Is infant baptism from the Bible?

[Marymog]

When you literally say you don't care about what an individual thinks/believes, it's pretty dang obvious. Learning to care about the individual will enable you to be a witness of God's words, rather than a clanging cymbal.

How about a little bit of honesty in our conversation???

What I said is that I don't care to understand what a individual person believes.

Mary

 

[Marymog]

You are a sinner in need of repentance. Abide by scripture: learn charity & care for the individual.

Red harring.

Herring...not "harring".

 

[Enoch111]

My understanding of the baptism of the Spirit is that the church was immersed in the Spirit - so to speak - at Pentecost, and the individual comes into the good of it at the new birth, but is subsequently baptised as a sign of personal faith, afterwards.

The New Birth can only take place after one receives the gift of the Holy Spirit, or is baptized with the Spirit. And according to Scripture water baptism must follow immediately, the best example being in Acts 10.

 

[Taken]

hi taken,

I refer you to @BreadOfLife post #2. He articulates it very well. The only thing I would add is Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins; and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit”. For the promise is to you and to your children and to all that are far off, every one whom the Lord our God calls to him” (2:38-39).

Mary, I have ZERO desire to be shuffled off to lend an ear to BOL.

I am Speaking TO YOU. If you do not know WHAT YOU DO, or WHAT you BELIEVE, or WHY you believe it...I surely am not going to ASK another person.

You stated, YOUR were BABY BAPTIZED...IN THE SPIRIT of God...

YOU ALSO Stated:
You have NO memory of that event.

There is NOT ONE IOTA of your claims THAT YOU Chose to BELIEVE IN God or Christ Jesus, BEFORE (you claim your received the Holy Spirit).

WHERE in ALL OF Scripture is it TAUGHT, A Confession of BELIEF IS NOT NECESSARY for a person to RECEIVE the Holy Spirit?

Instead of cherry picking scripture to fit what I believe both I look at ALL OF SCRIPTURE and what The Christian Church has practiced/believed for 2,000 years.

That's great YOU consider ALL of Scripture.
But yet NOT ONE SCRIPTURE do you Present says...
Anything about anyone receiving the Baptism of the Holy Spirit without Confessing Belief.

I already KNOW, wHAt your church men TEACH...
I already KNOW, you ACCEPT their Teacching.
I already KNOW, ou are IMPRESSED and ACCEPTING of a long TRADITION of your chruch.

NO need to keep repeating those facts.

So by all means...DO CHERRYPICK, and REVEAL THE BEST Scripture that SAYS, Confession IS NOT NECESSARY for a person to Receive the Holy Spirit!!!

Do CHERRYPICK the BEST Scripture that teaches for men to BAPTIZE ANYONE, who has not made a Confession of Belief.

You cherry pick Scripture

ABSOLUTELY, I DO CHERRYPICK BY quOTING the BEST Scripture to VERIFY the Point I am making.
Absolutely, there is no need for me to QUOTE the entire Scriptures. You are a big girl, you can read for yourself.

and accept what the Protestant's have believed/practiced for 500 years.

Stop trying to compare what I do, to what YOU do. I have never said, ANYTHING, about Baseing MY Beliefs ON Protestant men.

Scripture and your own Christian history teach opposite of what you believe.

You make a FALSE Scriptural Claim, then you make a FALSE Personal Claim against me.

Scripture DOES NOT TEACH;
Baptism of the Holy Spirit WITHOUT Confession.
(AS YOU CLAIM)

Scripture REVEALS CONFESSION of the Individual First, Before the individual receives the Holy Spirit.

It is YOUR church leaders, that IMPLEMENTED
(Baby) Baptism WITHOUT the individuals Consent, testimony, confession...
And YOUR church leaders, WHO proclaimed THEY accept that as the INDIVIDUAL having received the Holy Spirit....
And YOUR church leaders, WHO passed down through generations, MAKING Baby Baptism a TRADITION of YOUR church.
And IT IS YOU, who Accept your church leaders acceptance of their OWN devised ceremonies...
And it is YOU, who Accept the Proclamations, of your clerics,
And the Traditions of your Church...

Okie dokie....Acknowledged for the umpteenth time, what you accept...

NOW; WHERE IN SCRIPTURE Are THOSE THINGS "YOU ACCEPT" TAUGHT???

And YeS, Cherrypick...ie...PICK THE BEST Scripture that teaches,

The Baptism of the Holy Spirit IS RECEIVED WITHOUT Confession of Belief.

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[Taken]

The New Birth can only take place after one receives the gift of the Holy Spirit, or is baptized with the Spirit.

Agree.

And according to Scripture water baptism must follow immediately, the best example being in Acts 10.

"MUST" be water Baptized?

Disagree.


Glory to God,
Taken

 

[Marymog]

Mary, I have ZERO desire to be shuffled off to lend an ear to BOL.

I am Speaking TO YOU. If you do not know WHAT YOU DO, or WHAT you BELIEVE, or WHY you believe it...I surely am not going to ASK another person.

You stated, YOUR were BABY BAPTIZED...IN THE SPIRIT of God...

YOU ALSO Stated:
You have NO memory of that event.

There is NOT ONE IOTA of your claims THAT YOU Chose to BELIEVE IN God or Christ Jesus, BEFORE (you claim your received the Holy Spirit).

WHERE in ALL OF Scripture is it TAUGHT, A Confession of BELIEF IS NOT NECESSARY for a person to RECEIVE the Holy Spirit?



That's great YOU consider ALL of Scripture.
But yet NOT ONE SCRIPTURE do you Present says...
Anything about anyone receiving the Baptism of the Holy Spirit without Confessing Belief.

I already KNOW, wHAt your church men TEACH...
I already KNOW, you ACCEPT their Teacching.
I already KNOW, ou are IMPRESSED and ACCEPTING of a long TRADITION of your chruch.

NO need to keep repeating those facts.

So by all means...DO CHERRYPICK, and REVEAL THE BEST Scripture that SAYS, Confession IS NOT NECESSARY for a person to Receive the Holy Spirit!!!

Do CHERRYPICK the BEST Scripture that teaches for men to BAPTIZE ANYONE, who has not made a Confession of Belief.

ABSOLUTELY, I DO CHERRYPICK BY quOTING the BEST Scripture to VERIFY the Point I am making.
Absolutely, there is no need for me to QUOTE the entire Scriptures. You are a big girl, you can read for yourself.

Stop trying to compare what I do, to what YOU do. I have never said, ANYTHING, about Baseing MY Beliefs ON Protestant men.

You make a FALSE Scriptural Claim, then you make a FALSE Personal Claim against me.

Scripture DOES NOT TEACH;
Baptism of the Holy Spirit WITHOUT Confession.
(AS YOU CLAIM)

Scripture REVEALS CONFESSION of the Individual First, Before the individual receives the Holy Spirit.

It is YOUR church leaders, that IMPLEMENTED
(Baby) Baptism WITHOUT the individuals Consent, testimony, confession...
And YOUR church leaders, WHO proclaimed THEY accept that as the INDIVIDUAL having received the Holy Spirit....
And YOUR church leaders, WHO passed down through generations, MAKING Baby Baptism a TRADITION of YOUR church.
And IT IS YOU, who Accept your church leaders acceptance of their OWN devised ceremonies...
And it is YOU, who Accept the Proclamations, of your clerics,
And the Traditions of your Church...

Okie dokie....Acknowledged for the umpteenth time, what you accept...

NOW; WHERE IN SCRIPTURE Are THOSE THINGS "YOU ACCEPT" TAUGHT???

And YeS, Cherrypick...ie...PICK THE BEST Scripture that teaches,

The Baptism of the Holy Spirit IS RECEIVED WITHOUT Confession of Belief.

Glory to God,
Taken

It is great to consider all of Scripture.....You should try it.

Glory to God....Mary

 

[Enoch111]

"MUST" be water Baptized?

Disagree.

So you believe that a commandment of Christ can be ignored by a new Christian????? That would be a travesty of the Gospel and all Bible truth.

So kindly tell us why Peter commanded the Gentiles to be baptized in Acts 10 if it was optional?

 

[Taken]

It is great to consider all of Scripture.....You should try it.

Glory to God....Mary

Mary ~ You should have already understood, I consider ALL of Scripture.

You should have understood, when MAKING a Claim, "choosing the ONE OR TWO SCRIPTURES that VERIFY YOUR CLAIM" IS all that is necessary.

You have CherryPicked and QUOTED Scriptures....HOWEVER NOT ONE of YOUR CherryPicked Scriptures HAVE VERIFIED YOUR CLAIM....

That: Baby Baptism was Taught In Scripture.
OR
That: ANYONE receives the Baptism of the Holy Spirit WITHOUT that Person CONFESSING Belief IN God IN Christ.

So WHEN ARE YOU GOING to Acutally Stay ON POINT, and SHOW a Scripture that Verifies YOUR Claims?

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[Taken]

Scripture was also "CLEAR" to other men who teach/preach/believe opposite of you. Soooooo how do WE figure out who was most clear?

Mary

Yet another offpoint deflection.

Nothing to Compare.
My Clear Point is from "Scripture"
Your Clear Point is from your church "Tradition."

Already acknowledged YOUR TRADITION, and have ZERO Interest in YOUR TRADITION.

Stop deflecting...COMPARE Scripture with Scripture.

Show In Scripture...
Baby Baptism.
Show in Scirpture...
Baptism of the Holy Spirit WITHOUT that persons Confession.





Rom 10

1. [9] That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
2. [10] For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[Marymog]

My Clear Point is from "Scripture"
Your Clear Point is from your church "Tradition."

Already acknowledged YOUR TRADITION, and have ZERO Interest in YOUR TRADITION.

Glory to God,
Taken

Got it....YOUR clear point is from Scripture. NO ONE ELSE in the 2,000 year ENTIRE HISTORY of Christianity got a clear point about baptism from Scripture....FASCINATING!!! YOU got it right....they got it wrong...

I find it VERY funny that you accept the 500 year Protestant men teaching tradition on this subject and that's OK??? But Marymog accepts the 2,000 year teaching tradition of the Christian men that lived closest to the life of Jesus and Marymog is wrong????

You have 100% interest in your 500 year teaching but zero interest in a 2,000 year teaching......Fascinating.....simply, fascinating....I don't know what else to say.

Glory to God....Mary

 

[Marymog]

Mary ~ You should have already understood, I consider ALL of Scripture.

You should have understood, when MAKING a Claim, "choosing the ONE OR TWO SCRIPTURES that VERIFY YOUR CLAIM" IS all that is necessary.

You have CherryPicked and QUOTED Scriptures....HOWEVER NOT ONE of YOUR CherryPicked Scriptures HAVE VERIFIED YOUR CLAIM....

That: Baby Baptism was Taught In Scripture.
OR
That: ANYONE receives the Baptism of the Holy Spirit WITHOUT that Person CONFESSING Belief IN God IN Christ.

So WHEN ARE YOU GOING to Acutally Stay ON POINT, and SHOW a Scripture that Verifies YOUR Claims?

Glory to God,
Taken

Thank you taken. You should really stop lying. I gave Scripture. You rejected it.....your problem not mine. With that said:

You are right....infants do not make up entire families and even though Scripture says the promise is for me and my children... infants are not children.

I'm wrong.....You win.

Glory to God who has revealed this to me....Mary

 

[Pearl]

The New Birth can only take place after one receives the gift of the Holy Spirit, or is baptized with the Spirit. And according to Scripture water baptism must follow immediately, the best example being in Acts 10.

What if water baptism doesn't follow immediately?

 

[farouk]

What if water baptism doesn't follow immediately?

I think the point is that it's good if it does, but it's the order of events that is significant; believing (new birth), then public confession in baptism, the order in Acts 2.41-42; interesting that the breaking of bread (Lord's Supper) is something that follows also, together with continuance in the Apostles' doctrine, fellowship and prayers.

 

[Taken]

Got it....YOUR clear point is from Scripture. NO ONE ELSE in the 2,000 year ENTIRE HISTORY of Christianity got a clear point about baptism from Scripture....FASCINATING!!! YOU got it right....they got it wrong...

Thank you for once AGAIN being Factinated with your Bathering of Deflection.

Thank you for saying "they got it wrong".
That's your words.

I already said it is NOT ABOUT RIGHT AND WRONG.

But since you insist, I am right...
That's your words. Okie Dokie.

I find it VERY funny that you accept the 500 year Protestant men teaching tradition on this subject and that's OK??? But Marymog accepts the 2,000 year teaching tradition of the Christian men that lived closest to the life of Jesus and Marymog is wrong????

I find it VERY SAD, that you can be amused by you making false claims for me.

You have 100% interest in your 500 year teaching but zero interest in a 2,000 year teaching......Fascinating.....simply, fascinating....

Again, I find it SAD, that as an Adult you have not yet matured to KNOW, You making up lies and saying it is an others Belief, when they have said no such thing....your failure to know it is called LYING.

I don't know what else to say.

Nothing more for you to say.

You make up things people do not say, and you claim the other believes what YOU made up.

You claim your church teaches Baby Baptism,
But can show Nothing in Scripture to verify what your church teaches.

You claim without your confession of Belief, your church proclaims you received the Baptism of the Holy Spirit, and You accept your churches proclamation....
And further You can not show Anything in Scripture to Support your churches position or your acceptance thereof.

It's settled.
You can not present Scriptures to support your Position, regarding Baby Baptism, or your Position, regarding people receiving the Baptism of the Holy Spirit, without Confession.

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[Taken]

So you believe that a commandment of Christ can be ignored by a new Christian?????

Before you Accuse with a challenging Question....

How about you Identify EXACTLY what Christ Commanded, that you think is being IGNORED.

That would be a travesty of the Gospel and all Bible truth.

Jumping the gun, nothing specific has been Quoted or Denied.

So kindly tell us why Peter commanded the Gentiles to be baptized in Acts 10 if it was optional?

Baptism is a general term.
I was speaking specifically of Water Baptism.
Are you?

Secondly you started out your comment talking about JESUS" Commands, and Now are Speaking of Peter's Commands.

Which are you Speaking of?

Please be more Specific;
Peter's Commands TO Gentiles....?? Verses you are speaking of?

Glory to God.
Taken

 

[Marymog]

It's settled.

Glory to God,
Taken

It is settled. I already said I am wrong. You are right.

Anyone that's says' anything opposite of you is wrong. What more do you want me to say?

All the men who teach opposite of you are wrong. How much more clear can I be??

You (also a man) are right.

Glory to God who is always right....Mary

 

[Enoch111]

What if water baptism doesn't follow immediately?

Then you have a serious problem.

The whole point of IMMEDIATE Christian baptism is to (1) make the new convert immediately obedient and submitted to Christ, by obeying the first commandment for a Christian, (2) reckon his/her old life as dead and buried from that point on, and (3) empower the new believer to walk in newness of life as a child of God (by the power of the Spirit). It would also be a way publicly proclaiming that one is a Christian (full identification with Christ), while protecting the babe in Christ from spiritual assaults against the reality of his/her faith in Christ and conversion.

As Scripture says obedience is better than sacrifice, and you will note that throughout the book of Acts the apostles and their companions immediately baptized new converts (even those who had submitted to John the Baptizer's baptism).

The significance of water baptism by immersion for the new Christian is presented in Romans 6.

ROMANS 6
1 What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound?
2 God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?
3 Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?
4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
5 For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:
6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.
7 For he that is dead is freed from sin.
8 Now if we be dead with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with him:
9 Knowing that Christ being raised from the dead dieth no more; death hath no more dominion over him.
10 For in that he died, he died unto sin once: but in that he liveth, he liveth unto God.
11 Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord.
12 Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof.
13 Neither yield ye your members as instruments of unrighteousness unto sin: but yield yourselves unto God, as those that are alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness unto God.
14 For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.
15 What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.
16 Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?
17 But God be thanked, that ye were the servants of sin, but ye have obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine which was delivered you.
18 Being then made free from sin, ye became the servants of righteousness.

 

[Pearl]

Then you have a serious problem.

The whole point of IMMEDIATE Christian baptism is to (1) make the new convert immediately obedient and submitted to Christ, by obeying the first commandment for a Christian, (2) reckon his/her old life as dead and buried from that point on, and (3) empower the new believer to walk in newness of life as a child of God (by the power of the Spirit). It would also be a way publicly proclaiming that one is a Christian (full identification with Christ), while protecting the babe in Christ from spiritual assaults against the reality of his/her faith in Christ and conversion.

As Scripture says obedience is better than sacrifice, and you will note that throughout the book of Acts the apostles and their companions immediately baptized new converts (even those who had submitted to John the Baptizer's baptism).

The significance of water baptism by immersion for the new Christian is presented in Romans 6.

ROMANS 6
1 What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound?
2 God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?
3 Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?
4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
5 For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:
6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.
7 For he that is dead is freed from sin.
8 Now if we be dead with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with him:
9 Knowing that Christ being raised from the dead dieth no more; death hath no more dominion over him.
10 For in that he died, he died unto sin once: but in that he liveth, he liveth unto God.
11 Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord.
12 Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof.
13 Neither yield ye your members as instruments of unrighteousness unto sin: but yield yourselves unto God, as those that are alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness unto God.
14 For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.
15 What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.
16 Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?
17 But God be thanked, that ye were the servants of sin, but ye have obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine which was delivered you.
18 Being then made free from sin, ye became the servants of righteousness.

My own baptism came years after my rebirth and Spirit baptism. And it was the same for lots of people I know. In fact I don't know anybody who was baptised immediately after coming to Christ. But even then it was valid and wonderful. So perhaps it isn't wise to generalise.

 

[Enoch111]

How about you Identify EXACTLY what Christ Commanded, that you think is being IGNORED.

Before His ascension Christ commanded the apostles to (1) preach the Gospel to all nations and to every person and (2) baptize each one who obeyed the Gospel. That commandment now extends to the true Church.

And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth. Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost: Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen. (Mt 28:18-20) [NOTE: Here baptism is linked to observing "all things whatsoever I have commanded you"]

And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned. (Mk 16:15,16) [NOTE: Here baptism is linked to believing so closely that they could be regarded as one event. We see this in Acts 7 where the Ethiopian immediately requested baptism and was baptized by Philip]

Secondly you started out your comment talking about JESUS" Commands, and Now are Speaking of Peter's Commands.

Well isn't it obvious that Peter commanded water baptism because Christ commanded him to ensure that believers were baptized? So we see in both Acts 2 and Acts 10 that Peter commands those who believe to be baptized immediately.

 

[Dave L]

Before His ascension Christ commanded the apostles to (1) preach the Gospel to all nations and to every person and (2) baptize each one who obeyed the Gospel. That commandment now extends to the true Church.

And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth. Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost: Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen. (Mt 28:18-20) [NOTE: Here baptism is linked to observing "all things whatsoever I have commanded you"]

And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned. (Mk 16:15,16) [NOTE: Here baptism is linked to believing so closely that they could be regarded as one event. We see this in Acts 7 where the Ethiopian immediately requested baptism and was baptized by Philip]

Well isn't it obvious that Peter commanded water baptism because Christ commanded him to ensure that believers were baptized? So we see in both Acts 2 and Acts 10 that Peter commands those who believe to be baptized immediately.

Sometimes there is no chance of baptism until arranged for.