Is God sending people straight to hell when they die, today?

[Keiw]

That's quite ironic coming from Kingdom Hall! What do you think I just quoted? TRUTH! A better question is why do JW's HATE the Christian Bible?

Rev 20
10 The devil, who deceived them, was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone where the beast and the false prophet are. And they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.

I know you desire to be serving God, thus-When you see Babylon the great fall-Run to Jehovah, do not hesitate.

 

[Jack]

I know you desire to be serving God, thus-When you see Babylon the great fall-Run to Jehovah, do not hesitate.

Notice how Keiw avoids the Scripture I quoted from the JW bible like plague!

 

[teamventure]

Soul sleep ended a long long time ago . Folks need to read mathew chapter TWENTY SEVEN
ONCE JESUS ROSE from the dead , THOSE WHO SLEPT rose with him . MANY folks seen the saints too .
ITS recorded . NOW all who die in CHRIST are WITH HIM . To be absent from the body IS to be present with the LORD .
JESUS was the first to rise from the dead . Now all lambs who die shall never taste of death but are present with HIM
Yes . Go read mathew twenty seven and see the beauty of this . MANY of the souls that slept
AROSE after the ressurection of JESUS . IT says some people even seen them .

Great insight brother. Good to see you.

 

[teamventure]

While people may love the fact that people are going to be punished forever and ever there are alternative versions of the bible with more of a literal meaning, such as young literal translation.

People don't love the fact that people are going to be punished forever. That's a false assumption. The irony is you are leading people to hell by telling them otherwise because your assertions that everyone ends up in a peaceful place would eliminate the need for the cross.

 

[Jack]

While people may love the fact that people are going to be punished forever and ever there are alternative versions of the bible with more of a literal meaning, such as young literal translation.

That is blatant LIE!

“And these shall go away to punishment age-during, but the righteous to life ageduring.’”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭25‬:‭46‬ ‭YLT98‬‬

Matthew 25:46 And these shall go away to punishment age-during, but the righteous to life ageduring.’ | Young's Literal Translation 1898 (YLT98) | Download The Bible App Now

And these shall go away to punishment age-during, but the righteous to life ageduring.’

bible.com

That is very different reading, than,

I doubt you even know what 'life ageduring' means.

“And these will go away into everlasting punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.””
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭25‬:‭46‬ ‭NKJV‬‬

Matthew 25:46 And these will go away into everlasting punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.” | New King James Version (NKJV) | Download The Bible App Now

And these will go away into everlasting punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.”

bible.com

Just wanna give people something to think about.

Satan LOVES it when his messengers convince people there is no eternal Hell fire!

 

[MatthewG]

That is blatant LIE!

I doubt you even know what 'life ageduring' means.

Satan LOVES it when his messengers convince people there is no eternal Hell fire!

Cool. Thanks for your comments Jack.

 

[MatthewG]

People don't love the fact that people are going to be punished forever. That's a false assumption. The irony is you are leading people to hell by telling them otherwise because your assertions that everyone ends up in a peaceful place would eliminate the need for the cross.

Cool. If you say so. I’m not so sure you even know position that well? Thank you for commenting, teamventure.

Im gonna do my best to not argue, amd go by the spirit; i don’t expect everyone to understand that would be foolish on my part, deadly foolish with 8 billion in the world they say. That’s alot of people.

 

[Augustin56]

But its done away with according to Revelation, friend. Today there is just darkness and light like you said, @Augustin56. What baffels me is that even in Revelation there are people outside in the darkness, outside of the kingdom. That is where I see faithless people going to today. I dont understand why people continue to see hell as being active, when Yeshua has overcame it, all the souls were dumped out of it and it was thrown into the lake of fire with death, Satan, the false peophet, the beast… with souls coming out of it; then being thrown away with. There is no one going there today. It does not make sense to believe otherwise.

Well, keep in mind what St. Paul said in 1 Cor. 2:9, "But as it is written: “What eye has not seen, and ear has not heard, and what has not entered the human heart, what God has prepared for those who love him,” In other words, we cannot, here on earth, begin to understand what eternity is like, either in heaven or in hell. But, we do have clues.

I imagine that when we were in our mother's womb, that was our whole world! Dark, wet, warm, crowded, etc. That's all we knew. We had no inkling about the world into which we were born, with light, sounds, air, color, smells, etc. I suspect the same sort of experience will happen when we die. Death is not the end, but a new beginning, into eternity. And we, here on earth, do not have the ability to fully understand what awaits us.

 

[MatthewG]

Well, keep in mind what St. Paul said in 1 Cor. 2:9, "But as it is written: “What eye has not seen, and ear has not heard, and what has not entered the human heart, what God has prepared for those who love him,”

Do not know what God has in store for those who love him, you are right. Sometimes that gets me to wonder, what is God all about, does he desire all to come to him, and come to knowledge of his son, even in the afterlife?

Philippians 2:10-11 so that at the name of Jesus EVERY KNEE SHALL BOW, of those who are in heaven and on earth and under the earth, and that every tongue will confess and openly acknowledge that Jesus Christ is Lord , to the glory of God the Father.

Will they have the free choice to come to him even outside of the Kingdom?

Revelation 22:15 15 Outside are the dogs, those who practice magic arts, the sexually immoral, the murderers, the idolaters and everyone who loves and practices falsehood.

All one can do is hope, right friend? @Augustin56

 

[BlessedPeace]

No...an individual sends himself to hell.....not God.

That's not actually true.

As soon as an individual is accountable for offending God,sinning, they are destined for Hell unless or until they are Saved from Hell by accepting Jesus,who is God, as their savior from sin,Hell.

Some believe babies will go to Hell dying in infancy. Meaning we are born destined for Hell unless we are saved from it by God who determined that fate in our beginning.

Even if you don't hear about God,Jesus,Salvation,you are sent to Hell at the judgement. God is that judge.


You have to give God his due. He is God.We are the victims to his will.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

Symbolism--Only a sadist would create a literal eternal suffering, an unjust being at that. Meet the true God-God is love, merciful. All of his ways are justice. Which God does your religion serve?

Yeah, everyone who seeks to deny the truth will callpassages symbolic they find hard to believe. You are like millions of others.

But the Lake of Fire is real and people will suffer for eternity sadly. The most tragic part is that they do not have to, but choose to.

Remember the lake of fire was created for Satan and the angels that rebelled with him. Man by our willful unbelief choose to go there.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

It's clear from the gospels that water baptism had to do with the kingdom, which was ministered by John who was known as the Baptizer, and not a minister for the Church of God. John who was a prophet functioning under the old covenant was appointed by God to prepare and confirm the promises made to Israel. His message was to tell those who lived under the old covenant that the king had come and “the kingdom of heaven is at hand.” He used water as a sign to baptize those who believed the promised Messiah would be coming in just a matter of months and to illustrate that he would be the Christ, who would baptize them not with material water, but with holy spirit, which is “power from on high.” From the habit of tradition, and only for a short period of time, a small handful of people were baptized with water into the New Testament, but never again afterwards.

Johns Baptism was to announce the literal kingdom which Jesus came to offer Israel and to prepare teh way of the Lord. different than the water baptism of the church.

Water baptism is a carryover from part of the Levitical Law. There are many examples of people in the Old Testament who would wash themselves with water as a final step to being clean. Water baptism was an outward sign of washing, and then you would be clean to God. Baptism in water, and the need to be circumcised passed away with the coming of Pentecost, as did the other Levitical Laws. To be led by the spirit is to not be under the yoke of bondage with the extreme of legalism, seeking the works of the flesh from the old covenant concerning the past Law administration that was written to Israel.

Acts 8:29-39

King James Version

​

29 Then the Spirit said unto Philip, Go near, and join thyself to this chariot.
30 And Philip ran thither to him, and heard him read the prophet Esaias, and said, Understandest thou what thou readest?
31 And he said, How can I, except some man should guide me? And he desired Philip that he would come up and sit with him.
32 The place of the scripture which he read was this, He was led as a sheep to the slaughter; and like a lamb dumb before his shearer, so opened he not his mouth:
33 In his humiliation his judgment was taken away: and who shall declare his generation? for his life is taken from the earth.
34 And the eunuch answered Philip, and said, I pray thee, of whom speaketh the prophet this? of himself, or of some other man?
35 Then Philip opened his mouth, and began at the same scripture, and preached unto him Jesus.
36 And as they went on their way, they came unto a certain water: and the eunuch said, See, here is water; what doth hinder me to be baptized?
37 And Philip said, If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest. And he answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God.
38 And he commanded the chariot to stand still: and they went down both into the water, both Philip and the eunuch; and he baptized him.
39 And when they were come up out of the water, the Spirit of the Lord caught away Philip, that the eunuch saw him no more: and he went on his way rejoicing.

I guess Philip didn't get the memo.

1 Corinthians 1:13-17

King James Version

​

13 Is Christ divided? was Paul crucified for you? or were ye baptized in the name of Paul?
14 I thank God that I baptized none of you, but Crispus and Gaius;
15 Lest any should say that I had baptized in mine own name.
16 And I baptized also the household of Stephanas: besides, I know not whether I baptized any other.
17 For Christ sent me not to baptize, but to preach the gospel: not with wisdom of words, lest the cross of Christ should be made of none effect.

Neither did Paul!

Being baptized in teh Spirit happens the moment one is saved! If Paul was not sent to save people (baptize in teh aspirit by the spirit) then what was he sent to do?

No water Baptism is an outward sign of th einward reality of accepting christ. It has nothing to do with the OT washings but is a qualitatively new baptism of publicly identiying with Jesus!

In the epistles written just a little bit past the beginning of the New Testament is where we read the only time water baptism is mentioned is to note there is no more need for it, and that we are now to be baptized with holy spirit. And this is why in Acts 2:38, Peter commands “Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ.” In Acts 8:16, Peter and John “baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.” In Acts 10:48, Peter “commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord.” In Romans 6:3, it declares “that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ.” There is not one exception to this practice where we see water baptism, which belonged to the time period when Christ walked the earth, being used once the Church of God had become established.

I await you showing the verse that syas baptizing in the name of the Father, son and Holy Spirit is no longer needed.

Nowhere do we see any people being baptized in the name of the Father. like as the Holy Spirit.

So moving on--why do you reject the trinity.

 

[MatthewG]

Remember the lake of fire was created for Satan and the angels that rebelled with him. Man by our willful unbelief choose to go there.

Hey yo! Hope that its a purging fire but it must be aweful to go through, lossing ones self, when it could be done here in the fire (holy spirit and fire.)

 

[teamventure]

Do not know what God has in store for those who love him, you are right. Sometimes that gets me to wonder, what is God all about, does he desire all to come to him, and come to knowledge of his son, even in the afterlife?

Philippians 2:10-11 so that at the name of Jesus EVERY KNEE SHALL BOW, of those who are in heaven and on earth and under the earth, and that every tongue will confess and openly acknowledge that Jesus Christ is Lord , to the glory of God the Father.

Will they have the free choice to come to him even outside of the Kingdom?

Revelation 22:15 15 Outside are the dogs, those who practice magic arts, the sexually immoral, the murderers, the idolaters and everyone who loves and practices falsehood.

All one can do is hope, right friend? @Augustin56

Even satan and his minions will confess that Jesus is Lord, that doesn't mean they are saved.

 

[teamventure]

Cool. If you say so. I’m not so sure you even know position that well? Thank you for commenting, teamventure.

Im gonna do my best to not argue, amd go by the spirit; i don’t expect everyone to understand that would be foolish on my part, deadly foolish with 8 billion in the world they say. That’s alot of people.

Was it a fair statement to assert that people who believe in eternal punishment love the idea of it?

 

[MatthewG]

Was it a fair statement to assert that people who believe in eternal punishment love the idea of it?

I do not know who loves eternal punishment, I do believe everyone reaps their own punishments of life, by and through the flesh. Believer or for the unbeliever, I believe that those who are outside the kingdom of God, are able to come in to this fire? Which they take part if they choose too, and not a forced thing, I have never seen God be forceful in manner He just calls out his righteous judgement upon those who are wicked, and he was going to pour his wrath out on the nation of Israel and I believe all those who were in hell, were dumped out of that container, and they were all judged, and they part took of the lake of fire, but the devil is promised to be in there forever, with the false prophet and the beast, I believe that. Therefore, when it comes to punishment, I believe that God can measure out his measure of punishment in which he gets his hearts desires. Which is for all people to come to knowledge and truth of his son right my friend?

who wants all people to be saved and to come to a knowledge of the truth. (Written to timothy, 1 Timothy 2:4)

 

[Keiw]

Yeah, everyone who seeks to deny the truth will callpassages symbolic they find hard to believe. You are like millions of others.

But the Lake of Fire is real and people will suffer for eternity sadly. The most tragic part is that they do not have to, but choose to.

Remember the lake of fire was created for Satan and the angels that rebelled with him. Man by our willful unbelief choose to go there.

God throws death and Hades into the lake of fire to destroy them forever, just like all things that go in.
A single teaching proves it is symbolism--The place where the worm dieth not-Mark 9:48)--show us a worm that can survive more than 1 single hour in a hot firey place let alone dieth not. You know where they don't die? 6 feet under=Hades=Sheol=the grave. Deut 30:19--God set before all-LIFE or DEATH both will be everlasting.

 

[teamventure]

I do not know who loves eternal punishment, I do believe everyone reaps their own punishments of life, by and through the flesh. Believer or for the unbeliever, I believe that those who are outside the kingdom of God, are able to come in to this fire? Which they take part if they choose too, and not a forced thing, I have never seen God be forceful in manner He just calls out his righteous judgement upon those who are wicked, and he was going to pour his wrath out on the nation of Israel and I believe all those who were in hell, were dumped out of that container, and they were all judged, and they part took of the lake of fire, but the devil is promised to be in there forever, with the false prophet and the beast, I believe that. Therefore, when it comes to punishment, I believe that God can measure out his measure of punishment in which he gets his hearts desires. Which is for all people to come to knowledge and truth of his son right my friend?

who wants all people to be saved and to come to a knowledge of the truth. (Written to timothy, 1 Timothy 2:4)

God is not willing that any should perish, but he gives us free will, and narrow is the road that leads to life and few find it.
The verse you used does not mean that no one will perish but that God offers salvation for everyone to be saved. Sadly not everyone choose the way of salvation which is only in Christ.

 

[Peterlag]

Johns Baptism was to announce the literal kingdom which Jesus came to offer Israel and to prepare teh way of the Lord. different than the water baptism of the church.

Acts 8:29-39​

​

King James Version​

​

​

29 Then the Spirit said unto Philip, Go near, and join thyself to this chariot.
30 And Philip ran thither to him, and heard him read the prophet Esaias, and said, Understandest thou what thou readest?
31 And he said, How can I, except some man should guide me? And he desired Philip that he would come up and sit with him.
32 The place of the scripture which he read was this, He was led as a sheep to the slaughter; and like a lamb dumb before his shearer, so opened he not his mouth:
33 In his humiliation his judgment was taken away: and who shall declare his generation? for his life is taken from the earth.
34 And the eunuch answered Philip, and said, I pray thee, of whom speaketh the prophet this? of himself, or of some other man?
35 Then Philip opened his mouth, and began at the same scripture, and preached unto him Jesus.
36 And as they went on their way, they came unto a certain water: and the eunuch said, See, here is water; what doth hinder me to be baptized?
37 And Philip said, If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest. And he answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God.
38 And he commanded the chariot to stand still: and they went down both into the water, both Philip and the eunuch; and he baptized him.
39 And when they were come up out of the water, the Spirit of the Lord caught away Philip, that the eunuch saw him no more: and he went on his way rejoicing.

I guess Philip didn't get the memo.

1 Corinthians 1:13-17​

​

King James Version​

​

​

13 Is Christ divided? was Paul crucified for you? or were ye baptized in the name of Paul?
14 I thank God that I baptized none of you, but Crispus and Gaius;
15 Lest any should say that I had baptized in mine own name.
16 And I baptized also the household of Stephanas: besides, I know not whether I baptized any other.
17 For Christ sent me not to baptize, but to preach the gospel: not with wisdom of words, lest the cross of Christ should be made of none effect.

Neither did Paul!

Being baptized in teh Spirit happens the moment one is saved! If Paul was not sent to save people (baptize in teh aspirit by the spirit) then what was he sent to do?

No water Baptism is an outward sign of th einward reality of accepting christ. It has nothing to do with the OT washings but is a qualitatively new baptism of publicly identiying with Jesus!

I await you showing the verse that syas baptizing in the name of the Father, son and Holy Spirit is no longer needed.

Nowhere do we see any people being baptized in the name of the Father. like as the Holy Spirit.

So moving on--why do you reject the trinity.

I mentioned Philip when I said... From the habit of tradition, and only for a short period of time, a small handful of people were baptized with water into the New Testament, but never again afterwards. Water does nothing to anybody that has any common sense other then get you wet.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

Hey yo! Hope that its a purging fire but it must be aweful to go through, lossing ones self, when it could be done here in the fire (holy spirit and fire.)

Well we shall know for certain when eternity rolls around.

I hope you don't relax in sharing the gospel of salvation with the lost in the hope that they may be saved if they have to go to the lake of fire.