I Wake Up, The Girdle Of Truth Is First On! (My spiritual belt)

[Helen]

Seriously, you are judging me to be an alcoholic when I may have about three drinks in a 12month period - Wow , I think those comments say more about you then me !!
You, my friend , have not answered the question I asked - you have skirted around the question yourself.
So, let me get this straight, in your eyes ANYONE who has a drink is drinking because they get a buzz,and because they are an alcoholic........... Wow, I would love to watch you discuss that with Jesus and the apostles !!
As for being a lover of pleasure, are you honestly saying that you never eat or drink anything that you enjoy - and that if you get pleasure out of something it automatically means you are not a lover of the Lord. What a load of rubbish !!!!!
Rita

Good one well said.

I other words he only eat and drinks his bread and water to say alive...but never eats for the pleasure of doing so.

Christmas and thanksgiving must be a barrel of laughs with him!

Very sad view on "life more abundantly".
No killing of any fatted calf in his house. Any pleasure must be a sin...
Legalism to the extreem

Hugs H x

 

[Giuliano]

I love the lyrics to this song.

 

[Nancy]

Good one well said.

I other words he only eat and drinks his bread and water to say alive...but never eats for the pleasure of doing so.

Christmas and thanksgiving must be a barrel of laughs with him!

Very sad view on "life more abundantly".
No killing of any fatted calf in his house. Any pleasure must be a sin...
Legalism to the extreem

Hugs H x

For reals!!! To myself, legalism = bondage. We eat and drink according to our own consciences and our consciences either condemn: Romans 2:15.

 

[justbyfaith]

Good one well said.

I other words he only eat and drinks his bread and water to say alive...but never eats for the pleasure of doing so.

Christmas and thanksgiving must be a barrel of laughs with him!

Very sad view on "life more abundantly".
No killing of any fatted calf in his house. Any pleasure must be a sin...
Legalism to the extreem

Hugs H x

I was merely referencing what it says in the following scripture...

2Ti 3:1, This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come.
2Ti 3:2, For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy,
2Ti 3:3, Without natural affection, trucebreakers, false accusers, incontinent, fierce, despisers of those that are good,
2Ti 3:4, Traitors, heady, highminded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God;
2Ti 3:5, Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.

I am not saying that any pleasure is a sin...but I am saying that any pleasure that you put in front of the Lord in idolatry is a sin.

Unfortunately, many people lie to themselves and tell themselves that things are not an idol when they really are.

A good rule of thumb is that any pleasure you can thank the Lord for is very likely not a sin (can this be said of alcohol?)

 

[Prayer Warrior]

I woke up the other morning and my morning routine usually goes with a little prayer and then I get spiritually dressed for battle. The spiritual belt of truth is my first defensive weapon I put on and then I grab my breastplate, shoes, shield, helmet and sword, all of the spirit.

Ephesians 6:12 For our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the authorities, against the powers of this dark world and against the spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly realms.

I went out to mow the grass in our yard. It usually takes about 2 hours. Half way through, there was this dark cloud of emotions that had been building up and came upon me. There were a few tears. Sometimes, I like to drink a beer or 2 when I cut grass (truth be told). I felt the worst condemnation and thought at first this was coming from God! It depressed me after I finished cutting our yard. I prayed about it and the emotions I was feeling. So, I have bigger strongholds being broken every day, a couple of beer seems petty at this particular time. Later, that day or maybe it was the next day. I cleared all distractions from my mind, prayed again. I only remember one gentle whisper and it wasn't condemnation. It was a loving whisper from the spirit of our Lord Jesus. "This will pass." is what I heard about feeling so emotional and feeling condemned about the beer and cutting grass. The Lord has not yet Convicted me of beer while mowing grass He may in the future, but not now. I was led to a study, by the spirit of Christ in me, "Condemnation vs Conviction!" This has nothing to do about my beer (just used that as my example), some Christians have difficulty with Sugar, Obesity, Lieing, etc. Each one of us has our own earthly experiences and in your walk with the Lord, he and only he will convict you of what he wants to change in you so that you become more Christ like. My true life scenario I just gave is one of many! Welcome to Spiritual Warfare!! I would like to post a link to an eye opener of truth. It has freed me from the dark cloud the evil one tried to place on me the day I was mowing grass and drinking a beer. This is not the only resource I have used when learning the truth about "Condemnation and Conviction." I use many an I read scripture to make sure it is Truth and from our Lord! But take a look at this from desiringgod.org on Condemnation and Conviction. Then go look for other resources on the same subject, pray about it, and KNOW THE TRUTH. Do not let Satan rob you of the truth and take away your joy in your salvation. His goal is to separate us from our Father in Heaven.

The Link

The Devil Cannot Condemn You: How to Kill Accusations with Conviction

I appreciate what the article has to say about condemnation and conviction. Thanks for posting it! I think the writer hit the nail on the head as far as condemnation (which is from the devil) being vague and hopeless, but conviction (which is from the Holy Spirit) being clear and hopeful. That's how I learned years ago to distinguish between the two.

Just wanted to add a word about drinking. When I was a new Christian, the Lord told me not to drink ever. I was having a glass of wine when He spoke this to me. He showed me that I was using alcohol to relax and have peace, but this has to come from the Holy Spirit. He brought Ephesians 5:18 to mind, which says, "And don’t get drunk with wine, which leads to reckless actions, but be filled by the Spirit...." I obeyed what the Lord said to me, and I've never regretted it.

I know that you're not talking about getting drunk, and I'm not condemning Christians who drink, but I have to say that it has been hard at times hearing Christians talk about it flippantly. I think it's important to consider those who have drinking problems or had them in the past and not cause a brother to stumble.

 

[Butterfly]

I have absolutely no problem with those who feel a conviction not to drink, and I equally understand and agree with the passages and wisdom with regards to alcohol - what I have an issue with is the blanket approach that claims everyone who has a drink, including my ' three times a year ' is dependent and an alcoholic. Also I continue to ask the question about Jesus and the apostles having wine - it's not an excuse, or a distraction- it's a genuine question to those who consider all alcholhol wrong. How do you align with what's written in scripture about the miracle and Passover - because the bottom line is you must equally believe Jesus to be wrong as well.
Rita

 

[justbyfaith]

I have absolutely no problem with those who feel a conviction not to drink, and I equally understand and agree with the passages and wisdom with regards to alcohol - what I have an issue with is the blanket approach that claims everyone who has a drink, including my ' three times a year ' is dependent and an alcoholic. Also I continue to ask the question about Jesus and the apostles having wine - it's not an excuse, or a distraction- it's a genuine question to those who consider all alcholhol wrong. How do you align with what's written in scripture about the miracle and Passover - because the bottom line is you must equally believe Jesus to be wrong as well.
Rita

I believe that the fact that Jesus drank wine is too often used by alcoholics to justify their addictions...we need to take the whole Bible into account when we consider this issue.

If you can drink without getting drunk (I define drunk as even getting even a buzz), then more power to you. Of course, if that is the case, I wonder if your alcohol immunity isn't up over excessive drinking.

If, when you drink, you get a buzz; and if you drink in order to get that buzz...then you are in spiritual danger of being taken captive by this deceptive thing called alcohol.

It is better to drink soda than to be captivated by the buzz.

Jesus was and is God...so He is not in danger of having alcohol take control of Him...He drank in order to create a bridge between Himself and lost sinners. If you are a sinful human being then I don't suggest trying the same. It is something that can take you under its power...see 1 Corinthians 6:12.

 

[Butterfly]

You really dont know me just by faith- you are now jumping to the conclusion that if I dont get a buzz it must be down to excessive alcohol intake which has made me immune !
Just for your info, drink makes me depressed and very tired. I did get drunk as a teenager, but hated the after effects. Now , as I have said loads of times, I drink very rarely, by choice x
I do understand what you say about Jesus, but if you are going to use ' all ' of scripture you do have to take into account that jesus never discouraged his disciples to not take wine at the passover - in fact at the last supper he served them.
For me it's about balance and wisdom
I think we will have to agree to disagree on the total abstinence of drink x

 

[Giuliano]

You really dont know me just by faith- you are now jumping to the conclusion that if I dont get a buzz it must be down to excessive alcohol intake which has made me immune !
Just for your info, drink makes me depressed and very tired. I did get drunk as a teenager, but hated the after effects. Now , as I have said loads of times, I drink very rarely, by choice x
I do understand what you say about Jesus, but if you are going to use ' all ' of scripture you do have to take into account that jesus never discouraged his disciples to not take wine at the passover - in fact at the last supper he served them.
For me it's about balance and wisdom
I think we will have to agree to disagree on the total abstinence of drink x

Maybe the French and Italians are more sensible than the British and Americans. Kids get a little wine with their meals. They don't see it as being a forbidden thing or a kick. When they become teens, they don't go get totally blitzed the way some British and American kids do. For one thing, they got introduced to wine by their parents, they're being supervised. If you tell kids wine is an adult thing, they learn how to drink with each other when they hit the age of consent -- or get older kids to buy it for them to drink in secret. Thus there are no adults around to suggest maybe they've had enough and will regret it in the morning.

 

[Prayer Warrior]

Good one well said.

I other words he only eat and drinks his bread and water to say alive...but never eats for the pleasure of doing so.

Christmas and thanksgiving must be a barrel of laughs with him!

Very sad view on "life more abundantly".
No killing of any fatted calf in his house. Any pleasure must be a sin...
Legalism to the extreem

Hugs H x

Hey Helen,

I've been reading inklings that you're having some health problems. I pray that the Lord will touch you in a mighty and loving way that only He can do! May you FEEL His peace and presence throughout this trial.

Blessings,
Deborah

 

[justbyfaith]

I think we will have to agree to disagree on the total abstinence of drink x

I simply feel that for the alcoholic, it is not a good idea to encourage them in the matter; telling them that everyone has liberty to drink in the same way.

Alcoholism may indeed be a genetic disease; and if that be the case, it will hit at random anyone who has it the moment they take their first drink of alcohol.

For the alcoholic, total abstinence is the only option; if they drink even a little it will lead to excess. Ephesians 5:18 tells us that this is simply the nature of alcohol, and that it is not a respecter of persons. The drinking of alcohol simply leads to excess of drinking.

Therefore, if you truly can drink three glasses of alcohol in an entire year, then more power to you. But in my opinion, something is a little bit fishy about that.

 

[Butterfly]

I simply feel that for the alcoholic, it is not a good idea to encourage them in the matter; telling them that everyone has liberty to drink in the same way.

Alcoholism may indeed be a genetic disease; and if that be the case, it will hit at random anyone who has it the moment they take their first drink of alcohol.

For the alcoholic, total abstinence is the only option; if they drink even a little it will lead to excess. Ephesians 5:18 tells us that this is simply the nature of alcohol, and that it is not a respecter of persons. The drinking of alcohol simply leads to excess of drinking.

Therefore, if you truly can drink three glasses of alcohol in an entire year, then more power to you. But in my opinion, something is a little bit fishy about that.

Your opinion is wrong- 100%
I did write a longer response , but then deleted it. Opinion is not truth - my mum only use to drink a few times a year, and I have never seen my dad drunk - my brother doesn't drink either.
Drink is simply not my vice........... Now if we were to discuss food , that would be another story !!
Rita

 

[Giuliano]

Why make a big deal out of it unless it's causing someone problems?

Colossians 2:16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:

Definitely though, if I had a friend who was causing problems for himself and others by drinking too much, I'd try to talk to him about it -- not to condemn him for the drinking but for the excess that was causing him problems. Maybe the answer for him would be to abstain.

 

[Truth]

Speaking of the Law of Moses and "strong drink" reminds me of the passage about tithes. People were told to set aside that produce and/or money, not to give it all to the Temple, but to hold a celebration. Since the Levites didn't inherit land the way others did, they were also to help the Levites celebrate and anyone who was poor. If they lived too far away from the place of celebration, they could sell the produce and then use the cash to buy whatever they wanted. That included strong drink. . . . Somehow the idea of tithing got changed into giving a tenth of your income to a church.

Deuteronomy 14:26 And thou shalt bestow that money for whatsoever thy soul lusteth after, for oxen, or for sheep, or for wine, or for strong drink, or for whatsoever thy soul desireth: and thou shalt eat there before the Lord thy God, and thou shalt rejoice, thou, and thine household. . . .

Your response is correct, So let us put that in perspective, This was only for the Three Pilgrimage Feast's, God knew He created party animals, so It is OK to indulge, in His Presence, three times a Year!! Let us not stumble into being drunkards', Daily!!
Drinking is not the sin, actions derived after to much consumption, leads to sinful acts!
On the day of Pentecost, men accused them of being drunk on new wine, the Greek states, wheat wine!! this would constitute Brandy, or strong drink!
Notice, Peter Said they were not drunk, for it is only the Ninth Hour AM, Now if it were Nine PM, maybe it could be true, Remember Pentecost is also the Feast of Weeks, a Mandatory Pilgrimage Feast, So What ever Their Soul Lusted for is expectable, according to the Law, Sanctified by the LORD!

 

[Truth]

I woke up the other morning and my morning routine usually goes with a little prayer and then I get spiritually dressed for battle. The spiritual belt of truth is my first defensive weapon I put on and then I grab my breastplate, shoes, shield, helmet and sword, all of the spirit.

Ephesians 6:12 For our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the authorities, against the powers of this dark world and against the spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly realms.

I went out to mow the grass in our yard. It usually takes about 2 hours. Half way through, there was this dark cloud of emotions that had been building up and came upon me. There were a few tears. Sometimes, I like to drink a beer or 2 when I cut grass (truth be told). I felt the worst condemnation and thought at first this was coming from God! It depressed me after I finished cutting our yard. I prayed about it and the emotions I was feeling. So, I have bigger strongholds being broken every day, a couple of beer seems petty at this particular time. Later, that day or maybe it was the next day. I cleared all distractions from my mind, prayed again. I only remember one gentle whisper and it wasn't condemnation. It was a loving whisper from the spirit of our Lord Jesus. "This will pass." is what I heard about feeling so emotional and feeling condemned about the beer and cutting grass. The Lord has not yet Convicted me of beer while mowing grass He may in the future, but not now. I was led to a study, by the spirit of Christ in me, "Condemnation vs Conviction!" This has nothing to do about my beer (just used that as my example), some Christians have difficulty with Sugar, Obesity, Lieing, etc. Each one of us has our own earthly experiences and in your walk with the Lord, he and only he will convict you of what he wants to change in you so that you become more Christ like. My true life scenario I just gave is one of many! Welcome to Spiritual Warfare!! I would like to post a link to an eye opener of truth. It has freed me from the dark cloud the evil one tried to place on me the day I was mowing grass and drinking a beer. This is not the only resource I have used when learning the truth about "Condemnation and Conviction." I use many an I read scripture to make sure it is Truth and from our Lord! But take a look at this from desiringgod.org on Condemnation and Conviction. Then go look for other resources on the same subject, pray about it, and KNOW THE TRUTH. Do not let Satan rob you of the truth and take away your joy in your salvation. His goal is to separate us from our Father in Heaven.

The Link

The Devil Cannot Condemn You: How to Kill Accusations with Conviction

I liked your post, So as I had a very awakening, just 3 months Ago. My Wife passed away almost a year ago, and we did drink, But after She left I turned into a deeper indulgence, Daily!
I heard no Voice, But the Conviction was as real as It could be! My Father Woke me Up, I was convicted of the Path I was on, and for Two Days, I was Literally ILL, I mean Sick with Dread, I have not had any Drink since then, But that was for Me!
I consider this a Praise Offering to the Most High, not a condemnation to anyone else, as we all have our weaknesses, The Spirit is willing BUT the FLESH is weak!
Be Blessed

 

[Giuliano]

Your response is correct, So let us put that in perspective, This was only for the Three Pilgrimage Feast's, God knew He created party animals, so It is OK to indulge, in His Presence, three times a Year!! Let us not stumble into being drunkards', Daily!!
Drinking is not the sin, actions derived after to much consumption, leads to sinful acts!
On the day of Pentecost, men accused them of being drunk on new wine, the Greek states, wheat wine!! this would constitute Brandy, or strong drink!
Notice, Peter Said they were not drunk, for it is only the Ninth Hour AM, Now if it were Nine PM, maybe it could be true, Remember Pentecost is also the Feast of Weeks, a Mandatory Pilgrimage Feast, So What ever Their Soul Lusted for is expectable, according to the Law, Sanctified by the LORD!

Purim got added later, of course. How some Jews celebrate that! Jews seldom drink; but some of them really cut loose on Purim. I won't quote a big section of the article but here's a link to it for anyone who's interested.

The Purim Drunk


Rava said: A person is obligated to drink on Purim until he does not know the difference between "cursed be Haman" and "blessed be Mordechai."

The issue of whether and how Rava’s statement should be implemented in practice is a matter of disagreement between various Halachic authorities. The concept of becoming intoxicated on Purim is a legitimate Halachic position, which requires understanding and validation regardless of whether or not it is accepted in practice.

I don't think I could do it. I think I'd pass out before getting that drunk. It discusses how rational thinking is needed to arrange a marriage; but there comes a time when that's no longer needed.

In the cosmic marriage between G‑d and Israel, the intellect is the shadchan. Without it, the relationship could not have been realized. But there comes a point at which the shadchan’s brokering is no longer needed, for something much deeper and truer has taken over. At this point, the shadchan’s continued presence is undesirable, indeed intolerable.

Purim is a wedding at which the shadchan has been shown the door, a feast celebrating the quintessential bond between G‑d and Israel. There are "drunks" at this feast who have achieved a state of cognitive oblivion; but in no other way do they resemble the stereotypical drunk.

You will not see them hurling fists, insults or obscenities at each other, or slobbering over their domestic troubles. You will see outpourings of love to G‑d and to man. You will see pure, unbridled joy.

 

[Truth]

Purim got added later, of course. How some Jews celebrate that! Jews seldom drink; but some of them really cut loose on Purim. I won't quote a big section of the article but here's a link to it for anyone who's interested.

The Purim Drunk


Rava said: A person is obligated to drink on Purim until he does not know the difference between "cursed be Haman" and "blessed be Mordechai."

The issue of whether and how Rava’s statement should be implemented in practice is a matter of disagreement between various Halachic authorities. The concept of becoming intoxicated on Purim is a legitimate Halachic position, which requires understanding and validation regardless of whether or not it is accepted in practice.

I don't think I could do it. I think I'd pass out before getting that drunk. It discusses how rational thinking is needed to arrange a marriage; but there comes a time when that's no longer needed.

In the cosmic marriage between G‑d and Israel, the intellect is the shadchan. Without it, the relationship could not have been realized. But there comes a point at which the shadchan’s brokering is no longer needed, for something much deeper and truer has taken over. At this point, the shadchan’s continued presence is undesirable, indeed intolerable.

Purim is a wedding at which the shadchan has been shown the door, a feast celebrating the quintessential bond between G‑d and Israel. There are "drunks" at this feast who have achieved a state of cognitive oblivion; but in no other way do they resemble the stereotypical drunk.

You will not see them hurling fists, insults or obscenities at each other, or slobbering over their domestic troubles. You will see outpourings of love to G‑d and to man. You will see pure, unbridled joy.

Just Curious! Is this taken from Rabbinical Sources?

 

[Giuliano]

Just Curious! Is this taken from Rabbinical Sources?

It is but Rava was a rabbi in the late Third and early Fourth Centuries.

Rava - (circa 4038- 4112)

Rava (amora) - Wikipedia

 

[Helen]

Hey Helen,

I've been reading inklings that you're having some health problems. I pray that the Lord will touch you in a mighty and loving way that only He can do! May you FEEL His peace and presence throughout this trial.

Blessings,
Deborah

True.
Its been on ongoing battle for two months now...the doctor and the spine clinic feel it is something in my neck or spine which is causing the 24/7 headaches. Some days I can 'come over it', and some days it just overcomes me...( today being one of these days. )

But, one day at a time...
Thank you for the blessing... x

 

[Truth]

It is but Rava was a rabbi in the late Third and early Fourth Centuries.

Rava - (circa 4038- 4112)

Rava (amora) - Wikipedia

I do not put much stock in Rabbinical Commentary!
I have followed Rabbinical Torah Portions, and read their Commentary on said subject's in the Torah, rarely did I find that they were very accurate in their statements, and even silly at time's!
Mostly just the Opinions of Men!