Grace vs Legalism

[Behold]

Tomorrow's sin? Why not use the power that is the Spirit of God in you to not commit it in the first place?.

I will assume that after you read 55 of my Threads, where i taught that there is no "sin In Christ", in about 40 of them, and that by Right Believing, a believer can produce a perfected discipleship..
REMEMBER ALL THAT?
I THINK YOU DO.
So, after you've argued with me for about 2 months AGAINST = HOW and WHY Paul teaches "if we walk in the spirit we shall not sin".... you now come and say something to me about me "not sinning in the first place'""
Is your comprehension really that bad?

You are so confused.
Not a good place to be.

 

[marks]

It is that assumption you will always sin that Paul doesn't teach.

And where is this assumption that you will always sin?

 

[CharismaticLady]

You persist in parsing sin that the Bible does not parse.

Evidently you just do not respect the Scriptures from the BIBLE, Old and New that do. We've gone over them before, so I can't say you don't know them.

 

[CharismaticLady]

I will assume that after you read 55 of my Threads, where i taught that there is no "sin In Christ", in about 40 of them, and that by Right Believing, a believer can produce a perfected discipleship..
REMEMBER ALL THAT?
I THINK YOU DO.
So, after you've argued with me for about 2 months AGAINST = HOW and WHY Paul teaches "if we walk in the spirit we shall not sin".... you now come and say something to me about me "not sinning in the first place'""
Is your comprehension really that bad?

You are so confused.
Not a good place to be.

There is no sin in Christ, because Jesus took away that sin nature, and we were reborn with a new nature, making us new creatures that partake of the divine nature. Do you really believe the divine nature is going to commit an act of the flesh?

 

[CharismaticLady]

At the end of the day, I believe that No Sin comes from the Spirit of God, so when you sin of any description, it did not find it's source with God, His Spirit, or the new creation He's made you to be. And if it doesn't come from there, there's only one other option, your flesh. Whatever that sin is.

I see you believe we are a mixture of the carnal nature, and the born again nature, but God doesn't accept going back to the carnal nature.

Romans 8:9 shows that a Christian is Not in the flesh. So if we commit sins of the flesh, that means we have yet to be born again, and if we are not born again, Christ doesn't know us. This is the struggle of mind over the flesh of Romans 7. They do not have the Spirit of God in them at all.

 

[CharismaticLady]

You and I don't even seem to agree on what sin actually is. And how it is eliminated, not just some, but all.

Jesus told us, and also the apostles.

 

[CharismaticLady]

..

 

[CharismaticLady]

I will assume that after you read 55 of my Threads, where i taught that there is no "sin In Christ", in about 40 of them, and that by Right Believing, a believer can produce a perfected discipleship..
REMEMBER ALL THAT?
I THINK YOU DO.
So, after you've argued with me for about 2 months AGAINST = HOW and WHY Paul teaches "if we walk in the spirit we shall not sin".... you now come and say something to me about me "not sinning in the first place'""
Is your comprehension really that bad?

You are so confused.
Not a good place to be.

I want you to see something.

21 “Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. 22 Many will say to Me in that day, ‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?’ 23 And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!’

Here is a person who believes in Jesus as Lord. They even had the Spirit in them, casting out demons and prophesying, gifts that are irrevocable. But, then they listened to your teaching and saw that the sins they commit tomorrow are not sins against us at all, that Jesus has your sins you commit tomorrow already. So when tempted, they do not resist the devil, but quench the Spirit. And what does Jesus say to them?

cc: @marks, my friend

 

[CharismaticLady]

And where is this assumption that you will always sin?

You said it as if it is fact that you will commit it, and are asking me if it will condemn us. If Jesus has to say "I never knew you" what do you think?

You said: "Is it then your thinking that the best way to prevent tomorrow's sin is to believe that it will condemn you?

This assumption started somewhere after the apostles died. It has become Orthodox, and the Truth has become heresy. I know Martin Luther wrote it. I don't know where he got it. But it gets repeated on here over and over as if it is true. They don't know that it is just the carnal man that will always sin.

 

[marks]

Evidently you just do not respect the Scriptures from the BIBLE,

Perjorative nonsense, I'm sorry, but that's how I see this.

I happen to hold to a different understanding, that's the reality.

But rather than address the Scriptures, and our interpretations, you choose - choose - to denigrate my appreciation of the Bible.

And you cannot be further from the truth in this.

Do you honesty believe I don't respect the Scriptures?

Much love!

 

[CharismaticLady]

Perjorative nonesense, I'm sorry, but that's how I see this.

I happen to hold to a different understanding, that's the reality.

But rather than address the Scriptures, and our interpretations, you choose - choose - to denigrate my appreciation of the Bible.

And you cannot be further from the truth in this.

Do you honesty believe I don't respect the Scriptures?

Much love!

Well, the way you half quoted me, everyone could determine that I am guilty of that, but what I really SAID was the scriptures "that say that." What, back to much hate are you?

 

[justbyfaith]

He is saying....."evil men have subverted the understanding of GRACE, and have caused people to think that Grace, if taught correctly, is licentiousness".

Grace, if taught incorrectly, is licentiousness...and these men have taught it incorrectly.

If you teach that any self effort is to be attached to God's Salvation or God's Grace, then if you are born again, you are "fallen from Grace", are in opposition to the Cross, are a Truth Denier, and are a devout heretic. Legalist.

Effort is not necessarily a bad thing.

In Romans 3:23, the words "come short" are in the present passive indicative.

This indicates to me that we come short of the glory of God when we are not active in pursuing the Lord.

Since we are redeemed by faith alone whether we are ungodly or godly in our behaviour (Romans 4:5), I would say that pursuing holiness is something that we do over and above the salvation that the Lord has given to us. Iow, effort is something that we do because our conscience afflicts us when we sin. Not because we are attempting to obtain salvation through self-effort. But rather, because the Lord's discipline motivates us to desire to live holy; and that takes a certain amount of effort on our part. Since living holy is only the result of salvation and not the cause, we do not therefore put forth effort in order to be saved. We put forth effort because we are saved. The Holy Spirit within us motivates us to pursue the Lord and holiness so that we do not passively come short of the glory of God. It is effort that helps in the process of sanctification; but which has nothing to do with our justification.

Even the demons believe, and shudder!

They are not saved. Someone who says, Yes! This sounds great! and they say the prayer, and go home, but they haven't actually committed themself to God in faith, and aren't born again, these, when they are put to the test, fail, because they are not actually reborn.

Much love!

So, if believing doesn't always save, how can you know that the faith that you particularly have, saves you?

Is it not what I have already said, that the one who has a living and saving faith will cling (cleave) to the Lord in faith (Acts of the Apostles 11:23, Hebrews 6:18-20)?

 

[marks]

Well, the way you half quoted me, everyone could determine that I am guilty of that, but what I really SAID was the scriptures "that say that." What, back to much hate are you?

If we're just going to circle back to this, I'm not into it.

You want to nit pick what part of the Bible I have no respect for?

Evidently you just do not respect the Scriptures from the BIBLE, Old and New that do. We've gone over them before, so I can't say you don't know them.

I know them but don't respect them, whichever Scriptures you are thinking of. Right.

Make it about me, sure, it's common. Have fun!

 

[marks]

So, if believing doesn't always save, how can you know that the faith that you particularly have, saves you?

Do you understand what I'm pointing to in the difference between the believing that demons do, and the believing that God's children do?

Much love!

 

[justbyfaith]

Do you understand what I'm pointing to in the difference between the believing that demons do, and the believing that God's children do?

Much love!

I believe that it is characteristic of those who fall away that they originally receive the gospel anonymously with joy (Matthew 13:20 (kjv)). Because they did not make their profession public, they had no root in themselves; because I suppose that they hoped to go incognito as believers. Therefore they did not face the opposition for being a believer from the very beginning; and when they do experience it, they don't want any part of it any more; because they had hoped to believe without having to take any kind of stand for Christ.

 

[Behold]

Do you really believe the divine nature is going to commit an act of the flesh?

thank you for teaching what i teach.
a month ago you were telling me that "no sin in Christ" was "heresy.
I see you have come along nicely.

also, the born again Spirit, which you define as the "divine nature", can't sin.
1 John 3:9

 

[Behold]

I want you to see something.

21 “Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven.

And i want you to see something, so that you stop teaching nonsense, at least related to this...
As you have plenty more to share, im sure..

You teach that "he who does the will of my Father", incorrectly.
You teach this as a self effort, because you are a legalist, who is hiding out as a "justified by faith".
You and justbyfaith, in this regard, are both fakirs.

So, let me show you what the "will of God is", that you might later teach it and claim you knew it all the time, as this is your behavior...

1.) This is the WILL/work of God......"That you BELIEVE on the ONE whom God sent"

2.) And who is it that OVERCOMES ? "He who is born again, and has believed on Christ".

See that? We do not overcome by effort, will, or by abiding.
We overcome the world the flesh and the devil, by BEING BORN AGAIN.. This is how you "overcome", because you have, the. very instant you are born again.

See that? That is both the will of God and the Work of God.. and in both cases it is FINISHED.

Heretics try to teach this as some other idea of self effort to try to "abide" or keep yourself saved.
Which is what you do, and will again, until you recognize your mistake, and then you'll pretend that you knew it all the time.

 

[BOWnQUIVER]

-
The reality is........The Blood of Christ has already cleansed our Sin.....all of it.....>Tomorrow's included.

I found a few scriptures that say your past sins are forgivin

2 PETER1 [4] Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.[5] And beside this, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue; and to virtue knowledge;[6] And to knowledge temperance; and to temperance patience; and to patience godliness;[7] And to godliness brotherly kindness; and to brotherly kindness charity.[8] For if these things be in you, and abound, they make you that ye shall neither be barren nor unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ.[9] BUT HE THAT LACKETH THESE THINGS IS BLIND, AND CANNOT SEE AFAR OFF, AND HATH FORGOTTEN THAT HE WAS PURGED FROM HIS OLD SINS.

ROMANS 3 [23] For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;[24] Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:[25] Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness FOR THE REMISSION OF SINS THAT ARE PAST, through the forbearance of God;

Also found scriptures sayin if you continue in sin {future sins}, youll be up the creek without a paddle

JOHN 5 [11] He answered them, He that made me whole, the same said unto me, Take up thy bed, and walk. [12] Then asked they him, What man is that which said unto thee, Take up thy bed, and walk?[13] And he that was healed wist not who it was: for Jesus had conveyed himself away, a multitude being in that place.[14] Afterward Jesus findeth him in the temple, and said unto him, BEHOLD, THOU ART MADE WHOLE: SIN NO MORE, LEST A WORSE THING COME UNTO THEE.

PSALM 55 [17] Evening, and morning, and at noon, will I pray, and cry aloud: and he shall hear my voice. [18] He hath delivered my soul in peace from the battle that was against me: for there were many with me. [19] God shall hear, and afflict them, even he that abideth of old. Selah. BECAUSE THEY HAVE NO CHANGES, therefore they fear not God.

PSALM 68 [20] He that is our God is the God of salvation; and unto God the Lord belong the issues from death. [21] But God shall wound the head of his enemies, and the hairy scalp of such an ONE AS GOETH ON STILL IN HIS TRESPASSES.

Could you show me the scriptures or even 1 scripture that says your future sins are forgivin

 

[BOWnQUIVER]

-

A Legalist actually believes they are saved untill they sin, then confess, and are saved again, ... as if Salvation is a type of Yo-Yo, of sinning confessing, sinning confessing, sinning confessing.....up down, up down in Christ out of Christ, in Christ, out of Christ.,. kinda crazy, isn't it?
And all of this confusion and chaos is not only the misunderstanding the Blood Atonement, its also not giving FULL Credit DUE to the finished work of Jesus on the Cross.... and that is the REAL issue, for the Legalist - Heretic.
Don't be that person.

A legalist really believes that. Well...i guess im not a legalist. I cannot imagine standing before God and saying "save me Lord im an illegalist". I did nothing you commanded me to do. Now thats kinda crazy!

 

[justbyfaith]

So, let me show you what the "will of God is", that you might later teach it and claim you knew it all the time, as this is your behavior...

And it is your behaviour that you try to take the credit for sound teaching when other people teach it, saying that you taught it first...

Fact is, sometimes you do teach what is sound; but evidently your only reason for doing so is so that you can take the credit for it when it is taught by others and thereby substantiate the false teaching that is taught by you...

See that? We do not overcome by effort, will, or by abiding

Nevertheless, the anointing of the Holy Ghost teaches us to abide (1 John 2:27-28).

Could you show me the scriptures or even 1 scripture that says your future sins are forgiven?

Romans 4:8, Romans 8:38-39, Hebrews 9:12.