HERESY?

[GodsGrace]

In a person, holy means pure.

Holy means to be set apart for service to God.

What Is The Biblical Definition Of Holy?

The reason why some Christians struggle with sin, meaning they desire to sin, is because they are still in the flesh, meaning carnal nature and has nothing to do with our bodies as some think. Oy vey! Romans 8:9 says we are NOT IN THE FLESH but in the Spirit if the Spirit of God indwells us. And if we do not have the Spirit of Christ we do not belong to him. So you see it can't be about being out of our body or after we die.

Hmmm. I'm afraid Ive forgotten to what you're replying.
Romans 8:9 is saying that we are not in the body, inasmuch as we no longer desire to please ourselves but our God.
Those of us who welcome God into our lives have our minds set on the Spirit which is life...verse 7
Those of us who have our minds set on the flesh are hostile to God, we cannot please God and this leads to death...verses 6, 7 and 8.

I don't know what you mean about being out of our body (which we never are) or about after death.

Yes, the sin Jesus takes away from our nature is lawlessness. So to commit lawlessness is committing a sin unto death, and Jesus is not our Advocate. But you see at the end of 1 John 1:7, that is where Jesus is our Advocate, but first we must show that we living in reconciliation with the brethren. IOW, forgive those who trespass against us. The our own unintentional sins will be forgiven. Unintentional sins are sins, but not a sin unto death, but called a sin not unto death; 1 John 5:16-17.

Sin is intentional or it is not a sin.
And you're right about lawlessness - which shows that 1 John 3:4 is speaking of PRACTICING sin....
Here's the verse in the NASB:

1 John 3:4
Everyone who PRACTICES sin also practices LAWLESSNESS, and sin is lawlessness.

So we can agree that lawlessness is the practicing of sinful behavior.

You'll know if you have been baptized with the Holy Spirit or not, because you won't want to do anything wrong. You've been given a super-sensitized conscience where the laws of God are written. Just knowing the laws and trying to keep them with a carnal nature in opposition to the laws of God is not enough even if you know about Jesus. Even Satan knows about Jesus, but doesn't follow Him. A sinner is not following Jesus. And John 8:32-36 shows that those who sin are a slave to sin, and you are correct, lawlessness. The context of 1 John 3:5 is 1 John 3:4 - "sin is lawlessness."

I agree to this.

A sin not unto death is from immature fruit of the Spirit, not against the laws of God. The steps to glorification (that you call sanctification but entirely different) has to do with the fruit of the Spirit and found in 2 Peter 1:5-7 (but read in context 2-11). Let me know if there are any other questions you had that I didn't cover.

I could agree with the above. I'm not going to ask what you believe sanctification to be because there's already enough here.

 

[Marymog]

Agreed 100%
I'm just so tired of explaining it each time.
When I quote one of them, I'm told their writings were not inspired. I believe Ignatius of Antioch was taught by John and another Apostle and to have to hear that he was not inspired makes me giggle.
I have a chart that shows who was taught by whom.
I like the Didache, whose dating had now been put before 100AD. How about Barnabus, that almost made it into the bible?

I'm sorry most Protestants do not know Christian history , OTOH I do think it's dangerous to base doctrine on writings outside the bible.

Thanks. I like the Didache also. It has things in it that The Catholic Church still practices today.

I have no problem with the “writings outside the Bible” from the Apostolic Fathers. I can understand where those writings would help form doctrine since those men probably received clarification from the Apostles on what is in Scripture. The Church’s doctrine is, as best I can tell, in line with the Apostolic Fathers. After all, it takes men to interpret Scripture so whose writings of men to we trust to interpret it?

 

[Marymog]

Yes Proud Mary, keep on burning.

Aunty Jane doesn’t interpret but speaks the truth from the word of God, the Bible, unadulterated.

wow….fascinating.

 

[post]

Jesus died on the Passover.
He was resurrected 3 days later.

on firstfruits

which is always an 8th day, that which appears after the 7th

 

[1stCenturyLady]

This is why we have theologians and really should not be making up our own doctrine.

If 1 John 3:9 does not add the word PRACTICING.....which is generally accepted by Christianity that the intent is there...

Yes, human reasoning places "practicing" there because of the lesser type of sin that has not been removed from our new nature, however, the Catholic church for hundreds of years understood there were two strong distinctions. They called the sins unto death mortal sins, and the sins not unto death venial sins. Denominations that came after leaving the Catholic and Orthodox denominations did not bring this fundamental truth with them, but treated all sin as sin and equal, and heresies began, like Jesus blood covers our past, present and future sins, and adding presumptive words like "practicing" to the Word, but 2 Peter 1:9 shows that only our past sins (of lawlessness 1 John 3:4-5) were forgiven at the time of justification by faith.

Then could you please explain to us the difference between:

1 John 1:6-10
1 John 2:l

6If we say that we have fellowship with Him and yet walk in the darkness, we lie and do not practice the truth; 7but if we walk in the Light as He Himself is in the Light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus His Son cleanses us from all sin. 8If we say that we have no sin, we are deceiving ourselves and the truth is not in us. 9If we confess our sins, He is faithful and righteous to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. 10If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar and His word is not in us.

This has to do with mankind. Because of Adam's sin, we are all born into sin, with an inherited sin nature. (Except Jesus). Verses 5-10 shows the CONTRAST between light and darkness. That is an eastern style of writing. We read with a western mindset, and the present personal tense of "we" can hinder westerners from understanding the Jewish apostle's meaning.

5 This is the message which we have heard from Him and declare to you, that God is light and in Him is no darkness at all. 6 If we say that we have fellowship with Him, and walk in darkness, we lie and do not practice the truth. 7 But if we walk in the light as He is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus Christ His Son cleanses us from all sin.

8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. 9 If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. 10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar, and His word is not in us.

5 - God is LIGHT/HOLY SPIRIT
6 - If we walk in DARKNESS/DEVIL
7 - If we walk in the LIGHT/HOLY SPIRIT

8 - No truth in us, and without Jesus still say you have no sin - DARKNESS/DEVIL
9 - How to become a Christian - REPENT Acts 2:38 to receive Holy Spirit and Jesus takes away our sins of lawlessness
10 - Romans 3:23 talks about mankind since Adam: "all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God." Why we need Jesus. To say this isn't true makes God a liar and you don't know the Word of God.

Please note from the above:
1. THE BLOOD OF JESUS CLEANSES US FROM ALL SIN .....what sin would that be? Cleanses is an on-going verb.
2. IF WE SAY WE HAVE NO SIN WE ARE DECEIVING OURSELVES...this must mean we have sin.
3. IF WE CONFESS OUR SINS, HE IS FAITHFUL AND RIGHTEOUS TO FORGIVE US OUR SINS....we confess sins and are forgiven sins.
4. IF WE SAY WE HAVE NOT SINNED, WE MAKE HIM A LIAR.....so we must be sinning.

You will find the answer to this dilemma in verse 6....

Your number 2 is answered in verse 10 above about Romans 3:23. This does not mean a true Christian commits mortal sins of lawlessness. This verse, though we commit venial sins, does not refer to mankind after believing in Christ, and neither does verse 10. The people in verse 8 and 10 walk in darkness and are not saved, whether they think they are or not.

Cleanses in verse 7 and 1 John 2:1 is continual as those are venial sins, not mortal sins. Jesus is only our Advocate after justification for venial sins.

Cleanses in verse 9 is repentance, the same as how to receive the Holy Spirit. Our nature is completely cleansed from the desire to commit mortal sins, and then continually being cleansed of venial sins IF you continue to walk in the light (verse 7).

Verse 6 is an unbeliever or a pseudo believer that enjoys sinning/darkness. They are kidding themselves if they believed they are saved.

Give an example of a sin you do not know you are committing.

Worry. Fear.

And what does HOLY mean?
(can't seem to get a reply).

It means pure. Without spot or wrinkle. Sanctified. Perfect. Personally, I believe there are two stages. When we are first justified/sanctified, we are made righteous. We are sinless from willful sins of lawlessness. Holy on the other had, would be completely without spot or wrinkle from even venial sins and perfect. Holiness is what we ourselves must be party to and usually takes a lifetime of glorification - 1 John 3:3; 1 John 5:18.

 

[GodsGrace]

Yes Proud Mary, keep on burning.

Aunty Jane doesn’t interpret but speaks the truth from the word of God, the Bible, unadulterated.

Just fell upon this JohnPaul....

I just want to say that the JWs use their own bible.
The only other denomnation I can think of right now that uses its own bible is
the Calvinists (reformed)...John McArthur has his very own bible and interprets it to fit what HE believes.
Which is what the JWs did with the New World Translation.
It's different from other bibles so that it could agree with what they teach.

And if you do join the JWs, make sure you never plan to leave because you will have much grief if you do
from your so-called "friends" that you'll make there.

 

[GodsGrace]

on firstfruits

which is always an 8th day, that which appears after the 7th

It all fits so well.
Jesus also died when the lambs were being slaughtered on the other side of Jerusalem for the Passover on the same day.
The Lamb of God.

 

[1stCenturyLady]

Holy means to be set apart for service to God.

That is sanctified. That is at the beginning of the road to holiness, not the end. Perfection is holinesss.

If that is the entire definition of holy, then how is God Holy? God is holy because He is completely pure light. There is no darkness at all in Him. 1 John 1:5.

 

[GodsGrace]

Thanks. I like the Didache also. It has things in it that The Catholic Church still practices today.

I have no problem with the “writings outside the Bible” from the Apostolic Fathers. I can understand where those writings would help form doctrine since those men probably received clarification from the Apostles on what is in Scripture. The Church’s doctrine is, as best I can tell, in line with the Apostolic Fathers. After all, it takes men to interpret Scripture so whose writings of men to we trust to interpret it?

I have to agree.
Happily.

 

[1stCenturyLady]

I don't know what you mean about being out of our body (which we never are) or about after death.

I was referring to the common responses on the forums of people believing that being in the flesh has to do with sin in our body. But "flesh" by Paul means CARNAL NATURE. They believe that as long we live in these bodies, we will always sin. Again, the post-Catholic belief of sin is sin. They are justifying their desire to sin. We shouldn't even desire to commit venial sins - immature fruit of the Spirit. We should be continually growing towards perfection. 2 Peter 1:5-7 (context 2-11)

 

[1stCenturyLady]

I have to agree.
Happily.

and @Marymog

I actually believe that the Epistle of Barnabas should have been included as canonical and part of the New Testament.

 

[post]

It all fits so well.
Jesus also died when the lambs were being slaughtered on the other side of Jerusalem for the Passover on the same day.
The Lamb of God.

yes!

they slaughter the national lamb in the temple, and at exactly that moment THE LAMB delivers His spirit to the Father in heaven: the veil is rent, top to bottom
on First Fruits after the sabbath, He rises, greets the women, and presents His body also in the temple in heaven - waving the sheaf of the kernel that must fall to the ground and die, so that new life may spring up. one lamb as a burnt offering.
then on the Feast of Weeks, also an 8th day, a sabbath after the seventh sabbath, He appears in the upper room, baptizing them with fire: 'a new grain offering' - seven lambs as burnt offerings, and one kid of a goat for a sin offering.

 

[post]

and @Marymog

I actually believe that the Epistle of Barnabas should have been included as canonical and part of the New Testament.

wasn't it written in the 1300's-1500's by a Muslim who believed Christ was *just a prophet* that prostrated Himself before Mohammed?

 

[GodsGrace]

wasn't it written in the 1300's-1500's by a Muslim who believed Christ was *just a prophet* that prostrated Himself before Mohammed?

No.
It gets mixed up with another writer which was about the time you mention.

Here it is:

Epistle of Barnabas - Wikipedia

 

[GodsGrace]

yes!

they slaughter the national lamb in the temple, and at exactly that moment THE LAMB delivers His spirit to the Father in heaven: the veil is rent, top to bottom
on First Fruits after the sabbath, He rises, greets the women, and presents His body also in the temple in heaven - waving the sheaf of the kernel that must fall to the ground and die, so that new life may spring up. one lamb as a burnt offering.
then on the Feast of Weeks, also an 8th day, a sabbath after the seventh sabbath, He appears in the upper room, baptizing them with fire: 'a new grain offering' - seven lambs as burnt offerings, and one kid of a goat for a sin offering.

Thanks Post.
I always find this type of information to be such a blessing.
This could be one of the reasons why the Apostles decided to begin celebrating the 1st day of the week instead of the Sabbath?

 

[1stCenturyLady]

wasn't it written in the 1300's-1500's by a Muslim who believed Christ was *just a prophet* that prostrated Himself before Mohammed?

cc: @GodsGrace

No, that book is called The Gospel of Barnabas. The Epistles of Barnabas was written in the first century and quoted in the Didache.

 

[GodsGrace]

I was referring to the common responses on the forums of people believing that being in the flesh has to do with sin in our body. But "flesh" by Paul means CARNAL NATURE. They believe that as long we live in these bodies, we will always sin. Again, the post-Catholic belief of sin is sin. They are justifying their desire to sin. We shouldn't even desire to commit venial sins - immature fruit of the Spirit. We should be continually growing towards perfection. 2 Peter 1:5-7 (context 2-11)

OK. I see. I think all sin is sin...to us there is sin and more serious sin...I'd rather you lie to me than kill me.
But God is so holy that to Him everything is sin.

This is one of the reasons I don't agree with those that say they never sin.
We must sin a few times each day...it's just that when we think of sin, we think of big sins.
But there are tiny sins too.
I don't think that I, or those that believe as I do, want to justify sin.
I think we see God as so holy that to Him we sin a lot...even though we may not think so.

The more we get close to God...
The more we see sin.

And the more He loves us for trying harder when temptation strikes....

 

[post]

No.
It gets mixed up with another writer which was about the time you mention.

Here it is:

Epistle of Barnabas - Wikipedia

thanks =]

 

[GodsGrace]

That is sanctified. That is at the beginning of the road to holiness, not the end. Perfection is holinesss.

If that is the entire definition of holy, then how is God Holy? God is holy because He is completely pure light. There is no darkness at all in Him. 1 John 1:5.

It does have a more complicated definition.
God is Holy does not mean God is set apart to serve Himself.

But for US that's what holy means...
we are not holy as God is holy.

I agree re sanctification.
At the end of the road is glorification...but that's at our death.

 

[GodsGrace]

Yes, human reasoning places "practicing" there because of the lesser type of sin that has not been removed from our new nature, however, the Catholic church for hundreds of years understood there were two strong distinctions. They called the sins unto death mortal sins, and the sins not unto death venial sins. Denominations that came after leaving the Catholic and Orthodox denominations did not bring this fundamental truth with them, but treated all sin as sin and equal, and heresies began, like Jesus blood covers our past, present and future sins, and adding presumptive words like "practicing" to the Word, but 2 Peter 1:9 shows that only our past sins (of lawlessness 1 John 3:4-5) were forgiven at the time of justification by faith.



This has to do with mankind. Because of Adam's sin, we are all born into sin, with an inherited sin nature. (Except Jesus). Verses 5-10 shows the CONTRAST between light and darkness. That is an eastern style of writing. We read with a western mindset, and the present personal tense of "we" can hinder westerners from understanding the Jewish apostle's meaning.

5 This is the message which we have heard from Him and declare to you, that God is light and in Him is no darkness at all. 6 If we say that we have fellowship with Him, and walk in darkness, we lie and do not practice the truth. 7 But if we walk in the light as He is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus Christ His Son cleanses us from all sin.

8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. 9 If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. 10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar, and His word is not in us.

5 - God is LIGHT/HOLY SPIRIT
6 - If we walk in DARKNESS/DEVIL
7 - If we walk in the LIGHT/HOLY SPIRIT

8 - No truth in us, and without Jesus still say you have no sin - DARKNESS/DEVIL
9 - How to become a Christian - REPENT Acts 2:38 to receive Holy Spirit and Jesus takes away our sins of lawlessness
10 - Romans 3:23 talks about mankind since Adam: "all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God." Why we need Jesus. To say this isn't true makes God a liar and you don't know the Word of God.




Your number 2 is answered in verse 10 above about Romans 3:23. This does not mean a true Christian commits mortal sins of lawlessness. This verse, though we commit venial sins, does not refer to mankind after believing in Christ, and neither does verse 10. The people in verse 8 and 10 walk in darkness and are not saved, whether they think they are or not.

Cleanses in verse 7 and 1 John 2:1 is continual as those are venial sins, not mortal sins. Jesus is only our Advocate after justification for venial sins.

Cleanses in verse 9 is repentance, the same as how to receive the Holy Spirit. Our nature is completely cleansed from the desire to commit mortal sins, and then continually being cleansed of venial sins IF you continue to walk in the light (verse 7).

Verse 6 is an unbeliever or a pseudo believer that enjoys sinning/darkness. They are kidding themselves if they believed they are saved.



Worry. Fear.



It means pure. Without spot or wrinkle. Sanctified. Perfect. Personally, I believe there are two stages. When we are first justified/sanctified, we are made righteous. We are sinless from willful sins of lawlessness. Holy on the other had, would be completely without spot or wrinkle from even venial sins and perfect. Holiness is what we ourselves must be party to and usually takes a lifetime of glorification - 1 John 3:3; 1 John 5:18.

Also for @Aunty Jane

Past midnight here.
Tomorrow....