More FALSE TEACHING from Episkopos. Read Romans chapter 4 to confirm.
Imputation is based on the Old Testament
- Thread starter Episkopos
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More bot answers. Again, whoever you are...you are not responding to what I wrote...at all. I notice this among those who are also not able to read the bible for what it says. Instead many people have learned to be pew warmers and eat up whatever scheme makes more people sit in pews. But there is no understanding among them.
Had to look more of the passage up. It’s difficult to understand Paul in so many places.
16 Yet we know that a person is made right with God by faith in Jesus Christ, not by obeying the law. And we have believed in Christ Jesus, so that we might be made right with God because of our faith in Christ, not because we have obeyed the law. For no one will ever be made right with God by obeying the law.”[d]
17 But suppose we seek to be made right with God through faith in Christ and then we are found guilty because we have abandoned the law. Would that mean Christ has led us into sin? Absolutely not! 18 Rather, I am a sinner if I rebuild the old system of law I already tore down. 19 For when I tried to keep the law, it condemned me. So I died to the law—I stopped trying to meet all its requirements—so that I might live for God. 20 My old self has been crucified with Christ.[e] It is no longer I who live, but Christ lives in me. So I live in this earthly body by trusting in the Son of God, who loved me and gave himself for me.21 I do not treat the grace of God as meaningless. For if keeping the law could make us right with God, then there was no need for Christ to die.
I run across many men stuck in verse 16, (and I was one of them who got stuck there at times too) not grasping that you don’t get to obeying the law by trying to obey the law, but you DO come to obeying the law through trusting. It’s not easy to grasp at first.
We have a hard time leaving our own efforts because our own efforts are how we’ve always got by in the world all of our lives. It really is a narrow way that few find and only after great difficulty.
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I’ve really enjoyed the discussions ive had here today in a few threads and have greatly benefitted by them. Thanks.
Im going to listen to a man I began listening to today. He said the word mortgage comes from mort, meaning dead, and gage, meaning grip. It so piqued my interest that I went to see if that was right. He got it a little wrong. Mort does mean dead in Latin, but gage means pledge, supposedly because the deal dies when the debt is paid or when payment fails. So it would be “dead pledge.” Still quite interesting though that part of it means dead…!
Im going to listen to a man I began listening to today. He said the word mortgage comes from mort, meaning dead, and gage, meaning grip. It so piqued my interest that I went to see if that was right. He got it a little wrong. Mort does mean dead in Latin, but gage means pledge, supposedly because the deal dies when the debt is paid or when payment fails. So it would be “dead pledge.” Still quite interesting though that part of it means dead…!
Well look at what just came before me that confirms to me I did the right thing, according to Paul, by my promise at the beginning of this thread.
And now I make one more appeal, my dear brothers and sisters. Watch out for people who cause divisions and upset people’s faith by teaching things contrary to what you have been taught. Stay away from them.
another version says it like…mark them and have nothing to do with them.
Obviously, after a few years, it should become apparent that responding to or giving them any attention or trading barbs or defending myself is NOT staying away and having nothing to do with them but is rather doing the exact opposite of what Paul instructs. I don’t know if it’s for my good or for theirs or for the good of everyone, but Paul was certainly wiser than me so it’s going to be my habit from now on.
If it feels sad (and it really does), like just…turning them over to satan so he can manipulate and abuse them more, then so be it. Paul knew more than I do.
And now I make one more appeal, my dear brothers and sisters. Watch out for people who cause divisions and upset people’s faith by teaching things contrary to what you have been taught. Stay away from them.
another version says it like…mark them and have nothing to do with them.
Obviously, after a few years, it should become apparent that responding to or giving them any attention or trading barbs or defending myself is NOT staying away and having nothing to do with them but is rather doing the exact opposite of what Paul instructs. I don’t know if it’s for my good or for theirs or for the good of everyone, but Paul was certainly wiser than me so it’s going to be my habit from now on.
If it feels sad (and it really does), like just…turning them over to satan so he can manipulate and abuse them more, then so be it. Paul knew more than I do.
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Eternally Grateful
Well-Known Member
here is a bot answer
He posted we need to remain humble. and when he is called out for not being humble himself.. then he says we are not responding to what he wrote (which we did)
thats what happens when your doctrine is flawed. your all over the place. because your to busy trying to defend yourself by attacking others. than defending your truth, which is no truth at all
Amazing...You are doing exactly as you say. I have posted scriptures and shown how they relate to each other. Your understanding is based on religious conditioning...by adding to the word and taking away from it. So you will be unable to discuss anything I'm saying...instead resorting to the exact things you say I'm doing.
A bot answer means you are simply responding as you have been programmed to respond...unable to discuss...just accuse anyone that is not similarly indoctrinated.
You have to see that you are not interested in learning anything that might threaten your assumptions and presumptions.
At least a bot can't be charged with dishonesty. So the part of you that is not a bot is not able to discuss with any honesty.
To prove me wrong...go back and discuss the justification of Phinehas (from the OP) and how that relates to your understanding of imputation. I'm not holding my breath on this!
Eternally Grateful
Well-Known Member
I did not repond to your scripture post. I responded to your post where you said we need to be humble.. And instead of proving me wrong. you just attack, which in turn proved me right.
lol.. I am responding to what I see, not what I have been taught.Your understanding is based on religious conditioning...by adding to the word and taking away from them. So you will be unable to discuss anything I'm saying...instead resorting to the exact things you say I'm doing.
A bot answer means you are simply responding as you have been programmed to respond...unable to discuss...just accuse anyone that is not similarly indoctrinated.
You have to see that you are not interested in learning anything that might threaten your assumptions and presumptions.
At least a bot can't be charged with dishonesty. So the part of you that is not a bot is not able to discuss with any honesty.
To prove me wrong...go back and discuss the justification of Phinehas and how that relates to your understanding of imputation. I'm not holding my breath on this!
Now you on the other hand? you continue to show your lack of humility..
Not related to your thread but interesting - the man I was listening to last night, who I’ve listened to for a few months, in the live feed last night, had what I would call a fail with it. First time in months I have seen or think that. I always listen to his 2 and 3 hour vids more than once because I get so much. He didn’t exactly sound like a totally different man speaking, but…whatever precision “it” thing was somehow suddenly stopped. He was somehow disjointed and out of sorts and rambling? a bit. And it’s the first time out of dozens and dozens of videos I’ve watched. I think he was, at the exact moment he was speaking, taken into that strange cloud of having an infused download (best term I can come up with, I can’t explain that cloud thing exactly, I just know I’m in it sometimes and have learned to shut my mouth during it, and I’ve seen one other person be in it and try to converse and have now have also seen her out of it, during which she shared wonderful things).
If I wasn’t totally sure before, I am now - we should never run right out and try to share what we are receiving, at the moment we are receiving it, or while we are currently in that cloud of seeing everything at once while also knowing nothing.
I really feel for the man. I think he should have just cancelled his speaking engagement or sent someone else up to speak. It has to be hard to be a regular person just like everyone else and have the pressure of having to go to an engagement when people look forward to and hang on your teaching, while that infused download is happening. I hope he, or one of his close circle of brothers, figures it out. He doesn’t charge to speak when he rents a room to speak, so no one could get that mad that he wasn’t able to speak and someone else had to get up, could they…?
There was one great part where he managed to somehow convey part of it…
You've joined the ranks of the "dishonest indoctrinated". Welcome! Or maybe the point is that you just aren't welcome here.
Much love!
Eternally Grateful
Well-Known Member
All discussion is welcome. What is not welcome is robotically spewing an indoctrination that has no support in scripture whatsoever.
Just imagine God recognizing people as having the same righteousness as Himself. As in God saying ..."I recognize that Abraham had the same righteousness as Myself"...and then to make things worse...ALSO from that presumption also claiming to have the same righteousness as God...in a self-imputation!
Nowhere in the bible does it say that God recognizes the same righteousness in us as He does in Himself.
To confuse the matter further...The "our righteousness is as filthy rags" (which is not understood in context) argument is used to show that actually our righteousness is as high as God's! All we have to do is admit that our righteousness is bad...and VOILA we are now on a par with God Himself.
And I ask to this...is God's righteousness ALSO as filthy rags?...since the Lutheran heresy is to cover up sin to the point of making God blind to our true condition..
If God is thus blinded to us...can we take the further step in thinking that He also recognizes that we are now (due to His blindness) as righteous as God Himself?
At least that's how the indoctrination goes. How can people not be rejected from God for such blatant heresy? Sinning against holiness is far worse than sinning in the flesh. Prostitutes and whore mongers will get into the kingdom before the adulterers of eternal truth that is in holiness.
But how many even bat an eye over this?
And you will say which is which, no thank you. Been there, done that. Too much negativity, not enough real discussion.
Much love!
I have to show you humility so that you can prove you have been indoctrinated properly? The humility is that I even try to correspond to someone who displays such dishonesty. Unless you actually engage the thread at hand I will have to put you on ignore. I think honesty is what is required here...let humility be in subjection to the truth...not just a display of the flesh.
What do you say of Phinehas and God's imputation on Him? (Check out the OP) Will you be honest? Or will you hide behind a faux offense caused by religious sensibilities encountering the inconvenient truth?
Personally I've come to see it as a form of bullying.
Will you now begin your gaslighting campaign about how I'm all hurt feelings and emotionally reactive or some nonsense like that? You've done this with me, you've done it with others, and you are doing it again. It's poor form and inconducive to discussion.
If you begin to respect others it will show, that's all there is to it. If you don't, then we won't see anything different from you. Our words reveal ourselves, not others.
Much love!
The seat of all indoctrination is the ego. When an indoctrination is challenged, so is the ego. As such. it becomes impossible for the once-indoctrinated person to be set free...since the truth is seen as a threat. A personal threat.
Those who have fooled modern believers are wise indeed...but wise to evil.
Those who have fooled modern believers are wise indeed...but wise to evil.
Give me a good reply, and maybe I'll engage with you, but this isn't an attractive offer.
"Or will you hide etc ect". I'm more interested in a higher level of discussion. That's the reason I say anything to begin with, in the hopes that you will recognize what I'm saying.
Like I said, if you decide to do something different it will show.
Will I be honest? Will you??
Much love!
The seat of all indoctrination is the ego. When an indoctrination is challenged, so is the ego. As such, it becomes impossible for the once-indoctrinated person to be set free...since the truth is seen as a threat. A personal threat.
Those who have fooled modern believers are wise indeed...but wise to evil.
The "bullying" effect of the truth is that light exposes darkness. Agents of darkness will respond in horror to any expression of the truth. Is it any wonder that the demons thought Jesus had come to torment them?
Indoctrination, poor ideas, whatever labels you want to put on things, I think pride and envy are at the heart of them. If we are in error and are humble the Holy Spirit will be leading us to truth. Whichever is true of us, our words will show it.
Much love!
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