Isa 53:6, All we like sheep have gone astray; we have turned every one to his own way; and the LORD hath laid on him the iniquity of us all.
Hebrews 10:26-31
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Isa 53:6, All we like sheep have gone astray; we have turned every one to his own way; and the LORD hath laid on him the iniquity of us all.
How about not meek, not gentle, not peaceful, not long suffering, not good?
Well, so much for that. The points I made there which you apparently did not address is which I wish you would respond to.
Would you want for me to show you why it’s out of context?
Then you did not really got what I said. I said that Jesus Christ is THE ONLY TRUE AND RIGHTEOUS JUDGE, and not as you say A true and righteous judge. Now, if that is an honest mistake, then take this opportunity to respond to it anew.
Tong
R1686
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By all means.
My point is that we as the saints will judge both the world and angels. So then, Jesus is not the only judge.
I will not argue with your point if you are saying that we will not be true and righteous when we judge; except to say that if our judgments will not be righteous and true, why will we even be allowed to judge? Will the Lord allow judgment to take place that is not righteous and true?
Let me point out to you that it is my belief that every verse of scripture stands on its own as a bastion of spiritual truth.
As Hosea 11:1 was taken out of context by Matthew in Matthew 2:15 and he, under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit, applied it to Jesus, when in the original context it applied to Israel. The terminology was that "out of Egypt I have called my son".
And in 2 Corinthians 9:6, it should be clear that the immediate context bears out a health/wealth, name-it-and-claim it doctrine of financial seed-sowing and reaping; while if you take it out of its immediate context and apply Luke 8:11 to the verse you will get a more orthodox interpretation.
Therefore, sometimes the Holy Spirit does take things out of their immediate context to make a point; applying topical context instead (see 1 Corinthians 2:13 (kjv)).
As Hosea 11:1 was taken out of context by Matthew in Matthew 2:15 and he, under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit, applied it to Jesus, when in the original context it applied to Israel. The terminology was that "out of Egypt I have called my son".
And in 2 Corinthians 9:6, it should be clear that the immediate context bears out a health/wealth, name-it-and-claim it doctrine of financial seed-sowing and reaping; while if you take it out of its immediate context and apply Luke 8:11 to the verse you will get a more orthodox interpretation.
Therefore, sometimes the Holy Spirit does take things out of their immediate context to make a point; applying topical context instead (see 1 Corinthians 2:13 (kjv)).
You are moving away from the scriptures I referred to. But it’s okay if that’s what you like.
The question remains. Was it the nature of a sheep to go astray on his own from the flock and from his shepherd? Or they have gone astray because somebody made that happen?
The sheep there refers to Israel. Who was their shepherd during those times? Do you know why Israel have gone astray?
Tong
R1687
Before I do, I like for you to be clear. Do you contend that Jesus is not the only true and righteous judge? I want to be clarified because you always drop the word ONLY TRUE AND RIGHTEOUS.
Again you seem to argue against your own statement and not my statement. I have already brought to your attention that my statement is that Jesus Christ is the only true and righteous judge and you keep taking out the word ONLY TRUE AND RIGHTEOUS. Well, if that’s how you do it, what can I do.
Now, on your last paragraph, yes, we will judge as the scriptures says. But when will that be? Is it today or after we are perfected? Are you able to judge righteously today?
Now, our issue is about judging today, right?
Tong
R1688
I thought so. But now that you say it, then I understand why you believe what you believe. I see now that context is not part of your understanding a verse. So, it would be correct to say that your understanding of a verse is out of context.
First that is not an example of “out of context” understanding. That’s inspired revelation of the prophetic verse. Now if you are one Matthew or one Paul or any of the inspired apostles, then you can do that.
What? I have nothing good to say but that I totally disagree.
Tong
R1689
Ferris Bueller
Well-Known Member
The born again person struggles with sin. They do not live in it. You can tell if a person is born again or not by if they are living in a lifestyle of deliberate unrepentant sin......
9No one who is born of God will continue to sin, because God’s seed remains in them; they cannot go on sinning, because they have been born of God. 10This is how we know who the children of God are and who the children of the devil are: Anyone who does not do what is right is not God’s child 1 John 3:9
We can get caught up in a debate mentality.
Or, rather, we can forget ourselves and allow the flesh access to the keyboard. The mind of the flesh or the mind of Christ.
Much love!
I agree with you. This is a perversion. Telling people whom God has forgiven, justified, that they have "greasy grace"! What an offensive term!
The real sadness to me is knowing that a person won't walk in something they don't believe in, and it's God's grace that makes us to stand.
Much love!
There it is in a nutshell. We stop working, and begin living.
I guess to the one who has not seen this yet, it's all about the working, and then judging our performance according to what we see. It's all about the outside, seeking that assurance that we can only really receive from the inside, as we come to see, we really have met God, and He really has made us new people - even if it doesn't show as much on the outside.
Much love!
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Why do you want to sin??
It's a serious question. If you are born again, you don't. But your flesh does. So we need to get sorted out what in you is of God, and what in you is of Adam.
Once we can do that, we can start talking about deliberate sin. Without a clear understanding of who we are in Christ, and what Justification means to us, not only judicially, but also in who we've become, trying to discuss sin and it's implications in the Christian becomes a hopeless muddle.
Much love!
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We do have the Holy Spirit now.
And some, through the Holy Spirit, have the spiritual gift of "discerning of spirits".
Not exactly. The reality is that I do not only apply the immediate context; but I take into account topical context also.
Not out of topical context.
If anyone has the Holy Ghost, they can do that.
And it is an example of "out of context" understanding.
Clearly, the question should be asked, who is the Son? in both Hosea 11:1 and Matthew 2:15.
Since the answer is different in each verse; and yet one is the quoting of the other: it should be clear that the quoting of Hosea 11:1 in Matthew 2:15 is Matthew taking it out of context and making an application that was not in the original text.
What, exactly, do you disagree with? Everything that I said there was biblically substantiated.
Funny thing is, I ask the Lord to let everything that comes off of my keyboard be from the Holy Ghost, on a regular basis. Of course, I only began to do that recently (in the past year or so), so the instance to which we are referring may have happened before I started asking the Lord to do that.
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You are not your flesh?
Rom 7:18, For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not.
No, I am not.
I am a new creation, a spirit child of God, incarnated into the man born from Adam, until I receive my eternal dwelling. I used to be my flesh, now I live in my flesh, but I am the new creation.
Much love!
Do you know why Paul says, how to perform that which is good he doesn't find?
His body agrees with sin, while his spirit agrees with God. Before he was reborn, he had a mind that agreed with his body, which agreed with sin. Once he was reborn, the old man still agreed with sin, in the body that agreed with sin, but Paul's new spirit agreed with righteousness. And he didn't have a new body that likewise agreed with righteousness, that is, uncorrupted.
But one day the corruptible will put on incorruption. And then the conflict is over. We will find the means by which we may perform good, our resurrection body.
Much love!
When we commit acts of sin with our flesh, the scripture in question is clear that it is us committing that sin.
in me (that is, in my flesh).
in me (that is, in my flesh).
Let's talk Scripture.
Paul said, It is no more I who do it, but sin that lives in me.
What does that mean?
I think it means Paul recognizes that he isn't the sinner, rather, there is sin that lives in him, but is not him, and that is the source of sin. And this is why there is no condemnation. It's because God has completely separated us from our sin, and from it's source. He's ended our relationship with the Law, which was what condemns us, and has given us righteous life shared with Him.
But we still live in our Adamic bodies, in which sin lives.
Much love!
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