Homosexuality

[aspen]

Who's stopping them? Those living in sin will either repent and be saved or hate us. Some will thank us on Judgment Day for not letting them forget. Those who die in their sins will remember that we warned them. It is our responsibility.

Ezekiel 33:8-9 (ESV)
[sup]8 [/sup]If I say to the wicked, O wicked one, you shall surely die, and you do not speak to warn the wicked to turn from his way, that wicked person shall die in his iniquity, but his blood I will require at your hand. [sup]9 [/sup]But if you warn the wicked to turn from his way, and he does not turn from his way, that person shall die in his iniquity, but you will have delivered your soul.

Whose stopping them from what? Joining our churches? Homosexuals can join your church? They cannot join mine, unless they lie about it. Nor can those who were raised in the church and discovered their sexuality later, take the Eucharist.

 

[Duckybill]

Whose stopping them from what? Joining our churches? Homosexuals can join your church? They cannot join mine, unless they lie about it. Nor can those who were raised in the church and discovered their sexuality later, take the Eucharist.

I was responding to your comment:

"....shouldn't we allow homosexuals the grace and have faith in the HS to convict them, in His time?"

A person doesn't have to join a church to repent and be saved. In fact, I strongly advise against it.

 

[aspen]

I was responding to your comment:

"....shouldn't we allow homosexuals the grace and have faith in the HS to convict them, in His time?"

A person doesn't have to join a church to repent and be saved. In fact, I strongly advise against it.

I see - thanks for the clarification.

I think when a homosexual hears that they are going to Hell by every Christian they meet......they start avoiding Christians....and church - being isolated from the Christian community tends to lead people who are trying to be Christians into loneliness and isolation. I also think people who have a problem can hear that they are wrong and sinners a million times without connecting it. Finally, no one likes to hear how sinful they are without knowing any real solutions - hearing testimonies from former homosexuals are not helpful.

Having faith that God will convict them of their sin and provide a way out that works for them without badgering them all the time is the grace I am talking about. Also, some homosexuals will die as practicing homosexuals - I would rather have them involved in the Christian community where they can be loved than out in the world. The fact is, Jerry Falwell died in his sin of gluttony and I am sure he wasn't reminded by every Christian he met that he was going to Hell - and not only was he allowed to be a member of a Church, he was the pastor.

 

[Duckybill]

The fact is, Jerry Falwell died in his sin of gluttony and I am sure he wasn't reminded by every Christian he met that he was going to Hell - and not only was he allowed to be a member of a Church, he was the pastor.

How do you know he was a glutton?

 

[aspen]

How do you know he was a glutton?

He was about 300 pounds

 

[Duckybill]

He was about 300 pounds

Honestly Aspen, it sounds like you're judging the way you are accusing others of doing.

 

[aspen]

Honestly Aspen, it sounds like you're judging the way you are accusing others of doing.

I am pointing out a double standard to make a point - not to judge. This is a classic case of hypocrisy, why can you see it?


here is a quote from falwell related to the log in his own eye

According to a 1998 Purdue University study, obesity is associated with higher levels of religious participation. (Broken down by creed, Southern Baptists have the highest body-mass index on average, Catholics are in the middle, and Jews and other non-Christians are the lowest.) When this finding was brought to the attention of the Reverend Jerry Falwell, he was unperturbed. "I know gluttony is a bad thing," Falwell said. "But I don't know many gluttons." That is one way out of the dilemma -- to deny that overweight people are necessarily sinful gluttons. But it could also be that gluttony is not really a sin.​

​

 

[Duckybill]

How does it prove he was a glutton?

 

[aspen]

How does it prove he was a glutton?

Ducky....

No one gets to be that size without overeating.

The majority of Americans are overweight.....it is an epidemic in our country

Obesity does not exclude people from church membership, the pulpit, or becoming a Christian.

Yet, it is a lifestyle sin and it is often reversible

So why are homosexuals singled out, but obese people are not?

 

[Duckybill]

Ducky....

No one gets to be that size without overeating.

Lots of people become overweight for various reasons other than being gluttons. Sounds like you are judging him.

The majority of Americans are overweight.....it is an epidemic in our country

Obesity does not exclude people from church membership, the pulpit, or becoming a Christian.

Yet, it is a lifestyle sin and it is often reversible

So why are homosexuals singled out, but obese people are not?

You keep saying that but I have not singled out homosexuals. This thread is about homosexuals.

 

[aspen]

Lots of people become overweight for various reasons other than being gluttons. Sounds like you are judging him.

You keep saying that but I have not singled out homosexuals. This thread is about homosexuals.

Actually, I am not judging him. In fact, he would have been welcomed into my church. I would have listened to him preach.

Why are you dodging the real issue?

I've seen this type of response before.......it is fine to point out sin in those you do not believe to be Christians, but if someone points out that a leader in the Christian church is leading a sinful lifestyle - circle the wagons!

I seem to remember you questioning me about why I wasn't witnessing to my homosexual friends - wondering why I wasn't witnessing desperately - that I should be reminding them of their sin as much as it takes for them to not forget.

Those who truly repent will avoid sin like the plague it is. The Holy Spirit of God convicts of sin. The same Holy Spirit who Authored this:

1 Corinthians 6:9-10 (ESV)
[sup]9 [/sup]Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men who practice homosexuality, [sup]10 [/sup]nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God.

So when was the last time you warned your gluttonous friends that they are going to Hell?

 

[Duckybill]

It seems clear that you are judging Falwell very unfairly. Unless you have proof that he was a glutton?

"The fact is, Jerry Falwell died in his sin of gluttony"

Pretty serious Aspen.

 

[aspen]

It seems clear that you are judging Falwell very unfairly. Unless you have proof that he was a glutton?

"The fact is, Jerry Falwell died in his sin of gluttony"

Pretty serious Aspen.

I just repented for calling Jerry a glutton. God has forgiven me. Now back to the issue, can gluttons be Christians and if so, pastors?

 

[Duckybill]

I just repented for calling Jerry a glutton. God has forgiven me. Now back to the issue, can gluttons be Christians and if so, pastors?

God is going to judge us all by our motives and light. As you have clearly said, most homosexuals know homosexuality is sin and condemnation to Hell.

 

[aspen]

God is going to judge us all by our motives and light. As you have clearly said, most homosexuals know homosexuality is sin and condemnation to Hell.

What is your point?

 

[Duckybill]

What is your point?

They know better. They have no excuse for living in sin.

 

[aspen]

They know better. They have no excuse for living in sin.

So what is our response? Why are Christians still trying to convict them, rather than love them? Why are we not leaving conviction up to the Holy Spirit?

 

[Duckybill]

So what is our response? Why are Christians still trying to convict them, rather than love them? Why are we not leaving conviction up to the Holy Spirit?

You just keep going round and round Aspen. When you realize that homosexuals are condemned to Hell you will have accomplished something.

 

[aspen]

You just keep going round and round Aspen. When you realize that homosexuals are condemned to Hell you will have accomplished something.

We are going around and around because you are refusing to answer my questions.
I can also see that you are uncomfortable homosexuals are treated differently by Christians than other sinners......you recognize this hypocrisy, but instead of addressing it, you fall back onto safe ground......homosexuals aren't going to heaven.......

Well, I guess it is up to the Holy Spirit to help you realize this fact, because I am getting nowhere.

 

[Duckybill]

We are going around and around because you are refusing to answer my questions.

What didn't I answer???

I can also see that you are uncomfortable homosexuals are treated differently by Christians than other sinners

Not by me.

......you recognize this hypocrisy, but instead of addressing it, you fall back onto safe ground......homosexuals aren't going to heaven.......

Well, I guess it is up to the Holy Spirit to help you realize this fact, because I am getting nowhere.

You need to admit that homosexuals "will not inherit the Kingdom of God" and then you just might give up trying to squeeze them into Heaven.