If you found you were in the wrong faith, would you change?

[Marine0311]

No need for further discussion on this Ron, the 144k is a Biblical fact, and they are humans that have been selected to rule with Christ, if you disagree fine, but that is my teaching and opinion sir.

Rev 7:9 - After this I beheld, and, lo,a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds,and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb,clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands;
Rev 7:10 - And cried with a loud voice, saying, Salvation to our God which sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb.
Rev 7:11 - And all the angels stood round about the throne, and about the elders and the four beasts, and fellbefore the throne on their faces, andworshipped God,
Rev 7:12 - Saying, Amen: Blessing,and glory, and wisdom, andthanksgiving, and honour, and power,and might, be unto our God for everand ever. Amen.
Rev 7:13 - And one of the elders answered, saying unto me, What are these which are arrayed in white robes? and whence came they?
Rev 7:14 - And I said unto him, Sir,thou knowest. And he said to me,These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white inthe blood of the Lamb.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

I say it is future, you say it is now, any evidence to show the unity now? I don't see it.

Ephesians 2:10-13
King James Version

10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

11 Wherefore remember, that ye being in time past Gentiles in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands;

12 That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world:

13 But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ.

BUT NOW ! Future would be but when or will be. The oneness is present tense! Accept God at His Word!

 

[Ronald Nolette]

No need for further discussion on this Ron, the 144k is a Biblical fact, and they are humans that have been selected to rule with Christ, if you disagree fine, but that is my teaching and opinion sir.

Yes the 144,000 is a biblical fact! the Watchtowers definition is what is the lie! You are entitled to your opinion. But when it contradicts the clear written Word of God, expect lots of pushback!

 

[Ronald Nolette]

Yes sir, the end of this system will not exceed the generation of 1914, it will appear late Mat 24:48 but it will be right on time before the expiration of that generation.

And if it does, The watchtower will come up with yet another time frame and tell all JW's to forget the many times they were wrong.

They first said someone who was 12-13 years old on 1914.

New teaching is anyone born by 1914- that makes the youngest 108 years old! You know any JW's 108 years old??

 

[Robert Gwin]

Maybe one day you’ll be willing to see the fact that I already do.

Have a great afternoon.

You have given absolutely no facts maam, even after my petitioning you to do so. See the distinction Mal 3:18

Satan is no "true" god....only one, remember? We gave Satan the keys to the earthly kingdom in the garden but, Jesus, through His death, gained them back and will rip them from the talons of the evil one one day.

Believe it or not Nancy 2 Cor 4:4; Mat 7:13:14; 1 Cor 8:5,6. Fact is maam, he is a very powerful god that has 1/3 of the angels following him into the lake of fire, as well as the vast majority of humans when Jesus returns. Best to take note and serve Jehovah now! Mat 24:39

Do you have the desire to learn about Jesus' God Jehovah maam?

 

[Robert Gwin]

Well...that is an obvious disregard for the fact that Jesus was speaking to those of [that] generation, specifically referring to them as "you", and obviously not at all the proper definition of a generation.

As for Mat 24:48, you have missed the timing of when the leaders of the church began to say and teach that ‘My master is delaying his coming,’ by more than 1,800 years.

Among others, those are some major holes in what you have believed.

Two fold prophecy sir, the generation of the then current Israelites and the end of their system, and now the Israel of God and the end of the worldly system, and the coming of the Kingdom of God

 

[Robert Gwin]

Hi Marine, I assume you were in the Marine Corp, I too served from 73-75 stationed mostly at Camp Lejeune. I am sorry sir, but your reply did not come through sir. Perhaps it was recorded in the body of what I said, but I am too incompetent to figure out if that was the case. I am interested in what you had to say, and hope you will repost your comment.

 

[Robert Gwin]

Rev 7:9 - After this I beheld, and, lo,a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds,and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb,clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands;
Rev 7:10 - And cried with a loud voice, saying, Salvation to our God which sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb.
Rev 7:11 - And all the angels stood round about the throne, and about the elders and the four beasts, and fellbefore the throne on their faces, andworshipped God,
Rev 7:12 - Saying, Amen: Blessing,and glory, and wisdom, andthanksgiving, and honour, and power,and might, be unto our God for everand ever. Amen.
Rev 7:13 - And one of the elders answered, saying unto me, What are these which are arrayed in white robes? and whence came they?
Rev 7:14 - And I said unto him, Sir,thou knowest. And he said to me,These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white inthe blood of the Lamb.

Yes sir, the earthly citizens of God's Kingdom that survive the great tribulation. Did you see the contrast between them and the 144K previously itemized? The two groups of sheep Jesus referred to at Jn 10:16

 

[Nancy]

You have given absolutely no facts maam, even after my petitioning you to do so. See the distinction Mal 3:18


Believe it or not Nancy 2 Cor 4:4; Mat 7:13:14; 1 Cor 8:5,6. Fact is maam, he is a very powerful god that has 1/3 of the angels following him into the lake of fire, as well as the vast majority of humans when Jesus returns. Best to take note and serve Jehovah now! Mat 24:39

Do you have the desire to learn about Jesus' God Jehovah maam?

I have known Jesus since a girl and continue to grow closer and closer.
I have no desire to change my faith sir, thanks tho!

 

[Robert Gwin]

Ephesians 2:10-13
King James Version

10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

11 Wherefore remember, that ye being in time past Gentiles in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands;

12 That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world:

13 But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ.

BUT NOW ! Future would be but when or will be. The oneness is present tense! Accept God at His Word!

Since it is now sir, where are they? Is not their identity clear for all to see so that we can go with them?

 

[Robert Gwin]

Yes the 144,000 is a biblical fact! the Watchtowers definition is what is the lie! You are entitled to your opinion. But when it contradicts the clear written Word of God, expect lots of pushback!

So what does your Watchtower say as to their identity Ron?

 

[Robert Gwin]

And if it does, The watchtower will come up with yet another time frame and tell all JW's to forget the many times they were wrong.

They first said someone who was 12-13 years old on 1914.

New teaching is anyone born by 1914- that makes the youngest 108 years old! You know any JW's 108 years old??

Jesus said the generation that started with his presence would not expire before all those things occurred. What does your watchtower say about it sir?

 

[Ronald Nolette]

Since it is now sir, where are they? Is not their identity clear for all to see so that we can go with them?

The one flock? Sure! Just go with those who believe in the death and physical resurrection of Jesus for their sin payment! We aren't perfect- just forgiven.

YOu have been drilled in teh Catholic mindset that it must be a sect or organization. the body of Christ is not! It is a living organism made up of all believers in all sects, that have placed their trust in the death and physical resurrection of Jesus for their sin.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

Jesus said the generation that started with his presence would not expire before all those things occurred. What does your watchtower say about it sir?

Besides misinterpreting the word generation, the watchtower just arbitrarily declared Jesus returned invisibly in 1914. They also arbitrarily declared Jesus returned in 1874 and Judge Rutherford ( the 2nd president of the watchtower) wrote in his book "prophecy" published in 1930, ( I paraphrase) that the biblical evidence is conclusive that Jesus returned invisibly in 1874.

And it wasn't his presence that that particular generation would not pass away.

Matthew 24:32-34
King James Version

32 Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When his branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is nigh:

33 So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors.

34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.

And if you want to know what teh all things are- read Matthew 24 to that point, in any bible other than the New World Mistranslation.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

So what does your Watchtower say as to their identity Ron?

Well bob we do not have a "Watchtower". We have a bible and Gods Inspired Word calls the 144,000 ethnic Jews! 12,000 from twelve tribes of Israel. Also Gods Inspired Word, believed as written and not mystically reinterpreted lets us know these 144,000 have not even made the scene yet.

All 144,000 appear on earth at the same time and are sealed for service AFTER the first six seals are opened and the damage from them are done. So they are a future event to happen on earth.

 

[ChristisGod]

And if it does, The watchtower will come up with yet another time frame and tell all JW's to forget the many times they were wrong.

They first said someone who was 12-13 years old on 1914.

New teaching is anyone born by 1914- that makes the youngest 108 years old! You know any JW's 108 years old??

yes I lost count how many times their prophets were prove false by their written predictions on end. This makes them by the biblical standard of judging what they say as a false prophet. Anyone with common sense who understands Gods standard for truth and a prophet should steer clear of them as they have proven to be false prophets on numerous occasions over the past 100 years.

hope this helps !!!

 

[Ronald Nolette]

yes I lost count how many times their prophets were prove false by their written predictions on end. This makes them by the biblical standard of judging what they say as a false prophet. Anyone with common sense who understands Gods standard for truth and a prophet should steer clear of them as they have proven to be false prophets on numerous occasions over the past 100 years.

hope this helps !!!

I remember teh late Walter Martin! an extraordinary apologist against the cults.

He called the Watchtower "Armageddon INC." for the numerous times they predicted the end of the world! My heart breaks for the average JW. They are dedicated and sincere but so lost! they have been deceived by very slick human reasoning to twist teh word. I pray and battle for their souls, which they don't believe they have.

 

[ScottA]

Two fold prophecy sir, the generation of the then current Israelites and the end of their system, and now the Israel of God and the end of the worldly system, and the coming of the Kingdom of God

Well, it is not that there is no such thing as two fold prophecy, but your conclusion should then not go against the actual prophecy given by Christ, that these days are as the days of Noah, eating and drinking, etc..

If you can hear it, I would suggest that the two fold prophecy idea is just a convenient would-be confirmation of the lie and strong delusion that without a doubt is the other actual prophecy of these times. The thing about lies, is you need to keep telling them, while dismissing all else.

You might also consider, that your OP is actually projection, an image of the subconscious wrestling with the truth.

 

[Jane_Doe22]

I remember teh late Walter Martin! an extraordinary apologist against the cults.

He called the Watchtower "Armageddon INC." for the numerous times they predicted the end of the world! My heart breaks for the average JW. They are dedicated and sincere but so lost! they have been deceived by very slick human reasoning to twist teh word. I pray and battle for their souls, which they don't believe they have.

I would STRONGLY advice stating far far far away from Walter Martian and the “anti-cult” movement.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

I would STRONGLY advice stating far far far away from Walter Martian and the “anti-cult” movement.

and why??