If you found you were in the wrong faith, would you change?

[mailmandan]

Yes. That's why I left a church that taught salvation by works and became a born again believer in Christ.

 

[Philip James]

Faith isn't something you can choose. Rather, faith grows within you until the day comes when you realize you believe. Oftentimes that belief comes as a shock, being wholly unexpected. At least that's my experience.

A sound argument for the Baltism of our children, wherein we ask our Father to grant them the gift of Faith and the light of Christ in their hearts...

Pax et Bonum

 

[farouk]

Baptizing, when not mixed with personal faith, is irrelevant.

John 3: "Ye must be born again".

 

[ScottA]

I find it interesting though that you're speaking about those that didn't exercise faith as they being reasonable in how they didn't exercise faith, and not speaking more reasonable and loving and faithful about those who were faithful because of their love for the True God YHWH and his Christ.

Indeed, a good report would be better. You make a good point in recognizing that there certainly were those who did not reject Jesus, and had faith even unto death.

But if the majority of Israel rejected Christ...such a popular error is certainly one to examine and understand, so as not to repeat it...I should think.

 

[mailmandan]

Baptizing, when not mixed with personal faith, is irrelevant.

John 3: "Ye must be born again".

We absolutely must be born again and moral self reformation is not a substitute for regeneration.

 

[BARNEY BRIGHT]

Indeed, a good report would be better. You make a good point in recognizing that there certainly were those who did not reject Jesus, and had faith even unto death.

But if the majority of Israel rejected Christ...such a popular error is certainly one to examine and understand, so as not to repeat it...I should think.

To examine yes, but to understand that they, like the faithful, should and could have exercised faith as the apostles did and examine the reasons why they didn't exercise faith so that we like them don't make the same mistakes as they did.

 

[Matthias]

If you found that you were in the wrong faith, why wouldn’t you change?

 

[Ferris Bueller]

...with completely new laws.

Like what?

I know some were made obsolete, but completely new laws? Explain.

 

[Windmillcharge]

if you found out you were in the wrong faith,

Convince me Jesus didn't rise from the dead and I would abandon Christianity.

But there have been many intelectuals who have tried to do this, none can make a reasonable case.
Look at Willial lane Craigs debates with atheists about the resurrection or coldcasechristianity etc etc etc.
The logical evidence is Jesus rose from the dead.

 

[Ferris Bueller]

Have you ever put yourself in the shoes of God's people who underwent a changeover to a new covenant? How hard it might be to accept. God had a nation, a covenanted people of Abrahams descendants for centuries, when a seeming criminal apostate put into force a new covenant, open to all peoples, with completely new laws. What is more, that individual was executed by the authorities, would you have believed he was God's son at the time?

It was easy for prostitutes and tax collectors to embrace the forgiveness and acceptance of Jesus and abandon the covenant that condemned them. But Jesus also speaks about those who believed Moses and how that alone would equip them to believe in Jesus:

"27‘Then I beg you, father,’ he said, ‘send Lazarus to my father’s house, 28for I have five brothers. Let him warn them, so that they will not also end up in this place of torment.’29But Abraham replied, ‘They have Moses and the prophets; let your brothers listen to them.’30‘No, father Abraham,’ he said, ‘but if someone is sent to them from the dead, they will repent.’

31Then Abraham said to him, ‘If they do not listen to Moses and the prophets, they will not be persuaded even if someone rises from the dead.’ ” Luke 16:27-31​

 

[Ferris Bueller]

would you have believed he was God's son at the time?

I think so. But I understand why someone would see how seemingly contrary to the law everything about Jesus was. But as Jesus suggested, if a person listened to Moses and the prophets they would be persuaded to repent at the teaching about a risen Jesus. And I think I would have been a follower of God through Moses and the prophets if I had been alive during that time.

 

[Robert Gwin]

This is a very honest answer. I admire that honesty.

Thank you maam, since I have became a Christian, I do my utmost to conduct myself honestly in all things Heb 13:18. It is very kind of you to say so, and I so appreciate it when someone commends me on my honesty. Thanks again Jane.

 

[Robert Gwin]

@Robert Gwin

Okay, so "expectations" in error, have been noted..

Are you wanting to conclude there is a "wrong faith" presently at work? Is that where this is going?

There are well over 10,000 faiths that claim to be Christian Scott. While it would be nice that God accepts all faiths, the Bible quite clearly states that there is only one faith, since the Bible concludes that false christs will arise and deceive many, then I certainly will not argue against it. I have already concluded that there is a wrong faith sir. Frankly I thought that was understood, but then again my "Christian" neighbors fully knew and conveyed to me the evils of halloween, yet were well known in the community for the treats they gave to the trick or treators, so perhaps there are many who believe you can worship God anyway you desire and He will accept it.

 

[Robert Gwin]

The scriptures are very clear that the True God YHWH is looking for those that love him so much that they will exercise faith in him. Its not like the scriptures didn't tell how the promise seed would come. The scriptures clearly identified Jesus Christ as that promised seed. Just because the majority of Jews didn't exercise faith in what the scriptures said about the Christ and how he would come, doesn't justify them. The apostles and disciples of Jesus were jews also but they exercised faith that Jesus was the Christ. All the miracles that Jesus performed in their presence was clear proof that he was the Christ. He healed everyone that came to him for healing no matter what it was. He expelled the demons from those possessed by demons, Jesus even resurrected the dead, one of whom was dead for four days. The majrity of the jews believed what the pharisees said not just that Jesus was an apostate but also that he was demonic. They had plenty of proof that Jesus was the Christ and if you had lived back it that time you would have had plenty of proof too. So if you would have thought him an apostate you would have been among that number who didn't exercise faith. I find it interesting though that you're speaking about those that didn't exercise faith as they being reasonable in how they didn't exercise faith, and not speaking more reasonable and loving and faithful about those who were faithful because of their love for the True God YHWH and his Christ.

My point to you dear brother was that most of us rejected Jesus then because the leaders of the faith rejected him, if one is rejected by our leaders today, we are taught to reject that individual also. One needs to make sure that we personally are obedient to God above men, do you understand my meaning Barn? It is so easy for us now to look back and identify Jesus as the promised Messiah, but since the elders, as well as governing body (Sanhedrin) then rejected him, most of us would have, just as we did. It already happened and was recorded for us Barn. Rom 15:4

 

[Ferris Bueller]

There are well over 10,000 faiths that claim to be Christian Scott. While it would be nice that God accepts all faiths, the Bible quite clearly states that there is only one faith, since the Bible concludes that false christs will arise and deceive many, then I certainly will not argue against it. I have already concluded that there is a wrong faith sir. Frankly I thought that was understood, but then again my "Christian" neighbors fully knew and conveyed to me the evils of halloween, yet were well known in the community for the treats they gave to the trick or treators, so perhaps there are many who believe you can worship God anyway you desire and He will accept it.

Our divisions about 'how to worship God' are what has ruined Christianity. When Christianity is thought to be how you are to properly 'have church' you'll miss the Christ in Christianity. You will never know him.

 

[Robert Gwin]

What new covenant is this?

Thanks Ron for asking sir, it is found at Luke 22:28-30. This new covenant went into force on Pentecost of 33CE, and is still binding on God's people today. It is actually made with the anointed Christians, but all Christians are subject to the rules and regulations of that covenant, which are recorded for us throughout the Greek Scriptures Ron. We (Jehovah's witnesses) refer to it as the Law of the Christ Gal 6:2

 

[mailmandan]

Our divisions about 'how to worship God' are what has ruined Christianity. When Christianity is thought to be how you are to properly 'have church' you'll miss the Christ in Christianity. You will never know him.

Christianity is about a personal relationship with Jesus Christ and not legalistic, religious bondage to a particular church.

John 17:3 - And this is eternal life, that they may know You, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom You have sent.

 

[BARNEY BRIGHT]

My point to you dear brother was that most of us rejected Jesus then because the leaders of the faith rejected him, if one is rejected by our leaders today, we are taught to reject that individual also. One needs to make sure that we personally are obedient to God above men, do you understand my meaning Barn? It is so easy for us now to look back and identify Jesus as the promised Messiah, but since the elders, as well as governing body (Sanhedrin) then rejected him, most of us would have, just as we did. It already happened and was recorded for us Barn. Rom 15:4

Oh I agree that the majority of the jews disbelieved Jesus and his apostles and disciples because the religious leaders were against them. The scriptures are very clear that the majority of the Jews feared the religious leaders. But those scriptures were written for our instruction to not be like them. So people should believe the truth no matter what the religious leaders of today believe and teach if what they teach isn't accurate. Especially since the scriptures show that a falling away of the truth would happen after Jesus and the apostles went away.

 

[BarneyFife]

Have you ever put yourself in the shoes of God's people who underwent a changeover to a new covenant? How hard it might be to accept. God had a nation, a covenanted people of Abrahams descendants for centuries, when a seeming criminal apostate put into force a new covenant, open to all peoples, with completely new laws. What is more, that individual was executed by the authorities, would you have believed he was God's son at the time?

Looking back, it is easy for us to see he was the Messiah, and we fully accept the new covenant, but God still only has one people, those who worship Him with spirit and truth. How about you, if you found out you were in the wrong faith, would you be willing to accept the faith that is identified by Scripture?

Absolutely. I've got the scars.

 

[RedFan]

Oh I agree that the majority of the jews disbelieved Jesus and his apostles and disciples because the religious leaders were against them. The scriptures are very clear that the majority of the Jews feared the religious leaders.

Interesting point. John 9:22 relates that the parents of the blind man whose sight Jesus had restored “were afraid of the Jews; for the Jews had already agreed that anyone who confessed Jesus to be the Messiah would be put out of the synagogue.” A similar reference occurs later, in John 12:42, right after Jesus’ final entry into Jerusalem.

(I tend to doubt that Jesus’ following was really so large at the time this blind man got his sight that the Jewish authorities would have passed such a decree -- but that's just me.)