesus to those sins, too.


That’s why the apostle John wrote this - which is not written to unbelievers as a salvational instruction - but to believers as part of our Christian walk:


1Jn 1:9 If WE confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us oursins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.


Note that the apostle included himself by using the pronoun WE there, indicating he’s talking to believers about the need to confess our sins as we commit them, to have them forgiven.


To those who still want to deny that 1 John is written to the brethren, here’s John’s own words, proving it is:


1Jn 2:7 BRETHREN, I write no new commandment unto you, but an old commandment which ye had from the beginning. The old commandment is the word which ye have heard from the beginning.

 

[Brakelite]

In other words, Thinker, you do not have specific instances of turning your cheek in order to show the goods of what you tell others to do.

I thought so. A widely framed divergent persective as an answer to a plain question shows avoidance, while belying actual knowledge. So much for this topic.

Regards upon future speculations.

You are one worth watching. Even following perhaps. Such kindness. Such patience. Such understanding and benevolence. Such Christian virtue and spiritual gifts on display. We should all be honored by your willingness to share with us your erudite and heart warming encouraging opinions.

 

[Tong2020]

Tong2020 said: ↑
Then I guess you don’t believe that the Jesus’ sacrifice for the atonement and forgiveness of your sins was not accepted by God until your conversion and repentance. But of course that is not the case with the sacrifice of Christ, nor is the truth. The resurrection of Jesus Christ 3 days after His death refutes such position.

Your refutation is not even close.

It was not me. It’s the resurrection of Christ last 2000 years ago that refutes your position.

Jesus paid the price for all sins on the cross - yet scripture is crystal clear that it takes repentance and faith, for His sin atonement to be APPLIED to us - otherwise all humanity would be saved.

Not at all. For not all humans were given by the Father to the Son to raise in the last day unto eternal life.

Did Jesus Christ died for those for example who were destroyed by God in the flood during Noah’s time?

However since SCRIPTURE SAYS old sins are forgiven at salvation, and SCRIPTURE SAYS sins that are past are forgiven at salvation, it becomes crystal clear that His atonement is applied to repented-of sins,

Well, while we have scriptures speaking of past/old sins as were forgiven the believer, it does not say anything to the effect that He did not die for sins that follows after.

Besides, when Christ died and made the sacrifice for sin, our sins relative to that point in time were future sins.

…and clear that we can’t repent of sins we haven’t committed,

That’s right. With that, y should be able to understand why Peter only mentions old sins as had been forgiven the believer. But that does not take away the fact and truth that the sacrifice of Jesus Christ was not limited to the past/old sins of the one whose sins Jesus Christ was paying for at the cross some 2000 years ago, but includes all his sins.

so that per 1 John 1:9, we must confess our sins when we commit them, to ALSO have His already-completed atonement of our sin be applied to new sins.

TO WHIT:

Jesus took all the sins of the whole world on the cross, so the logical human reasoning is that all our sins are saved at salvation- including future sins.


But when scripture tells us twice that old sins and sins that are past are forgiven at salvation, we must drop our human reasoning, and believe God.


2Pe 1:9 But he that lacketh these things is blind, and cannot see afar off, and hath forgotten that he was PURGED from his OLD SINS.


Rom 3:25 Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of SINS THAT ARE PAST through the forbearance of God;


The obvious conclusion about why our future sins are not automatically forgiven at salvation is that we must repent of our sins as part of our conversion to have them forgiven (Acts 3:19 ; Acts 20:21 ; 1John 1:9), but we can’t pre-repent of FUTURE sins - so only OLD sins and PAST sins are forgiven at salvation - not future sins.


But even if we couldn’t conclude any reasons why only old sins and past sins are forgiven at salvation, we have to accept that it is true because the word of God says it.


So hyper-grace doctrine coming from human reasoning, which claims that all our sins - past, and present, and future - are forgiven at salvation is wrong, and we must repent of future sins to apply the atonement of Jesus to those sins, too.


That’s why the apostle John wrote this - which is not written to unbelievers as a salvational instruction - but to believers as part of our Christian walk:


1Jn 1:9 If WE confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us oursins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.


Note that the apostle included himself by using the pronoun WE there, indicating he’s talking to believers about the need to confess our sins as we commit them, to have them forgiven.


To those who still want to deny that 1 John is written to the brethren, here’s John’s own words, proving it is:


1Jn 2:7 BRETHREN, I write no new commandment unto you, but an old commandment which ye had from the beginning. The old commandment is the word which ye have heard from the beginning.

One must have an understanding about what Jesus Christ had done some 2000 years ago at the cross and what His resurrection means, to have an understanding of the salvation of God.

<<<Note that the apostle included himself by using the pronoun WE there, indicating he’s talking to believers about the need to confess our sins as we commit them, to have them forgiven.>>>

The sins of those who are being saved by Jesus Christ were already atoned for, and paid for, some 2000 years ago. Not that those who are being saved today such as you and I, were not yet in existence then, does not mean that their sins were not atoned for and paid for by Jesus Christ as such sins likewise were not yet committed.

The matter of 1 John 1:9 really has nothing to do with the believer’s salvation from eternal punishment. For that had been dealt with by Jesus Christ already at the cross.

Try to go meditate on what Jesus Christ had accomplished by his death.

Perhaps, as a simple exercise, ask yourself what you mean when you say Jesus Christ died for you, what you understand when scriptures say that Jesus died for you. Tell me what the answer or your answer is.

Tong
R4031

 

[BloodBought 1953]

Jesus lived under Law.Jesus Preached Law.Under Law you had to Forgive others to be forgiven yourself....it was a threat.....

We are no longer under Law . On THIS side of the Cross , we are under Grace . We no longer have to “ Forgive to be Forgiven” , which usually means “ pretend” to forgive, or try your absolute best to “ Try” to forgive because you think that if you Don’t do it you are damned to Hell.....I must admit, that is a pretty good Incentive to try to do something even if our hearts ain’t really in it......and your “ heart being in it” is the only thing God cares about.....He can see clear through a phony forgiveness prompted by fear....

The impetus for Forgiveness , this side of the Cross, in this wondrous Age Of Grace , is Gratitude and Love ......When you see yourself as the Wretched Sinner that you are, when you wake up to the fact that the only reason that you EVER got Saved was due to the Love and Mercy Of God.....When you see the Colossal Forgiveness That was Granted to you simply because of your Trust in Jesus Christ, it gets a lot easier to forgive somebody else.....if God can save a wretch like you—— why cant YOU extend some Forgiveness to somebody else? THAT is your Motive—— NOT Fear !

The best part of all of this is that there is Chapter and Verse to verify it....Try Col2:13.....” God has made you alive with Him, having forgiven us all of our sins”....Col1:14....” in whom we have Redemption through His Blood, the forgiveness of sins”......Acts 13:38....”through Jesus the forgiveness of sins is proclaimed to you”...... Hebrews 10:10....” we have been made Holy through the sacrifice of Jesus once for all”......

The Truth is, you are Forgiven before you even ask.....this Grace....this Love—- it makes you WANT to Forgive others .....as are so many other things that come from the Holy Spirit within you.....they come natural......God bless....

 

[Tong2020]

The Truth is, you are Forgiven before you even ask.....this Grace....this Love—- it makes you WANT to Forgive others .....as are so many other things that come from the Holy Spirit within you.....they come natural......God bless....

I concur. It seems that few here realize this truth.

One was forgiven even before he even asked. That goes to any one of those saved by Jesus Christ.

That truth ~ Jesus Christ died for “us”, even while we were still sinners.

Tong
R4033

 

[ChristisGod]

"Brigham Young said it" doesn't equate to "Thus Saith the Lord" by any stretch of the imagination. LDS Christians don't believe in automatic infallibility of any person, including leaders. The 'blood atonement' idea is one of those that has been thoroughly shot down as false.

(Sorry for the derail OP, I just had to get that clarified)

not only does she twist what mormons believe she does the same thing with reformed believers as well.

 

[ChristisGod]

I forgave my husband and his mistress for breaking up two marriages and marrying each other. It is up to God whether He does too, but God told me my husband would not repent.

But my husband did not have cause to divorce me, and I didn't divorce him or even sign his paperwork. He is still the last man I kissed after 20 years and I still wear my rings.

God never told you that how absurd. That is your wish and desire not Gods. God is not willing for anyone to perish but for all to come to repentance and the knowledge of the truth to be saved.

You just made God out to be a liar. You should repent !

You make God out to be a MONSTER. The audacity to make things up about God that is contrary to His LOVING Character. You should be ashamed of yourself.

hope this helps!!!

 

[CharismaticLady]

God never told you that how absurd. That is your wish and desire not Gods. God is not willing for anyone to perish but for all to come to repentance and the knowledge of the truth to be saved.

You just made God out to be a liar. You should repent !

You make God out to be a MONSTER. The audacity to make things up about God that is contrary to His LOVING Character. You should be ashamed of yourself.

hope this helps!!!

Actually, yes He did tell me that my husband would never repent.