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Imminent.
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Maybe, but seeing as they had NEVER seen rain I think that was the reason they laugh at him and thought him a weirdo. It took Noah and his children about 60-75 years to build the Ark and telling people how God would flood the world with RAIN, which they had never seen.rockytopva said:
It always reminds me of this Bill Cosby skit from the 60s.
https://youtu.be/zJ6tV5tws-o
The rapture will certainly not be imminent. There are events that must come to pass before the rapture/day of the lord begins...
Prewrath Rapture of the Church by Marvin Rosenthal
http://www.middletownbiblechurch.org/proph/prewra01.JPG
1. Antichrist signs peace treaty with Israel to begin the 70th week Isa 28:15 NIV, Isa 28:18 NIV, Isa 57:8-9 NIV, Dan 9:27 NIV, Rev 6:2 NIV, Rev 6:8 NIV.
2. The third temple is built Ez 40-48 NIV, Dan 9:27 NIV, 2 Thess 2:3-4 NIV.
3. The first 3.5 years are birth pains, the first four seals are open along with apostasy of Jews Dan 11:36-45 NIV, Matt 24:4-7, 2 Thess 2:3 NIV, Rev 6:1-8 NIV.
4. At the middle of the 70th week the abomination of desolation takes place Dan 9:27 NIV, Dan 11:31 NIV, Dan 12:11 NIV, Matt 24:15 NIV, 2 Thess 2:3-4 NIV.
5. Michael the angel, the restrainer is removed here Dan 12:1 NIV, 2 Thess 2:6-12 NIV, Rev 12:6-12 NIV.
6. Immediately after the abomination of desolation the fifth seal is open and the Great Tribulation begins, man's rebellion against God Rev 6:9-11 NIV.
7. This is right around where the two witnesses make their appearance and prophesy for 1,260 days Mal 4:5 NIV, Rev 11:2-3 NIV.
8. The last 3.5 years of the 70th week now begins.
9. Then the Great Tribulation is cut short around the middle of the last 3.5 years Matt 24:22 NIV.
10. Immediately after the Great Tribulation ends cosmic disturbances occur before the Day of the Lord begins.
11. The 144,000 are then sealed before the rapture, so they can enter the Day of the Lord without harm Rev 7:2-4 NIV.
12. The rapture occurs at the seventh seal, after the Great Tribulation and at the beginning of the Day of the Lord Matt 25:31-46 NIV, Rev 7:14 NIV, Rev 8:1-5 NIV.
13. The Bema Seat of Christ is here Matt 16:27 NIV, Luke 14:14-15 NIV, 2 Cor 5:10 NIV, Rev 19:8-9 NIV, Rev 22:12 NIV.
14. The Feast/Marriage Supper of the Lamb is also here Luke 14:14-15 NIV, Rev 7:9 NIV, Rev 19:1 NIV, Rev 19:9 NIV.
15. Then begins the Day of the Lord, the start of God's wrath of trumpets. The 5th trumpet will also last five months Rev 9:5 NIV.
16. At the end of the 70th week the beast will kill the two witnesses, but after 3.5 days they will come alive Rev 11:7-12 NIV.
17. Very few people will be left after the 70th week is complete Zech 13:8-9 NIV.
18. Jesus Christ landing on the Mount of Olives is here Zech 9:14-17 NIV, Zech 10:1-12 NIV, Zech 12:10-14 NIV, Zech 14:4 NIV, Mal 3:2-4 NIV, Matt 25:31-46 NIV, Rom 11:26-27 NIV, Jude 1:14-15 NIV, Rev 19:11-21 NIV.
19. After the 70th week is complete the bowl judgments begin for 30 days Dan 12:11 NIV, Zech 12:10-14 NIV.
20. Then the 45 days begin for cleansing of the Temple Dan 12:12 NIV, Zech 13:1-6 NIV.
21. After the 45 days are finished the 1,000 year millennium begins Rev 20:4-6 NIV.
22. Nonbelievers will also be a part of the 1,000 year millennium Zech 14:16-19 NIV.
23. After the 1,000 years are finished, the dead believers and nonbelievers that are left over will be judged Rev 20:11-15 NIV.
24. Then a New Heaven and a New Earth will appear making everything new Rev 21:1-8 NIV.
25. Lastly, Eden is restored in which we now live with Jesus Christ forever and ever. Amen Rev 22:1-5 NIV.
Side Note 1: The full seven years are never called "the tribulation period", rather the 70th week is the proper name to describe the seven years.
Side Note 2: The Great Tribulation and the Day of the Lord are not the same event. The GT is man's rebellion against God, and the Day of the Lord is God's wrath against man. These two events are split in half in the last 3.5 years of the 70th week. The church will have to go through the first five seals and also the GT, but they will be raptured before the Day of the Lord begins, God's wrath of trumpets and bowls. The church will witness the signing of the peace treaty, the third temple built, the first four seals opening, the abomination of desolation, the two witnesses, the fifth seal opening, the GT of man's rebellion and the sixth seal of cosmic disturbances in the sun, moon and stars before they are raptured.
Prewrath Rapture of the Church by Marvin Rosenthal
http://www.middletownbiblechurch.org/proph/prewra01.JPG
1. Antichrist signs peace treaty with Israel to begin the 70th week Isa 28:15 NIV, Isa 28:18 NIV, Isa 57:8-9 NIV, Dan 9:27 NIV, Rev 6:2 NIV, Rev 6:8 NIV.
2. The third temple is built Ez 40-48 NIV, Dan 9:27 NIV, 2 Thess 2:3-4 NIV.
3. The first 3.5 years are birth pains, the first four seals are open along with apostasy of Jews Dan 11:36-45 NIV, Matt 24:4-7, 2 Thess 2:3 NIV, Rev 6:1-8 NIV.
4. At the middle of the 70th week the abomination of desolation takes place Dan 9:27 NIV, Dan 11:31 NIV, Dan 12:11 NIV, Matt 24:15 NIV, 2 Thess 2:3-4 NIV.
5. Michael the angel, the restrainer is removed here Dan 12:1 NIV, 2 Thess 2:6-12 NIV, Rev 12:6-12 NIV.
6. Immediately after the abomination of desolation the fifth seal is open and the Great Tribulation begins, man's rebellion against God Rev 6:9-11 NIV.
7. This is right around where the two witnesses make their appearance and prophesy for 1,260 days Mal 4:5 NIV, Rev 11:2-3 NIV.
8. The last 3.5 years of the 70th week now begins.
9. Then the Great Tribulation is cut short around the middle of the last 3.5 years Matt 24:22 NIV.
10. Immediately after the Great Tribulation ends cosmic disturbances occur before the Day of the Lord begins.
11. The 144,000 are then sealed before the rapture, so they can enter the Day of the Lord without harm Rev 7:2-4 NIV.
12. The rapture occurs at the seventh seal, after the Great Tribulation and at the beginning of the Day of the Lord Matt 25:31-46 NIV, Rev 7:14 NIV, Rev 8:1-5 NIV.
13. The Bema Seat of Christ is here Matt 16:27 NIV, Luke 14:14-15 NIV, 2 Cor 5:10 NIV, Rev 19:8-9 NIV, Rev 22:12 NIV.
14. The Feast/Marriage Supper of the Lamb is also here Luke 14:14-15 NIV, Rev 7:9 NIV, Rev 19:1 NIV, Rev 19:9 NIV.
15. Then begins the Day of the Lord, the start of God's wrath of trumpets. The 5th trumpet will also last five months Rev 9:5 NIV.
16. At the end of the 70th week the beast will kill the two witnesses, but after 3.5 days they will come alive Rev 11:7-12 NIV.
17. Very few people will be left after the 70th week is complete Zech 13:8-9 NIV.
18. Jesus Christ landing on the Mount of Olives is here Zech 9:14-17 NIV, Zech 10:1-12 NIV, Zech 12:10-14 NIV, Zech 14:4 NIV, Mal 3:2-4 NIV, Matt 25:31-46 NIV, Rom 11:26-27 NIV, Jude 1:14-15 NIV, Rev 19:11-21 NIV.
19. After the 70th week is complete the bowl judgments begin for 30 days Dan 12:11 NIV, Zech 12:10-14 NIV.
20. Then the 45 days begin for cleansing of the Temple Dan 12:12 NIV, Zech 13:1-6 NIV.
21. After the 45 days are finished the 1,000 year millennium begins Rev 20:4-6 NIV.
22. Nonbelievers will also be a part of the 1,000 year millennium Zech 14:16-19 NIV.
23. After the 1,000 years are finished, the dead believers and nonbelievers that are left over will be judged Rev 20:11-15 NIV.
24. Then a New Heaven and a New Earth will appear making everything new Rev 21:1-8 NIV.
25. Lastly, Eden is restored in which we now live with Jesus Christ forever and ever. Amen Rev 22:1-5 NIV.
Side Note 1: The full seven years are never called "the tribulation period", rather the 70th week is the proper name to describe the seven years.
Side Note 2: The Great Tribulation and the Day of the Lord are not the same event. The GT is man's rebellion against God, and the Day of the Lord is God's wrath against man. These two events are split in half in the last 3.5 years of the 70th week. The church will have to go through the first five seals and also the GT, but they will be raptured before the Day of the Lord begins, God's wrath of trumpets and bowls. The church will witness the signing of the peace treaty, the third temple built, the first four seals opening, the abomination of desolation, the two witnesses, the fifth seal opening, the GT of man's rebellion and the sixth seal of cosmic disturbances in the sun, moon and stars before they are raptured.
Marcus O'Reillius
Active Member
No, not at all.rockytopva said:
When the desolations come, we won't be here for that according to a Pre-Wrath point-of-view.
I will say that both Noah and Lot were saved right before God's Wrath fell.
This overall view of their examples leads me to look at the Day of the Lord when we will be rescued, and then God's Wrath will fall.
My motto is: hupomone: endure patiently, keep the faith, and remain steadfast.
My warning to the Pre-Trib adherents mimics what Jesus had to say about those in a panic, looking for Him: When you find your self IN the one 'seven' and it's getting really, really bad - hupomone.
As We Look of whats happening in the world the Rapture is very imminent, And when you see these things come about in the world lift your eyes Up. I say Jesus come Quickly and He says YES I come Quickly!
And Come, my people, enter thou into thy chambers, and shut thy doors about thee: hide thyself as it were for a little moment, until the indignation be overpast.
And "But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved. " (Matthew 24:13, KJV)
But what they do is "cherry pick" the verses to suit their whims; we need to read the surrounding verses to get the context:
" And Jesus went out, and departed from the temple: and his disciples came to him for to shew him the buildings of the temple. And Jesus said unto them, See ye not all these things? verily I say unto you, There shall not be left here one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down. And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world? And Jesus answered and said unto them, Take heed that no man deceive you. For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many.: And ye shall hear of wars and rumours of wars: see that ye be not troubled: for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet. For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be famines, and pestilences, and earthquakes, in divers places. All these are the beginning of sorrows. Then shall they deliver you up to be afflicted, and shall kill you: and ye shall be hated of all nations for my name's sake. And then shall many be offended, and shall betray one another, and shall hate one another. And many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many.: And because iniquity shall abound, the love of many shall wax cold. But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.: And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come. " (Matthew 24:1-14, KJV)
Note that the disciples asked "what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?" This was way before Jesus told them about the Rapture; keep in mind that the Rapture doesn't have a "sign" per se; it is an IMMINENT event, so that adds a second clue to this. Jesus was describing the Tribulation when he spoke of "enduring until the end".
Also, consider his audience: he was not speaking to gentiles, but to jewish disciples. Matthew was written for the Jewish, to demonstrate that Jesus is their prophesied Messiah. It doesn't mean that we ignore what Jesus said: certainly a great deal of what he says in Matthew is happening now. But we must be sure to read in CONTEXT and make sure we are not trying to make scripture say something it is not.
But what they do is "cherry pick" the verses to suit their whims; we need to read the surrounding verses to get the context:
" And Jesus went out, and departed from the temple: and his disciples came to him for to shew him the buildings of the temple. And Jesus said unto them, See ye not all these things? verily I say unto you, There shall not be left here one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down. And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world? And Jesus answered and said unto them, Take heed that no man deceive you. For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many.: And ye shall hear of wars and rumours of wars: see that ye be not troubled: for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet. For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be famines, and pestilences, and earthquakes, in divers places. All these are the beginning of sorrows. Then shall they deliver you up to be afflicted, and shall kill you: and ye shall be hated of all nations for my name's sake. And then shall many be offended, and shall betray one another, and shall hate one another. And many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many.: And because iniquity shall abound, the love of many shall wax cold. But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.: And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come. " (Matthew 24:1-14, KJV)
Note that the disciples asked "what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?" This was way before Jesus told them about the Rapture; keep in mind that the Rapture doesn't have a "sign" per se; it is an IMMINENT event, so that adds a second clue to this. Jesus was describing the Tribulation when he spoke of "enduring until the end".
Also, consider his audience: he was not speaking to gentiles, but to jewish disciples. Matthew was written for the Jewish, to demonstrate that Jesus is their prophesied Messiah. It doesn't mean that we ignore what Jesus said: certainly a great deal of what he says in Matthew is happening now. But we must be sure to read in CONTEXT and make sure we are not trying to make scripture say something it is not.
You almost got it bhope. There are still many events that need to take place before the rapture, thus we can confirm the rapture is not imminent just yet. Post 23.blessedhope said:
I just luv . rapture haters they just ooze out of the wood work and talk about their lusts for them and their world, And But our citizenship is in heaven, and from it we await a Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ, who will transform our lowly body to be like his glorious body, by the power that enables him even to subject all things to himself. But these oozers do do not read verses like this but follow their own lusts and dogmas !
And these serpents will try to tell you then we have to spiritualizing it and it really does not really or really mean what the bible is really >like really saying. you really cant say it really saying THAT!
I would like to respond to your post but I am not sure what you mean by "born again"?blessedhope said:
Could you give your definition of born again?
And The rapture is one of the greatest gifts that God has promised the faithful. So great in fact it is often referred to as the "blessed hope:" "Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Savior Jesus Christ;" (Titus 2:13). The promise is that someday soon, at the blowing of a trumpet and the shout of an archangel, Jesus will appear in the clouds and take up believers to Heaven.
At the rapture Jesus will physically transform us in a fraction of a second from our aging, achy, disease-prone bodies to new, glorified and immortal bodies suitable for eternity. The Bible describes this transformation as occurring in "the twinkling of an eye" (1 Corinthians 15:52). Some sources estimate that is as fast as eleven one-hundredths of a second.
It is unclear what unbelievers will see or hear when the rapture occurs. Some scholars believe that the trumpet of the Lord, and his appearing in the sky, will only be sensed by believers being raptured. The unsaved may only see the vanishing of believers in a fraction of a second and hear a loud thunder clap, "...in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet; for the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised imperishable, and we will be changed" (1 Corinthians 15:52). Jesus tells us that it will be sudden, "For just like the lightning comes from the east and flashes to the west, so the coming of the Son of Man will be (Matthew 24:27).
The rapture is one of the most controversial topics in Christian eschatology. Much of that controversy stems from Satan's deceit in his attempts to keep believers ignorant of God's prophetic timeline. Satan knows Bible prophecy (Revelation 12:12). He recognizes the significance of world events as signs of the times that Jesus is coming soon. Because Satan does not want anyone else to be aware of that fact he does everything possible to discredit or obscure God's prophetic word. That is why we are seeing a growing number of self-proclaimed experts criticizing the rapture, especially the pre-tribulation rapture. Criticism ranges from claims that the word "rapture" never appears in the Bible to it being a hoax stemming from a satanic vision.
Many criticisms of the rapture stem from legitimate disagreements over its timing. Others are part of Satan's fog of evil designed to keep believers from understanding God's plan. Perhaps the most common criticism is that neither the word "rapture," nor the rapture concept appears in the Bible. By that logic, the word Bible is also missing from scripture but that doesn't prevent people from referring to its 66 books as the Holy Bible.
In fact, the term rapture comes from a Latin word Harpazo which means to catch up, to snatch away, or to take out. It is a Biblical word that comes right out of the Latin Vulgate translation of the Bible. The word is found in 1 Thessalonians 4:17: "Then we who are alive, who are left, will be suddenly caught up together with them [dead believers] in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will be with the Lord always." In the New American Standard Version, the English phrase, "caught up," is used. The same phrase is used in the King James and New International Versions.
The first clear mention of the concept of the rapture is found in the words of Jesus recorded in John 14:1-4. Jesus said, "I will come again, and receive you to Myself; that where I am, there you may be also." The most detailed revelation of the actual events related to the rapture is given by Paul in 1 Thessalonians 4:13-18. He says that when Jesus appears, the dead in Christ, also known as the Church age saints, will be resurrected and caught up first. Then, those of us who are alive in Christ will be translated "to meet the Lord in the air." Paul then exhorts us to "comfort one another with these words."
Paul mentions the rapture again in 1 Corinthians 15 verses 51 and 52, his famous chapter on the resurrection of the dead, "Behold, I tell you a mystery; we shall not all sleep, but we shall be changed, in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet." Paul's reference here to being changed is an allusion to the fact that the saints (the raptured believers in Christ) will receive glorified bodies that will be perfected, imperishable and immortal (1 Corinthians 15:42-44, and 50-55).
A second pernicious criticism is that the first appearance of a pre-tribulation rapture originated in a demonic vision by Margaret MacDonald. One of the most widely circulated attacks against its pre-trib timing is the notion that a Scottish girl named Margaret MacDonald started this theological view back in 1830. The claim is typically made that MacDonald received a demonic vision, passed it on to John Darby, who in turn popularized it.
According to R. A. Huebner, in his well-documented book, "Precious Truths Revived and Defended Through J. N. Darby, Vol. 1" (Morganville, N. J.: Present Truth Publishers, 1991), Darby developed his belief in the pre-trib rapture while convalescing from a horse riding accident during December 1826 and January 1827, at least three years before anyone, including MacDonald, could have influenced his thought.
Huebner documents that Darby's pre-trib rapture beliefs were developed from what "he saw from Isaiah 32 that there was a different dispensation coming . . . that Israel and the Church were distinct. Darby, himself said in 1857 that he first started understanding things relating to the pre-trib Rapture "thirty years ago." With that fixed point of reference Huebner documents that Darby "had already understood those truths upon which the pre-tribulation rapture hinges."
Other scholars have discovered a host of rapture writings that predate Margaret MacDonald. As far back as the 4th Century AD Ephraim the Syrian, a 4th Century deacon and theologian of the Syriac Orthodox Church, wrote a wide variety of hymns, poems, sermons and biblical exegesis. He is credited with a practical style of theology that helped explain Church doctrine during troubled times. He is also considered a Saint by some branches of Christianity. A sermon written by him sometime around 374 A.D. talks about the rapture:
Why therefore do we not reject every care of earthly actions and prepare ourselves for the meeting of the Lord Christ, so that he may draw us from the confusion, which overwhelms all the world?...For all the saints and elect of God are gathered, prior to the tribulation that is to come, and are taken to the Lord lest they see the confusion that is to overwhelm the world because of our sins. (Source: Ice and Demy, 1999, pps. 55-66).
There is also the discovery that Morgan Edwards wrote about his pre-tribulation rapture beliefs in 1744 and later published them in 1788. Edwards taught the following:
The distance between the first and second resurrection will be somewhat more than a thousand years. I say, somewhat more- , because the dead saints will be raised, and the living changed at Christ's "appearing in the air" (I Thessalonians. IV:17); and this will be about three years and a half before the millennium, as we shall see hereafter: but will he and they abide in the air all that time? No: they will ascend to paradise, or to some one of those many "mansions in the father's house" (John xiv. 2), and disappear during the foresaid period of time. The design of this retreat and disappearing will be to judge the risen and changed saints; for "now the time is come that judgment must begin," and that will be "at the house of God" (I Peter IV:17) . . . (The spelling of all Edwards quotes have been modernized for clarity.)
Edwards clearly separates the rapture from the Second Coming of Christ by three and a half years. He uses modern pre-trib rapture verses, including 1 Thessalonians 4:17 and John 14:2, to describe the rapture.
A more recent refutation of this criticism occurred during a recent meeting of the Evangelical Theological Society in late 2001 in Colorado Springs. At that conference, Francis X. Gumerlock presented a paper entitled "Before Darby: Expanding the Historical Boundaries of Pretribulationism." Gumerlock argues that Brother Dolcino and his sect, called the Apostolic Brethren, taught a pretribulation rapture around 1304 A.D.
Gumerlock's research led him to conclude that the fourteenth-century text, "The History of Brother Dolcino," demonstrates that some Christians in the Middle Ages held a view of the rapture that had basic elements of its pre-tribulation timing. These include a significant gap of time between the rapture of the saints - believing Christians - and their subsequent descent to earth during Christ's Second Coming and the purpose of the rapture related to escaping end-time tribulation.
The most controversial aspect of the rapture is its timing. Some place it at the end of the tribulation making it concurrent with the Second Coming. Others place it in the middle of the tribulation. Still others believe that it will occur at the beginning of the tribulation. The reason for these differing viewpoints is that the exact time of the rapture is not precisely revealed in scripture. It is only inferred.
I believe the best inference of Scripture is that the rapture will occur before the beginning of the Tribulation. The most important reason has to do with the issue of imminence. Over and over in Scripture we are told to watch for the appearing of the Lord. We are told "to be ready" (Matt. 24:44), "to be on the alert" (Matt. 24:42), "to be dressed in readiness" (Luke 12:35), and to "keep your lamps alight" (Luke 12:35). The clear force of these persistent warnings is that Jesus can appear at any moment. Only the pre-Tribulation concept of the rapture allows for the imminence of the Lord's appearing for His Church.
When the rapture is placed at any other point in time the imminence of the Lord's appearing is destroyed because other prophetic events must happen first. For example, if the rapture is going to occur in mid-tribulation, then why should I live looking for the Lord's appearing at any moment? I would be looking instead for an Israeli peace treaty, the rebuilding of the Temple, and the revelation of the Antichrist. Based on Biblical prophecy, then and only then can the Lord appear.
A key argument in behalf of a pre-trib rapture has to do with the promises of God to protect the Church from His wrath. The book of Revelation shows that the wrath of God will be poured out during the entire period of the tribulation. The Bible promises over and over that the Church will be delivered from God's wrath. Romans 5:9 says that "we shall be saved from the wrath of God through Him [Jesus]." 1 Thessalonians 1:10 states that we are waiting "for His Son from heaven...who will deliver us from the wrath to come." The promise is repeated in 1 Thessalonians 5:9 - "God has not destined us for wrath, but for obtaining salvation through our Lord Jesus Christ."
In addition, there are several prophetic types in Scripture that seem to affirm the concept of deliverance from the tribulation. Enoch is a prominent example. He was a prophet to the Gentiles who was raptured out of the world before God poured out His wrath in the great flood of Noah's time. Enoch appears to be an archetype of the Gentile Church that will be taken out of the world before God pours out His wrath again. If so, then Noah and his family are a prototype for the Jewish remnant that will be protected through the Tribulation.
Another Old Testament symbolic type which points toward a pre-trib rapture is the experience of Lot and his family. They were delivered out of Sodom and Gomorrah before those cities were destroyed. The Apostle Peter alludes to both of these examples in his second epistle. He states that if God spared Noah and Lot, then He surely "knows how to rescue the godly from trial and to keep the unrighteous under punishment for the day of judgment" (2 Peter 4-9).
I believe that we should be looking for two future comings of the Lord, one near the beginning of the tribulation, the other at the end. The first is the rapture that will occur when the Lord appears in the clouds for His Church. He doesn't step foot on earth at that time. The second is the Second Coming. It occurs on Christ's return to the earth to "judge and wage war" against the enemies of God (Revelation 19:11).
His appearance at that time will be so powerful that in addition to destroying the massive armies arrayed against him "with the breath of his mouth" (2 Thessalonians 2:8) that at the moment His foot touches down the Mount of Olives outside of Jerusalem will be "split in two from east to west forming a great valley with half of the mountain moving north and half moving south (Zechariah 14:4).
Many skeptics and unbelievers wallow in ignorance and misjudge God by His unfinished work. However haphazard or mysterious God's dealings with men may appear, those who believe the Bible must acknowledge that His original and unalterable plan has been, and still is progressing systematically to completion. Believers are able to discern God's purpose because of spiritual discernment via the Holy Spirit. The view of the rest is obscured by the fog of evil leaving them to grope in darkness while awaiting the surprise unfolding of God's plan. "But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned" (1 Corinthians 2:14).
At the rapture Jesus will physically transform us in a fraction of a second from our aging, achy, disease-prone bodies to new, glorified and immortal bodies suitable for eternity. The Bible describes this transformation as occurring in "the twinkling of an eye" (1 Corinthians 15:52). Some sources estimate that is as fast as eleven one-hundredths of a second.
It is unclear what unbelievers will see or hear when the rapture occurs. Some scholars believe that the trumpet of the Lord, and his appearing in the sky, will only be sensed by believers being raptured. The unsaved may only see the vanishing of believers in a fraction of a second and hear a loud thunder clap, "...in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet; for the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised imperishable, and we will be changed" (1 Corinthians 15:52). Jesus tells us that it will be sudden, "For just like the lightning comes from the east and flashes to the west, so the coming of the Son of Man will be (Matthew 24:27).
The rapture is one of the most controversial topics in Christian eschatology. Much of that controversy stems from Satan's deceit in his attempts to keep believers ignorant of God's prophetic timeline. Satan knows Bible prophecy (Revelation 12:12). He recognizes the significance of world events as signs of the times that Jesus is coming soon. Because Satan does not want anyone else to be aware of that fact he does everything possible to discredit or obscure God's prophetic word. That is why we are seeing a growing number of self-proclaimed experts criticizing the rapture, especially the pre-tribulation rapture. Criticism ranges from claims that the word "rapture" never appears in the Bible to it being a hoax stemming from a satanic vision.
Many criticisms of the rapture stem from legitimate disagreements over its timing. Others are part of Satan's fog of evil designed to keep believers from understanding God's plan. Perhaps the most common criticism is that neither the word "rapture," nor the rapture concept appears in the Bible. By that logic, the word Bible is also missing from scripture but that doesn't prevent people from referring to its 66 books as the Holy Bible.
In fact, the term rapture comes from a Latin word Harpazo which means to catch up, to snatch away, or to take out. It is a Biblical word that comes right out of the Latin Vulgate translation of the Bible. The word is found in 1 Thessalonians 4:17: "Then we who are alive, who are left, will be suddenly caught up together with them [dead believers] in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will be with the Lord always." In the New American Standard Version, the English phrase, "caught up," is used. The same phrase is used in the King James and New International Versions.
The first clear mention of the concept of the rapture is found in the words of Jesus recorded in John 14:1-4. Jesus said, "I will come again, and receive you to Myself; that where I am, there you may be also." The most detailed revelation of the actual events related to the rapture is given by Paul in 1 Thessalonians 4:13-18. He says that when Jesus appears, the dead in Christ, also known as the Church age saints, will be resurrected and caught up first. Then, those of us who are alive in Christ will be translated "to meet the Lord in the air." Paul then exhorts us to "comfort one another with these words."
Paul mentions the rapture again in 1 Corinthians 15 verses 51 and 52, his famous chapter on the resurrection of the dead, "Behold, I tell you a mystery; we shall not all sleep, but we shall be changed, in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet." Paul's reference here to being changed is an allusion to the fact that the saints (the raptured believers in Christ) will receive glorified bodies that will be perfected, imperishable and immortal (1 Corinthians 15:42-44, and 50-55).
A second pernicious criticism is that the first appearance of a pre-tribulation rapture originated in a demonic vision by Margaret MacDonald. One of the most widely circulated attacks against its pre-trib timing is the notion that a Scottish girl named Margaret MacDonald started this theological view back in 1830. The claim is typically made that MacDonald received a demonic vision, passed it on to John Darby, who in turn popularized it.
According to R. A. Huebner, in his well-documented book, "Precious Truths Revived and Defended Through J. N. Darby, Vol. 1" (Morganville, N. J.: Present Truth Publishers, 1991), Darby developed his belief in the pre-trib rapture while convalescing from a horse riding accident during December 1826 and January 1827, at least three years before anyone, including MacDonald, could have influenced his thought.
Huebner documents that Darby's pre-trib rapture beliefs were developed from what "he saw from Isaiah 32 that there was a different dispensation coming . . . that Israel and the Church were distinct. Darby, himself said in 1857 that he first started understanding things relating to the pre-trib Rapture "thirty years ago." With that fixed point of reference Huebner documents that Darby "had already understood those truths upon which the pre-tribulation rapture hinges."
Other scholars have discovered a host of rapture writings that predate Margaret MacDonald. As far back as the 4th Century AD Ephraim the Syrian, a 4th Century deacon and theologian of the Syriac Orthodox Church, wrote a wide variety of hymns, poems, sermons and biblical exegesis. He is credited with a practical style of theology that helped explain Church doctrine during troubled times. He is also considered a Saint by some branches of Christianity. A sermon written by him sometime around 374 A.D. talks about the rapture:
Why therefore do we not reject every care of earthly actions and prepare ourselves for the meeting of the Lord Christ, so that he may draw us from the confusion, which overwhelms all the world?...For all the saints and elect of God are gathered, prior to the tribulation that is to come, and are taken to the Lord lest they see the confusion that is to overwhelm the world because of our sins. (Source: Ice and Demy, 1999, pps. 55-66).
There is also the discovery that Morgan Edwards wrote about his pre-tribulation rapture beliefs in 1744 and later published them in 1788. Edwards taught the following:
The distance between the first and second resurrection will be somewhat more than a thousand years. I say, somewhat more- , because the dead saints will be raised, and the living changed at Christ's "appearing in the air" (I Thessalonians. IV:17); and this will be about three years and a half before the millennium, as we shall see hereafter: but will he and they abide in the air all that time? No: they will ascend to paradise, or to some one of those many "mansions in the father's house" (John xiv. 2), and disappear during the foresaid period of time. The design of this retreat and disappearing will be to judge the risen and changed saints; for "now the time is come that judgment must begin," and that will be "at the house of God" (I Peter IV:17) . . . (The spelling of all Edwards quotes have been modernized for clarity.)
Edwards clearly separates the rapture from the Second Coming of Christ by three and a half years. He uses modern pre-trib rapture verses, including 1 Thessalonians 4:17 and John 14:2, to describe the rapture.
A more recent refutation of this criticism occurred during a recent meeting of the Evangelical Theological Society in late 2001 in Colorado Springs. At that conference, Francis X. Gumerlock presented a paper entitled "Before Darby: Expanding the Historical Boundaries of Pretribulationism." Gumerlock argues that Brother Dolcino and his sect, called the Apostolic Brethren, taught a pretribulation rapture around 1304 A.D.
Gumerlock's research led him to conclude that the fourteenth-century text, "The History of Brother Dolcino," demonstrates that some Christians in the Middle Ages held a view of the rapture that had basic elements of its pre-tribulation timing. These include a significant gap of time between the rapture of the saints - believing Christians - and their subsequent descent to earth during Christ's Second Coming and the purpose of the rapture related to escaping end-time tribulation.
The most controversial aspect of the rapture is its timing. Some place it at the end of the tribulation making it concurrent with the Second Coming. Others place it in the middle of the tribulation. Still others believe that it will occur at the beginning of the tribulation. The reason for these differing viewpoints is that the exact time of the rapture is not precisely revealed in scripture. It is only inferred.
I believe the best inference of Scripture is that the rapture will occur before the beginning of the Tribulation. The most important reason has to do with the issue of imminence. Over and over in Scripture we are told to watch for the appearing of the Lord. We are told "to be ready" (Matt. 24:44), "to be on the alert" (Matt. 24:42), "to be dressed in readiness" (Luke 12:35), and to "keep your lamps alight" (Luke 12:35). The clear force of these persistent warnings is that Jesus can appear at any moment. Only the pre-Tribulation concept of the rapture allows for the imminence of the Lord's appearing for His Church.
When the rapture is placed at any other point in time the imminence of the Lord's appearing is destroyed because other prophetic events must happen first. For example, if the rapture is going to occur in mid-tribulation, then why should I live looking for the Lord's appearing at any moment? I would be looking instead for an Israeli peace treaty, the rebuilding of the Temple, and the revelation of the Antichrist. Based on Biblical prophecy, then and only then can the Lord appear.
A key argument in behalf of a pre-trib rapture has to do with the promises of God to protect the Church from His wrath. The book of Revelation shows that the wrath of God will be poured out during the entire period of the tribulation. The Bible promises over and over that the Church will be delivered from God's wrath. Romans 5:9 says that "we shall be saved from the wrath of God through Him [Jesus]." 1 Thessalonians 1:10 states that we are waiting "for His Son from heaven...who will deliver us from the wrath to come." The promise is repeated in 1 Thessalonians 5:9 - "God has not destined us for wrath, but for obtaining salvation through our Lord Jesus Christ."
In addition, there are several prophetic types in Scripture that seem to affirm the concept of deliverance from the tribulation. Enoch is a prominent example. He was a prophet to the Gentiles who was raptured out of the world before God poured out His wrath in the great flood of Noah's time. Enoch appears to be an archetype of the Gentile Church that will be taken out of the world before God pours out His wrath again. If so, then Noah and his family are a prototype for the Jewish remnant that will be protected through the Tribulation.
Another Old Testament symbolic type which points toward a pre-trib rapture is the experience of Lot and his family. They were delivered out of Sodom and Gomorrah before those cities were destroyed. The Apostle Peter alludes to both of these examples in his second epistle. He states that if God spared Noah and Lot, then He surely "knows how to rescue the godly from trial and to keep the unrighteous under punishment for the day of judgment" (2 Peter 4-9).
I believe that we should be looking for two future comings of the Lord, one near the beginning of the tribulation, the other at the end. The first is the rapture that will occur when the Lord appears in the clouds for His Church. He doesn't step foot on earth at that time. The second is the Second Coming. It occurs on Christ's return to the earth to "judge and wage war" against the enemies of God (Revelation 19:11).
His appearance at that time will be so powerful that in addition to destroying the massive armies arrayed against him "with the breath of his mouth" (2 Thessalonians 2:8) that at the moment His foot touches down the Mount of Olives outside of Jerusalem will be "split in two from east to west forming a great valley with half of the mountain moving north and half moving south (Zechariah 14:4).
Many skeptics and unbelievers wallow in ignorance and misjudge God by His unfinished work. However haphazard or mysterious God's dealings with men may appear, those who believe the Bible must acknowledge that His original and unalterable plan has been, and still is progressing systematically to completion. Believers are able to discern God's purpose because of spiritual discernment via the Holy Spirit. The view of the rest is obscured by the fog of evil leaving them to grope in darkness while awaiting the surprise unfolding of God's plan. "But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned" (1 Corinthians 2:14).
There is no timing within the 7th week! The Church and Israel are two diff animals but some say the church is Israel >Israel is the church. and this is a big NO! once you come to an understanding that these animals are different and they will be going in two different jungles then you can understand bible prophecy! Enjoy
bhope, I do agree the church and Israel are not the same. Another question, do you believe Dan 9:27 is future?blessedhope said:
Then why does Matt 24 say otherwise...blessedhope said:
Matt 24:29-31 NIV “Immediately after the distress of those days “ ‘the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light; the stars will fall from the sky, and the heavenly bodies will be shaken.’ 30“Then will appear the sign of the Son of Man in heaven. And then all the peoples of the earth will mourn when they see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven, with power and great glory. 31And he will send his angels with a loud trumpet call, and they will gather his elect from the four winds, from one end of the heavens to the other.
And
[SIZE=10pt]
With the wedding and the supper of the Lamb complete, the Lamb prepares to return with his bride to the earth. John sees Christ seated on a white horse along with the rest of the redeemed on white horses wearing the clothing of the Redeemed.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=8pt]11 Now I saw heaven opened, and behold, a white horse. And He who sat on him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness He judges and makes war.14 And the armies in heaven, clothed in fine linen, white and clean, followed Him on white horses. Revelation 19:11,14[/SIZE]
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