Francis Chan Warns Against Division in the Church

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gregjgordon

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Over 3 years ago, God started to speak to me deeply on the great sin of division, slander, and gossip in the body of Christ. God started to have me in situations where great hurt was being done and I saw first hand the way the enemy used these tactics to destroy and hurt the testimony of Jesus Christ in others lives. One of many devotional articles I wrote during that time was called: God's Church Is Sacred In This Earth. The premise of the devotion was a warning that when we speak against the body of Christ we speak against God's Sacred Church of whom we are all a part.

Recently, God spoke to Francis Chan on that exact same verse (1 Corinthians 3:17) to give us a loving warning to the body of Christ against division.

Here is a recent statement Francis made in regards to people who divide and leave Church fellowship:

"There is this terrifying verse in 1 Timothy where Paul talked about two men who rejected the faith. Paul said that he had handed them over to Satan, by which he meant that he’d put them outside of the church (1:20). Basically, these men were actively opposing the works of God, so rather than pretending everything was fine, Paul removed them from the safety and blessings of the fellowship of believers. He was hoping that the misery of being separated from the church would lead them to repent. Are you catching the weight of this? Paul equated removal from the church with being handed over to Satan! It is crazy to me that we live in a time when people are voluntarily doing this to themselves! No church has placed them outside of the fellowship; instead, they’ve handed themselves over to Satan!"

What a sobering thought that those in our day in North America being critical of so much that is called Christian are doing to themselves what Paul the Apostle had to recommend Timothy to do to others as a last resort to have them repent of their pride and sins.

We are living in a day where we are judging others and not ourselves. We are finding it easy to be critical of everything but our own sins we ourselves struggle with.

Francis again shares on how God wants to send real unity to the body of Christ:

"Real love, unity and blessing were supposed to be found in the church. Many are having a hard time finding that, so they’re setting off on their own. Jesus said that the world would see the supernatural unity and love we share in the church and believe in Him through that. But we’re not experiencing it. We’ve given up on it. We no longer believe it is possible."

Perhaps we can start to change our minds and start looking towards others with seeing their good and not bad, speaking blessings over others and not curses. Remember we are fitted together in a temple of God with all saints of all ages. And Francis gives the example of someone taking a sledgehammer to this temple. What a fearful thing to do, of course we would depart from such an individual for fear of what God Himself would do to him. As the Scripture says, "Warn a divisive person once, and then warn them a second time. After that, have nothing to do with them" (Titus 3:10).

You can watch the full video message by Francis Chan, "Are You Destroying The Church" where he gives this loving warning against division in the Church:
 

BreadOfLife

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I like his videos ... :)
Francis Chan is PART of the division in the Church.
Sounds very hypocritical of him to blast something that he is actively engaged in . . .
 
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Helen

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Francis Chan is PART of the division in the Church.
Sounds very hypocritical of him to blast something that he is actively engaged in . . .

I have listened to a few of his. ( I have to, my husband is getting deaf now..and has his computer sound on MAX!!! :eek: )

I found him somewhat anti 'established church'..protestant ...which I am too.. I am 'out of church'..ie what passes for church these days .. rock, noise, Exhibitionism= hollywood style...etc

Maybe it depends on 'which' of his videos a person listens to.
 

Enoch111

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*Francis Chan Warns Against Division in the Church*

1. Divisions already exist within Christendom. Indeed, have existed for hundreds of years.

2. It is the ones who hold to false doctrines and practices who create divisions. And historically, the ones seeking to follow the Bible are compelled to separate themselves.

3. Christendom (not the Church, the Body of Christ) at large is moving along the path of apostasy at present. It generally represents the church at Laodicea:
Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked: I counsel thee to buy of me gold tried in the fire, that thou mayest be rich; and white raiment, that thou mayest be clothed, and that the shame of thy nakedness do not appear; and anoint thine eyes with eyesalve, that thou mayest see.

4. There are more and more false teachers, false apostles, and false prophets rising and leading people astray.

5. There are more and more Christians resisting the truth today, which again leads to divisions.

While this is a sad state of affairs, the Lord already predicted this time, and so did the apostles.

MATTHEW 24
9 Then shall they deliver you up to be afflicted, and shall kill you: and ye shall be hated of all nations for my name's sake.
10 And then shall many be offended, and shall betray one another, and shall hate one another.
11 And many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many.

12 And because iniquity shall abound, the love of many shall wax cold.
13 But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.

The next item on the agenda will be the rise of the Antichrist and the setting up of the Abomination of Desolation.

15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand...

21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.


 

CoreIssue

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The Church is not denominations. Paul condemned system thinking.

The Church is not Catholicism. In fact many bible only literalist say it is a cult.

The bible never says to embrace error in the name of unity.

The true Church is composed of strong, week and members in between.

These are the days of apostasy. As true Christians die off there are fewer and fewer replacements.

Some say there will be revival. There will not. The bible makes a clear.

Some say the rapture is nowhere near or does not exist. It does and is very close.

I believe the mission of the Church now is a salvage run. Salvage those remaining who Christ can make his own.

The world hates as more and more.

That is the reality I see.
 
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farouk

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The issue is continuance in the apostles' doctrine (Acts 2.42), especially in the local church. Trying to lump everyone together in some doctrinally shallow organization would be disastrous.
 

Helen

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2. It is the ones who hold to false doctrines and practices who create divisions. And historically, the ones seeking to follow the Bible are compelled to separate themselves.

This caused me to muse. Is that true?
I don't believe so...I went back in my life to 'church splits' etc etc...and every time it was the root of pride.

Someone was jealous of someone else...twice I knew of church splits when the pastor was sent away on holiday...and someone else took over his church ( one he built from the roots up)
The other guy and wife ..when he came back from a holiday then sent him on...found all his furniture and belongings out on the lawn (the church owned the house) ...and same story...someone else wanted his church.

I can't think of a split over doctrine...

Just saying...doctrine is not 'always' the root cause.
What do you think?
Anyone?
 
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CoreIssue

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This caused me to muse. Is that true?
I don't believe so...I went back in my life to 'church splits' etc etc...and every time it was the root of pride.

Someone was jealous of someone else...twice I knew of church splits when the pastor was sent away on holiday...and someone else took over his church ( one he built from the roots up)
The other guy and wife ..when he came back from a holiday then sent him on...found all his furniture and belongings out on the lawn (the church owned the house) ...and same story...someone else wanted his church.

I can't think of a split over doctrine...

Just saying...doctrine is not 'always' the root cause.
What do you think?
Anyone?

There are many reasons for a church to split.

Paul was talking about following the teachings of individuals, not the bible, which is the definition of denominationalism. Happened three times where I live. Once over a larger group wanting to accept LGBTQ as Biblical. Another over saying women pastors were Biblical and all related to it.

On TV denominations split over doctrine. Again over LGBTQ as Biblical as well as embracing Islam as OK, denying the deity of Christ in example.

It has happened three times where I live. Always more conservative and literal Christians leaving a church that was going deeper and deeper into apostasy.

You cannot sit down to discuss, even debate, bible, if your doctrine is superior to the bible.

Growth comes via discussion study and thinking. Doctrines replace thinking,
 

Enoch111

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Just saying...doctrine is not 'always' the root cause.
What you are bringing up is simply sinful behavior within churches causing splits. But the Reformation is a good example of doctrine being the basis of separation. And more recently we have the Fundamentalists leaving the liberal mainline denominations in the late 19th- early 20th century.

Fundamentalism, in the narrowest meaning of the term, was a movement that began in the late 19th- and early 20th-century within American Protestant circles to defend the "fundamentals of belief" against the corrosive effects of liberalism that had grown within the ranks of Protestantism itself. Liberalism, manifested in critical approaches to the Bible that relied on purely natural assumptions, or that framed Christianity as a purely natural or human phenomenon that could be explained scientifically, presented a challenge to traditional belief.

Teachinghistory.org
 

CoreIssue

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Labels such as Fundamentalism had been so distorted, abused and misused what value do they have left in the main?

Sad. We depend on names, labels, except for for communication. What happens when their value is diminished?
 

Enoch111

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Labels such as Fundamentalism had been so distorted, abused and misused what value do they have left in the main?
That is entirely beside the point. Those Bible-believing Christians had to leave the mainline denominations because the theological liberals attacked the Bible, and could not be removed from those churches.
 

BreadOfLife

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I have listened to a few of his. ( I have to, my husband is getting deaf now..and has his computer sound on MAX!!! :eek: )

I found him somewhat anti 'established church'..protestant ...which I am too.. I am 'out of church'..ie what passes for church these days .. rock, noise, Exhibitionism= hollywood style...etc

Maybe it depends on 'which' of his videos a person listens to.
Forgetting for a moment that Protestantism itself is tens of thousands of divisions - Chan is a hypocrite.

Several years back, he had a campaign called "juststopandthink.com". It was a video about life and coming to Christ that seemed to help a lot if people. One of my Protestant siblings was raving about him, so I decided to have a look for myself.

The video was fine - fairly generic Christianity. HOWEVER, when I perused the rest of the site, I found a section on "Cults" in which he included the Catholic Church. It had a series of articles filled with the most venomous - and easily-debunkable lies about Catholics. I shared it with my pastor and he commissioned me to write rebuttals to all of them - which I did.

He talks a good talk - he just doesn't practice it.
It's one thing to have disagreements - but to simply post lies for the sake pof lying makes him the kind of false teacher. that we are warned about in Matt 7.
 
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VictoryinJesus

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I like his videos ... :)

I like his videos also. Of course like with all there has to be caution but as you said in another post...maybe it is the videos you watch. Most seem to encourage. It seems we could find something wrong with every man and deem them a teacher of lies. At least Chan will admit, because I’ve heard him admit it, that there are things about God that He doesn’t like because they challenge who he is and forces him to always to take a closer look. And that he(Chan) believes God is always right on an issue and he is always wrong. Not many will say they are ever wrong.
 
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VictoryinJesus

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Over 3 years ago, God started to speak to me deeply on the great sin of division, slander, and gossip in the body of Christ. God started to have me in situations where great hurt was being done and I saw first hand the way the enemy used these tactics to destroy and hurt the testimony of Jesus Christ in others lives. One of many devotional articles I wrote during that time was called: God's Church Is Sacred In This Earth. The premise of the devotion was a warning that when we speak against the body of Christ we speak against God's Sacred Church of whom we are all a part.

Recently, God spoke to Francis Chan on that exact same verse (1 Corinthians 3:17) to give us a loving warning to the body of Christ against division.

Here is a recent statement Francis made in regards to people who divide and leave Church fellowship:

"There is this terrifying verse in 1 Timothy where Paul talked about two men who rejected the faith. Paul said that he had handed them over to Satan, by which he meant that he’d put them outside of the church (1:20). Basically, these men were actively opposing the works of God, so rather than pretending everything was fine, Paul removed them from the safety and blessings of the fellowship of believers. He was hoping that the misery of being separated from the church would lead them to repent. Are you catching the weight of this? Paul equated removal from the church with being handed over to Satan! It is crazy to me that we live in a time when people are voluntarily doing this to themselves! No church has placed them outside of the fellowship; instead, they’ve handed themselves over to Satan!"

What a sobering thought that those in our day in North America being critical of so much that is called Christian are doing to themselves what Paul the Apostle had to recommend Timothy to do to others as a last resort to have them repent of their pride and sins.

We are living in a day where we are judging others and not ourselves. We are finding it easy to be critical of everything but our own sins we ourselves struggle with.

Francis again shares on how God wants to send real unity to the body of Christ:

"Real love, unity and blessing were supposed to be found in the church. Many are having a hard time finding that, so they’re setting off on their own. Jesus said that the world would see the supernatural unity and love we share in the church and believe in Him through that. But we’re not experiencing it. We’ve given up on it. We no longer believe it is possible."

Perhaps we can start to change our minds and start looking towards others with seeing their good and not bad, speaking blessings over others and not curses. Remember we are fitted together in a temple of God with all saints of all ages. And Francis gives the example of someone taking a sledgehammer to this temple. What a fearful thing to do, of course we would depart from such an individual for fear of what God Himself would do to him. As the Scripture says, "Warn a divisive person once, and then warn them a second time. After that, have nothing to do with them" (Titus 3:10).

You can watch the full video message by Francis Chan, "Are You Destroying The Church" where he gives this loving warning against division in the Church:

Concerning division...Matthew 12:30
[30] He that is not with me is against me; and he that gathereth not with me scattereth abroad.
 
D

Dave L

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As the Scripture says, "Warn a divisive person once, and then warn them a second time. After that, have nothing to do with them" (Titus 3:10).

This is fine if your platform is true. But where would we be if followed the establishment instead of Jesus?
 

Hidden In Him

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Over 3 years ago, God started to speak to me deeply on the great sin of division, slander, and gossip in the body of Christ.

Yes. Many use doctrinal and denominational differences as an excuse to welcome a spirit of division, slander, insults, ridicule, mockery and gossip. They insult one another without recognizing they are giving themselves over to demonic influence in doing so.

I'm not surprised some oppose your position on this thread. They see themselves as "defenders of the truth," and the enemy therefore seduces them into justifying their sin. But that's how badly the enemy has blinded God's people. I've been blinded before and acted similarly as well, but I'm now coming to the place where I see more than I once did.

Blessings in Christ,
Hidden In Him
 

CoreIssue

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Be careful to use the Biblical definition of division, not the secular one.

The KJV New Testament Greek Lexicon
Strong's Number:
141 Browse Lexicon
Original Word
Word Origin
aiJretikovß from the same as (140)
Transliterated Word TDNT Entry
Hairetikos 1:184,27
Phonetic Spelling Parts of Speech
hahee-ret-ee-kos' Adjective
Definition
  1. fitted or able to take or choose a thing
  2. schismatic, factious, a follower of a false doctrine
  3. heretic
 

Nancy

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Over 3 years ago, God started to speak to me deeply on the great sin of division, slander, and gossip in the body of Christ. God started to have me in situations where great hurt was being done and I saw first hand the way the enemy used these tactics to destroy and hurt the testimony of Jesus Christ in others lives. One of many devotional articles I wrote during that time was called: God's Church Is Sacred In This Earth. The premise of the devotion was a warning that when we speak against the body of Christ we speak against God's Sacred Church of whom we are all a part.

Recently, God spoke to Francis Chan on that exact same verse (1 Corinthians 3:17) to give us a loving warning to the body of Christ against division.

Here is a recent statement Francis made in regards to people who divide and leave Church fellowship:

"There is this terrifying verse in 1 Timothy where Paul talked about two men who rejected the faith. Paul said that he had handed them over to Satan, by which he meant that he’d put them outside of the church (1:20). Basically, these men were actively opposing the works of God, so rather than pretending everything was fine, Paul removed them from the safety and blessings of the fellowship of believers. He was hoping that the misery of being separated from the church would lead them to repent. Are you catching the weight of this? Paul equated removal from the church with being handed over to Satan! It is crazy to me that we live in a time when people are voluntarily doing this to themselves! No church has placed them outside of the fellowship; instead, they’ve handed themselves over to Satan!"

What a sobering thought that those in our day in North America being critical of so much that is called Christian are doing to themselves what Paul the Apostle had to recommend Timothy to do to others as a last resort to have them repent of their pride and sins.

We are living in a day where we are judging others and not ourselves. We are finding it easy to be critical of everything but our own sins we ourselves struggle with.

Francis again shares on how God wants to send real unity to the body of Christ:

"Real love, unity and blessing were supposed to be found in the church. Many are having a hard time finding that, so they’re setting off on their own. Jesus said that the world would see the supernatural unity and love we share in the church and believe in Him through that. But we’re not experiencing it. We’ve given up on it. We no longer believe it is possible."

Perhaps we can start to change our minds and start looking towards others with seeing their good and not bad, speaking blessings over others and not curses. Remember we are fitted together in a temple of God with all saints of all ages. And Francis gives the example of someone taking a sledgehammer to this temple. What a fearful thing to do, of course we would depart from such an individual for fear of what God Himself would do to him. As the Scripture says, "Warn a divisive person once, and then warn them a second time. After that, have nothing to do with them" (Titus 3:10).

You can watch the full video message by Francis Chan, "Are You Destroying The Church" where he gives this loving warning against division in the Church:
Welcome @gregjgordon ! Love your post and I think it is spot on. Have not seen the video but I sure do understand the lack of love between brothers and sisters in the Church. "...and the love of any shall wax cold..." I will watch the video in a bit.
In Him -nancy
 

Nancy

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This caused me to muse. Is that true?
I don't believe so...I went back in my life to 'church splits' etc etc...and every time it was the root of pride.

Someone was jealous of someone else...twice I knew of church splits when the pastor was sent away on holiday...and someone else took over his church ( one he built from the roots up)
The other guy and wife ..when he came back from a holiday then sent him on...found all his furniture and belongings out on the lawn (the church owned the house) ...and same story...someone else wanted his church.

I can't think of a split over doctrine...

Just saying...doctrine is not 'always' the root cause.
What do you think?
Anyone?
"Just saying...doctrine is not 'always' the root cause."
My take is that all sin begins with pride in some way or the other. Sin is the pride of life...:(
 
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