God is in control: A Word from the Lord to those who will receive

[Anthony D'Arienzo]

No, I never saw a hand writing on the wall; and if you read the whole thread, you would know I ignored the "audible" voices the few times I heard them. Nor would I say my revelations come through the small still voice, although I have heard that. Rather the communications arise in my mind as ideas which I know are not my ideas. Sometimes they may contan "words" in English, other times no -- other times it's the idea and I would need to supply words myself to try to tell others. For example, in a vision, I may see things without words being used.

Almost everyone has the ability to receive ideas like that, but few don't when awake. To that sort of person, spiriits can communicate in dreams. Such spiritual communications could be angelic or demonic, of course. Most people are spiritually deaf when awake for a very good reason. I think it's probably best to let the spiritually deaf remain that way.

I can also tell you I think I could teach almost anyone how to send and receive such spiritual messages. I decline to give out such information on the internet. I would teach only people I felt confident would be sincere about it and not apt to use it to manipulate others, to take advantage of others, etc. There are perils in turning on your spiritual ears and eyes. People with impure hearts could be deceived by the demonic posing as the angelic. They can also deceive themselves without a demon needing to help mislead them since people can be motivated by greed and lust.

I would not even lay hands on a Christian to have their ears and eyes opened unless I knew him or her extremely well. I would not because I cannot read their hearts. Someone can be a 99% good person; but if there is 1% sin in the heart, there is danger that even good Christians could succumb to temptation. I leave it up to God then to decide who should receive what gift.

Then there are non-Christians who might convert to Christianity if their spiritual eyes and ears were opened. You might say they were saved even; but danger exists there too, that they may return like a dog to its vomit. Their fate would be worse than had they never known Jesus.

Isaiah 6:10 Make the heart of this people fat, and make their ears heavy, and shut their eyes; lest they see with their eyes, and hear with their ears, and understand with their heart, and convert, and be healed.

Strange as it sounds, it is better for some people to be struck with spiritual blindness and deafness. If they understood, if they converted and were healed, they could stand in terrible peril.

Hebrews 10:26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,
27 But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.

Many if not most people have sins remaining to be dealt with -- and those sinful urges need to be dealt with before it's safe for God to open their spiritual eyes and ears. There is also the matter of impure lips or the tongue which is burning with the fire of hell. Such a person could do great damage if he received truth since his impure lips would change it into something corrupt. Thus Isaiah acknowledged his situation, and the seraphim purified his lips.

It took at least three years of discipline under Jesus before the disciples were ready to communicate with Heaven on their own. They had problems that needed to be dealt with. Peter was the first to make his own connection with the Father, and it was a struggle. Peter had to be corrected several times.

Most people still have uncircumcised ears and hearts. If they could hear spiritual voices, it wouldn't be a heavenly voice talking to them. Better then to be spiritually deaf.

Acts 7:51 Ye stiffnecked and uncircumcised in heart and ears, ye do always resist the Holy Ghost: as your fathers did, so do ye.

Thank you for a well thought out response with some scriptural support.I will try and get back to this later if possible, have to work now

 

[John Caldwell]

I asked the poster, not Samuel. Do you claim you hear voices in your head? Do you hear audible voices? Are you an oracle?

Yes. I hear God, voices in my head and heart (mind and spirit).

You have never heard the voice of God? I understand if backslidden, but never?

The flesh cannot grasp that which is spiritual.


I bet you hate that song In The Garden. You probably cannot see how it is biblical... Lol

 

[John Caldwell]

[QUOTEJohn Caldwell,

yes, I have read your posts...maybe someday you will grasp hold of it, where there is life, there is hope.
God saves sinners, all kinds, liars, trolls, stalkers,those who break the 9th commandment constantly, but consider it a light thing.
wherr n God saves a person they hear his voice in scripture as He designed it

You may not believe me, but that is no reason for you to call me a liar. I have heard God's voice. I have had communion with God, not just reading Scripture but in my life in general. I heard God when my father was passing from cancer. There was an assurance (not a bible verse, but an assuring voice) in the circumstances that occurred. I heard God's voice in the life of a friend who was dying of throat cancer (not just a bible verse). I have been in situations where I heard God directing me to go to a person and witness to them, or give them help. These were not bible verses.

Even when I was saved I heard the voice of God calling me (this time it was less than an voice and more of a drawing). But it had nothing to do with bible verses. It had to do with an encounter with God Himself.

We can know about God through Scripture. And Scripture is how we test spirits. But Scripture itself is not the "voice of God". Certainly God communicates through us when we meditate on Scripture. But do not limit God.

His Spirit is in us. He guides us into spiritual truth (not just a knowledge of Scripture).

 

[Anthony D'Arienzo]

Giuliano,


[No, I never saw a hand writing on the wall;]
ok, so far so good.
[and if you read the whole thread, you would know I ignored the "audible" voices the few times I heard them.]
I have never heard audible voices
[Nor would I say my revelations come through the small still voice,]
ok
[Rather the communications arise in my mind as ideas which I know are not my ideas.]
Where are we told to expect any such "communication"?
How do you know they are not"your ideas"?

[Sometimes they may contan "words" in English, other times no -- other times it's the idea and I would need to supply words myself to try to tell others.]
If you are supplying the words, can it be said to be a revelation from God?

[For example, in a vision, I may see things without words being used.]

This differs from a normal daydream in what way?

[Almost everyone has the ability to receive ideas like that, but few don't when awake.]

Are you thinking of any place in the bible that teaches this?
[ To that sort of person, spiriits can communicate in dreams. Such spiritual communications could be angelic or demonic, of course.]
Where do you read of this?


[ Most people are spiritually deaf when awake for a very good reason. I think it's probably best to let the spiritually deaf remain that way.]
Are these believers?

[I can also tell you I think I could teach almost anyone how to send and receive such spiritual messages.]

I thought we were speaking of mrssages sent by God?
I decline to give out such information on the internet. I would teach only people I felt confident would be sincere about it and not apt to use it to manipulate others, to take advantage of others, etc.
I do not see this in scripture

[There are perils in turning on your spiritual ears and eyes. People with impure hearts could be deceived by the demonic posing as the angelic. They can also deceive themselves without a demon needing to help mislead them since people can be motivated by greed and lust.]
I do not see this in scripture
[I would not even lay hands on a Christian to have their ears and eyes opened unless I knew him or her extremely well. I would not because I cannot read their hearts. Someone can be a 99% good person; but if there is 1% sin in the heart, there is danger that even good Christians could succumb to temptation. I leave it up to God then to decide who should receive what gift.
I do not see this in scripture

 

[John Caldwell]

@Anthony D'Arienzo ,

I think the issue most are objecting to is that your posts seem to suggest God does not speak (or communicate) to Christians except that communication be Scripture itself. I am not sure that this is what you mean.

When asked a question about your beliefs you have a habit of posting a lot of things but never actually answering the question.

Do you believe that the Spirit communicates to people? I mean, more than just making them believe Scripture?

 

[Heart2Soul]

@Anthony D'Arienzo ,

I think the issue most are objecting to is that your posts seem to suggest God does not speak (or communicate) to Christians except that communication be Scripture itself. I am not sure that this is what you mean.

When asked a question about your beliefs you have a habit of posting a lot of things but never actually answering the question.

Do you believe that the Spirit communicates to people? I mean, more than just making them believe Scripture?

This is pushing the same button over and over again...I think it's time to humbly agree to disagree, Amen?

 

[John Caldwell]

This is pushing the same button over and over again...I think it's time to humbly agree to disagree, Amen?

I guess it could be. I am just not sure what he means.

It sounds to me like his posts are saying God does not work except through Scripture BUT I do not believe that is actually what he is saying (or believes) based on other comments.

I think that some (myself included) may be misunderstanding what he is trying to communicate, but perhaps not.

I just was asking for clarification because I believe too many arguments arise out of assumption.

Does that make sense?

 

[Heart2Soul]

I guess it could be. I am just not sure what he means.

It sounds to me like his posts are saying God does not work except through Scripture BUT I do not believe that is actually what he is saying (or believes) based on other comments.

I think that some (myself included) may be misunderstanding what he is trying to communicate, but perhaps not.

I just was asking for clarification because I believe too many arguments arise out of assumption.

Does that make sense?

That it is his beliefs...seeds have been planted, then they get watered, but God gives the increase....
I know the bible says we will all come to the unity of faith in these last days and I believe that is happening....
God Bless!

 

[John Caldwell]

That it is his beliefs...seeds have been planted, then they get watered, but God gives the increase....
I know the bible says we will all come to the unity of faith in these last days and I believe that is happening....
God Bless!

I've been checking my plants daily (only a few tomatoes, cucumbers, and peppers). I always think, why do I plant these things when the are fresh produce all over the place here? I am not a very patient person, I suppose. I always want to at least see those buds starting to bloom. But I suppose that is where we all were at one time. A seed was planted and watered. God gave the increase. And there were probably a few "farmers" standing around thinking "is this thing ever going to grow?". Some will, some will not. And there will be different degrees of growth. God is in control.

 

[JunChosen]

Those who believe that God is still bringing revelations today through dreams and visions, communicating to people in an audible voice, or angel visitations etc.., does NOT understand nor can they see/read Scripture with spiritual eyes!

I mean, what part of Revelation 22:18,19 do they not understand? It's written in black and white that even a six years old who can read and write are able to understand these two verses!

Is this because of hardness of hearts on their part?

Yes, I believe it is and as I've alluded to already, Satan comes as an angel of light and that he is able to deceive even the elect.

Are you spiritual? Then let it be acknowledged that what is written in Scripture are the commandments from God.

To God Be The Glory

 

[John Caldwell]

Those who believe that God is still bringing revelations today through dreams and visions, communicating to people in an audible voice, or angel visitations etc.., does NOT understand nor can they see/read Scripture with spiritual eyes!

I mean, what part of Revelation 22:18,19 do they not understand? It's written in black and white that even a six years old who can read and write are able to understand these two verses!

Is this because of hardness of hearts on their part?

Yes, I believe it is and as I've alluded to already, Satan comes as an angel of light and that he is able to deceive even the elect.

Are you spiritual? Then let it be acknowledged that what is written in Scripture are the commandments from God.

To God Be The Glory

It seems like you are confusing a couple of things.

First, the command in Revelation states specifically it is for that book (the Scriptures as we have them were not complied when Revelation was written).

Second, we are to test these things against Scripture. No one is saying additional Scripture is given.

What people are saying is God is neither dead or inactive in the lives of believers. God has led me to specific passages in my life. God has led me to people and even places in my life. God has led me to give to people, given me the knowledge there was a need.

 

[Heart2Soul]

Those who believe that God is still bringing revelations today through dreams and visions, communicating to people in an audible voice, or angel visitations etc.., does NOT understand nor can they see/read Scripture with spiritual eyes!

I mean, what part of Revelation 22:18,19 do they not understand? It's written in black and white that even a six years old who can read and write are able to understand these two verses!

Is this because of hardness of hearts on their part?

Yes, I believe it is and as I've alluded to already, Satan comes as an angel of light and that he is able to deceive even the elect.

Are you spiritual? Then let it be acknowledged that what is written in Scripture are the commandments from God.

To God Be The Glory

you have your beliefs, I have my testimonies so at this point there is no reason to continue to debate......we can agree to disagree.

But guess what, what God spoke to me in prayer is already manifesting....I have a lot of anticipation about Pentecost Sunday...we shall see.

 

[JunChosen]

First, the command in Revelation states specifically it is for that book (the Scriptures as we have them were not complied when Revelation was written).

If you mean for the Book of Revelation only then I am correct in my assertions. Question: "can you understand Revelation apart from the whole Bible?"

Second, we are to test these things against Scripture. No one is saying additional Scripture is given.

Of course you are, when you say, "God told me in a dream or in whatever form to go to such a person..." This now becomes an addition to His Word and whether realizing it or not, it is a violation of Revelation 22:19.

What people are saying is God is neither dead or inactive in the lives of believers. God has led me to specific passages in my life. God has led me to people and even places in my life. God has led me to give to people, given me the knowledge there was a need.

Yes, only because it is our duty to do so! (Luke 17:10)

We can know about God through Scripture. And Scripture is how we test spirits. But Scripture itself is not the "voice of God".

Oh really? Scripture itself is not the "voice of God?" How then do you understand when God came to Moses and told him to take a scroll and write all the things that He said to him, likewise with Jeremiah? And, with Paul?

What about Matthew 28:18-20? Is not this a command of Jesus (verbally commanded) to His disciples and is not this Scripture?

To God Be The Glory

 

[John Caldwell]

If you mean for the Book of Revelation only then I am correct in my assertions. Question: "can you understand Revelation apart from the whole Bible?"



Of course you are, when you say, "God told me in a dream or in whatever form to go to such a person..." This now becomes an addition to His Word and whether realizing it or not, it is a violation of Revelation 22:19.



Yes, only because it is our duty to do so! (Luke 17:10)



Oh really? Scripture itself is not the "voice of God?" How then do you understand when God came to Moses and told him to take a scroll and write all the things that He said to him, likewise with Jeremiah? And, with Paul?

What about Matthew 28:18-20? Is not this a command of Jesus (verbally commanded) to His disciples and is not this Scripture?

To God Be The Glory

No. I mean applying Revelation 22:19 to Scripture as a whole or to deny that God continues to work in the lives of Christians (not just through the Bible) is abusing Scripture.

I never said God told me anything in a dream.

I also never said that Scripture is not the voice of God.

You are making assumptions there. I am saying God also lives in us and directs us and communicates to us.

Where you and I differ is I believe the Spirit dwells in Christians. As Paul said, the good he does is Christ in him not just Paul reading his Bible and following those instructions but Christ guiding Paul) . I believe this applies to Christians today, not just to Paul.

That is fine, we do not have to agree. This is true especially on this forum because there is such a wide range of beliefs here (I am Baptist and where your view is different from Baptist theology this is not a Baptist forum).

 

[DNB]

How do you know? God uses people (God is a God of means). When a preacher shares the gospel with a person then that person hears an audible voice from God.

God's Spirit moves in the believer in ways others cannot judge. It is not the means but the result that we judge. When someone says "God told me" I stop everything and listen. And then I evaluate what that person says that God told them.

Exactly, so have you taken the time to evaluate the OP? It sounds like flaky nonsense to me. One does not need a prophecy to know, what she attempted to impart. It's like it was taken straight out of the Bible itself.
@Anthony D'Arienzo

 

[DNB]

Yes we do. However he has sealed his word until He returns;

18 For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book:

19 And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.

If God audibly speaks to anyone, it would be adding to His completed revelation.....we could write rev.23

I agree, but only pertaining to prophecy that is on a global or national level. I personally believe that God will still literally speak to someone on a personal level (don't marry her, buy this house, take that job, inspect your car..). And yes, with an audible voice, whether it be His, or His messenger's. But, as for this OP, a categorical no!

 

[John Caldwell]

Exactly, so have you taken the time to evaluate the OP? It sounds like flaky nonsense to me. One does not need a prophecy to know, what she attempted to impart. It's like it was taken straight out of the Bible itself.
@Anthony D'Arienzo

No. The topic had migrated a bit before I took notice. I evaluated the posts to which I responded.

Scripture is the test. Take what is said and evaluate it against Scripture.

My point is we cannot declare God effectively dead in the lives of believers. The Spirit indwells believers and guides them. This is not just Scripture.

One problem with the church today it it's absolute denial of the Holy Spirit. Sure, some will allow the Spirit to help us believe verses in the Bible. But Christianity is so much more.

Perhaps you have never experienced God working in your life except when reading your Bible. But not all Christians are like that. I personally could not imagine the absence of God's voice (of God's Spirit) in my life.

I guess I am just not smart enough to rely on my study of the Bible alone. I need the Spirit guiding me. Those who do not should not critize those of us who are weak and dependent on "Christ in us".

 

[DNB]

oral roberts claimed he had a 7 hour conversation with a 900ft tall Jesus.
Do you believe that?
In 1977, Roberts claimed to have had a vision from a 900-foot-tall Jesus who told him to build City of Faith Medical and Research Center, and the hospital would be a success.[33][34][35] In 1980, Roberts said he had a vision that encouraged him to continue the construction of his City of Faith Medical and Research Center in Oklahoma, which opened in 1981. At the time, it was among the largest health facilities of its kind in the world and was intended to merge prayer and medicine in the healing process. The City of Faith operated for only eight years before closing in late 1989, but the importance of treating the whole person—spirit, mind, and body—was conveyed to many medical professionals.[36][37] The Orthopedic Hospital of Oklahoma still operates on its premises. In 1983 Roberts said Jesus had appeared to him in person and commissioned him to find a cure for cancer.[38][39]

Roberts' fundraising was controversial. In January 1987, during a fundraising drive, Roberts announced to a television audience that unless he raised $8 million by that March, God would "call him home."[40][41] However, the year before on Easter he had told a gathering at the Dallas Convention Center that God had instructed him to raise the money "by the end of the year" or he would die.[42] Regardless of this new March deadline and the fact that he was still $4.5 million short of his goal,[43] some were fearful that he was referring to suicide, given the impassioned pleas and tears that accompanied his statement. Late in March 1987 while Roberts was fasting and praying in the Prayer Tower, Florida dog track owner Jerry Collins donated $1.3 million.[44][45] Highly worried from what he perceived as Roberts threatening to starve himself, Collins said, "I did it in order to save the guy from going to heaven in a hurry. It's got nothing to do with religion. I've been a Baptist and a Methodist. I believe in religion and not just the church. You have to help one another."[46] Altogether, Roberts raised a total of $9.1 million.[47] Later that year, he announced that God had raised the dead through his ministry.[48] Some of Roberts' fundraising letters were written by Gene Ewing, who headed a business writing donation letters for other evangelicals such as Don Stewart and Robert Tilton.[49]

Prime example! ...let all the straw-man arguments start now?

 

[DNB]

No. The topic had migrated a bit before I took notice. I evaluated the posts to which I responded.

Scripture is the test. Take what is said and evaluate it against Scripture.

My point is we cannot declare God effectively dead in the lives of believers. The Spirit indwells believers and guides them. This is not just Scripture.

One problem with the church today it it's absolute denial of the Holy Spirit. Sure, some will allow the Spirit to help us believe verses in the Bible. But Christianity is so much more.

Perhaps you have never experienced God working in your life except when reading your Bible. But not all Christians are like that. I personally could not imagine the absence of God's voice (of God's Spirit) in my life.

I guess I am just not smart enough to rely on my study of the Bible alone. I need the Spirit guiding me. Those who do not should not critize those of us who are weak and dependent on "Christ in us".

John, I am merely saying test the wisdom behind the prophecy. It has vain imagination written all over it. I believe in God's power and His Spirit so much, that I would never relegate it to such a mundane, reiterated and over-used rhetoric. Like I said, I could give that exact same 'prophecy', just from the top of my head. I find it offensive that she claims this to be God's power, and not that I don't believe in God's intervention in His believer's lives.

 

[Heart2Soul]

John, I am merely saying test the wisdom behind the prophecy. It has vain imagination written all over it. I believe in God's power and His Spirit so much, that I would never relegate it to such a mundane, reiterated and over-used rhetoric. Like I said, I could give that exact same 'prophecy', just from the top of my head. I find it offensive that she claims this to be God's power, and not that I don't believe in God's intervention in His believer's lives.

You need to educate yourself before attacking what you don't believe.