Desire Of All Nations
Well-Known Member
Whether Jesus is the Son of God or not isn't the issue here. The issue is whether or not Jesus was ever equal to His Father in authority, and the answer is clearly "no".
How God Can Witness & Judge Anyone?
- Thread starter Christ4Me
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I used to believe that only the Son is the King of kings but since in the end He will be giving back the kingdom to the Father is why He is also King of kings. It makes sense to me in how the King can judge any one because there are Two Witnesses as that King.
Jesus said that the Father judges no one in John 5:22 and has render all judgment unto the Son. So although the Son is submissive to the Father's will, the Son has His permission to have the authority to judge as the Father's will be done for why the Father would be in agreement.
As of now, all power has been given unto the Son per Matthew 28:18 for why the Holy Spirit is known as the Spirit of Christ in all that the Spirit say or do is to testify of the Son thru us ( John 15:26-27 ) to glorify the Son ( John 16:14 ).
Although Jesus is the Head of the Church & running things with authority, it is in according to the Father's will. That makes the Son's authority equal to the Father's authority in all that the Son do and say only because the Son is performing according to the Father's will.
So not clearly a "no" when the Son has the authority of the Father in the performance of His Father's will.
BARNEY BRIGHT
Well-Known Member
There are various Trinitarian concepts but generally the the Trinitarian say the Trinity teaching is that in the Godhead there are three persons, Father, Son, and Holy Ghost; yet, together they are but one God.
The doctrine says that the three are coequal, almighty, and uncreated, having existed eternally in the Godhead. This doctrine I have not found in scripture nowhere.[/QUOTE\]
christ4Me said :
Mayhap because the co equal as inferring that each is God is throwing that reading off in scripture.[/QUOTE\]
This statement is you speculating
The doctrine says that the three are coequal, almighty, and uncreated, having existed eternally in the Godhead. This doctrine I have not found in scripture nowhere.[/QUOTE\]
christ4Me said :
Mayhap because the co equal as inferring that each is God is throwing that reading off in scripture.[/QUOTE\]
This statement is you speculating
christ4Me said :
Mayhap because the co equal as inferring that each is God is throwing that reading off in scripture.
Speculating on the Trinitarians for how they were applying co-equal to the Three Persons within the One God per their Trinitarian doctrine.
Per your quote, you were addressing Trinitarians in regards to their teaching about the co-equal of each 3 Persons of the Godhead.
I had applied scripture to reprove them that there is a higher authority within the One Godhead as the Father's will shall be done even though each Person is God & this in turn reproves your doctrine in post #35 as there cannot be a One Person God and thereby you are not to deny the deity of Jesus Christ and the Third Witness of the Holy Spirit within that One God.
How God Can Witness & Judge Anyone?
Ask yourself this; why is Jesus Christ at that throne of grace to pray to unless He is God? even the heathens knows you only pray to a deity.[/QUOTE]
@BARNEY BRIGHT
I used to believe that only the Son is the King of kings but since in the end He will be giving back the kingdom to the Father is why He is also King of kings. It makes sense to me in how the King can judge any one because there are Two Witnesses as that King.
Jesus said that the Father judges no one in John 5:22 and has render all judgment unto the Son. So although the Son is submissive to the Father's will, the Son has His permission to have the authority to judge as the Father's will be done for why the Father would be in agreement.
As of now, all power has been given unto the Son per Matthew 28:18 for why the Holy Spirit is known as the Spirit of Christ in all that the Spirit say or do is to testify of the Son thru us ( John 15:26-27 ) to glorify the Son ( John 16:14 ).
Although Jesus is the Head of the Church & running things with authority, it is in according to the Father's will. That makes the Son's authority equal to the Father's authority in all that the Son do and say only because the Son is performing according to the Father's will.
So not clearly a "no" when the Son has the authority of the Father in the performance of His Father's will.
I used to believe that only the Son is the King of kings but since in the end He will be giving back the kingdom to the Father is why He is also King of kings. It makes sense to me in how the King can judge any one because there are Two Witnesses as that King.
Jesus said that the Father judges no one in John 5:22 and has render all judgment unto the Son. So although the Son is submissive to the Father's will, the Son has His permission to have the authority to judge as the Father's will be done for why the Father would be in agreement.
As of now, all power has been given unto the Son per Matthew 28:18 for why the Holy Spirit is known as the Spirit of Christ in all that the Spirit say or do is to testify of the Son thru us ( John 15:26-27 ) to glorify the Son ( John 16:14 ).
Although Jesus is the Head of the Church & running things with authority, it is in according to the Father's will. That makes the Son's authority equal to the Father's authority in all that the Son do and say only because the Son is performing according to the Father's will.
So not clearly a "no" when the Son has the authority of the Father in the performance of His Father's will.
BARNEY BRIGHT
Well-Known Member
[/QUOTE]
As I said there's no evidence in the scriptures of a Trinity Doctrine, of three persons in a Godhead. Whenever someone starts talking of the Trinity Doctrine they leave scripture and are using theology and philosophy when speaking of the Trinity.
GRACE ambassador
Well-Known Member
Incorrect; some of use ALL Of God's Word Of TRUTH; NOT leaving IT!:
"Complete" Case FOR The Triune GodHead!!
BARNEY BRIGHT
Well-Known Member
I shall pray for you BARNEY BRIGHT. Only God can cause the increase for you to see the truth in His words. More than likely your church's teachings is getting in the way of you see other scriptures that opposes what it is you have been taught by scripture not rightly divided since it does not align with the truth as plainly written in His words elsewhere in scripture.
BARNEY BRIGHT
Well-Known Member
The Trinity Doctrine isn't in the scriptures. In the Bible I have seen no scripture or combination of scriptures that say there are three persons in a Godhead. In fact when it comes to the Greek term, to thei'on translated Godhead in some Bibles, to thei'on translated as Divine Being is a more accurate translation of the Greek term, to thei'on according to the context of Acts 17:29 since the person of God is being described, in other words the True God is a Divine Being and its illogical for humans to imagine that he is like silver or gold or stone.
At Romans 1:20 instead of translating the Greek term, thei•o'tes as Godhead as some Bibles do I think translating it as Godship is more accurate and goes along with the context. Those Bibles translating thei•o'tes as Godhead are trying to convey the idea of personality, the state of being a person. However the Greek term thei•o'tes here in Romans 1:20 is referring to the quality of being a god not the person of God. In other words Romans 1:20 is discussing things that are discernible in the physical creation such as Gods eternal power and Godship.
Also at Colossians 2:9 where some Bibles translate thei•o'tes as Godhead its more accurate to translate thei•o'tes as
There's no trinity Doctrine in the scriptures. That's not going to change. I understand that other human beings have the right to believe and express what they believe to be true, but that doesn't necessarily mean what they believe is true, it just means they have the right to believe what they choose to believe is true and express that belief. You and I disagree when it comes to what the truth is in the scriptures. You haven't shown me the Trinity Doctrine in the scriptures. Noone has shown me where Gods Holy Spirit inspired men to write down any Trinity Doctrine, you and anyone else can think of me however you want, but I don't follow imperfect human beings and their interpretation of the scriptures, which is all Trinitarian are teaching is their interpretation of scripture. Do they have the right to their interpretation of scripture and to express that? Yes, but it's only trinitarians expressing their interpretation of scripture. Other people will agree with them or not agree with them. I'm going to continue to disagree with them because as I said, the Holy Spirit didn't inspire men to write down any Trinity Doctrine.
I had such questions as a Roman Catholic and sitting under dogma rather than sound doctrine.
However, Christ resolves all such misunderstandings (through His teaching) when you receive His Holy Spirit by believing His promises, submitting to His word, and praying in faith for His control over your life.
You must believe to receive and if you doubt, expect nothing from the Lord.
Ah yes, this is the dividing line for the cults, but scripture teaches quite plainly that Jesus created all things. The Jehovah's Witnesses were troubled by this verse and changed it in their corrupted translation to read "all other things". So the JWs, who say that they believe in one God, actually believe in at least two creators. It's dumb founding how anyone can recognize multiple creators and believe in one God, but when you don't have a sane mind it's possible to believe anything. This is what scripture calls "strong delusion" because it defies reason (strong delusion defies reason.)The Father judges no one, but has given all judgement to the Son
then get tryna Quote that imo, that you may come to see how untrue that is
there are no “persons” in Yah wadr, unless you can Quote that?
There is only One Immortal, Who dwells alone in unapproachable light
i think it is?
The old testament also has God saying through the prophets:
I, even I, am the Lord,
And besides Me there is no savior. Isaiah 43:11
I don't know if the New Word corruption changed this verse (the JW founders weren't clever enough to even see all the testimony of Jesus Christ in the old testament), but every Jehovah's witness that acknowledges Jesus as Savior falls into the logical fallacy that there are two saviors (as a child without His Spirit, that verse from Isaiah gave me doubts that the cults embraced.)
If you read scripture literally and limited to a carnal understanding, you'll find quite a few apparent contradictions. However, our God is not a god of confusion. He's not a liar. He doesn't change His testimony or His mind. He resolves all the contradictions perceived in the carnal mind by teaching us through the same Holy Spirit that inspired the writers of scripture, when we believe Him and receive Jesus Christ as Lord by faith, receive His Spirit, and believe His teaching.
All the cults exist as the result of carnal reasoning and disbelief in the Lord, Jesus the Christ.
Still, we can pray for others that God will help them see the truth in His words.
Of course we can, and we can do so in confidence because such prayer is according to His will. God makes no promise to answer prayer outside His will, but there is always power in prayer that is aligned with His will and in believing that you have received His promise. Not every answer to prayer is yes, but all of His promises are "yes" in Christ.
Knowing and believing that from His word is power indeed, and if necessary, puts to shame those who are in error.
I've even heard fervent prayer to harass, to make sleepless, to convict, and even incarcerate an errant child or believer, in order that God's discipline correct them and restore them to the path of righteousness. These prayers made in faith and according to God's word were proven effective.
28 And we know that all things work together for good to those who love God, to those who are the called according to His purpose. Romans 8:28
Our church saw a troubled son incarcerated, eventually released, and restored to the fellowship all through the power of prayer. Such lessons are hard learned, but rebellion is more the norm in the human experience than obedience.
We are, after all, sinners by our first nature.
Thanks for sharing.
One thing I have come across this is why sinners do not come to Jesus because they believe they have to clean up their lives first before coming to Him. In actuality, we are habitual sinners before a sinner is saved and so whenever the gospel is preached, it should be known that Jesus Christ came into the world to save sinners from their sins and not just give them eternal life & all they need to do is believe in Him to do that daily after having been saved by Him for believing in Him.
So when they cannot find it in themselves to repent from all sins in coming to Jesus, it is because they need Jesus Christ in them first to be able to do so. Therefore the only repentance required for sinners at the onset is to repent from unbelief by believing in Him for the remission of sins and thereby receive the gift of the Holy Ghost at their born again of the Spirit moment of salvation & now with Him in us, we can run that ace daily looking to Him to help us lay aside every weight & sin in walking in the light in fellowship with the Father & the Son.
BARNEY BRIGHT
Well-Known Member
I've already stated to you too many times to count that I don't believe Jesus Christ to be God but instead I believe him to be the Only Begotten Son of God. If you can't understand that clear statement from me that's your fault, but I have made myself very clear.
Just getting a start off point for this rebuttal below for how Jesus is the Lord Jehovah that appeared unto men in the O.T. scriptures.
John 1:18 No man hath seen God at any time, the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him.
John 6:46 Not that any man hath seen the Father, save he which is of God, he hath seen the Father.
Although Jesus testified above that no man had seen God the Father at any time, but He did as God because He was from above and not of the earth as other men were.
John 8:23 And he said unto them, Ye are from beneath; I am from above: ye are of this world; I am not of this world. 24 I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins.
You should heed that warning, brother.
Jesus said that scriptures testify of Himself and that Moses had written specifically about Himself.
John 5:39 Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me. 40 And ye will not come to me, that ye might have life....
46 For had ye believed Moses, ye would have believed me; for he wrote of me. 47 But if ye believe not his writings, how shall ye believe my words?
Scriptural proof that the Lord Jesus is that Jehovah that had spoken to Moses for why Jesus Christ had said, Moses had written of Himself as the God named Jehovah in the scriptures for having appeared to Abraham, Isaac, & Jacob that men had seen in the O.T. .
Exodus 6:1Then the Lord said unto Moses, Now shalt thou see what I will do to Pharaoh: for with a strong hand shall he let them go, and with a strong hand shall he drive them out of his land. 2 And God spake unto Moses, and said unto him, I am the Lord: 3 And I appeared unto Abraham, unto Isaac, and unto Jacob, by the name of God Almighty, but by my name Jehovah was I not known to them. 4 And I have also established my covenant with them, to give them the land of Canaan, the land of their pilgrimage, wherein they were strangers.
Jesus said Abraham had seen Him in His day before His incarnation as the prophesied Son of Man.
John 8:56 Your father Abraham rejoiced to see my day: and he saw it, and was glad. 57 Then said the Jews unto him, Thou art not yet fifty years old, and hast thou seen Abraham? 58 Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am. 59 Then took they up stones to cast at him: but Jesus hid himself, and went out of the temple, going through the midst of them, and so passed by.
The Lord appeared to Abraham in Genesis 12:7, Genesis 17:1, & Genesis 18:1-8 was when He did eat & drank what Abraham had prepared for Him.
The Lord appeared to Isaac in Genesis 26:1-2 & Genesis 26:24
The Lord appeared to Jacob & they had wrestled face to face & Jacob still lived for why Jacob had called that place Penuel in verse 30 of Genesis 32:24-30
The Lord appeared to Moses in Exodus 3:2, Exodus 3:15-17, Exodus 4:1-8 & Exodus 6:1-4
This is why Jesus is the Lord Jehovah that men has seen in the O.T. & not the Father.
By addressing His deity in scripture, may lead you to reconsider the existence of the Three witnesses within the One God by reading this prophesy below in how the Lord Our Redeemer is speaking and yet the Lord God & His Spirit sent Him.
Isaiah 48:16 Come ye near unto me, hear ye this; I have not spoken in secret from the beginning; from the time that it was, there am I: and now the Lord God, and his Spirit, hath sent me. 17 Thus saith the Lord, thy Redeemer, the Holy One of Israel; I am the Lord thy God which teacheth thee to profit, which leadeth thee by the way that thou shouldest go.
Only God can help you see the truth in His words because you do not seem to be clearly reading His words.
BARNEY BRIGHT
Well-Known Member
Christ4Me said:
John 1:18-No man hath seen God at any time, the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him.
John 6:46- Not that any man hath seen the Father, save he which is of God, he hath seen the Father.
Although Jesus testified above that no man had seen God the Father at any time, but He did as God because He was from above and not of the earth as other men were.[/QUOTE\]
I agree with the scriptures that say the Only Begotten Son of God is from heaven, that he existed in heaven before he became human. What I disagree with is how people interpret certain scriptures to try to prove that this person who is the Only Begotten Son of God and who was in heaven before he became human and was given the name Jesus when he became human is the same person as God(ho the•os)[YHWH]. It should be noted that the greek word "[the•os'] and [ho the•os']were not the same thing in this period when John originally was inspired to write his gospel. For the apostle John, only the Father was 'God' [ho the•os](YHWH) John shows us this at John 17:3. John always showed that the Only Begotten Son of God is subordinate to God(ho the•os)[YHWH]. So God(ho the•os) is YHWH he is the Father and God of Jesus Christ.(John 20:17) It should also be noted concerning John 1:1 that this text says that the Word was with God(ho the•os)[YHWH], this part of John 1:1 isn't saying that the Word is God (ho the•os)[YHWH].The second part of John 1:1 doesn't contradict the first part that says the Word was with God(ho the•os)[YHWH] and verse 2 of John chapter 1 would be completely unnecessary if John was inspired to write that The Word was God(ho the•os)[YHWH]. At John 1:18 the most reliable manuscripts translate this scripture as, "No man has seen God(ho the•os)[YHWH] at anytime the only-begotten god who is at the Father side is the one who has explained him. "God or "ho the•os" is "YHWH" and is Jesus Christ Father and God. This is the point I keep saying is what the scriptures show that God or ho the•os or YHWH is the Father and God of Jesus Christ. The scriptures don't show that Jesus is God or ho the•os or YHWH. So John 6:46 is saying that Jesus is YHWH because the scriptures make it clear that the Father and God of Jesus is YHWH.
Christ4Me said:
John 8:23-And he said unto them, Ye are from beneath; I am from above: ye are of this world; I am not of this world. 24 I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins.[/QUOTE\]
As I said I understand that the Only Begotten Son of God existed in heaven before coming to mankind as a human. However 1John 4:9-11shows us that the person who came from heaven and became a human named Jesus, that before he became human he was said to be the Only Begotten Son of God, not "ho the•os or YHWH." This is confirmed by Jesus himself when he says at John 8:38,42 and John 17:5,24 and other clear statements in scripture God inspired other apostles to write down such as Romans 8:3; Galatians 4:4; 1John 4:9-11. The scriptures don't show that Jesus is YHWH(ho the•os).
Christ4Me said:
Jesus said Abraham had seen Him in His day before His incarnation as the prophesied Son of Man.
John 8:56 Your father Abraham rejoiced to see my day: and he saw it, and was glad. 57 Then said the Jews unto him, Thou art not yet fifty years old, and hast thou seen Abraham? 58 Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am. 59 Then took they up stones to cast at him: but Jesus hid himself, and went out of the temple, going through the midst of them, and so passed by.[/QUOTE\]
You have excluded John 8:54 where Jesus said that, "If I glorify myself, my glory is nothing. It is my Father who glorifies me, the one who you say is your God." Anyone knows that the one these Jews claimed to worship was God(ho the•os)[YHWH] so Jesus wasn't claiming to be "ho the•os or YHWH," but that it was YHWH(ho the•os) that glorifies him. It is the Father and God of Jesus who is "ho the•os or YHWH." So you using John 8:56-59 to try to prove that Jesus is saying he's YHWH or ho the•os I disagree with what you're saying, these scriptures don't say that Jesus was saying he was "ho the•os or YHWH."
Christ4Me said:
The Lord appeared to Moses in Exodus 3:2, Exodus 3:15-17, Exodus 4:1-8 & Exodus 6:1-4[/QUOTE\]
The scripturalness of an invisible presence is borne out by YHWH God saying to Moses regarding the ark of the covenant in the Most Holy of the Tabernacle: "and I will present myself to you there and speak with you from above the cover."(Exodus 25:22) This scripture isn't saying that God appeared to Moses in a visible form, since the scriptures are clear that, " no man has seen God at any time"- neither Moses nor the high priest who entered the Most Holy (John 1:18; Exodus 33:20)
We have to keep such scriptures as 1kings 8:10-13, 27-30 and Acts 7:45-50 in mind too. YHWH wasn't literally in the temple, no one literally saw YHWH, but his attention was toward that temple at Jerusalem.
These scriptures show us that YHWH power to be present on earth in a spiritual way therefore invisible while he yet remains in heaven. His presence might in some cases be by means of an angelic representative who acted and spoke for YHWH, the angel even saying, "I am the God of your father," as an angel did in the flaming bush who spoke to Moses.(Exodus 3:2-8; Exodus 23:20; 32:34)
YHWH told Moses that he was "coming" to him at Mount Sinai and would "come down" there(Exodus 19:9, 11, 18, 20), yet the apostolic writings show that it was actually by his angels that YHWH was there present and delivered to Moses his covenant. Galatians 3:19; Hebrews 2:2
The Apostles and disciples of Jesus were familiar with accounts which individuals or at times the Bible writer of the account, responded to or spoke of an angelic messenger as though he were YHWH God.(Genesis 16:7-11, 13; 18:1-5, 22-23; 32:24-30; Judges 6:11-15; 13:20-22.) We must understand that these were angelic representatives of YHWH not literally YHWH himself.
None of these scriptures contradict the fact that it's the Father and God of Jesus who is YHWH.
The one thing you consistently show is that you don't believe or have faith that God has a Only Begotten Son who he used to create through him not only the rest of creation into existence but in using his Only Begotten Son to undo all the things that the angel who became Satan has caused when he rebelled and got others, humans and other angels to join him in his rebellion.
John 1:18-No man hath seen God at any time, the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him.
John 6:46- Not that any man hath seen the Father, save he which is of God, he hath seen the Father.
Although Jesus testified above that no man had seen God the Father at any time, but He did as God because He was from above and not of the earth as other men were.[/QUOTE\]
I agree with the scriptures that say the Only Begotten Son of God is from heaven, that he existed in heaven before he became human. What I disagree with is how people interpret certain scriptures to try to prove that this person who is the Only Begotten Son of God and who was in heaven before he became human and was given the name Jesus when he became human is the same person as God(ho the•os)[YHWH]. It should be noted that the greek word "[the•os'] and [ho the•os']were not the same thing in this period when John originally was inspired to write his gospel. For the apostle John, only the Father was 'God' [ho the•os](YHWH) John shows us this at John 17:3. John always showed that the Only Begotten Son of God is subordinate to God(ho the•os)[YHWH]. So God(ho the•os) is YHWH he is the Father and God of Jesus Christ.(John 20:17) It should also be noted concerning John 1:1 that this text says that the Word was with God(ho the•os)[YHWH], this part of John 1:1 isn't saying that the Word is God (ho the•os)[YHWH].The second part of John 1:1 doesn't contradict the first part that says the Word was with God(ho the•os)[YHWH] and verse 2 of John chapter 1 would be completely unnecessary if John was inspired to write that The Word was God(ho the•os)[YHWH]. At John 1:18 the most reliable manuscripts translate this scripture as, "No man has seen God(ho the•os)[YHWH] at anytime the only-begotten god who is at the Father side is the one who has explained him. "God or "ho the•os" is "YHWH" and is Jesus Christ Father and God. This is the point I keep saying is what the scriptures show that God or ho the•os or YHWH is the Father and God of Jesus Christ. The scriptures don't show that Jesus is God or ho the•os or YHWH. So John 6:46 is saying that Jesus is YHWH because the scriptures make it clear that the Father and God of Jesus is YHWH.
Christ4Me said:
John 8:23-And he said unto them, Ye are from beneath; I am from above: ye are of this world; I am not of this world. 24 I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins.[/QUOTE\]
As I said I understand that the Only Begotten Son of God existed in heaven before coming to mankind as a human. However 1John 4:9-11shows us that the person who came from heaven and became a human named Jesus, that before he became human he was said to be the Only Begotten Son of God, not "ho the•os or YHWH." This is confirmed by Jesus himself when he says at John 8:38,42 and John 17:5,24 and other clear statements in scripture God inspired other apostles to write down such as Romans 8:3; Galatians 4:4; 1John 4:9-11. The scriptures don't show that Jesus is YHWH(ho the•os).
Christ4Me said:
Jesus said Abraham had seen Him in His day before His incarnation as the prophesied Son of Man.
John 8:56 Your father Abraham rejoiced to see my day: and he saw it, and was glad. 57 Then said the Jews unto him, Thou art not yet fifty years old, and hast thou seen Abraham? 58 Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am. 59 Then took they up stones to cast at him: but Jesus hid himself, and went out of the temple, going through the midst of them, and so passed by.[/QUOTE\]
You have excluded John 8:54 where Jesus said that, "If I glorify myself, my glory is nothing. It is my Father who glorifies me, the one who you say is your God." Anyone knows that the one these Jews claimed to worship was God(ho the•os)[YHWH] so Jesus wasn't claiming to be "ho the•os or YHWH," but that it was YHWH(ho the•os) that glorifies him. It is the Father and God of Jesus who is "ho the•os or YHWH." So you using John 8:56-59 to try to prove that Jesus is saying he's YHWH or ho the•os I disagree with what you're saying, these scriptures don't say that Jesus was saying he was "ho the•os or YHWH."
Christ4Me said:
The Lord appeared to Moses in Exodus 3:2, Exodus 3:15-17, Exodus 4:1-8 & Exodus 6:1-4[/QUOTE\]
The scripturalness of an invisible presence is borne out by YHWH God saying to Moses regarding the ark of the covenant in the Most Holy of the Tabernacle: "and I will present myself to you there and speak with you from above the cover."(Exodus 25:22) This scripture isn't saying that God appeared to Moses in a visible form, since the scriptures are clear that, " no man has seen God at any time"- neither Moses nor the high priest who entered the Most Holy (John 1:18; Exodus 33:20)
We have to keep such scriptures as 1kings 8:10-13, 27-30 and Acts 7:45-50 in mind too. YHWH wasn't literally in the temple, no one literally saw YHWH, but his attention was toward that temple at Jerusalem.
These scriptures show us that YHWH power to be present on earth in a spiritual way therefore invisible while he yet remains in heaven. His presence might in some cases be by means of an angelic representative who acted and spoke for YHWH, the angel even saying, "I am the God of your father," as an angel did in the flaming bush who spoke to Moses.(Exodus 3:2-8; Exodus 23:20; 32:34)
YHWH told Moses that he was "coming" to him at Mount Sinai and would "come down" there(Exodus 19:9, 11, 18, 20), yet the apostolic writings show that it was actually by his angels that YHWH was there present and delivered to Moses his covenant. Galatians 3:19; Hebrews 2:2
The Apostles and disciples of Jesus were familiar with accounts which individuals or at times the Bible writer of the account, responded to or spoke of an angelic messenger as though he were YHWH God.(Genesis 16:7-11, 13; 18:1-5, 22-23; 32:24-30; Judges 6:11-15; 13:20-22.) We must understand that these were angelic representatives of YHWH not literally YHWH himself.
None of these scriptures contradict the fact that it's the Father and God of Jesus who is YHWH.
The one thing you consistently show is that you don't believe or have faith that God has a Only Begotten Son who he used to create through him not only the rest of creation into existence but in using his Only Begotten Son to undo all the things that the angel who became Satan has caused when he rebelled and got others, humans and other angels to join him in his rebellion.
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