God's Word does ""not"" teach that baptism is essential for salvation.

[GISMYS_7]

God's Word does ""not"" teach that baptism is essential for salvation.
The proof is found in God's word--the word that has no contradictions. Clearly, salvation is by faith. For example, Rom. 5:1 states that we are justified (declared righteous) by faith. It does not say faith and baptism. If baptism were part of salvation, then it would say we were justified by faith and baptism. But it does ""not"". If justification is by faith, then it is by faith. Baptism is ""not"" faith. It is a ceremony. It is something we do as a ritual. Proof baptism does not save is the many unbelievers that get baptized to please family and friends but remain and die unbelievers and will be in hell! Furthermore, please consider the following verses which declare how we are saved.

1. Rom. 3:22, "even the righteousness of God through faith in Jesus Christ for all those who believe; for there is no distinction."
2. Rom. 3:26, "for the demonstration, I say, of His righteousness at the present time, that He might be just and the justifier of the one who has faith in Jesus."
3. Rom. 3:28, "For we maintain that a man is justified by faith apart from works of the Law."
4. Rom. 4:5, "But to the one who does not work, but believes in Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is reckoned as righteousness."
5. Baptism and John 3:5 | CARM.org
6. Rom. 5:1, "Therefore having been justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ."
7. Gal. 3:8, "And the Scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the Gentiles by faith, preached the gospel beforehand to Abraham."
8. Gal. 3:24 , "Therefore the Law has become our tutor to lead us to Christ, that we may be justified by faith."
9. Eph. 2:8, "For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God.

 

[historyb]

So throw out the other verses. You can just use the Bible in a vacuum to prove your false doctrinal fantasy

 

[Triumph1300]

God's Word does ""not"" teach that baptism is essential for salvation.
The proof is found in God's word--the word that has no contradictions. Clearly, salvation is by faith. For example, Rom. 5:1 states that we are justified (declared righteous) by faith. It does not say faith and baptism. If baptism were part of salvation, then it would say we were justified by faith and baptism. But it does ""not"". If justification is by faith, then it is by faith. Baptism is ""not"" faith. It is a ceremony. It is something we do as a ritual. Proof baptism does not save is the many unbelievers that get baptized to please family and friends but remain and die unbelievers and will be in hell! Furthermore, please consider the following verses which declare how we are saved.

1. Rom. 3:22, "even the righteousness of God through faith in Jesus Christ for all those who believe; for there is no distinction."
2. Rom. 3:26, "for the demonstration, I say, of His righteousness at the present time, that He might be just and the justifier of the one who has faith in Jesus."
3. Rom. 3:28, "For we maintain that a man is justified by faith apart from works of the Law."
4. Rom. 4:5, "But to the one who does not work, but believes in Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is reckoned as righteousness."
5. Baptism and John 3:5 | CARM.org
6. Rom. 5:1, "Therefore having been justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ."
7. Gal. 3:8, "And the Scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the Gentiles by faith, preached the gospel beforehand to Abraham."
8. Gal. 3:24 , "Therefore the Law has become our tutor to lead us to Christ, that we may be justified by faith."
9. Eph. 2:8, "For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God.

You are correct.

I know that United Pentecostals believe otherwise.
They also believe you need to be speaking in tongues in order to be saved.
(I attended there for some time)

Fact is that many people don't have the opportunity to get water baptized,
for instance in hospitals.

The fellow next to Christ on the cross did not get baptized.

This is it: Believe upon the name of the Lord and you shall be saved.

However....To “believe in the Lord Jesus Christ” is much more than intellectual assent to the fact that He existed; it means that you place your trust, your faith, your expectant hope for being saved in who Jesus is and what He did for you.

 

[GISMYS_7]

So throw out the other verses. You can just use the Bible in a vacuum to prove your false doctrinal fantasy

YES!!! So throw out the other and misunderstood verses and teachings of little men.

 

[Reggie Belafonte]

You must be water baptised first and then the hope is that you become born again, then you will become baptised with the Holy Spirit.
It does not work any other way.
I know people who claim to be born again but they are not truly, all they have is some faith and all they are doing is making stupid claims from stupid worldly foundations.
This is their gibberish that I have found
1 they claim such nonsense, like you can not be water baptised unless you want to be claim ? so your parents wish to baptise one are of no value ?

Well they point to the Bible points, well yes but they are pointing to a time in History before Christianity was not established in Nations, they forget this fact. so the point I make is under a Christian Nation all it's children would be water baptised, would they not. because their Parents are Christians in fact, now outside of such as that one who was born to as heathen parents ? well then it may be as such as in the Bible account before the establishment of Christ in Nations.
So their is no excuse for a child born of Christian parents not to water baptise their Children, such a one who does not do as such is not truly a real Christian and is a blight.
If one was a true Christian parent of a child, what stands in ones way not to water baptise ? nothing at all ! the parents are also making a commitment to bring that child up as a Christian. now that is their most important job, but that does not mean that the child will not take up Christianity themselves, but the parents have done their duty. many a child brought up in a Christian family do not have enough faith to become worthy of such, as Bible says of such in the parable of the sower. they are of little faith and such is challenged by this world to drag that faith that you have down.
So yes such a one can loose their faith ?
Now if you do not want to water baptise your Children, that comes under the worldly pagans, on par with them lot who claim all sorts of nonsense and the reason why, is because not one of them is truly born again in fact. they are a curse to God ! I have seen their works, oh some make claims of water baptism as if is something other.
I am not saying I am against anyone who is of age etc to want to get water baptised ! I do not stand in anyone's way as such but they are making a fuss over Christian parents Children, come off it !
All their claims do not cut it and I find some of such people attitude pathetic.
I am saying yes to water baptism, where does Jesus say no to such ever.

One must be water baptised first because this is how on learns, it can never work the other way round and get born again first and then if ? you want then you may get water baptised.

 

[Reggie Belafonte]

That's the garbage that a mate claims, but his position on being born again is a worldly stance in fact.

 

[Triumph1300]

Quote by Reggie: You must be water baptised first and then the hope is that you become born again, then you will become baptised with the Holy Spirit.
It does not work any other way.
----------------------------------------------------------

Sorry Reggie, but here is how it happened to me in 1980.

In this order:

1. Born again.
2. Couple of months later Holy Spirit baptism with speaking in tongues.
3. Some time later: Water baptism.

 

[Reggie Belafonte]

You are correct.

I know that United Pentecostals believe otherwise.
They also believe you need to be speaking in tongues in order to be saved.
(I attended there for some time)

Fact is that many people don't have the opportunity to get water baptized,
for instance in hospitals.

The fellow next to Christ on the cross did not get baptized.

This is it: Believe upon the name of the Lord and you shall be saved.

However....To “believe in the Lord Jesus Christ” is much more than intellectual assent to the fact that He existed; it means that you place your trust, your faith, your expectant hope for being saved in who Jesus is and what He did for you.

The fellow on the cross most likely was water baptised you know and no one can prove otherwise.
Many people were water baptised in the days you know.
Not to mention that this one had faith is Jesus you know and that does not come from just nowhere, he knew Jesus was and that's why Jesus said of him as such that he did.
To make claims that this man just said as he did without faith in Jesus is a cunning insult.
I am sure that he was water baptised in fact as such gives one such strength.

 

[Triumph1300]

The fellow on the cross most likely was water baptised you know and no one can prove otherwise.
Many people were water baptised in the days you know.
Not to mention that this one had faith is Jesus you know and that does not come from just nowhere, he knew Jesus was and that's why Jesus said of him as such that he did.
To make claims that this man just said as he did without faith in Jesus is a cunning insult.
I am sure that he was water baptised in fact as such gives one such strength.

There's no evidence of that in scripture.
You are guessing and trying to justify your opinion.

 

[Reggie Belafonte]

Quote by Reggie: You must be water baptised first and then the hope is that you become born again, then you will become baptised with the Holy Spirit.
It does not work any other way.
----------------------------------------------------------

Sorry Reggie, but here is how it happened to me in 1980.

In this order:

1. Born again.
2. Couple of months later Holy Spirit baptism with speaking in tongues.
3. Some time later: Water baptism.

Good on you dear Triumph1300.
The main thing is that one has some faith, I do not stand in the way of such as that. the rest is up to the Lord Jesus to work in you and you abiding in the Vine.

 

[Triumph1300]

The main thing is that one has some faith, I do not stand in the way of such as that. the rest is up to the Lord Jesus to work in you and you abiding in the Vine.

The point of this thread is about water baptism being required.
It is not.

 

[historyb]

YES!!! So throw out the other and misunderstood verses and teachings of little men.

I do throw out your lies little men, simple enough

 

[Reggie Belafonte]

There's no evidence of that in scripture.
You are guessing and trying to justify your opinion.

More than just guessing, I have faith in such is most likely the way, why because you do not see people out of the blue make such claims and secondly water baptism can give strength, even to people who are wayward in their faith, you will not see such in an atheist.

True story 2 men on drugs down and out one says hey man we can finish ourselves off with this needle, the other said no ! I am baptised ! he did not give up because he had faith in Jesus Christ and that baptism gave him the strength, that man then turned his life around and became a wonderful Priest.

 

[Reggie Belafonte]

The point of this thread is about water baptism being required.
It is not.

Required it sure is. but the whole point is that it is to lead one to the Holy Spirit and become born again. as such we enter into the Kingdom of God. because as such one is not of this world.
The dude on the cross just made the first move against this world, backing up Jesus.

You know when Saul became Paul he was water baptised as well before hand.

 

[Triumph1300]

You know when Saul became Paul he was water baptised as well before hand.

Not true.
Saul called Jesus “Lord” before he was baptized, so he was saved prior to baptism.

 

[historyb]

The Salvation journey begins with Baptism and ends with Death.

 

[justbyfaith]

It simply amounts to gambling on eternity to believe that I can be saved apart from baptism and then act accordingly.

1) the Holy Ghost is absolutely promised to those who repent and receive baptism in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins (Acts of the Apostles 2:38-39, Romans 8:30).

You can also receive the Holy Ghost merely by asking (Luke 11:9-13).

2) those who merely believe "should not perish" (John 3:16) while those who believe and are baptized "shall be saved" (Mark 16:16).

Those who call on the name of the Lord also "shall be saved." (Romans 10:13)

 

[Randy Kluth]

God's Word does ""not"" teach that baptism is essential for salvation.
The proof is found in God's word--the word that has no contradictions. Clearly, salvation is by faith. For example, Rom. 5:1 states that we are justified (declared righteous) by faith. It does not say faith and baptism. If baptism were part of salvation, then it would say we were justified by faith and baptism. But it does ""not"". If justification is by faith, then it is by faith. Baptism is ""not"" faith. It is a ceremony. It is something we do as a ritual. Proof baptism does not save is the many unbelievers that get baptized to please family and friends but remain and die unbelievers and will be in hell! Furthermore, please consider the following verses which declare how we are saved.

1. Rom. 3:22, "even the righteousness of God through faith in Jesus Christ for all those who believe; for there is no distinction."
2. Rom. 3:26, "for the demonstration, I say, of His righteousness at the present time, that He might be just and the justifier of the one who has faith in Jesus."
3. Rom. 3:28, "For we maintain that a man is justified by faith apart from works of the Law."
4. Rom. 4:5, "But to the one who does not work, but believes in Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is reckoned as righteousness."
5. Baptism and John 3:5 | CARM.org
6. Rom. 5:1, "Therefore having been justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ."
7. Gal. 3:8, "And the Scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the Gentiles by faith, preached the gospel beforehand to Abraham."
8. Gal. 3:24 , "Therefore the Law has become our tutor to lead us to Christ, that we may be justified by faith."
9. Eph. 2:8, "For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God.

I agree. Water Baptism is for the convert who has already gotten saved, and wants to "tell the world." It is not a "purification ceremony." Rather, it is a symbolic declaration that the novice is prepared to continue living a purified life, bathed in the spirituality of Christ. It is a testimony to the fact we've been saved, and demonstrate publicly, in ritual, the fact that we've been purified by turning our lives over to Christ.

We could not purify ourselves by anything we do, except by compliance with the word of Christ. The choice to get water baptized is not the act that saves us. The act that saves us is accepting Christ in our heart as our new way of life.

Rather, water baptism is an act of embracing the life of Christ going forward, showing the world that we have chosen him. It does not obtain salvation, but rather, obtains a witness to the fact we've already been saved and intend on continuing to live that way.

 

[farouk]

In Acts 2.41, people were baptised because they were believers, not in order supposedly to become believers.

 

[Mungo]

If baptism were part of salvation, then it would say we were justified by faith and baptism.

Jesus taught that: Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved (Mk 16:16)
You need to believe Jesus.