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Yes.
But is my quote you posted saying....>"unbelievers will be in Heaven"?
Its does not say that, deceiver.
My QUOTE says that the BORN AGAIN.......are in Heaven......even if they lose their faith on earth.
So, are the born again. "unbelievers"?
Really fella, you have to get your thinking together, as you are lost in your own carnal foolishness, at this point.
Twisting your own words.
You teach born again christians can later loose their faith become unbelievers and still be saved,
You know you can convince some if you tell the same lie over and over,
John 8:44
What you said is actually your misinterpretation of Paul's teaching that a believer can "fall from Grace".
Titus .... If you own a bible, you should study Galatians.....and find out what "falling from Grace", means.
I dont think you will, as you are too compulsive in your need to try to argue your personal theology on this forum.
So, here is the teaching.
A born again believer can "fall from Grace".
This means they have lost faith in Christ, and have become "under the law", and "in the Flesh".
Their faith in Christ, is gone, and they have become a LEGALIST.
A Legalist, can be a born again believer, whose faith in Christ has become broken, ruined, and dead.
They will go to heaven when they die, even tho they are faith ruined.
Why?
Because they are born again........as i keep explaining to you, Titus.
there must be the outward sign!
Ez 36:25
eph 2 he quickend us or brought us to life
Thru baptism
Gal 3:27
A sacrament is an outward sign for all men including infants And a gift from God to help us see what he does inwardly and invisibly by his grace!
As grace Washes our souls in the merits of Jesus blood from original and personal sin, so the outward action of washing is visible!
without the outward action the inward action cannot take place!
Jn 3:5 Titus 3:5 water and washing
acts 22:16 wash away your sin!
Jn 3:5 Born again BY water and the spirit! Not by “faith alone”!
They did not go to Jerusalem and preach “accept Christ as you’re personal Lord and savior “
They went to the river (water) and they baptized! Jn 3:22
A covenant requires an outward sign of the inward action of grace!
Ez 36:25 I will sprinkle you with clean water and you shall be made white as snow.
Acts 22:16 washing away your sins.
1 pet 3:21 baptism saves you.
Baptism!
God breathed life into Adam, gen 2:7 and we received this life from our fathers!
Christ breathed on the apostles our spiritual fathers, we receive the new covenant life of God’s grace from them thru faith & baptism! Jn 20:21-23 Mk 16:16 acts 8:36-38 eph 2
Born again! Born from above!
'The Father has set his seal' on Christ (John 6:27) and also seals us in him (cf. 2 Corinthians 1:22; Ephesians 1:23, 4:30). Because this seal indicates the indelible effect of the anointing with the Holy Spirit in the sacrament of Baptism,
Baptism indeed is the seal of eternal life." 87 The faithful Christian who I has "kept the seal" until the end, remaining faithful to the demands of his Baptism, will be able to depart this life "marked with the sign of faith," 88 with his baptismal faith, in expectation of the blessed vision of God - the consummation of faith - and in the hope of resurrection.
St. Paul tells the faithful at Ephesus that they have been “sealed with the promised Holy Spirit.” This is in terms of an indelible character imprinted on the soul in the sacraments of baptism and confirmation. It is not as if this invisible mark is simply decorative. Rather, through it, we are enabled to participate in Christ’s mission and in his offices of priest, prophet, and king. Eph 1:13
Sealed by God eph 1:13 sealed by God (ez 36:25-27) in the ark of salvation by baptism just as Noah was sealed by God in the ark of the flood gen 7:16
1 Pet 3:20 Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water.
21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us!
(Ark of Noah a type of the church, member of Christ and his church and salvation by baptism!)
(Outside the ark of Noah none were saved, outside the church (the ark of salvation) none are saved!)
Sealed in the ark, sealed in the church the ark of salvation by God thru baptism!
Effects of baptism!
Faith and baptism accomplish justification
With these effects:
born again Jn 3:5
New creation in Christ 2 cor 5:17
Passed from death to life 2 Tim 1:10
Out of the kingdom of darkness into the kingdom of light 1 pet 2:9
All sins (original and personal) washed away acts 22:16
Washed in Christ’s blood 1 pet 1:2
Member of Christ and His church
1 cor 12:13
Put on Christ gal 3:27
Died with Christ rom 6:3
Risen with Christ col 2:12
Sealed by God in the ark of salvation 1 pet 3:20-21
Sealed with the Holy Spirit eph 1:13
And none by “faith alone”!
“Faith alone”
Questions
where does scripture says we have died with Christ by “faith alone”?
Rom 6:3 Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?
where does scripture say we are members of Christ and his church by “faith alone”?
1 Corinthians 12:13
For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.
where does scripture says we put on Christ by “faith alone”?
Galatians 3:27
For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
Where does scripture say our sins are washed away by “faith alone”?
Acts 22:16
And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.
where does scripture say we are saved or justified by “faith alone”?
1 pet 3:21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us!
The only reference in scripture to “faith alone” is James 2:24 NOT BY “FAITH ALONE”?
Jn 3:5 born again by faith alone?
Where is “Accept Christ as your personal lord & savior” is not found in scripture?
They did not go preaching this line but went immediately to the river and baptized Jn 3:22
Acts 22:16
And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.
1 Corinthians 12:13
For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.
Galatians 3:27
For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
Eph 4:5 one baptism
Why don’t it say one teeny tiny little act of “faith alone”???
When we first believed we are saved?
Romans 13:11
And that, knowing the time, that now it is high time to awake out of sleep: for now is our salvation nearer than when we believed.
I asked you not to post excessively long "cut and paste" statements.
Would you not do this anymore on my Threads?
2nd time ive asked you, theefaith.
Infants cannot be scripturally baptized because they do not quality for the gospel,
Mark 16:15-16.
The first qualification to be baptized is one must have faith!
Mark 16:15-16.
The first qualification to be baptized is one must have faith!
amigo de christo
Well-Known Member
Its all he does , he has to go to info already available cause like most folks he dont truly know the scrips for himself .
amigo de christo
Well-Known Member
My advice is we better get glued in the bible for ourselves . cause i am seeing some outright scary things getting told .
No one who returns to unbelief will be saved peroid . They will be told depart from me i never knew you .
Why on earth would anyone encourage such a dangerous lie . WHEN in truth the true apostels , as well as Christ
were adamant about enduring to the END . Who on earth would teach one can believe but later fall away and still be saved .
That is blasphemous and it encourages certain death .
We are told by paul and others , IF YE HOLD , IF YE CONTINUE . Folks open bibles and learn bibles
AND if the WORD IF appears , BELIEVE what follows that IF . Its all for our own good that we heed all things they did teach .
No one who returns to unbelief will be saved peroid . They will be told depart from me i never knew you .
Why on earth would anyone encourage such a dangerous lie . WHEN in truth the true apostels , as well as Christ
were adamant about enduring to the END . Who on earth would teach one can believe but later fall away and still be saved .
That is blasphemous and it encourages certain death .
We are told by paul and others , IF YE HOLD , IF YE CONTINUE . Folks open bibles and learn bibles
AND if the WORD IF appears , BELIEVE what follows that IF . Its all for our own good that we heed all things they did teach .
I understand.
I see this on many forums over the years... you have someone who wants to be a teacher, so, they think...
"Ok, if i post 300 verses, then that proves i know what im talking about".
Actually, it proves that you can cut and paste from a site or from a commentary, which proves you are not a teacher.
A real teacher opens the verse.......vs, just posting them, and saying...."see there, gotcha".
Too many playing "gotcha" on Forums..
In fact, what ive noticed over the years, is that the most carnal people, feel that when they are attacking another person, this is the "holy spirit".
So, that's pretty scary, as to feel that its the HS leading you to be mocking, and tactless......... is not a good thing.
Debate is good.
Arguments are going to happen, but, hatefulness, and false accusation, the personal kind, is DEVIL INSPIRED.
Thats a fact.
If the person is born again, then how they feel on any given day, or what they thought , 15 mins ago, has no impact on the New Birth.
Listen.....going to heaven, is not based on how you THINK today.
Its based on God performing the NEW BIRTH of your SPIRIT, when you gave God your faith..
Faith is not the Savior.
faith is not the Savior.
God is the Savior... .who took you faith ONCE.....ONE TIME......when you trusted in Christ, and God gave you "the righteousness of God, in Christ"
= BORN AGAIN.
And THAT, is why you will go to heaven, as that is why you are already there.... "seated in Heavenly places in Christ".
So, you must stop BELIEVING that you keep yourself saved by FAITH.
You do not.
God keeps you saved by the BLOOD OF JESUS, and by causing you to become a "new Creation In Christ".
So, get you FAITH in Christ, and stop trusting IN FAITH.
amigo de christo
Well-Known Member
So get faith in Christ who said YE must continue to the end . My trust in faith is IN THE LORD .
if something is not possible it’s not required!
Refer to ez 36:25 this promise
Acts 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
39 For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.
to your children!
God calls all!
Lk 2:10-11 a savior for all!
Who says little ones can’t believe?
Matt 19:14 But Jesus said, Suffer little children, and forbid them not, to come unto me: for of such is the kingdom of heaven.
Matthew 18:6
But whoso shall offend one of these little ones which believe in me, it were better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and that he were drowned in the depth of the sea.
Acts 16:15 entire household baptized! Does not say except infants!
1 Corinthians 12:13
For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit. (It does not say except infants!) (but it does say “all”)!
amigo de christo
Well-Known Member
What is the title of this thread again . My advice is dont follow popes nor any other dangerous false teacher .
Cause that is exactly how one is led astray . Pick up bibles and learn That doctrine well .
Cause that is exactly how one is led astray . Pick up bibles and learn That doctrine well .
Continue WHAT = To the "end" of what?
The end of the age?
The end of the Great Trib?
I think all of us will continue to the end of our lives, or no?
Here is what God offered so that you can go to heaven.
JESUS on THE CROSS.
Just believe that Christ is the only way to heaven, and let go of Water, Works, Commandments, Mary, and whatever it is you are trying to DO, and instead just TRUST in GOD's GRACE., and you'll be fine, and not only that, God will be well pleased with you.
Carry that logic to its end.
Since babies cannot have faith.
Babies are not required to be baptized.
